The Long Night Part Three: Bonfire at Dawn (45k)

Durin said:

With the Dragon poised to break through the defensive lines in several locations and the entire region turned into a quagmire of broken shards of reality, the dragon war will no longer be contained to the region around Sol, and no one can consider themselves truly safe from it.

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Looks like we'll actually be hit with Dragon forces directly instead of just shipping our forces off to the front.

I think some people forgot that the stat is named Admin here, not Stewardship.

[] Admin
[X] Learning
[X] Diplomacy

[X] Grandmaster Tamia Jameson- In her role as Grandmaster of the Central Department, Tamia works closely with the Avernite Government on a range of issues. Nurma has often been assigned as her liaison and has been taken under her wing, giving her a better understanding of the psykers that are much of what makes Avernus, and the Imperial Trust as a whole unique.
[X] Chief Administrator Martinus Argall- Nurma has worked closely with Martinus Argall and the Administratum. This has given her a solid understanding of the bureaucracy, and an appreciation for just how well method of delegation works.

Mostly my thinking on these is that Admin probably unlocks the powerful Architect trait line that reduces our construction costs. Learning is more speculative, but anything that boosts Tranth and Tamia in any way would be great. Tamia I selected because the benefits Avernus provides are mostly due to psykers and Tranth. And Tranth was not an option to even compare with.

Diplo added because of potential for powerful buffing traits. And admin we probably won't be building too much.

We should vote somewhat with the priorities outlined in handpicking the Hands.
So either Martial or Administratum with a secondary in something else.

[X] Lord-General Tychon Rakes- Nurma has spent much time working with Lord-General Rakes and Avernite High Command. Under his mentorship she has learned many of the arts of military command, and how to set up a proper defensive position.
[X] Minister of State Kent Cline- The Minister of State has spent much time on Avernus working with the Council of Peoples, and Nurma was often his liaison. In this role she has learned much about diplomacy and how to work with others of different mindsets, a trait often not developed on Avernus.

Ugh. We'd be hunky dory and able to have all the factions focus on rebuilding and fixing their realms, maybe even getting humanity less balkanised, if it weren't for the fucking C'Tan. This is a mess.

The Anatolian, he who was once Emperor, has made it known he'd prefer his return not be revealed to his subjects, but we can safely assume he's got something in the works. The Silent King presumably also has some tricks left up his sleeve, given he was the one who killed the bastard the first time. But those are the only two big additions to our abilities so far. Hopefully it's enough.

I'd say we should make ourselves Nurma's mentor. Rotbart finally retiring is gonna be a massive shock to Avernite society, he's been around since the world was colonised - his heir being his direct student will help lessen the fear and backlash this will lead to. Additionally, while Rotbart is mostly known for being ridiculously good at war, he was an administrator long before he became the greatest mortal General of humanity and has been a Planetary Governor since the last days of the original Imperium. He knows what Nurma will need to learn.

[X] Yourself
[X] Admin

[] Lord-General Tychon Rakes- Nurma has spent much time working with Lord-General Rakes and Avernite High Command. Under his mentorship she has learned many of the arts of military command, and how to set up a proper defensive position.

M, good relationship with generals very important. Character will be defensive/military-minded.

[] Chief Administrator Martinus Argall- Nurma has worked closely with Martinus Argall and the Administratum. This has given her a solid understanding of the bureaucracy, and an appreciation for just how well method of delegation works.

A, good relationship with Admin is important. Character will look at things from a delegation/logistics perspective.

[] Minister of State Kent Cline- The Minister of State has spent much time on Avernus working with the Council of Peoples, and Nurma was often his liaison. In this role she has learned much about diplomacy and how to work with others of different mindsets, a trait often not developed on Avernus.

D, good relationship with Peoples of Avernus. Character look at things from a 'how does this look from their perspective' kind of perspective.

[] Arbitrator Jane Oakheart- Nurma has often been assigned to work beside the Security Forces of Avernus, and their leader Jane Oakheart, whose skills in that field while not as known as her combat skills, are still legendary.
[] Jane Oakheart the Arbiter of Fate- Nurma is a student of the Oakheart School who has had the fortune to study under its founder herself. While she holds only the merest candle of her teacher's unmatched skill, even this is enough to make her one of the more deadly blades on Avernus.

I/C respectively, I don't think they're important beyond 'don't be shit at this'.

[] Fabricator-General Marian Scott- The Imperial Trust's Adeptus Mechanicus is based in the Helheim system, and Nurma has often been appointed to liaise with their leader. In this role she has gained a better understanding of their rather different culture, and how to best work with it.

L, Scott Relationship. Character looks at things from both the Avernite and Mechanicus standpoint.

[] Grandmaster Tamia Jameson- In her role as Grandmaster of the Central Department, Tamia works closely with the Avernite Government on a range of issues. Nurma has often been assigned as her liaison and has been taken under her wing, giving her a better understanding of the psykers that are much of what makes Avernus, and the Imperial Trust as a whole unique.

L/D, Tamia relationship. Character looks at things as well from a 'how does this affect psykers' POV.

[] Grand Vizier Ælfgar Korrapati- Rather then working with one of the branches of the Avernite Government or as a liaison, Nurma spent much of her career working beside the Vizier learning how Avernus is actually run.

No focus. Character looks at things from a 'Big Picture' perspective and 'How Avernus works' perspective.

[] Yourself- You took Nurma as a student and successor long ago, and have taught her what you can of both administration and war over that time.
A/M, Rotbart Relationship (Read: Avernus Rep). Character looks at things from a.. actually not sure.

[X] Admin
[X] Learning

[X] Grandmaster Tamia Jameson- In her role as Grandmaster of the Central Department, Tamia works closely with the Avernite Government on a range of issues. Nurma has often been assigned as her liaison and has been taken under her wing, giving her a better understanding of the psykers that are much of what makes Avernus, and the Imperial Trust as a whole unique.

I feel like the first trait priority should be learning if we are going to pick Tamia better synergy no? Or ....oh wait, the order of these isn't going to matter. nvm

I agree we should prioritize psykers tho---their going to become increasingly common and relevant.

btw: I'm not sure we get to pick a person AND two traits---it grammer implies its one or the other...but this seems to make more sense I think? IDK

edit: I'd also be ok with going a diplo route. I will switch if the two choices here are close tho.

[] Diplomacy
[] Minister of State Kent Cline- The Minister of State has spent much time on Avernus working with the Council of Peoples, and Nurma was often his liaison. In this role she has learned much about diplomacy and how to work with others of different mindsets, a trait often not developed on Avernus.

[X] Chief Administrator Martinus Argall- Nurma has worked closely with Martinus Argall and the Administratum. This has given her a solid understanding of the bureaucracy, and an appreciation for just how well method of delegation works.

[X] Admin
[X] Learning

[X] Chief Administrator Martinus Argall- Nurma has worked closely with Martinus Argall and the Administratum. This has given her a solid understanding of the bureaucracy, and an appreciation for just how well method of delegation works.

[X] Admin
[X] Learning

[X] Grandmaster Tamia Jameson- In her role as Grandmaster of the Central Department, Tamia works closely with the Avernite Government on a range of issues. Nurma has often been assigned as her liaison and has been taken under her wing, giving her a better understanding of the psykers that are much of what makes Avernus, and the Imperial Trust as a whole unique.

[X] Yourself- You took Nurma as a student and successor long ago, and have taught her what you can of both administration and war over that time

gamer50018 said:

The Silent King presumably also has some tricks left up his sleeve, given he was the one who killed the bastard the first time. But those are the only two big additions to our abilities so far. Hopefully it's enough.

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The Silent King never killed the Dragon. The Eldar knocked it out with multiple blackstones, and then Szarekh backstabbed the C'tan. It was suspected that he waited until the Dragon was incapacitated because he feared his betrayal would fail if it were still around. This fear was probably confirmed in universe when the Dragon subverted the Necrons with a crit when they first attacked.

Speaking of the Silent King's enemies,

strauss said:

4) Is it fair to say that if the Nids had hit the galaxy proper it would have been a likely game over, or at the very least would have required blowing up a lot of what was left.
4) yes
if the Necrons had rolled worse
this would be the Dawn of the Devourer
as everyone, inlcuding the Void Dragon and Chaos, fights desperatly not to be eaten

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strauss said:

2) Anything else you're willing to say about Szarekh's possible past experience with Tyranids?
2) he found a galaxy that they had been through
and tried to help defending another

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strauss said:

3) Did he ever intend to come back or was it just for the Nids and he wasn't expecting the eldar to make such a dog's breakfast of the situation?
3) he has actualy returned seeral times over the eons
just, this time rather then doing a basic check of things and finding a Dominion that could stomp the Necrons flat if they decided to wake
he found the dumpster fire that is 40k

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That is some truly horrible timing for the fall of the Eldar. Imagine how badly Szarekh much have shit his shiny metal pants when he realized the Dominion fell just in time for the Tyranids to reach his galaxy.

[X] Learning
[X] Diplomacy

[X] Grandmaster Tamia Jameson- In her role as Grandmaster of the Central Department, Tamia works closely with the Avernite Government on a range of issues. Nurma has often been assigned as her liaison and has been taken under her wing, giving her a better understanding of the psykers that are much of what makes Avernus, and the Imperial Trust as a whole unique.

[X] Learning

[X] Yourself- You took Nurma as a student and successor long ago, and have taught her what you can of both administration and war over that time

[X] Admin
[X] Diplomacy

[X] Grandmaster Tamia Jameson- In her role as Grandmaster of the Central Department, Tamia works closely with the Avernite Government on a range of issues. Nurma has often been assigned as her liaison and has been taken under her wing, giving her a better understanding of the psykers that are much of what makes Avernus, and the Imperial Trust as a whole unique.

[X] Admin
[X] Diplomacy

Some questions for Durin:

1: Is it a reasonable feasibility to try to modify psi-thrones to be capable of being networked together---in exchange for the only thing that psykers on/in the network can do is song weaving?

2: no tech from necrons--but what about tech-samples for high-payoff examples? getting the transcendent time-crytech to take a look at jane's chronomancy widgit and upgrading it, and/or adding their own as a alternative for when jane encounters something that shuts down warp-craft?

3: how much correlation (because the warp is the warp and a lot of this went down inside/adjacent to said realm) is there between team sanity finally 'uniting' with the final major sane faction (the necrons) into The Final Stand of Sanity, with belakor trying--and failing--, to unite chaos behind him (and thus functionally killing chaos undivided)?

3b: since belkor cheats hardcore (much like the eldar, just in his own way(s) obviously), is part of the 'cost' that he paid to make his ritual have any chance at all, an additional "narrative impetus" towards chaos undivided (the thing his ritual was built on) being damaged/'killed' more then would otherwise be the case---all else being equal?

4: I believe we (think?) that events like this allow for a (at least partial) redefinition of the fundamental rules of reality right? does the necrons/eldar/anyone have ANY historical documentation as to any examples/details of what can/could happen during a singularity like this one (whether prior, predicted/guessed or on other galaxy's)? I feel like getting that info put together and shared at this conclave is reasonable here....

5: The necrons willing to give us even a notion of how many other galaxies they visited?

6: of the 90 yrs spent trying to double check Aria's "Aria-ness"; how many was spent trying to figure out how to double-check without risking collapsing the wave function (of what she actually is) in a bad way (example: killing her, damaging her soul irreparably, etc)

7: Considering their probably the resident experts atm; what do the necrons have to say about Aria? (or are we not allowing them a close inspection?) what about the worldship? is her nature just as "impossible" in their model of reality/souls as ours/eldars/Avernus's?

8: How plausable is it that Aria's chimaric nature is a 'glitch' in reality brought on by how much damage is happening? maybe early-onset symptoms/changes being rought by the singularity maybe?

not a question...but the idea of somebody having a soul/mind/body/etc that is somehow 'compatible' with more then one branch of "technological progress" has me wondering what would happen if somebody was somehow able to go down every "branch" simualtaniously (tech, warp, primal, constructed, etc).....it should be a dozen kinds of impossable---but Aria's proof that at least ONE of them is merely improbable.

[X] Minister of State Kent Cline- The Minister of State has spent much time on Avernus working with the Council of Peoples, and Nurma was often his liaison. In this role she has learned much about diplomacy and how to work with others of different mindsets, a trait often not developed on Avernus.

[X] Diplomacy

Delegation is the ultimate superpower

E: Got rid of vote for Admin.

[X] Chief Administrator Martinus Argall- Nurma has worked closely with Martinus Argall and the Administratum. This has given her a solid understanding of the bureaucracy, and an appreciation for just how well method of delegation works.

[X] Minister of State Kent Cline- The Minister of State has spent much time on Avernus working with the Council of Peoples, and Nurma was often his liaison. In this role she has learned much about diplomacy and how to work with others of different mindsets, a trait often not developed on Avernus.

[X] Admin
[X] Diplomacy

I am considering switching admin for learning, and Martinus for Tamia. There are strengths and weaknesses to both.

I wasn't planning on voting but the way the vote is going is kind of driving me nuts since we know for a fact that the Admin as well as Learning stats don't really do anything for the governor anymore, and the good delegation traits as seen with the Khoswe tend to be Diplomacy traits. So, the vote should be going for a Diplomacy primary and an Intrigue secondary vote as they synergize well covering what remains of the governor's duties with Argall as one of the mentors to pick up the delegation trait since those kinds of traits are either among the most powerful or flat out the most powerful kinds of traits.

[X] Minister of State Kent Cline- The Minister of State has spent much time on Avernus working with the Council of Peoples, and Nurma was often his liaison. In this role she has learned much about diplomacy and how to work with others of different mindsets, a trait often not developed on Avernus.
[X] Chief Administrator Martinus Argall- Nurma has worked closely with Martinus Argall and the Administratum. This has given her a solid understanding of the bureaucracy, and an appreciation for just how well method of delegation works.
[X] Diplomacy
[X] Intrigue

[X] Admin
[X] Diplomacy

[X] Chief Administrator Martinus Argall- Nurma has worked closely with Martinus Argall and the Administratum. This has given her a solid understanding of the bureaucracy, and an appreciation for just how well method of delegation works.

[X] Minister of State Kent Cline- The Minister of State has spent much time on Avernus working with the Council of Peoples, and Nurma was often his liaison. In this role she has learned much about diplomacy and how to work with others of different mindsets, a trait often not developed on Avernus.

[X] Grand Vizier Ælfgar Korrapati- Rather then working with one of the branches of the Avernite Government or as a liaison, Nurma spent much of her career working beside the Vizier learning how Avernus is actually run.

I'm not picking learning because that stat is only useful for a ruler if they have a lot of it, and I doubt we can get enough without neglecting other important areas.

I'm split between Chief Admin, Minister of State, and Grand Vizier, so I'll just vote for all of them.

I just realized, the Architect trait would actually not be that useful because most things that we want built have already been built, we can't expand hives on Avernus any further and it's going to take a long time for is to actually hit popcap.

Admin only gives a modest amount of resources at this point. Like Admin Efficiency really isn't that big a deal.

So I removed my vote for Admin. I think Diplomacy is probably where we should focus our efforts on as that's where we have the greatest impact possible.

[X] Minister of State Kent Cline- The Minister of State has spent much time on Avernus working with the Council of Peoples, and Nurma was often his liaison. In this role she has learned much about diplomacy and how to work with others of different mindsets, a trait often not developed on Avernus.
[X] Chief Administrator Martinus Argall- Nurma has worked closely with Martinus Argall and the Administratum. This has given her a solid understanding of the bureaucracy, and an appreciation for just how well method of delegation works.
[X] Diplomacy
[X] Intrigue

[X] Minister of State Kent Cline- The Minister of State has spent much time on Avernus working with the Council of Peoples, and Nurma was often his liaison. In this role she has learned much about diplomacy and how to work with others of different mindsets, a trait often not developed on Avernus.
[X] Chief Administrator Martinus Argall- Nurma has worked closely with Martinus Argall and the Administratum. This has given her a solid understanding of the bureaucracy, and an appreciation for just how well method of delegation works.
[X] Diplomacy
[X] Admin

Enerael said:

Administration
-Should do some multiplying for Helheim systems crazy economy. Always useful for leaders of large organisations besides. Focus here would be on numbers going up to give our armies even better equipment, which multiplies one of our strengths.

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So I feel the need to specifically point out that this is extremely Incorrect. Higher admin does not improve production of resources, it does not multiply anything. It will absolutely not be enough to actually give our armies better equipment, because at this point those are a function of AM/EM/Psyker production which Admin doesn't influence whatsoever.

What Admin does do is lower the consumption of basic resources like Thrones/Food/Material/Metal/Promethium, which while relevant is not anywhere near the point where it can significantly change our calculus on our ability to give our armies better equipment.

[X] Minister of State Kent Cline- The Minister of State has spent much time on Avernus working with the Council of Peoples, and Nurma was often his liaison. In this role she has learned much about diplomacy and how to work with others of different mindsets, a trait often not developed on Avernus.

[X] Diplomacy

[X] Minister of State Kent Cline- The Minister of State has spent much time on Avernus working with the Council of Peoples, and Nurma was often his liaison. In this role she has learned much about diplomacy and how to work with others of different mindsets, a trait often not developed on Avernus.
[X] Chief Administrator Martinus Argall- Nurma has worked closely with Martinus Argall and the Administratum. This has given her a solid understanding of the bureaucracy, and an appreciation for just how well method of delegation works.
[X] Diplomacy
[X] Intrigue