[X] Plan Let's get a gun
-[X] (Jumo): Start the shop
-[X] (Volkstruppe): Run a new rifled gun design
--[X] A weight of no more than 700kg including recoil dampening, single piece ammunition, penetrating 6cm of flat plate at 100 (50% criteria).
-[X] 6 months

I am pretty confident that this can be done, given that it's fulfilled by the 75mm Gun M3 of the Lee and Sherman. Which is a Canon de 75 modèle 1897 but lightened. It's also fulfilled by the 5cm KwK 38 using PzGr. 39, so anything above 5,5cm should be able to fulfill this RFQ.
 
Do note that we are building a light tank so a 75mm gun might be too big, we might have to look at somthing like the 2 pounder which fortunately fits in your requirments any ways
 
So Cruiser Mk II would fit.
That's a pretty decent reference point to be thinking about. If our engine wizard hobo can really get us 300 hp, we ought to be able to improve on it in one or more significant aspects. On the other hand, we might be trying for something a little smaller depending on how all of this works out.
 
Do note that we are building a light tank so a 75mm gun might be too big, we might have to look at somthing like the 2 pounder which fortunately fits in your requirments any ways
This requirement can, as I said, be fulfilled by an analogue to the 5cm KwK 38, and the early Panzer IIIs also fit the weight requirement you guys got.
 
[X] Plan Let's get a gun
This seems good, and while I worried for a bit that not explicitly demanding those penetrating rounds explode would be problematic, but tanks should be dense enough for that to be a non-issue as long as the loader is quick. I would suggest specifying a range unit. I assume yards or meters, but it's not explicitly clear.
 
[X] Plan Let's get a gun

This is admitedly a bit overkil right now, but it won't be shockingly soon and I think we won't have to sacrifice armor or speed very much if the magic 300hp engine works out okay.
 
yadda yadda ALL ABOARD THE BANDWAGON CHOO CHOO
Adhoc vote count started by 7734 on Dec 6, 2018 at 12:23 AM, finished with 25 posts and 9 votes.

  • [X] Plan Let's get a gun
    -[x] (Jumo): Start the shop
    -[x] (Volkstruppe): Run a new rifled gun design
    --[X] A weight of no more than 700kg including recoil dampening, single piece ammunition, penetrating 6cm of flat plate at 100 (50% criteria).
    -[X] 6 months
    [x] Plan Light Tank not Monster
    -[x] (Jumo): Start the shop
    -[x] (Volkstruppe): Run a new rifled gun design
    --[x] 20mmL70 High Velocity firing HE, AP, emphasize rangefinder and radio
    -[x] How many months until you put out the RFQ?
 
Contest 7: Gun Prototyping
After getting Jumo started in a tool shop off the Commission's funds, you promptly got to work setting out the requirements of a new gun. Recoil controlled, seven hundred kilo max weight, fixed ammunition (you had to make sure someone didn't try and sneak a gun-mortar in) and a borrowed standard from the Reichsmarine of six centimeters of rolled plate at one hundred meters with a fifty percent or better success rate, you got to work testing guns.

Interestingly, the stock model of 5,5cm field gun neatly achieved this objective firing a slug round, with the caveat that the gun with a recoil-stabilized carriage came in at about three hundred and eighty kilos. Minus sixty for the carriage, and you had a solid three hundred twenty kilo weapon platform. Penetration-wise, of the twenty shot trial it penetrated the plate thirteen times, with three ricochets and four shell failures (in which the shell did not penetrate but rather sorta went squish). The artillery crew was happy they weren't doing a fast course of fire, and were quite happy to leave and park their gun off the range.

Before you got to the armories, Skoda had sent in a gun as well. With an absurdly short twenty caliber barrel and broad nine centimeter bore, you had to question what, exactly, they were thinking. Then you saw it clock in for weight at just over four hundred twenty kilograms, and the lightbulb went off. It was supposed to be a shell-firing gun primarily, thus the large bore and low pressure. Firing a slug round, in the penetration trial it scored fifteen in twenty penetrations, with two shell failures and three ricochets. The Skoda engineers, once firing was finished, proceeded to check the main pivots and mount mechanisms of their gun, and recovered it easily.

Thryssen's gun was quite unique, being a six centimeter sixty five caliber design, and equipped with a special proprietary armor-tearing shell that worked on the principal of having a hard, shearing head, and a soft and heavy body. With recoil mechanism the design came in at four hundred kilograms, and was boasted to be the most accurate at range. In firing testing, the gun scored nineteen penetrations, and one shell failure. You did out of the corner of your eye note that the Thryssen armorers were fretting over the barrel, and scrubbing it down very thoroughly afterwards.

The fine gentlemen from the Hannover Armory were next, with a very interesting rework of the rugged seven point five centimeter fifty caliber gun. By completely reworking the drop breach and using a unique pivot-stroke cam action to use a large, broad pedestal-like piston, it managed to clock in at a very respectable three hundred sixty kilograms. On test firing, it clocked a very respectable fourteen penetrations, with six shells striking true and failing to penetrate. After firing, the Hannover Armorers cleaned the gun professionally, cleared the breech, and then proceed to take it home.

Over the following month, you also got word back from Jumo- he'd already started covering a good bit of his own costs with a production run of a V-12 engine made of two smaller straight six engines which had been suffering anemic sales. The J-66 engine produced nearly seven hundred horespower running at full stroke, but at the cost of consuming a hundred and fifty kilograms of fuel an hour at a high cruise. Jumo swore blind he could refine the design to where it wouldn't produce such ruinous results for endurance, while at the same time starting sales to Skoda for consideration for the new Light Patrol Boat concept. You'd have to see what he came up with next.



VOTES

[] Write RFQ
-[] Write in RFQ plan
[] Write-in further research topics- engines, steel, enemy equipment, domestic readiness, how much trouble is Wanderer in, etc.
 
[] Write-in further research topics- engines, steel, enemy equipment, domestic readiness, how much trouble is Wanderer in, etc.

What are the trade-offs here that stop us from going [X] Everything? How many topics do we get before those trade-offs bite us in the rear?

Also, can we rerun the gun trials without the careful maintenance?
 
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What are the trade-offs here that stop us from going [X] Everything? How many topics do we get before those trade-offs bite us in the rear?

Also, can we rerun the gun trials without the careful maintenance?

The gun trials weren't matinenced between shots; that's the post-shoot cleanup. As for intel, pick two: fast, cheap, accurate. The more you do on any one turn, the less detail and the less accurate the detail will get, as well as running into the Cost Rules that penalize writing up a wall of vote.
 
I don't suppose it would be possible to get Thryssen to license their shell design, would it? It sounds like something's wrong with their gun design, but getting better armor piercing ammunition for whatever we do go with would be a big win.
 
The gun trials weren't matinenced between shots; that's the post-shoot cleanup. As for intel, pick two: fast, cheap, accurate. The more you do on any one turn, the less detail and the less accurate the detail will get, as well as running into the Cost Rules that penalize writing up a wall of vote.

Ah, alright. What's the standard combat load of a tank like we're developing? Sufficiently over twenty rounds to cause maintenance problems that our trials would have missed? Is reloading a sufficiently involved process that a barrel scrubbing can usually be squeezed in there? Asking mainly because of Thryssen's entry, wondering if stats that good come with a reliability downside.
Alternatively, how easy would Thryssen's shells be to adapt to other, potentially less finicky guns?
 
Can we ask that they develop a version of that AP round for each calibre to test with? And see about adding a small explosive filling?

Killing tanks is as much what happens after you get past the armor as perforating it in the first place.

As to the gun itself, they all seem fairly capable. Can we get their volume/dimensions behind the mount? That might have important implications when considering the turret design.
 
[X] RFQ Plan tonk intensifies
-[X]Dimensional limits: 17.5 tons max, at least 50kph top road speed, no larger than can fit on a standard rail car.
-[X]Must use one of the cannons tested, in an armored turret.
-[X]Must be protected against nearby detonation of large artillery shells from all directions, as well as direct hits from high explosive rounds fired by field guns comparable to its own.
-[X]Some anti-infantry armament such as a coaxial machine gun is encouraged but not required, and no crew should need be dedicated to machine gun operation.
[X]Look into whether the other guns can use armor-piercing shells of similar design to the ones Thryssen devised.
[X]Determine rough penetration characteristics of equivalent foreign guns, for calibrating armor designs.

Preliminary plan is preliminary.
 
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I don't suppose it would be possible to get Thryssen to license their shell design, would it? It sounds like something's wrong with their gun design, but getting better armor piercing ammunition for whatever we do go with would be a big win.
Can we ask that they develop a version of that AP round for each calibre to test with? And see about adding a small explosive filling?

Let's see the relationship chat with Thryssen.



Errrrr, good luck with that.

Ah, alright. What's the standard combat load of a tank like we're developing? Sufficiently over twenty rounds to cause maintenance problems that our trials would have missed? Is reloading a sufficiently involved process that a barrel scrubbing can usually be squeezed in there? Asking mainly because of Thryssen's entry, wondering if stats that good come with a reliability downside.
Alternatively, how easy would Thryssen's shells be to adapt to other, potentially less finicky guns?

Check contest 5; tldr version is that's tank loadouts vary a lot and what's good for the goose is not good for the gander.
 
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