Voting is open
Okay.

So it's quite obvious.

Do we spend a massive amount of money for a temporary patch, or do we save it for the actual solution we can access next turn?

Do keep in mind that Poptart did say this one of our better options in solving the root of our current financial crisis. I feel that is definitely worth sacrificing some of our income for for several turns. Here's the quote from the QM.

Why yes. Yes there is. Which is why, next year, there will be options to accept massive income cuts in order to release industrial assets back to the civilian population. At the moment, they're mobilized to government control, and are not in direct civilian hands. Thus, simply releasing them is indeed an option, and it's actually likely to be one of your better ones in terms of solving the root problems of this crisis.
 
Okay.
So it's quite obvious.
Do we spend a massive amount of money for a temporary patch, or do we save it for the actual solution we can access next turn?
Not an either/or situation.
We spend a significant amount of money for the temporary patch, THEN we get to working on the longterm solution(s), which will take time to implement and fully fund.

EDIT
We can afford it because we aren't paying for it.
FDO money locked up on supporting Nimal Pak isn't creating new mines.
Opportunity cost is a real issue here.
 
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Cost: -40,000 yearly income until option concludes. Effect: Send crews to identify municipalities that could be easily and productively turned into cities, relieving your mounting population pressure and substantially reducing your unemployment for the duration of the projects.

Cost: -45,000 yearly income for duration of option. Effect: Press unemployed workers into service building and then staffing new infrastructural and industrial improvements to the civilian sector. Improve civilian economy's health over time. Susceptible to cost overruns.

Cost: -39,000 yearly income for duration of crisis. Nobody will starve in unemployment.

Cost: -30,000 yearly income for duration of option. Effect: Train segments of your unemployed population to some minimal level of employable skill.

We have 154 000/year in options already waiting for. In addition to that there'll be some truly massive cuts we'll probably want to take.

Do we really want to waste 50 000/ year on the military in that situation?

Do keep in mind that Poptart did say this one of our better options in solving the root of our current financial crisis. I feel that is definitely worth sacrificing some of our income for for several turns. Here's the quote from the QM.

That may have been confusing. I'm not arguing against cutting resources away from the military. I've been arguing for that for several pages. I'm arguing against increasing the military budget with 50 000/year.

Not an either/or situation.
We spend a significant amount of money for the temporary patch, THEN we get to working on the longterm solution(s), which will take time to implement and fully fund.

Our money is not infinite.
 
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We have 154 000/year in options already waiting for. In addition to that there'll be some truly massive cuts we'll probably want to take.
Do we really want to waste 50 000/ year on the military in that situation?
We intend to take one of Option 1 or 2 regardless next turn.
Taking the Military Expansion reduces the cost of Option 3, because there are fewer unemployed to support.
We have already implemented Option 4.

Our money is not infinite.
Agreed.
But it is potentially significantly more than you realize, as long as we focus on the right policies.

For example, both Fun Coupons and Crash Courses complete in Turn 21, returning 80,000 credits income to our budget for expenditure elsewhere.
And if we task the FDO appropriately, we can raise our mining income by at least 110,000 credits over the next three years.
And none of that accounts for the productivity of Assilia Prime once it gets going.
 
We have 154 000/year in options already waiting for. In addition to that there'll be some truly massive cuts we'll probably want to take.

The fourth one you quoted is Crash Courses, which is already in effect. The first three are all Stewardship options, and we can only pick two of them (so if we take Unemployment Benefits, it'll be one more turn before we can pick New Cities as well). The third, Unemployment Benefits, Poptart has said will be cheaper if we take options that employ the populace.

So, between Colony Launch, Yes to the Military Bill, Yes to Virani's proposal, and Public Works Projects next turn, (which is the full gamut of options we've seen so far that markedly reduce unemployment) Unemployment Benefits should be much cheaper and get even better every turn afterward as Public Works Projects continues to do its job.

Let's pretend, however, that Unemployment Benefits hits at its full cost for a moment, which should more than make up for cost overruns from Public Works Projects. In two more turns, Crash Courses will finish, and we'll be getting that 30k back from it. At the same time, we'll get another 50k back from Fun Coupons finishing. So, next turn we would hit a maximum of -134,000 loss, and the turn after next, if we choose to pick New Cities then (as I'd like to), we would have one turn with a maximum of -174,000 to our current income before it starts climbing back up, turn by turn, from completing projects and an increasingly employed population.

That would still be a hit, certainly, but you have to contrast it with what may happen to our budget when the crash actually hits us. This way, at least, we would have done absolutely everything we can to make the hit we take as small as possible.
 
[X][PM] Campaign as normal. Ti'ord has gathered substantial support, but not nearly enough to threaten you as things stand.
[X][POLICY] Yes: Diamonds In the Rough. The FDO will prioritize systems that return the most profit, expense no object.
[X][NAME] Assilia Prime. Utilitarian and easily-scaled.
[X][COLONIES] No, this sets a poor precedent. The FDO will retain a limited remit of space-based development, and you will develop Nimal Pak at your leisure.
 
I feel like people are being unnecessarily cautious with Virani's proposal. For reference, here's the relevant section:

She intends to use this authority to focus her office's efforts almost exclusively on the colonization prospect in the hub system of Nimal Pak, which she identifies as the single best development target for the purposes of employing people and expanding the Virmirean economy, but longer-term, it would require revisiting in order to ensure no...problems...arise.

Virani is good at her job, and she believes this is the single best way she can contribute to our current primary goals. It costs us nothing, and because she's suggesting it, we can assume it would improve the FDO's effectiveness more than just changing policies to Diamond in the Rough. Yes, her ambition is concerning, but I feel that this is a manageable concern.

This is an area where if she overreaches, it will not be difficult to identify, and would easily give us the reason we're looking out for to get rid of her. If she succeeds, then we'll have a tested and proven method for expanding colonization without us having to do the work of trying to get it right, and we can build a new department for it, taking the power back from her. Do you remember the debacle of getting the FDO started to begin with? We're going to abstract beyond handling colonization efforts manually at some point, and I'd rather not have to go through all the trouble we did with starting the FDO when we have an opportunity here to build from and a patsy to fire if it all goes wrong.
 
We need to switch FDO Policy from Better Trails TO Diamonds In The Rough

You still never got clear confirmation that that does what you think it does.

@PoptartProdigy since we have a difference of interpretation here, can you clarify whether Diamonds in the Rough or Low-Hanging Fruit will yield more net short-term income?
 
You still never got clear confirmation that that does what you think it does.

@PoptartProdigy since we have a difference of interpretation here, can you clarify whether Diamonds in the Rough or Low-Hanging Fruit will yield more net short-term income?

The description certainly implies that Diamonds will yield more net long-term income, but the implication is also that it will likely have a greater short-term cost. We won't bear that cost directly, though, and some of it is likely paid for by virtue of several systems already being ready for development from our previous efforts.
 
Virani is good at her job, and she believes this is the single best way she can contribute to our current primary goals. It costs us nothing, and because she's suggesting it, we can assume it would improve the FDO's effectiveness more than just changing policies to Diamond in the Rough. Yes, her ambition is concerning, but I feel that this is a manageable concern.
This is the problem as I see it:
Virani believes that Nimal Pak is the best net return on investment. She may even be right. But there is no hard timetable on when it becomes profitable, or how much it returns. Shit you need for economic planning, especially in our current straits.

You can't plan on it.

We know OTOH that HQ mines will bring in ~22,000 credits each. Per mine.
And her current allocation of ~70,000/year is enough to punch out two of them per year for the next couple years.
I'd rather stick with the sure thing than the speculative shot until our budget and economy stabilizes.

It's not a politics thing, at least not from my PoV.
It certainly isn't about her ambition; competent opposition is good, andI'm fairly confident Mira can clobber her if it comes to politics.
It's a hard economics decision.

Virani's pretty good at implementation.
That doesn't mean she's necessarily all that good at planning, or that she's taking non-economic concerns into account.

Besides, remember: Mira LIKES the woman, even if she is keeping a short leash on her.
 
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The case in point might be the Marines. Half a million marines is considerably cheaper.

I'd not be surprised if actually implementing and deploying personal barrier tech will need new training or even doctrinal changes to be used effectively. The cadence of being able to break cover to press an advantage, then taking cover to allow the recharge delay, etc.

Not that we have any money, but it might be worth developing (and field-testing) them before we redesign our Marine forces, lest we have to do it again for barrier-equipped Marines. We've been caught out by the situation changing in the middle of a reform before (like our previous navy logistics upgrade, iirc)
I strongly suspect that developing personal barriers will take several years, and putting the equipment into mass production will take years more. Delaying a redesign of our marine corps that long could cost us.

Programs like that are a symptom of peacetime. Mira hadn't put that program on her docket yet, but once she has those soldiers, she intends to use them.
...On what? We don't have anything to point a billion rifles at, or rather, if we did, we'd already be pointing the four hundred million rifles we already have at it. Is the plan to start retaking rachni planets in Attican Beta?

If so, guys, we should be very worried about massive military casualties consequent upon taking this option. Because that would be horrific.

On the other hand, if not... well, exactly what does she do with them? The first ten million or so can each go keep a Lystheni company or something, but then what will she do next?
 
This is the problem as I see it:
Virani believes that Nimal Pak is the best net return on investment. She may even be right. But there is no hard timetable on when it becomes profitable, or how much it returns. Shit you need for economic planning, especially in our current straits.

You can't plan on it.

We know OTOH that HQ mines will bring in ~22,000 credits each. Per mine.
And her current allocation of ~70,000/year is enough to punch out two of them per year for the next couple years.
I'd rather stick with the sure thing than the speculative shot.

...

Virani's pretty good at implementation.
That doesn't mean she's necessarily all that good at planning, or that she's taking non-economic concerns into account.

We don't have the numbers, but Virani does. I'll concede that there is technically some risk in her being wrong, but I feel that she is well placed to know all the necessary details and that she is probably extremely well suited to planning, since she's the reason we'd be getting those ~22k credits per mine. Realize, she's not presenting this as a "maybe," she's presenting this as a definite.

Also, from a Doylist perspective, the trade-off for accepting this is intended to be that we're giving her more power, not that it's risky.

It's not a politics thing, at least not from my PoV.
It certainly isn't about her ambition; competent opposition is good, andI'm fairly confident Mira can clobber her if it comes to politics.
It's a hard economics decision.

I'm aware that you're looking at it from a financial perspective, which I do appreciate, but I felt the need to address concerns about her ambition both because that seems to be many people's primary (or at least more stated) reason for opposing it and it seems, as I mentioned, to be the intended trade-off for approving the measure.
 
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I strongly suspect that developing personal barriers will take several years, and putting the equipment into mass production will take years more. Delaying a redesign of our marine corps that long could cost us.
At least 2 years, I suspect, assuming we apply a PA.
But yeah, Marine Corps redesign can't wait for it.

...On what? We don't have anything to point a billion rifles at, or rather, if we did, we'd already be pointing the four hundred million rifles we already have at it. Is the plan to start retaking rachni planets in Attican Beta?
Trust the Poptart.
It has been pointed out before that Mira has been looking forward to expanding the ground forces. Not just in the latest update
What for, we'll see. If nothing else, planetary garrisons on new colonies *cough* Assilia *cough* should account for a chunk.

I rather doubt that the woman who was appalled at 30% casualties in the marine corps is going to dump army troops en masse on Rachni planets.
If nothing else, military operations usually cost money.
We don't have the numbers, but Virani does. I'll concede that there is technically some risk in her being wrong, but I feel that she is well placed to know all the necessary details and that she is probably extremely well suited to planning, since she's the reason we'd be getting those ~22k credits per mine. Realize, she's not presenting this as a "maybe," she's presenting this as a definite.
Also, from a Doylist perspective, the trade-off for accepting this is intended to be that we're giving her more power, not that it's risky.
So does Lissa.
Note how our Stewardship Minister isn't there supporting her, and Lissa isn't exactly particularly territorial; she spun off the agency, recommended Virani for the job, and hasn't exactly been agitating to keep her under her thumb.

Which is why I suspect Virani is prone to monofocus.

As for the Doylist perspective *le shrug*
We give all our subordinates a LOT of power. Hundreds of thousands of credits and millions of lives pass through their hands every year.
Virani hasn't done anything so far to make us question the responsibility we've given her, and we need competent people, not bootlickers.

If anything, her abrasiveness makes it unlikely that she is going to be the type to pull something off behind our back.
It's usually the flatterers you need to watch out for.

If people really don't trust her, or think she's up to no good, ask Shurna to take a look at her books.
Otherwise *le shrug*
I'm aware that you're looking at it from a financial perspective, but I felt the need to address concerns about her ambition both because that seems to be many people's primary (or at least more stated) reason for opposing it and it seems, as I mentioned, to be the intended trade-off for approving the measure.
Fair enough.
 
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[X][PM] Campaign as normal. Ti'ord has gathered substantial support, but not nearly enough to threaten you as things stand.
[X][POLICY] Yes: Diamonds In the Rough. The FDO will prioritize systems that return the most profit, expense no object.
[X][NAME] Assilia Prime. Utilitarian and easily-scaled.
[X][COLONIES] No, this sets apoor precedent. The FDO willretain a limited remit of space-based development, and you willdevelop Nimal Pak at your leisure.
[X][BILL] Fetch me my rubber stamp! Assembly implements an army expansion option, raising the size of the standing army to a full one billion individuals in combat roles (from its current four hundred million). Takes up significant unemployed slack and lessens strain on civilian economy by way of removing huge swathe of population from civilian economy. Not actually a long-term fix and may actually lead to worse problems eventually by way of all of those individuals eventuallygoing back onto the civilian market, all at once, but gives way more time to prepare for them andimplement solutions. Also: gigantic army. Some would say the benefits are self-evident. -50,000 yearly income.
 
You still never got clear confirmation that that does what you think it does.

@PoptartProdigy since we have a difference of interpretation here, can you clarify whether Diamonds in the Rough or Low-Hanging Fruit will yield more net short-term income?
You all need to tell me what is unclear about the descriptions as offered in the Status Screen.

The functionality, as written, is that low-hanging prioritizes easy prospects. Whatever is cheapest and easiest to set up is the target. In practice it's an order to work strictly within range of established infrastructure, even if that means refusing to push for profitable investments. Best used if you've developed supply chains within range of good prospects.

Diamonds has the FDO rank all available sites by expected profit and exploit them from most profitable down, even if that means eating a loss for the first few years due to startup costs. For instance, the new HQ mining systems in the former LBZ, if settled via a diamonds policy, will not return their initial investment until their third year of operations. This is best if you're in the right place to plan for the long-term, economically.
This is the problem as I see it:
Virani believes that Nimal Pak is the best net return on investment. She may even be right. But there is no hard timetable on when it becomes profitable, or how much it returns. Shit you need for economic planning, especially in our current straits.

You can't plan on it.

We know OTOH that HQ mines will bring in ~22,000 credits each. Per mine.
And her current allocation of ~70,000/year is enough to punch out two of them per year for the next couple years.
I'd rather stick with the sure thing than the speculative shot until our budget and economy stabilizes.

It's not a politics thing, at least not from my PoV.
It certainly isn't about her ambition; competent opposition is good, andI'm fairly confident Mira can clobber her if it comes to politics.
It's a hard economics decision.

Virani's pretty good at implementation.
That doesn't mean she's necessarily all that good at planning, or that she's taking non-economic concerns into account.

Besides, remember: Mira LIKES the woman, even if she is keeping a short leash on her.
I will note that Virani's assessment of the value of Nimal Pak, while indeed just her opinion, is an opinion without notable opposition from the rest of the Ministry of Finance. Lissa agreed with her, in fact, quite fervently.
I strongly suspect that developing personal barriers will take several years, and putting the equipment into mass production will take years more. Delaying a redesign of our marine corps that long could cost us.

...On what? We don't have anything to point a billion rifles at, or rather, if we did, we'd already be pointing the four hundred million rifles we already have at it. Is the plan to start retaking rachni planets in Attican Beta?

If so, guys, we should be very worried about massive military casualties consequent upon taking this option. Because that would be horrific.

On the other hand, if not... well, exactly what does she do with them? The first ten million or so can each go keep a Lystheni company or something, but then what will she do next?
The Rachni hold dozens of planets within Virmirean-controlled space, tying down the First Raiding Fleet to the point of exclusion in a constant patrol pattern to keep them suppressed. In addition to garrisoning the new colony, Mira would use this army to kill rachni. Unless you want to glass them all (you don't, they're quite valuable and it would look terrible once you reestablish contact with the wider galaxy), you need to invade those worlds at some point. This would hardly be an immediate thing, mind; preparations would need to be made. This is the same woman who lit into her subordinates over casualties borne of poor preparation. But Mira is not in a position where she'll be rolling back a recruitment wave.
 
[X][PM] Campaign as normal. Ti'ord has gathered substantial support, but not nearly enough to threaten you as things stand.
[X][POLICY] Yes: Diamonds In the Rough. The FDO will prioritize systems that return the most profit, expense no object.
[X][NAME] Assilia Prime. Utilitarian and easily-scaled.
[X][COLONIES] No, this sets apoor precedent. The FDO willretain a limited remit of space-based development, and you willdevelop Nimal Pak at your leisure.
[X][BILL] Fetch me my rubber stamp! Assembly implements an armyexpansion option, raising the size of the standing army to a full one billion individuals in combat roles (from its current four hundred million). Takes upsignificant unemployed slack and lessens strain on civilian economy by way of removing huge swathe ofpopulation from civilian economy. Not actually a long-term fix and may actually lead to worse problems eventually byway of all of those individuals eventuallygoing back onto the civilian market, all at once, but gives way moretime to prepare for them andimplementsolutions. Also: gigantic army. Somewould say the benefits are self-evident. -50,000 yearly income.
 
You all need to tell me what is unclear about the descriptions as offered in the Status Screen.
It wasn't clear which produced the most net income immediately.
Which was why Virani presumably approached us. In the future, it might be helpful if she pointed out what the existing default options might do if she changes her focus.
The functionality, as written, is that low-hanging prioritizes easy prospects. Whatever is cheapest and easiest to set up is the target. In practice it's an order to work strictly within range of established infrastructure, even if that means refusing to push for profitable investments. Best used if you've developed supply chains within range of good prospects.

Diamonds has the FDO rank all available sites by expected profit and exploit them from most profitable down, even if that means eating a loss for the first few years due to startup costs. For instance, the new HQ mining systems in the former LBZ, if settled via a diamonds policy, will not return their initial investment until their third year of operations. This is best if you're in the right place to plan for the long-term, economically.
See, now this is useful information.
It doesn't change my vote atm; we have at least 4 HQ mines within next to already colonized or exploited systems, three within one hop of Amalinya.
It does mean we will want to revisit the decision in two or three years, once all the HQ mines are gone.

I will note that Virani's assessment of the value of Nimal Pak, while indeed just her opinion, is an opinion without notable opposition from the rest of the Ministry of Finance. Lissa agreed with her, in fact, quite fervently.
Oh, it's not in dispute that Nimal Pak is very valuable. Astrography alone makes that obvious. I know I was voting for it back when it was SO28.
Time to yield, OTOH, is something we literally have no referents for.
Assilia is next door, and we have no referents for that either.
 
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So does Lissa.
Note how our Stewardship Minister isn't there supporting her, and Lissa isn't exactly particularly territorial; she spun off the agency, recommended Virani for the job, and hasn't exactly been agitating to keep her under her thumb.

Which is why I suspect Virani is prone to monofocus.

As for the Doylist perspective *le shrug*

I will note that Virani's assessment of the value of Nimal Pak, while indeed just her opinion, is an opinion without notable opposition from the rest of the Ministry of Finance. Lissa agreed with her, in fact, quite fervently.

That. I hadn't even considered Lissa not being present, because it doesn't seem like the place for Lissa to be. It's the delivery of an option rather than a scene that would require the sort of back and forth or immediate analysis we can trust that Lissa could provide.
 
Diamonds has the FDO rank all available sites by expected profit and exploit them from most profitable down, even if that means eating a loss for the first few years due to startup costs. For instance, the new HQ mining systems in the former LBZ, if settled via a diamonds policy, will not return their initial investment until their third year of operations. This is best if you're in the right place to plan for the long-term, economically.
Hm. That... I am not sure that sounds like the situation we find ourselves in, now that I think about it.


The Rachni hold dozens of planets within Virmirean-controlled space, tying down the First Raiding Fleet to the point of exclusion in a constant patrol pattern to keep them suppressed. In addition to garrisoning the new colony, Mira would use this army to kill rachni. Unless you want to glass them all (you don't, they're quite valuable and it would look terrible once you reestablish contact with the wider galaxy), you need to invade those worlds at some point. This would hardly be an immediate thing, mind; preparations would need to be made. This is the same woman who lit into her subordinates over casualties borne of poor preparation. But Mira is not in a position where she'll be rolling back a recruitment wave.
Well, suffice to say that war on that kind of scale is... I'm honestly expecting seven-figure casualty numbers, at least. I'm not sure anyone on Virmire is really ready for what's likely to happen except maybe the batarians. And maybe the salarians, but while they're cold-blooded enough to shrug off "a million casualties is a statistic," they lack the willingness to engage in that kind of brutal slogging combat, as far as I can tell.



It does remove a huge swath of unemployed from the job market now without spending action. Those people will draw unemployment insurance once we get that going, so not that big a spending.
Interestingly, unemployment insurance for all the unemployed people costs considerably less than drafting roughly half the unemployed people. Despite how much surplus equipment we're throwing at the problem of the army expansion based on what @PoptartProdigy said.
This suggests that while drafting six hundred million soldiers may be effective at fighting the effects of unemployment, it probably isn't very efficient. I'm not at all sure I support it.
By the end of WW2, ~31% of the population of Germany was in military service.
The USSR had around 34 million people drafted of a population of ~190 million, around 18%. The fact that we're at ~16% is nothing to freak out about.
World War Two Germany was, by that point, in the midst of an apocalyptic invasion from all sides by nations that were loudly (with reason) fantasizing about crushing them back into the Iron Age. It was conscripting just about every male from thirteen to sixty.


Soviet Russia was, at around the same time, picking over its military manpower pool so thoroughly there were hardly any males left alive of the cohorts born in 1922-23 (those of prime military age for conscription in the early 1940s). They, too, were drafting every male from 18-51 except a handful of critical war specialists.


Those were desperate levels of military conscription justified only by the urgent military need to put as many rifles in the hands of as many warm bodies as possible in order to be able to prosecute the war.
By contrast, our war depends far more on naval assets than land war assets, and more on our number of engineers than our number of infantrymen. We need to kickstart our education and industrial infrastructure, not our infantry. This is an emergency measure and we'd be better off winding down the size of the army again once the civilian economy stabilizes.
Guys, by approving you get 600kk people paid. For what - you can decide.
You can teach them there. You can train them there. You can give each and every one a shovel and get your "Public Works" program without spending Stewardship action on it.
We can also give them the Unemployment Benefits option and train them in the already ongoing Crash Courses program.
The main argument for doing this isn't "it gets people paid and trained," it's "we already have the guns and boots sitting around to make soldiers of all these beings, making this VASTLY cheaper than it would normally be.
And espite that I'm still worrying.
We are at total war.
Offensive operations cost money. Refitting our navy costs money. Expanding our navy costs money.
Even RESEARCH costs money; we haven't been able to pursue Personal Barriers because it costs ~16% of our current income.

Seriously people, I don't get your priorities.
How do you vote for a Raiding Fleet and not get that you are supposed to be straining to be on the offensive?
I get it, but our economy just had a heart attack and stumbled out from under us. If we don't concentrate on long-term sustainability and building up economic endurance, our doctrine won't matter because we won't be able to defend ourselves, let alone attack.


1) And a high tech army needs a shitton of supplies, from boots to electronic comms. ALL of which has to be built and supplied by companies in the economy. Who have workers. Who get paid.
The problem is, all of this pours back into the issue of brain drain and material drain of resources into the military. Making equipment for the army is almost certainly the main reason the low end consumer goods economy is shriveling up. If the size of our army supply contracts grows by 150% over the next year or two, supplies of civilian consumer products are going to stay shriveled up.

So, your plan that wouldn't require an actions requires an action?
To be fair, it requires a martial action. Right now, stewardship actions are more precious than martial actions. We've finished the major round of military reforms we had planned, and are unlikely to be able to undertake major offensives for another few years, so our martial actions are sort of... pottering around, potentially, and we may be able to benefit from redirecting them along lines more likely to help with the recession. Sort of like with Intrigue.
Okay.

So it's quite obvious.

Do we spend a massive amount of money for a temporary patch, or do we save it for the actual solution we can access next turn?
I don't think they're mutually exclusive. It'll be healthier for us to release industry back to the civilian sector in chunks anyway, if only to avoid Russian Oligarch Syndrome. We'll just release one less chunk, or hold off on releasing the last chunk until our first wave of emergency draftees pass through their term of enlistment and return to civilian life.
No.
HQ and Top Tier Mines cost more to invest in, but yield more. Immediately.
The map explicitly shows there are four five HQ Mines we have yet to tap, representing about 88k/year 110,000/year in income.
Yeah, you're right, I just wish we had more investment capital right now... :p
 
Hm. That... I am not sure that sounds like the situation we find ourselves in, now that I think about it.

I am, personally, in favor of taking every possible option that helps with long-term growth and sustainability and adding the options that help us get through the short term to that, which is why I'm in favor of switching to Diamonds in the Rough. (and, again, why I'm in favor of approving Virani's suggestion)

I get it, but our economy just had a heart attack and stumbled out from under us. If we don't concentrate on long-term sustainability and building up economic endurance, our doctrine won't matter because we won't be able to defend ourselves, let alone attack.

Yeah, that. Essentially, I don't mind taking the extra three or so years to make back the initial investment and start producing real income. I expect that the next two to three years will be the hardest ones as we spend as much money as we can investing, but that's something I can accept in exchange for a stronger recovery.
 
I am, personally, in favor of taking every possible option that helps with long-term growth and sustainability and adding the options that help us get through the short term to that, which is why I'm in favor of switching to Diamonds in the Rough. (and, again, why I'm in favor of approving Virani's suggestion)
The problem is that Diamonds in the Rough isn't a short-term option; it focuses on long term payoff but costs MORE in the short term. Given how many other things we're doing that fit that same profile (costly now, rewards later when the civilian economy hopefully thaws), we may not be able to afford taking more.

Yeah, that. Essentially, I don't mind taking the extra three or so years to make back the initial investment and start producing real income. I expect that the next two to three years will be the hardest ones as we spend as much money as we can investing, but that's something I can accept in exchange for a stronger recovery.
Maaaaybe.
 
Those were desperate levels of military conscription justified only by the urgent military need to put as many rifles in the hands of as many warm bodies as possible in order to be able to prosecute the war.
By contrast, our war depends far more on naval assets than land war assets, and more on our number of engineers than our number of infantrymen. We need to kickstart our education and industrial infrastructure, not our infantry. This is an emergency measure and we'd be better off winding down the size of the army again once the civilian economy stabilizes.
If previous patterns hold true, the next census next year is going to show up to 1 billion more people in our population, taking us over 7 billion.
We're unlikely to be short on people there.
But yeah, we need to revamp our education sector.
 
The problem is that Diamonds in the Rough isn't a short-term option; it focuses on long term payoff but costs MORE in the short term. Given how many other things we're doing that fit that same profile (costly now, rewards later when the civilian economy hopefully thaws), we may not be able to afford taking more.
This is my major objection to it. If we could I would rather pull some funding from the FDO for more immediate use.
 
The problem is that Diamonds in the Rough isn't a short-term option; it focuses on long term payoff but costs MORE in the short term. Given how many other things we're doing that fit that same profile (costly now, rewards later when the civilian economy hopefully thaws), we may not be able to afford taking more.

Strictly speaking, it doesn't cost us more now, unlike the other options, it just costs the FDO more. Mechanically, this works out to no additional cost now, but all benefit is slightly slower in coming.

Edit:
This is my major objection to it. If we could I would rather pull some funding from the FDO for more immediate use.

Right, unless we compare it to pulling funding from the FDO, though I'm not in favor of that.
 
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