I would feel much better about either pick if we end up getting Flare in time. Assuming we go with Marshall, we will likely fight in two updates(if it comes to combat) and we are currently 7.9 Arete + debt away from Flare(which can be snap-bought). Generating 8 Arete in two updates is not easy, however.
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A Simple Transaction I
- Thread starter Rihaku
- Start date
- Original
OctarineShrike
Avatar of Mandos
The most powerful albeit risky thing to do with a ring is give it to a companion.
A Simple Transaction I Original
Letrizia vs Gisena is ironically the most contested part of this vote, almost! And with less argument power per side than the monster fight votes, so each individual argument has more influence, too! You will have to graduate from murderhobo status some day... but, perhaps, not today! Today is...
forums.sufficientvelocity.com
DkArthas
CAPITAL IS TO BLAME
- Location
- Earth
- Pronouns
- They
Avecarn is the hardest to fool because of Rank disparity and he is also potentially capable of utterly breaking us if we don't get Magic + Hero defeating Stance(that means 7-14 arete!) when/if we fight, even than it would still be an uphill battle that we can lose.
Some arete spent upfront for safety is more than worth it here. I would argue it's the path with the greatest chance of getting an EFB in the temple.
Some arete spent upfront for safety is more than worth it here. I would argue it's the path with the greatest chance of getting an EFB in the temple.
- Location
- Omniverse #1345
We can generate 8 arete in one update. With none of the bonuses from Rihaku's patreon in play.
The issue is sufficient motivation.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
[X] Selune vi Tries [Cost: 4 Arete]
I think I'm more worried about the prospect of being attacked by Gondar than most, and more interested in actually infiltrating. The Marshal seems too tough, and maybe not that easy to fool- we might have to crash-spend MORE than four Arete to cope!
I think I'm more worried about the prospect of being attacked by Gondar than most, and more interested in actually infiltrating. The Marshal seems too tough, and maybe not that easy to fool- we might have to crash-spend MORE than four Arete to cope!
On the other hand, we've used Wraith Form repeatedly to beat opponents in the temple; he may know we have it. He may stalk and observe us in combat, though at this point not much in the Outer and Middle Temples is likely to be capable of killing us, so it might not come up. And if his first shot fails, well, I think it'd be very unwise to assume he can't shoot to good effect more than once, or break contact somehow and shoot again. "Ranger" does not equal "static gun emplacement!"
All I know is I sure as skippy HOPE Gondar can't duplicate that "shoot from a dozen places at once" trick.
- Location
- Omniverse #1345
Magic defeating stance is apparently not very helpful against him. Hero defeating stance would probably let us fight him evenly.
DkArthas
CAPITAL IS TO BLAME
- Location
- Earth
- Pronouns
- They
Hero Defeating stance would make his Rank advantage bearable while Magic defeating Stance would neutralise his Soul evocation. I suspect we are going to need both. Our superior stats should take care of him after that.
- Location
- Omniverse #1345
Okay, so
The High Marshall is probably the best option if we get to 25 arete before we meet him and instant-buy the Ring upgrade. 1.5 rank is still massive, but our blood buffs and debuffs would be .5 rank over his, and our stat advantage starts huge, and rank can only do so much when your enemy is far faster, stronger, etc.
Therefore everyone voting for the High Marshall now has a charge: We proved when we got Cut through we can generate over 8 arete in a single update. We need to approximately repeat that feat here. If Rihaku is being generous we get 2 updates to do it over, in which case it is relatively easy.
Ignoring the fight aspect, socially we would be at a significantly lesser disadvantage against him via the improved rank, and we can probably debuff his socials to a degree without it being obvious.
The High Marshall is probably the best option if we get to 25 arete before we meet him and instant-buy the Ring upgrade. 1.5 rank is still massive, but our blood buffs and debuffs would be .5 rank over his, and our stat advantage starts huge, and rank can only do so much when your enemy is far faster, stronger, etc.
Therefore everyone voting for the High Marshall now has a charge: We proved when we got Cut through we can generate over 8 arete in a single update. We need to approximately repeat that feat here. If Rihaku is being generous we get 2 updates to do it over, in which case it is relatively easy.
Ignoring the fight aspect, socially we would be at a significantly lesser disadvantage against him via the improved rank, and we can probably debuff his socials to a degree without it being obvious.
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That required a pretty dramatic confluence of events tbh. But well, whatever. I am committed to 5k words of reaction today, if a bunch more people do the same, we can output some good numbers. It doesn't even matter what wins, anything over 4 arete would provide is with a pretty good amount of slack.
Bonuses from patreon?
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- Location
- Brazil
Clearly, our is the most fearsome stance of all: the self-defeating stance. Not taking the synergetic option when it's staring at our face. And the GM explicitly calling it so.
[X] Selune vi Tries [Cost: 4 Arete]
[X] Evening Sky: Silver of Evening - 25 Arete (1 pick)
Reminder that we have a 2 arete option that transforms our charisma into protection. If both synergize, I think we have 8? Charisma(if someone knows please tell me)
So, 160% charisma, rouglly 20.4 charisma. We would, on top of doubling agi, multiply our protection ten-fold, on top of our already crazy high-stats. Our protection would go from our current 2? To 23.
No, seriously, evening sky costed 7 arete and gave us a fraction of this protection. If it does work like that, it's an absolute steal. 27 arete for 21 protection.
[X] Selune vi Tries [Cost: 4 Arete]
[X] Evening Sky: Silver of Evening - 25 Arete (1 pick)
Reminder that we have a 2 arete option that transforms our charisma into protection. If both synergize, I think we have 8? Charisma(if someone knows please tell me)
So, 160% charisma, rouglly 20.4 charisma. We would, on top of doubling agi, multiply our protection ten-fold, on top of our already crazy high-stats. Our protection would go from our current 2? To 23.
No, seriously, evening sky costed 7 arete and gave us a fraction of this protection. If it does work like that, it's an absolute steal. 27 arete for 21 protection.
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LordOfMurder
Bhaal
- Location
- Australia
Yeah getting our rank up is a prereq if we want to take the rank option of the EFB trinity and Crimson Flare offers us a nice jump up to 5 to make that more doable.
OctarineShrike
Avatar of Mandos
I'm tempted.(edit: was referring to Xalvitors remarks)
[X] Selune vi Tries [Cost: 4 Arete]
[X] Evening Sky: Silver of Evening - 25 Arete (1 pick)
[X] Selune vi Tries [Cost: 4 Arete]
[X] Evening Sky: Silver of Evening - 25 Arete (1 pick)
- Location
- Omniverse #1345
At least one person appears to have been crazy enough to sign up for his $120/month tier. And, well...
If he's just giving this for every 120/month he's getting rather than just for individuals staying in that tier it's, uh, higher. At least double, probably triple.
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DkArthas
CAPITAL IS TO BLAME
- Location
- Earth
- Pronouns
- They
We might even be able to take a look at the method through which this civilization access there Soul evocations! All we need to do to get access to all the sweet lore and other shit they might have is to successfully infiltrate. I don't want to give up at this point...
Well, it sure beats rolling for waifus in FGO at least.
- Location
- Omniverse #1345
This is accurate.
But anyway, yeah, 8 arete is actually reachable if we are willing to push for that.
LordOfMurder
Bhaal
- Location
- Australia
Most of the power of silver is in the stat boost, which gives 60% to all stats and 160% to agi and cha with our current level of proficiency in Edeldross which we can boost to 100% all stats and 200% agi and cha for short bursts. That's an extremely powerful boost to our capabilites in every way and it scales with every + we take to every stat as well as with our proficiency in Edeldross. Total Eclipse doesn't give any power up front since a pure potential and Silver of Evening doesn't give as much potential because it's almost a pure power EFB.
- Location
- Brazil
Actually, just to confirm, does vigor incarnate transform our effective charisma into protection, or only the +? @Rihaku
If it's the former, then it's Indeed 27 arete for absolutely insane protection, more so than any single combo or option that we have seen so far.
If we take vanguard later, this would all but guarantee the safety of our companions too.
If it's the former, then it's Indeed 27 arete for absolutely insane protection, more so than any single combo or option that we have seen so far.
If we take vanguard later, this would all but guarantee the safety of our companions too.
DkArthas
CAPITAL IS TO BLAME
- Location
- Earth
- Pronouns
- They
I am uncomfortable depending on massive arete generation in a couple of updates for our plans. We should take an path that does not require that overmuch.
- Location
- Omniverse #1345
All such bonuses apply to only the +'s. (as you've realized it's utterly broken if it applies any other way, as that stacks the % boosts on top of themselves.). The 100% thing would probably apply, but the 60% part would not, as the 60% is an active boost Hunger is maintaining.
Shrug. We can tell if we're going to make it or not. But you'll notice I'm not actually voting for this path. I'm saying it is the requirement if you want to actually meet the High Marshall, unless you have some very smooth talking to do.
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- Location
- The savanna.
[X] Selune vi Tries [Cost: 4 Arete]
[X] The Ring of Power: Crimson Flare
Arete cost fucking hurts, but this doesn't put us below 10, we can still grab a couple blade FBs on the fly if shit goes sideways. It's steep but puts us in a good position to learn a lot about the Inners and Gisena should be powering up any day now, so we'll have superhuman man/app on our side too.
[X] The Ring of Power: Crimson Flare
Arete cost fucking hurts, but this doesn't put us below 10, we can still grab a couple blade FBs on the fly if shit goes sideways. It's steep but puts us in a good position to learn a lot about the Inners and Gisena should be powering up any day now, so we'll have superhuman man/app on our side too.
- Location
- Pindorama
I have already gone at length about the incredible power of EFBs and how they are the most efficient way we can spend Arete. 4 Arete here is a significant price to pay, basically 2 updates worth. I really don't think paying is necessary compared to taking our chance with the other two guys.
Plus, having to convince another person of the evils of the Temple or essentially break their heart and have to possibly kill Letrizia's distant relationship is not a complication I want to have. This infiltration might take long enough as is. This would be much easier if she wasn't as superhuman manipulator; if we try to explain ourselves at the wrong time the whole thing can come crashing down; That extra four Arete we spent could become really important if we are revealed due to Apocryphal.
Don't mission-creep this thing by trying to add yet another minion; just end their civilization and go. Keep it simple.
Plus, having to convince another person of the evils of the Temple or essentially break their heart and have to possibly kill Letrizia's distant relationship is not a complication I want to have. This infiltration might take long enough as is. This would be much easier if she wasn't as superhuman manipulator; if we try to explain ourselves at the wrong time the whole thing can come crashing down; That extra four Arete we spent could become really important if we are revealed due to Apocryphal.
Don't mission-creep this thing by trying to add yet another minion; just end their civilization and go. Keep it simple.
- Location
- Philippines
As it was mentioned before, from both ends, it would be prudent to reiterate some stuff for Gondar (which I cannot see as anything or anyone else besides that of Bounty Hunter from Dota1/2)
Gondar is, in the ways that matter, representative of something akin to Pre-Hunger during his guerrilla days. Alternatively, he's also like a different flavor of Shadowcord, whose name we have yet to still actually learn. Shadowcord is a goddamn mouthful. He excels at basically being a Hunter. He is stealthy, he is treacherous, and though he's like bffs with Vanreir, I doubt he holds any equivalent value of 'honor' like Van did.
And, as already noted in a previous thread post, fighting Gondar is the equivalent of being harassed day in and day out. That's without even taking into account whatever bullshit Soul Evocation he has. Even if he was within Hunger's sphere of actionable influence, we'd have a terribly hard time balancing protection, chasing, and murdering the twit.
We have a ton of loss conditions. (Well, not really but a lot of those possibilities is gonna hurt the voterbase where it matters.) Gondar only has one. (Probably.)
And yeah, sure. We might have Wraith Form to survive an alpha strike. Gisena, Letrizia, and Shadowcord doesn't. And having to fight him outside? While being reasonably unaware? Just. Ouch. We can probably trip him up with social. Sure. But that means getting into some kind of accord that doesn't end up with any of our less defendable teammates at arrow point. Add on to the fact that he's literally "The Arrow." If he's got conceptual bullshit about "piercing through" (which is becoming painfully common) and "never straying from his path" (goddamnit), trying to change his mind is gonna be one whole truckload of "plot armor" to ablate it.
Age and Treachery...might not be enough in this case.
Alternatively, the fight will still be outnumbered against Gondar. There's a bunch of hoops that the guy still needs to pass over to actually be in a position to hurt us. We've got our own cloaking device too, albeit at a disadvantage since I highly doubt Shadowcord's ability can substantially overcome the rank difference. There are more vectors of danger (Letz in Verse, Gisena saying "no u" to esoteric stuff, Shadowcord trying to be Batman) that Gondar would have to face to get at us, and that would drive him to a state of mind that, if our WiS/Wits was high enough, we could take advantage of.
Also we have a fucking giant ass robot. Unless Gondar has an Anti-Skyscraper Noble Phantasm Soul Evocation skill tree, we can just have everyone get inside the Cockpit aside from Hunger and do what giant evil robots piloted by cutesy tsundere teenagers do best.
...basically, the disadvantages and advantages of the fight are highly dependent on how good we can bullshit our way into the upper hand. Par the course for most of our fights, really but I thought it'd be nice to lay my not-quite-definitive understanding of the pros and cons of fighting Gondar.
500 words if it helps.
Really need to keep doing more of these to not suddenly go into crippling arete debt.
Gondar is, in the ways that matter, representative of something akin to Pre-Hunger during his guerrilla days. Alternatively, he's also like a different flavor of Shadowcord, whose name we have yet to still actually learn. Shadowcord is a goddamn mouthful. He excels at basically being a Hunter. He is stealthy, he is treacherous, and though he's like bffs with Vanreir, I doubt he holds any equivalent value of 'honor' like Van did.
And, as already noted in a previous thread post, fighting Gondar is the equivalent of being harassed day in and day out. That's without even taking into account whatever bullshit Soul Evocation he has. Even if he was within Hunger's sphere of actionable influence, we'd have a terribly hard time balancing protection, chasing, and murdering the twit.
We have a ton of loss conditions. (Well, not really but a lot of those possibilities is gonna hurt the voterbase where it matters.) Gondar only has one. (Probably.)
And yeah, sure. We might have Wraith Form to survive an alpha strike. Gisena, Letrizia, and Shadowcord doesn't. And having to fight him outside? While being reasonably unaware? Just. Ouch. We can probably trip him up with social. Sure. But that means getting into some kind of accord that doesn't end up with any of our less defendable teammates at arrow point. Add on to the fact that he's literally "The Arrow." If he's got conceptual bullshit about "piercing through" (which is becoming painfully common) and "never straying from his path" (goddamnit), trying to change his mind is gonna be one whole truckload of "plot armor" to ablate it.
Age and Treachery...might not be enough in this case.
Alternatively, the fight will still be outnumbered against Gondar. There's a bunch of hoops that the guy still needs to pass over to actually be in a position to hurt us. We've got our own cloaking device too, albeit at a disadvantage since I highly doubt Shadowcord's ability can substantially overcome the rank difference. There are more vectors of danger (Letz in Verse, Gisena saying "no u" to esoteric stuff, Shadowcord trying to be Batman) that Gondar would have to face to get at us, and that would drive him to a state of mind that, if our WiS/Wits was high enough, we could take advantage of.
Also we have a fucking giant ass robot. Unless Gondar has an Anti-Skyscraper
...basically, the disadvantages and advantages of the fight are highly dependent on how good we can bullshit our way into the upper hand. Par the course for most of our fights, really but I thought it'd be nice to lay my not-quite-definitive understanding of the pros and cons of fighting Gondar.
500 words if it helps.
Really need to keep doing more of these to not suddenly go into crippling arete debt.
...
Last vote: we'll get an EFB soon, no way Shadowlord is comparable to that.
This vote: Let's pay more than half its cost for a safety option, which together with Edeldross Adept costs nearly as much.
That was a quick turnaround.
Last vote: we'll get an EFB soon, no way Shadowlord is comparable to that.
This vote: Let's pay more than half its cost for a safety option, which together with Edeldross Adept costs nearly as much.
That was a quick turnaround.