Game, Set, [MAFIA]

Do people like pointless polls with their mafia?

  • Yes.

    Votes: 7 24.1%
  • No.

    Votes: 2 6.9%
  • I didn't answer this.

    Votes: 7 24.1%
  • Wynaut?

    Votes: 13 44.8%

  • Total voters
    29
Let's get some more positions marked out to start building.

ATM, I'm suspect on IH for the negative reaction to me earlier (though very slight here, since the sell on that tracks), Deviljho for being noncommital and enthusiastic and Meso for being Meso.

@ondine @Young Pyromancer @Cyricubed @Totadileplayz @Tykan @mesonoxian Between IH, Deviljho and Meso, who'd you vote if you had a gun to your head right now and why?

@Swarmingu why are you picking me to vote?
Honestly, I don't know anyone well enough to vote on someone for deviating from usual behavior. Devil talking about game balance was the weirdest bit for me. We're playing the game now, whether it's balanced or not doesn't matter. Arguing about isn't going to make things better.
[X] vote LostDeviljho
 
If the game is unbalanced, or balanced, there's no way to change that now. The game has started. There's no point in discussing the game balance right now.
 
If the game is unbalanced, or balanced, there's no way to change that now. The game has started. There's no point in discussing the game balance right now.
Changing it isn't the point of discussing it, though? The point of discussing it is knowing where we stand.

I don't think what you're saying is suspicious, it's just wtf incomprehensible to me. It's entirely counter to my own feelings on the subject. :confused:
 
I find it uncomfortable how many people seem to have faked up actual justifications for Devil already and I do not think I'll.be voting there today.

Can I choose the bullet? Dying over a debate seems like my way to go.

You never choose to die unless you know you're less valuable to the town for a fact. Which is almost always impossible and certainly is day one. Your goal as town is to kill wolves full stop. If you're town you know for a 100% fact that you're town. So you should be last on the list of who you're willing to let die.

Are you a newbie totodile?
 
I find it uncomfortable how many people seem to have faked up actual justifications for Devil already and I do not think I'll.be voting there today.



You never choose to die unless you know you're less valuable to the town for a fact. Which is almost always impossible and certainly is day one. Your goal as town is to kill wolves full stop. If you're town you know for a 100% fact that you're town. So you should be last on the list of who you're willing to let die.

Are you a newbie totodile?
Until this game. I've played this game 2 different times, my first time I was a neutral who allied with the wolves. With The Wolves split up, I pretty much just listened to the others to make us win. I fulfilled my personal victory condition through sheer luck on the first night. I then played my second game here, where I had to play up my newbishness because I had no concept of how to play this game, since I didn't really need to on the first game. Now here the first time I've actually played town. I know for a fact I'm useless in this game. I'm a terrible investigator, and that's what you really need on town side. I've picked up some tricks but they're only useful as an adversary. Personal playstyle I am a negative asset. I am only even kinda good as a wolf.

That Being Said I do have a role that I do believe can be of some use maybe. Not definitely, but it's possible. My only positive asset to town is that role. As a result.... That's why I answered it that way. I don't know any of their roles. Since I don't truly believe any of them are scum, and they probably have more experience then me. I'd basically be better off dead then the other 3 so long as my belief none of them is scum was correct.
 
Changing it isn't the point of discussing it, though? The point of discussing it is knowing where we stand.

I don't think what you're saying is suspicious, it's just wtf incomprehensible to me. It's entirely counter to my own feelings on the subject

I want to boil it down to new player perspective. I agree with LDJ that knowing where we stand as town is a good idea. That being said let me put out my thoughts.

1: I'm hoping we don't have all 3 fools. It'll make any potential watchers/Lookouts less effective and add confusion.
2: Whom ever the cop may be if we have one please be careful with your findings. You might be finding townies guilty and scum inno thanks to that Laywer. So along those lines use a combination of results and social deduction please. Don't be a blind cop. :p
3: Bulletproof if you exist callout if you got attacked, there is 0 reason to not do so.
4: BG if you exist and if you survive attacks...don't call out you did so. Your better off not being revealed.

More to come as I think on things. Eating atm.
 
Changing it isn't the point of discussing it, though? The point of discussing it is knowing where we stand.

I don't think what you're saying is suspicious, it's just wtf incomprehensible to me. It's entirely counter to my own feelings on the subject. :confused:
It's not that figuring out the roles and stuff isn't important, it's just that complaining about game balance doesn't matter.
That Being Said I do have a role that I do believe can be of some use maybe. Not definitely, but it's possible. My only positive asset to town is that role. As a result.... That's why I answered it that way. I don't know any of their roles. Since I don't truly believe any of them are scum, and they probably have more experience then me. I'd basically be better off dead then the other 3 so long as my belief none of them is scum was correct.
So you're saying you don't trust your analysis, but trust others because you believe they're innocent. That seems weird to me. Also, if you were village, you're less likely to say you had a good role, as that seems like just inviting the Mafs to kill you this night. As my prior vote is super flimsy, I guess I might as well
[X] vote Totadileplayz
 
It's not that figuring out the roles and stuff isn't important, it's just that complaining about game balance doesn't matter.

So you're saying you don't trust your analysis, but trust others because you believe they're innocent. That seems weird to me. Also, if you were village, you're less likely to say you had a good role, as that seems like just inviting the Mafs to kill you this night. As my prior vote is super flimsy, I guess I might as well
[X] vote Totadileplayz
Ironically, the fact I'm doing this cements that I'm a town. Since, I know how to play as a wolf. And I never said I had a good role. I simply stated I had a role that is probably my best attribute to town, since I'm not good in what a vanilla town should be able to do. All Roles Besides Fool are pretty much still on the table, Since I already debunked that Role more due to my own personally inquisitive nature.
 
Please stop bleeding info about your roles. Don't disclose that you're low utility or not until, like, there's actually a serious wagon against you or the like. Scum knows which are in play, so any kind of statement about your powers might be simplifying things a good deal for scum specifically.
 
... What part of stop bleeding info do you people not get? Jesus.

Also, we should do some cop cover tomorrow.
 
Oh lord day is really shorter than I thought. Figured I could start on analysis today and be fine...Okay then.


Let's get some more positions marked out to start building.

ATM, I'm suspect on IH for the negative reaction to me earlier (though very slight here, since the sell on that tracks), Deviljho for being noncommital and enthusiastic and Meso for being Meso.

@ondine @Young Pyromancer @Cyricubed @Totadileplayz @Tykan @mesonoxian Between IH, Deviljho and Meso, who'd you vote if you had a gun to your head right now and why?

@Swarmingu why are you picking me to vote?

None. Shoot me first, I don't fear death, I fear being wrong.

This seems like some extremely dubious speculation, and I'm not sure what purpose it's purported to serve.
[X] Vote Shadell

So here's where IH makes a vote against shadell for and I quote "Stuff".

[x] vote InterstellarHobo

Pushing down on an early attempt to get talk on the game strikes me as suspect.

@Scia how do you feel about IH's post responding to me.

And Shadell's reaction to it.

We don't have a ton to go off right now but atm this is making me think something is wrong with how this was taken. It felt oppurtunistic on something that both wasn't what shadell pursed it as, and was possible just memes.

Along with the immediete jump to some doom gloom analysis...it actually gave me the vibe of trying to make town seem weaker than we are. Based off the entire roll list even with some of those roles missing I'd say we're in a solid spot. I doubt mafia can do all those together so we're likely in a safer spot than you might think.

I'm not seeing much else, LDJ looks good to me, IH is okay, and Meso seems pretty null for me, but not in a bad way? Some gut feel there too. Second to Shadell I'd want to look at QT more...or at least see QT more. Pepehands.

[X] Vote Shadell
 
Alright, time to unpack and rearrange this a bit. Warning: May containt traces of humour, hypocrisy and sarcasm.


That Being Said I do have a role that I do believe can be of some use maybe. Not definitely, but it's possible. My only positive asset to town is that role. As a result.... That's why I answered it that way. I don't know any of their roles. Since I don't truly believe any of them are scum, and they probably have more experience then me. I'd basically be better off dead then the other 3 so long as my belief none of them is scum was correct.
As others already said: Please stop infobleeding. We have an incredibly small amount of "vanillas". Don't have to make it even easier for scum to hit a pr.
Additionally, your positive asset to town would be being town. Don't undervalue yourself. If you are having trouble in your "everyday townplay", try to improve it. You can only do that if you're alive.
Give us your suspicions, your gut instincts, whatever and try to frame them. If you picked up something genuine, there's a chance it might gain traction. The more you try it, the better you might get.

Can I choose the bullet? Dying over a debate seems like my way to go.

More Seriously. Right now. I'm more up for Voting for you Shadell over those 3. That Being said if I had to choose to vote for one of those 3 I'd choose Devilijho.

Why? Something seems off. Call it a gut instinct but something you said on the beginning of page 3 made my gut reaction go off and say you're mafia.

This didn't go off on any of those 3, but logically I can see Devilijho having a very flawed reasoning, and as a result of those 3 I'd vote for them.

Scia is the only other person that's triggered that gut reaction so far in this game, but since it's just that a Gut Instinct. I don't typically vote with it.
See? You already gave us two suspicions of yours. Now please go ahead and quote the parts that triggered your gut and tell us what exactly feels off.
Gut instinct isn't always that bad. Especially if there isn't much more to go with for now.



For the record: I am Town, but if y'all are gonna Lynch town my utility is low enough you won't lose much.
Personally I'd prefer not to get lynched D1, but then that applies everyone so like... *shrugs*
Shame on you, using AtE that early. ;) Almost making me rank you higher on the scum candidate list.

Ironically, the fact I'm doing this cements that I'm a town.
Some fine wine you got there. Do you have any good cheese to go with for me?



Let's get some more positions marked out to start building.

ATM, I'm suspect on IH for the negative reaction to me earlier (though very slight here, since the sell on that tracks), Deviljho for being noncommital and enthusiastic and Meso for being Meso.

@ondine @Young Pyromancer @Cyricubed @Totadileplayz @Tykan @mesonoxian Between IH, Deviljho and Meso, who'd you vote if you had a gun to your head right now and why?
Hmm, if I had to vote one of them, it'd be LDJ. But he's only number 3 on the list right now.
What caught my suspicion was him jumping on the Hobo train that easily early on. Smelt like an easy lynch.

Along comes number 2, QTess. For exactly the same thing, jumping on LDJ. Under the assumption of Lost being scum, their interaction whiffs of distancing to me.
Here comes the big caveat: I tend to have legacy bias. My last game with LDJ had him as scum. QTess was probably also more often scum than not when I played with him. Plus I always read him as scum at first.

So let's go with my number one suspect for now.

[X] Vote Ondine


You are awfully quiet, which is quite uncommon for you. Last game, where you conciously held back D1, doesn't count. With nothing better to go for right now, here, have my vote- ;)

Fake-Edit:
Yeah, loads of hypocrisy in the first part. Well...
 
Alright, time to unpack and rearrange this a bit. Warning: May containt traces of humour, hypocrisy and sarcasm.



As others already said: Please stop infobleeding. We have an incredibly small amount of "vanillas". Don't have to make it even easier for scum to hit a pr.
Additionally, your positive asset to town would be being town. Don't undervalue yourself. If you are having trouble in your "everyday townplay", try to improve it. You can only do that if you're alive.
Give us your suspicions, your gut instincts, whatever and try to frame them. If you picked up something genuine, there's a chance it might gain traction. The more you try it, the better you might get.




See? You already gave us two suspicions of yours. Now please go ahead and quote the parts that triggered your gut and tell us what exactly feels off.
Gut instinct isn't always that bad. Especially if there isn't much more to go with for now.




Shame on you, using AtE that early. ;) Almost making me rank you higher on the scum candidate list.


Some fine wine you got there. Do you have any good cheese to go with for me?




Hmm, if I had to vote one of them, it'd be LDJ. But he's only number 3 on the list right now.
What caught my suspicion was him jumping on the Hobo train that easily early on. Smelt like an easy lynch.

Along comes number 2, QTess. For exactly the same thing, jumping on LDJ. Under the assumption of Lost being scum, their interaction whiffs of distancing to me.
Here comes the big caveat: I tend to have legacy bias. My last game with LDJ had him as scum. QTess was probably also more often scum than not when I played with him. Plus I always read him as scum at first.

So let's go with my number one suspect for now.

[X] Vote Ondine

You are awfully quiet, which is quite uncommon for you. Last game, where you conciously held back D1, doesn't count. With nothing better to go for right now, here, have my vote- ;)

Fake-Edit:
Yeah, loads of hypocrisy in the first part. Well...
See and I just came.over here to do some work!

Last game I did too much in general, so yeah I'm trying to be more circumspect this game. But tbh the big reason I've been quiet is that I'm playing in two games plus also doing this fanfiction podficcing competition. The week for the podfic thing ended last night and day ended in my other game 6 minutes ago..sooo here I am!

Honestly two of my suspects are Toto and LDJ as well, but I don't feel great about voting for either as Toto is basically a newbie and LDJ is back after a long absense.

I don't get the Shadell suspicion. And it rubs me the wrong way. I also don't like Cyri's response to Shadell's question. Refusal to actually give a read and then saying no kill me? Feels like a very wolfy thing to do. Tell them you're not afraid to die at all! As though you can put off suspicion by being overly relaxed with the idea.

[X] vote Cyricubed
 
Also can I say I appreciate how this community has switched to Vote with a minimum of fuss. It's really nice guys. Good job with the basic decency thing!
 
See? You already gave us two suspicions of yours. Now please go ahead and quote the parts that triggered your gut and tell us what exactly feels off.
Gut instinct isn't always that bad. Especially if there isn't much more to go with for now.
Yeah. I'll tell you why I logically think my gut instinct thinks they're mafia. Because they're moderators with Red colored names. My Gut instinct isn't something I follow, because it typically follows that line of logic. Since I percieve the Mafia members with the colors red, and the moderators have the color red on their names the first time I see their names with the color red in the game. It makes me believe they're mafia. Not a good reason.

However, I'll link the two posts my gut said scum. No I'm not going to vote for them, because well. I don't follow my gut because it does stupid crap like what I said earlier. If I can't rationally pick someone's post as wolfy or scummy, which honestly I don't think there's evidence for. I'm not going to try to vote in that direction. However, Just because I can't rationalize logically that either of these posts say scum, doesn't mean that I shouldn't hide why my gut went scum in the first place.
[x] Vote Nictis

Nictis claims to know that there's 3 scum! Who'd know that there are 3 scum exactly? Scum obviously!



Okay, first thing, we got "all potential roles for town" and "the mafia's abilities." Based on Nictis' response above, I assume that the mafia has all of these, and knows exactly what town has in play. This, at a glance, honestly makes me think town's just kind of fucked, but it's possible that scum's actually a lot weaker than the list suggests at a glance. (If, say, killing+arson aren't compatible, that halves the effective speed with which mafia wins) OTOH, I don't think town has any possible way of confirming a lot of this.

So, this is a bit of a mess. We don't know if abilities are all distributed with each mafia getting one (or all?!) actions each night, or mafia is like an arsonist, a dual rolecop/block and a lawyer. Mafia also is loaded on powers to nullify anything town does. The fools potentially number equal to the mafia, each of our investigative roles has a clear failure condition or two, and mafia knows *exactly* which ones are unprovable to claim at any given moment, and that's not considering that each of them has a drawback.

In the worst case, mafia more or less wins D3 presuming dousing doubles their rate of kills.

We know, ostensibly, that everything that anyone does has some kind of hidden drawback (though wtf is a hidden drawback on a fool whose 'power' seems to be a straight up disadvantage to their faction in the first place?) It's likely that what we don't see here is quite good for town on the whole.

So, basically, in the worst case for town, none of our powers actually work with anything resembling reliability, scum has near impunity on fakeclaims and scum has a horrific rate of murder, while also being able to kill twice as fast as a normal scum team.
1: Information is key, models to use information are good, arguing against them is thus not in the interest of town to have more tools avaible -> Ih scum
2:Scum wants to appear trustworthy to town so having a good chain of logic for lynching at the start is good for them to be in the grace of town -> Shadel scum
3:Someone that can analyse is good for town, and scum wants to remove them first _> more likely that IH is Scum
4: Betraying scumness this early with such a move is a surprising bad play, so its less likely that it is a Scum plan.
 
See and I just came.over here to do some work!

Last game I did too much in general, so yeah I'm trying to be more circumspect this game. But tbh the big reason I've been quiet is that I'm playing in two games plus also doing this fanfiction podficcing competition. The week for the podfic thing ended last night and day ended in my other game 6 minutes ago..sooo here I am!

Honestly two of my suspects are Toto and LDJ as well, but I don't feel great about voting for either as Toto is basically a newbie and LDJ is back after a long absense.

I don't get the Shadell suspicion. And it rubs me the wrong way. I also don't like Cyri's response to Shadell's question. Refusal to actually give a read and then saying no kill me? Feels like a very wolfy thing to do. Tell them you're not afraid to die at all! As though you can put off suspicion by being overly relaxed with the idea.

[X] vote Cyricubed
Yeah, that's a good reason if I ever heard one.
Damn you, how dare you shoot down my suspicions that easily. ;)

[x] Null

Yeah. I'll tell you why I logically think my gut instinct thinks they're mafia. Because they're moderators with Red colored names. My Gut instinct isn't something I follow, because it typically follows that line of logic. Since I percieve the Mafia members with the colors red, and the moderators have the color red on their names the first time I see their names with the color red in the game. It makes me believe they're mafia. Not a good reason.

However, I'll link the two posts my gut said scum. No I'm not going to vote for them, because well. I don't follow my gut because it does stupid crap like what I said earlier. If I can't rationally pick someone's post as wolfy or scummy, which honestly I don't think there's evidence for. I'm not going to try to vote in that direction. However, Just because I can't rationalize logically that either of these posts say scum, doesn't mean that I shouldn't hide why my gut went scum in the first place.
OK, that weren't exactly the reasons I expected. I can see why you won't vote on that alone.
Sorry if I came off somewhat too pushy(?)

Fake-Edit: Lol, the system just warned me that my message's mostly spoilers & quotes and is likely spam. Didn't have that one happen to me before.
 
Along with the immediete jump to some doom gloom analysis...it actually gave me the vibe of trying to make town seem weaker than we are. Based off the entire roll list even with some of those roles missing I'd say we're in a solid spot. I doubt mafia can do all those together so we're likely in a safer spot than you might think.

Presuming this was my goal, it isn't, why would it likely be a scum play?
 
Your friendly neighborhood GM here just popping in to inform you that the Day will end in ten hours and five minutes.
 
No real bandwagon means no real pressure, means no real good choices.

I'm suspect of how quickly Deviljho built votes, but Deviljho is also a vet and was doing things that read as pretty suspicious (bleeding info, sheeping) so I don't think it's that strange.

People can jump on me for early doom and glooming, but the point was to get us out of memes quickly given the short day, and I think that mostly worked, for all we're missing the hyperactive posters that can drive a thread, and I think the actual scum play there would be to try to lay low while letting memes extend.

Swarmingu, Totodile and Young Pyromancer have all set off a few red flags for me as well, but a lot of that can be covered under being new.

So, let's start kicking up rocks? @QTesseract is a very good player, and a good scum player whose been pretty quiet. This isn't out of character, but I think we have time to throw a bit of pressure before settling on a mark, and this strikes me as probably the best stone to overturn for building up knowledge to work from later.

[x] Vote QTesseract
 
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