The Azure is a eons old Tyrant who put Sten people's through oppression atleast as great the Tyrant did back in Hunger's home.
To be fair it was the previous ring bearer that did those things. Unless the ring was outright controlling him, of course.

Presumably the ring mostly didn't care one way or the other
 
I don't agree with Sara, but Im not strong enough for Moral Boogaloo: Part 2.

I wonder if Aeira piloting Nova is just a setting feature, or if it is meant as a hint about how Closing the Fist is going to play out in tonight's update. My understanding is that the robot's Rank + Stats are high enough that any pilot will be effective on the battlefield regardless of skill level. That would mean we could deploy Letrizia + Aeira together while Hunger, Gisena, and Aobaru act as a separate combat force.

Aobaru should stay with Gisena because the Sophont Halo's physical Fragility can be offset by Vigorflame. Plus, I trust Hunger to pull a rabbit out of his hat if the Chains curse activates. The rest of the party? Not so much.

Too bad that Adorie's new November Sky aura is Imprisoned by Archmage. Maybe she can be paroled to the Robot strike force?
 
To be fair it was the previous ring bearer that did those things. Unless the ring was outright controlling him, of course.

Unless your someone like Hunger and Gisena, that is generally the default, and even Hunger is basically as much the ring as the man at this point. It's literally his name and identity, after all.

But that besides the point, since the ring centric interludes outlined that yes, the Azure was the driving factor back in those days.
 
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It's probably worthwhile to point out that Hunger has canonically did things comparable to kidnapping children as hostages to compel their parents as per the Temple Arc to defeat The Tyrant, and this is causing far less death then say, the War Crime:Okay method of conquest that's gotten so much praise after it thankfully lost the vote. The Azure is a eons old Tyrant who put Sten people's through oppression atleast as great the Tyrant did back in Hunger's home. While that doesn't justify the sheer torture it went through, especially since said torture also caused the deaths of countless other beings slaughtered by the Temple's people over millenia, it's not exactly a innocent actor.

So, it's not really that out of character to Hunger in my eyes.
well put Sara, I completely agree! Though I also agree with Pittauro's point that it's notable how the ring's death was discussed so casually

Unless the ring was outright controlling him, of course.
it's my understanding that it was, yes
I think 'Ring-slave' was the term?
 
Tyranny
Tyranny

What is Hunger's strategy for taking the battle to Dien? All strategies below will be executed competently due to Breaker of Suns, with input from Gisena and the others in their areas of specialty. Tactics can still help, however!

What is the purpose of Gisena's findross suffusion? Note that this effect will not persist if the Sophont Halo is destroyed.

[ ] Might Alone - While suffused with findross, Hunger's effective Rank is increased by a further 0.5. As she does not benefit from Once and Future's hyper-scaling, even this increase requires a monumental effort to effect, given the heights of Hunger's current power. Stacks with Supreme Commander, Once and Future etc.

[ ] Spark of Prowess - While suffused with findross, Hunger will gain a broad baseline level of proficiency within all of his domains, substantially increasing the complexity and sophistication of his magical effects. Adds a flat bonus to Hunger's current level of skill regardless of how capable he is, short of true mastery.

What is Hunger's proposed strategy?

[ ] War Across the Stars - Hunger will focus his initial training on a specific array of domains intended to enable the creation of a truly staggering number of wraith-constructs. Each holding his visage and a small fraction of his overall power, this phantasmal menace will spread throughout Republic space to reclaim territory and effectively proliferate the effects of Supreme Commander. Each phantasmal wraith possesses 10% of Hunger's physical and 50% of his mental and social parameters before Praxis use, and can wield Pressure at his Rank -2 levels, or at the present level of Supreme Commander in their locality. They do not benefit from the Praxis except that they receive 0.1 ISH elevation to speed from the Attainment of Quickness and one-tenth the benefits of the Refinement of Battle (currently x2.1 to their offensive and defensive final parameters).

Similarly muted versions of his other magics exist on each such clone, save for his Soul Evocation; given Might Alone, each should be near to a match for an Armament outside its shroud. Hunger estimates he can maintain roughly ~1 billion of them at a time; with Spark of Prowess, losses will be replenished in short order.

Strike teams will further pursue Dien's outflung contingencies to track, parse, and catalog his myriad contingencies. When the noose is tightened sufficiently, a final broadside of constructs, a veritable attack of the clones, will descend upon Dien and enact the revenge of all humanity upon the Surgeon's final redoubt.

An army of clones will not just serve to efficiently utilize Supreme Commander, it will also act as an occupation force for the subsequent conquest of the Human Sphere, ensuring an easy transition of power with minimal or no casualties. By flooding Dien with an unending stream of expendable, yet surprisingly powerful combatants, he can tie up the Surgeon's own resources, freeing up Hunger to continue advancing in his mastery of the Archmage Soul Evocation until victory is inevitable.

Turnabout is the fairest play of all - wouldn't you say so, Hero?

[ ] And I'll Form, the Head - Concentrate on the domains of Essence and Union in order to successfully perform Closing the Fist on Hunger, Novakhron, The Ring of Blood, the Forebear's Blade and the Evening Sky. The resultant entity will have Novakhron's base stats and the Ring's primacy, augmented by the full weight of Hunger's magics and Praxis techniques, with the destructive ferocity of the Forebear's Blade and the vast reach of the Evening Sky, all exponentiated by the power of Closing the Fist. By virtue of encompassing the entire volume affected by his Rank, this giga-conglomerate ultrabeing will expand at the speed of Supreme Commander, and simply engulf Dien wheresoever he resides, eventually. The sheer lunatic power of this fusion is all-but guaranteed to bring Dien to a close, but playing this card now invites Apocryphal escalation in the future, to say nothing of the potential collateral damage to the Human Sphere... take care you do not unmake or transmute into un-recognizability the very realm you are supposed to rule!

This is only possible with Might Alone, and marginally at that. After the fusion recedes Hunger won't be able to re-attempt this procedure for several decades at minimum.

[ ] Overlord - Focus on accelerating the feedback loop of Progression by directing all of Hunger's efforts towards comprehensive self-augmentation via the power of the Archmage. High-pick fights in the Realm itself will become only more dangerous as Hunger diverts resources from recovery towards pure augmentation, but it is simply too dangerous to pursue any individual strategy when Dien's countermeasures are unknown. When in doubt, pursue power: the ability to fulfill instrumental goals no matter what their idiosyncratic nature. Hunger will focus on attempting to increase his Attributes, the power of his magics, and his Rank in the pursuit of complete supremacy: domination of Dien in every field of endeavour, and thus victory inevitable given time. One he emerges from the Realm and can gather more data via his vastly expanded domains, a more specific strategy can be enacted.

With Might Alone - Power begets power. Significant enhancements made to Supreme Commander and November Sky, likely the most relevant magics in halting Dien's expansion.
With Spark of Prowess - Proficiency lends itself well to operations of a delicate nature. Effectiveness of Mental and Social Attribute augmentations enhanced.

[ ] Quick to Anger - But not particularly subtle. Focus unceasingly on three core areas: finding Dien, traveling to where Dien is, and putting Dien down for good. All else can wait. The consistency and strategic vision of this choice are its strengths; its potential myopia and lack of raw conceptual power its potential weaknesses. Still, there is much to be said for decisively pursuing one's objective, even if one's capacity may be insufficient: is that not the story of Hunger himself, after all?

What ought be done to those things which cannot be cut? Cut through, even so. So it is with Heroes as well. The fastest overall strategy if successful, focused monotonically on Dien's defeat. There's much to be said for limiting your opponent's scope of action...

Both of Gisena's buffs are helpful here.

[ ] The Killing Blow - Attempt via esoteric means to create some sort of Astral hyper-virus capable of eradicating Dien itself. Where he hides will matter not, if it is targeted properly, and you've plenty of samples of his work to operate from. Dien expects overwhelming brute force from you; the path of subtlety and technical prowess would run counter to his predictions, but perhaps not his precautions. It will be no trivial thing to slay the Foremost in this manner, very nearly his arena of strength, but even if you fail you still hold the offensive position by virtue of being personally invincible against Dien's counterattacks. What's the harm in trying, especially as this will create a perfect training opportunity for the higher echelons of Archmage mastery?

Spark of Prowess recommended. Gisena will lend her genius to atttempt as well, of course!
 
[ ] Might Alone - While suffused with findross, Hunger's effective Rank is increased by a further 0.5. As she does not benefit from Once and Future's hyper-scaling, even this increase requires a monumental effort to effect, given the heights of Hunger's current power. Stacks with Supreme Commander, Once and Future etc.
Impressive. Currently we're at roughly 10.5 Military Rank, so this would bring us to roughly 11 Military Rank. No small deal.

However...
[ ] Spark of Prowess - While suffused with findross, Hunger will gain a broad baseline level of proficiency within all of his domains, substantially increasing the complexity and sophistication of his magical effects. Adds a flat bonus to Hunger's current level of skill regardless of how capable he is, short of true mastery.
While raw rank fuels the potency of Ring-casting, finesse is the reason why we got Archmage in the first place. I'm leaning towards this.
 
[X] Might Alone
[X] Spark of Prowess
[X] War Across the Stars
[X] And I'll Form, the Head
[X] Overlord
[X] Quick to Anger
[X] The Killing Blow


I've wanted to do this for a while, but Aeira'ing Zampano requires the Refinement of Quickness. This is an interesting array of choices, though I can already tell I'm not going to vote for Form the Head. Risk of Apocryphal escalation and task failure? In one option? No thanks.
 
[ ] The Killing Blow - Attempt via esoteric means to create some sort of Astral hyper-virus capable of eradicating Dien itself. Where he hides will matter not, if it is targeted properly, and you've plenty of samples of his work to operate from. Dien expects overwhelming brute force from you; the path of subtlety and technical prowess would run counter to his predictions, but perhaps not his precautions. It will be no trivial thing to slay the Foremost in this manner, very nearly his arena of strength, but even if you fail you still hold the offensive position by virtue of being personally invincible against Dien's counterattacks. What's the harm in trying, especially as this will create a perfect training opportunity for the higher echelons of Archmage mastery?
You know, given the Sophont Halo improved the Attribute bonus, as well as the +1 to Sealing Protocol level improving her crafting-related Graces, Gisena's in a good position to help us quite a bit, I think.

This very well could work.

Though, currently I'm leaning towards War Across the Stars for now. The idea of a barrage of Hungers just spamming across the galaxy is too amusing to miss out on. Imagine Dien's reaction?

[X] Spark of Prowess
[X] War Across the Stars
 
[X] Spark of Prowess

We have a bunch of magics that we barely know how to use. Let's fix that.

[X] Quick to Anger

Find Dien, get to Dien, and kill Dien. Those are the goals and this gives us the means.
 
Each phantasmal wraith possesses 10% of Hunger's physical and 50% of his mental and social parameters before Praxis use, and can wield Pressure at his Rank -2 levels, or at the present level of Supreme Commander in their locality. They do not benefit from the Praxis except that they receive 0.1 ISH elevation to speed from the Attainment of Quickness and one-tenth the benefits of the Refinement of Battle (currently x2.1 to their offensive and defensive final parameters).
For those who are curious, this'd place them as Rank 8.5 combatants with solid physical stats for their tier. Might Alone would bring them to Rank 9 tho, so tbh I might have to switch to that to make it more viable.

This is a world where stronger combatants tend to overwhelm even masses of weaker ones, after all, and in the High Ranks even a difference of 0.5 counts as Overwhelming.

Bastion-boosted Hero Defeating Stance quarters this effect, ofc. Though, that might get nerfed by the cloning process, in retrospect.

EDIT: Though, due to Supreme Commander, this whole assault will have Hunger's full Rank supporting the endeavor. That should be taken into account, I think.
 
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Proposed modification: War across the Stars's is described as involving training so as to create the Wraiths; rather then use Spark of Prowess to execute the strategy with greater sustainability, I propose to select Spark, and War, but only preform it to the degree he would with Might, and use the remaining time on either The Killing Blow or Overlord, depending on just how substantially the time to attain might-level skill is reduced by the choice of Spark (where if spark is essentially sufficient to preform War across the Stars with no further training I propose The Killing Blow, and if it's only to half or so, I advise Overlord). Even if the lessened War is unlikely to be lethal, tying up the majority of Diens resources is no small thing, the Supreme Commander scaling puts us in a better position as time passes, and if done well may buy more time than it costs.

[X] Spark of Prowess
[X] War Across The Stars (Lesser)
[X] Overlord
(I suspect the time-save isn't as high as I'd hope, so my vote is for what will be acceptable either way.)
 
I'm going to wait on voting until I've got a better sense of people's arguments for each option.
 
Something about War Across The Stars makes me laugh.

A billion of Hunger's shadow clones.

Assuming Hunger was isekaid prior to Shippuden. Oh man. He's gonna be the Forebear one day.
 
No, he didn't. The only person involved in that fusion is Hunger himself, the rest is his artifacts, rather than his allies.
Then it mirrors Diens ascent all the more, for just as in Diens case, the components as a class scarcely have the will to resist him; they perhaps were separate once, but now each is Facet of Hunger, the Hunger that Was, the Hunger that Grows, the Hunger that Protects, The Hunger that strives through boundless challenge, and binding them all together the Lord Hunger who is once and future the Forebearer, who twice sacrificed his name for power and twice took up a new one, who wishes well to his polities and despises those who strike them down, who shall Cut Through an ever-expanding spiral of things until he can Cut all through every ontology and structure, and in rising up shall cast down the boundless procession of those who have wrong him and his.

(I don't actually believe Nova, at least, is part of Hunger to that degree, but I treat him as a portion for the sake of describing it as all the more a thematic mirror.)
 
[X] Might Alone
[X] Spark of Prowess

[X] War Across the Stars
[X] The Killing Blow
I'm not sure whether Crimson Flare's +Progression(Blood) got turned into +Progression(Magic). What I do know is that Archmage advancements will help feed my ever-increasing avarice for magic blurbs. Prowess + Killing Blow are the immediate favorites.

The only thing that's holding me back is the dramatic irony that we've burned ourselves on when we failed to take +Rank options recently. Regalia of Strife pairs better with Might Alone + War Across the Stars. If there's anything I like as much as magic blurbs, it is a well-oiled character sheet.

For now, I'm going to vote for Killing Blow because you have to vote for the things you want to see. Effortpost incoming tomorrow, while I'm stuck at the county courthouse for my first-ever Jury Duty.
[X] Spark of Prowess
[X] The Killing Blow
 
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