I don't want to join a new colony and bend the knee to some other ant. If we enter a new colony, it should be as a conqueror!
Besides the disagreement on "not being a warlord -> being a servant":
We could also simply make like a tree and leaf if we don't like the conditions.
And once inside it should be easier to deal with them.
We survived one colony brawl, no reason we shouldn't survive an other. Yes, previous was FFA, everyone against everyone else, and now its us against the other colony, but we grew enough since then that non-cultivator ants can't harm us.
 
I am very interested in not starving and having meat shields for predators. If that means we have to spend 2 actions helping them I'd say that's a worthy trade.
 
[X] Plan: Second Farm Time
This isn't working, tally bot thinks you are refering to your version of the plan, because you didn't remove the X from the [] in the post where you defined it.
[X] Plan: Second Farm Time
-[X] Day 35: Try to expand your meager shelter (9/30)
-[X] Day 36: Try to expand your meager shelter (9/30)
-[X] Day 37: Work towards expanding your fungus farm.
Adhoc vote count started by Toboe on Aug 26, 2023 at 2:45 PM, finished with 36 posts and 10 votes.

  • [X] Plan: Using our stored food to buy time to make friends
    -[X] D35: Try to integrate into a new colony (0/??)
    -[X] D36:Try to integrate into a new colony (0/??)
    -[X] D37: Cultivate outside your lair (Medium chance of summoning a ?? Level predator)
    [X] Deposit the black tarry substance far from your lair (0/??)(Medium chance of encountering ??? Level predator. Predator encountered will fight to the death)
    [X] Plan: Second Farm Time
    -[X] Day 35: Try to expand your meager shelter (9/30)
    -[X] Day 36: Try to expand your meager shelter (9/30)
    -[X] Day 37: Work towards expanding your fungus farm.
    [X] Plan: Second Farm Time with cultivation time
    -[X] Day 35: Try to expand your meager shelter (9/30)
    -[X] Day 36: Try to expand your meager shelter (9/30)
    -[X] D37: Cultivate outside your lair (Medium chance of summoning a ?? Level predator)
    [X] Plan: Second Farm Time
    -[X] Day 35: Try to expand your meager shelter (9/30)
    --[X] beetle charge: Try to expand your meager shelter (9/30)
    -[X] Day 36: Work towards expanding your fungus farm.
    -[X] D37: Cultivate outside your lair (Medium chance of summoning a ?? Level predator)
 
Besides the disagreement on "not being a warlord -> being a servant":
We could also simply make like a tree and leaf if we don't like the conditions.
And once inside it should be easier to deal with them.
We survived one colony brawl, no reason we shouldn't survive an other. Yes, previous was FFA, everyone against everyone else, and now its us against the other colony, but we grew enough since then that non-cultivator ants can't harm us.

Then why not take over another colony instead? We have a progress bar for it.

I am very interested in not starving and having meat shields for predators. If that means we have to spend 2 actions helping them I'd say that's a worthy trade.

Mathematically, not really?

It takes us 4-5 actions to get a second farm, at which point we cannot starve batting bad events.

Predators are a vital and useful resource to be encouraged, not something to avoid.

This isn't working, tally bot thinks you are refering to your version of the plan, because you didn't remove the X from the [] in the post where you defined it.

Adhoc vote count started by Toboe on Aug 26, 2023 at 2:45 PM, finished with 36 posts and 10 votes.

  • [X] Plan: Using our stored food to buy time to make friends
    -[X] D35: Try to integrate into a new colony (0/??)
    -[X] D36:Try to integrate into a new colony (0/??)
    -[X] D37: Cultivate outside your lair (Medium chance of summoning a ?? Level predator)
    [X] Deposit the black tarry substance far from your lair (0/??)(Medium chance of encountering ??? Level predator. Predator encountered will fight to the death)
    [X] Plan: Second Farm Time
    -[X] Day 35: Try to expand your meager shelter (9/30)
    -[X] Day 36: Try to expand your meager shelter (9/30)
    -[X] Day 37: Work towards expanding your fungus farm.
    [X] Plan: Second Farm Time with cultivation time
    -[X] Day 35: Try to expand your meager shelter (9/30)
    -[X] Day 36: Try to expand your meager shelter (9/30)
    -[X] D37: Cultivate outside your lair (Medium chance of summoning a ?? Level predator)
    [X] Plan: Second Farm Time
    -[X] Day 35: Try to expand your meager shelter (9/30)
    --[X] beetle charge: Try to expand your meager shelter (9/30)
    -[X] Day 36: Work towards expanding your fungus farm.
    -[X] D37: Cultivate outside your lair (Medium chance of summoning a ?? Level predator)

Cheers! Will edit.
 
Then why not take over another colony instead? We have a progress bar for it.
Because take over is ??? while join is ??.
The range for take over is an order of magnitude over the range for joining.
And it would be weird for us to not be able to take over after joining.
Those are arguments for people who want to conquer not join.

Besides that there is the idea that joining is more interesting than conquering, but that is a different discussion where I'm not sure how fruitful having it would be.
 
Choosing to join now doesn't mean we will always join in future lives. This is so we know what the costs are and what benefits we get in return.

We want knowledge so that we can make fully informed decisions in the future.
 
Because take over is ??? while join is ??.
The range for take over is an order of magnitude over the range for joining.
And it would be weird for us to not be able to take over after joining.
Those are arguments for people who want to conquer not join.

Besides that there is the idea that joining is more interesting than conquering, but that is a different discussion where I'm not sure how fruitful having it would be.

Fair enough, but given where we are in the quest, I'd be shocked if it was more than 100-150.

More broadly, I think we pretty definitely decided against joining another colony with our choice of self-sufficiency via farms. It's odd to see us going back on that decision.

I feel like some voters might be going for this basedin the idea of finding out the DC, but it's two actions - this sorta commits us to joining on another colony. This snacks of the voters bring bamboozled to me.

Hoodwinked!

Rusted!

[Insert other drunken synonyms for bamboozled here]

In all seriousness, I respect where you're coming from, but this is a drastic change of direction for the quest, and we shouldn't do it without extensive debate.

...Which I will not be here for as I'm currently at a Goals gig and Spanish Sahara just started.
 
More broadly, I think we pretty definitely decided against joining another colony with our choice of self-sufficiency via farms. It's odd to see us going back on that decision.
The trait we got for the free farm is only for this life. We lose it when we die and get a new perk based on how we died, Starvation, Combat, or Cultivation.

The only thing we keep forever is knowledge of mechanics and what various actions do.
 
More broadly, I think we pretty definitely decided against joining another colony with our choice of self-sufficiency via farms. It's odd to see us going back on that decision.
Disagree.
Farms have already been worth it for us and were worth picking for that. And would make sense for both "staying alone" and "teaming up" (and "conquer") strategies.
It would make even more sense for it if having chosen farm means we bring that option to the colony we join (imagine they lack a good fungus, like we did before the lucky event that unlocked farm), then the npc ants could help dig more storage and set up farms and I'll just refer to a previous post i made...
actually, we are several times more productive than an ordinary ant and apparently only eat as much as a regular ant does, and if we gathered food 100% of the time we only break even.

How do ants exist?
We'd slightly more than break even:
AVG(1d20)=10.5
.5 progress per turn isn't much, but with a hundred ants that is 50 progress a sheltered-but-no-other-bonuses hive of 100 ants has.
50 progress that could be invested into infrastructure like the farm.
The basic farm gives 1 food per 5 turns
solo scavenging gives 1 Food per 10 progress
-> the basic farm is equivalent to 10 solo-scavenging progress per 5 turns
-> equivalent to 2 solo scavenging progress per turn
-> the effort for the farm pays of in 15 turns (assuming enough storage space for the farm and the produced food, so probably should also consider the cost to dig the storage)

That is ignoring that scavenging would be made up of the steps "find food" and "bring food home before source is lost" (loss of source -> something else eats it, rot takes it).
Solo scavenging means having to both find and haul it alone
In a group many ants work in paralel to find it and once something is found, many ants can then skip the "find food" step and jump to "bring food home", leading to much more efficient scavenging.
 
The trait we got for the free farm is only for this life. We lose it when we die and get a new perk based on how we died, Starvation, Combat, or Cultivation.

The only thing we keep forever is knowledge of mechanics and what various actions do.

My desire to spend another IRl month grinding up from Initial 1st can be measured next to my desire for socks made of ground glass tbh.

Like sure, learning us good, but let's make decisions based on what gives us the best chance if winning this life - honestly I suspect we'll learn more that way than if we assume we're going to die.

(To be clear Tobie, I understand and respect that you think joining a new colony does do this - I just disagree, because among other reasons it seems virtually certain to me that joining another colony will be no free lunch.)
 
Between the lady bug smell, the farm rot and the cultivation gunk making sticking around difficult. Plus the large food surplus we got from the bug it seemed a good time to find a new hole or join a colony.
 
[X] Plan: Gu Jar phase 1 - acquire jar
-[X] Day 35: Take over another colony (0/???)
--[X] beetle charge
-[X] Day 36: Take over another colony (0/???)
--[x] Qi Burst
-[X] D37: Cultivate outside your lair (Medium chance of summoning a ?? Level predator)

Mostly because I think turning the colony into a Gu Jar will be easier if we're in charge.
 
Between the lady bug smell, the farm rot and the cultivation gunk making sticking around difficult. Plus the large food surplus we got from the bug it seemed a good time to find a new hole or join a colony.
We dealt with the farm rot, so that is not an issue anymore.
But wit the new colony we could set up farms based on ours if they don't have any yet.
And we could lead a collection team of ants to our cultivation gunk.

[X] Plan: Gu Jar phase 1 - acquire jar
-[X] Day 35: Take over another colony (0/???)
--[X] beetle charge
-[X] Day 36: Take over another colony (0/???)
--[x] Qi Burst
-[X] D37: Cultivate outside your lair (Medium chance of summoning a ?? Level predator)

Mostly because I think turning the colony into a Gu Jar will be easier if we're in charge.
If you are dead set on pushing for a takeover, you could use the joining as a stepping stone. (take over from the inside)
 
Disagree.
Farms have already been worth it for us and were worth picking for that. And would make sense for both "staying alone" and "teaming up" (and "conquer") strategies.
It would make even more sense for it if having chosen farm means we bring that option to the colony we join (imagine they lack a good fungus, like we did before the lucky event that unlocked farm), then the npc ants could help dig more storage and set up farms and I'll just refer to a previous post i made...

I mean, this could be true, but we have no evidence that it is, and it feels a bit like wishful thinking?

If our colony farmed fungus then given the way ant colonies/species work the null hypothesis is that other similar colonies have it.

Unless they're a completely different species to us, like we were a leafcutter and they're army ants. But given how different ant species tend to interact: in that case we probably aren't integrating; we're conquering.
 
Last edited:
[X] Plan: Second Farm Time

We seem really close to being able to survive indefinitely with just our farms, I'd rather not roll the dice that the joining a colony mechanics will be similarly safe.
 
[X] Plan: Second Farm Time

We seem really close to being able to survive indefinitely with just our farms, I'd rather not roll the dice that the joining a colony mechanics will be similarly safe.
Note that after the 21 progress to expand the storage area, then there is a separate action (building the first was 30 progress, so that will probably be too) needed to build the farm itself.
So we are 51 progress away from having two farms. Many chances for a negative event.
 
We've weathered plenty of negative events before and overcome them, and continued to face heaven alone.

Let's not give up now when we're at the brink of victory over food insecurity forever, in only another few turns of hard work.

If we want to check out another colony, let's do it from a position of being able to choose, rather than feeling forced by food insecurity.

sure.

[X] Plan: Second Farm Time
-[X] Day 35: Try to expand your meager shelter (9/30)
--[X] beetle charge: Try to expand your meager shelter (9/30)
-[X] Day 36: Work towards expanding your fungus farm.
-[X] D37: Cultivate outside your lair (Medium chance of summoning a ?? Level predator)

Might want to add Qi Burst to the cultivation here as well?
 
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