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From Stone to the Stars

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veekie said:
If you want to fight back you probably want a coalition. They outnumber us AND have a martial hero
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Obviously, however at the moment I would rather we shore up the Fingers in the short term and use the next turn to build up a coalition, train up some warriors, and after that then raid the Hundred Bands. I don't think we can just keep on ignoring them like we've been doing after this. It's us or them, and even if it may not be the most optimal or energy productive plan, neither is getting constantly raided or having our secrets of sugar production spread.
 
[X] [Lesson] Allowing a Known Enemy to Recover! (+1 Stab)
[X] [Action] Fight Back! (Raid: Hundred Band, at least +1 Stab)

The enemy is a coalition of hostiles held loosely by the big man.
An attack on him might just reduce his Legitimacy enough for the coalition to fall back to infighting or turn on the big man.
Furthermore, we're currently bleeding, not doing anything to reaffirm our martial prowess will invite everyone to partake of our flesh.

After all, blood calls for the sharks.
 
[X] [Lesson] Allowing a Known Enemy to Recover! (+1 Stab)
[X] [Action] Fight Back! (Raid: Hundred Band, at least +1 Stab)
 
[X] [Action] Focus on the Defense! (Improve Palisade, +1 Stab)
[X] [Lesson] Lack of Defense! (+1 Stab)
 
[X] [Action] Focus on the Defense! (Improve Palisade, +1 Stab)
[X] [Lesson] Allowing a Known Enemy to Recover! (+1 Stab)

We have to make sure they can't retaliate before we attack them. Besides, let's let the big man think he won for a bit, get nice and complacent before we destroy everything he loves.
 
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[X] [Action] Focus on the Defense! (Improve Palisade, +1 Stab)
[X] [Lesson] Lack of Defense! (+1 Stab)
 
[X] [Action] Focus on the Defense! (Improve Palisade, +1 Stab)
[X] [Lesson] Allowing a Known Enemy to Recover! (+1 Stab)
 
Space Jawa said:
Way I see it, going to war with allies is better than going to war by ourselves.

I do agree though, that taking the defense option with "let enemy recover" is ridiculous.
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We don't have a lot of Options for allies, with the Peace Seekers giving us the finger for some reason and Arrow Lake being a new albeit friendly contact to our Southeast. I'm not sure anyone's willing to stick their necks out for us, since the former hates us and the latter just met us a turn ago.

When it comes to combat, we're kings of the skirmish, and being holed up in a palaside without the ability to aim and fire properly screwed us over big time. In the open field, I'm sure we'll be able to run circles around the Hundred Band since we'll be attacking rather than struggling to defend against a surprise attack. Dragging people who can't keep up with us might turn out to be more of a liability than anything.
 
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Well, seeing as literally nobody else wants to back my option anyway...

[X] [Action] Fight Back! (Raid: Hundred Band, at least +1 Stab)
[X] [Lesson] Allowing a Known Enemy to Recover! (+1 Stab)
 
veekie said:
If you want to fight back you probably want a coalition. They outnumber us AND have a martial hero
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I will confirm that the rising Big Man is actually not a Hero. The dice have just been kind to him; as long as that occurs, even someone who's average can rise above and make great change.

Hannz said:
We don't have a lot of Options for allies, with the Peace Seekers giving us the finger for some reason
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Look at it from their perspective: as soon as they married into you, they suffered forty years of intensifying skirmishes between you and the Barrow Builders. The weather also turned decidedly against them so it looked like the spirits were pissed. What was a group founded on the principles of peace supposed to do? They rejected both belligerents, but it looks like the Barrow Builders didn't take the polite hint to get lost while you did.

Hannz said:
The Hundred Band?

There won't be a single Band left after we're done with them. Let's remind the People what we did to the ancestors of the Fingers, and what we'll soon do to those who cross us. The Fingers' outnumbered us back then too, but that didn't do them much good.
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You also had a Martial Hero at that point which makes up for a lot.

zac1 said:
e all three of theses.

For the action I want us to attack them, using a designed assault/ambush/diplomacy combo.

What I propose is sending someone willing to die to try and trust a blade into the bands leader. With a small guard squad to also be ready to kill any around them.

The bands big man is looking to learn our sugar methods, well, why not just give it to him? march to the bands with sugar and shouts of peace and pleas of mercy.

Of course this is all a lie.

Next we send hunter squads of 5 in the cover of night to attack camps/settlements, using fire, the spirit weapon of the people.

This has a chance of backfiring but even if it fails we are doing major damage to a wide swath of their land, and showing how angry we are, also we tainted the sugar. An if we dont have any known methods of plant poison then just taint the bag with human filth, anyone who eats the bag, say the big man taste testing the contents, as Im sure no one has thought of using poop to slowly kill a person, although the taste would leave the big man wide open.

This is an aggressive idea, likely to give us something. Im kinda tired of the premade ideas, so far they leave us open for months at a time doing one thing.

As shown here we were to focus on house building we didnt even get to the farming expanding.
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Too advanced. You don't really have any concepts related to deception on a societal level Besides, you expect the enemy that's enslaved some of yours to deal peacefully with diplomats?

Japanime said:
For all we know those captives they took likely know our secrets of sugar.
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Pemmican too, they could learn from this. Pemmican is a miracle food. It keeps literally for years with only dry storage, though some people claim to have had it still be edible after decades. It's also extremely energy dense; a fistful is enough to feed a grown, working adult for a full day. It's not healthy to eat exclusively, but when it comes time for winter stockpiling, raiding or trading, it is invaluable.

Hannz said:
When it comes to combat, we're kings of the skirmish, and being holed up in a palaside without the ability to aim and fire properly screwed us over big time. In the open field, I'm sure we'll be able to run circles around the Hundred Band since we'll be attacking rather than struggling to defend against a surprise attack. Dragging people who can't keep up with us might turn out to be more of a liability than anything.
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Everyone is kings of skirmish in the current age. You're actually best at attacking hostile camps because of the Ember-Eyes and their fire tricks. You're not bad at regular confrontations, you just don't have any huge advantages. Of course, that means that if the dice turn against you, you're no more resilient than the Fingers were.
 
Redium said:
Everyone is kings of skirmish in the current age. You're actually best at attacking hostile camps because of the Ember-Eyes and their fire tricks. You're not bad at regular confrontations, you just don't have any huge advantages. Of course, that means that if the dice turn against you, you're no more resilient than the Fingers were.
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My bad, I assumed most of our enemies were starting to go the 'heavy' Infantry route with how much emphasis was put into their shields, 2 handed axes, and armor.

Still, the fact that we have some semblance of an advantage when sieging does tell me we should use it. We gave up having +1 Legitimacy/Stability for fire so might as well put it to use!
 
[X] [Lesson] Allowing a Known Enemy to Recover! (+1 Stab)
[X] [Action] Fight Back! (Raid: Hundred Band, at least +1 Stab)

I forgot they took captives. Unacceptable.
 
[X] [Lesson] Allowing a Known Enemy to Recover! (+1 Stab)
[X] [Action] Fight Back! (Raid: Hundred Band, at least +1 Stab)
 
[X] [Lesson] Allowing a Known Enemy to Recover! (+1 Stab)
[X] [Action] Fight Back! (Raid: Hundred Band, at least +1 Stab)

Alright, with that information.
Time for ancient warcrimes
 
Hmm. Focusing on defense doesn't really do much for us if the offensive always has the upper hand.

[X] [Lesson] Allowing a Known Enemy to Recover! (+1 Stab)
[X] [Action] Fight Back! (Raid: Hundred Band, at least +1 Stab)
 
What we need is a good defensive innovation. Something that allows us to fight before the enemy breaks through the palisades. A tower for instance. Or walkable walls. And then we can rain rocks, arrows and fire from above.
 
[X] [Lesson] Allowing a Known Enemy to Recover! (+1 Stab)
[X] [Action] Fight Back! (Raid: Hundred Band, at least +1 Stab)
Adhoc vote count started by Japanime on Mar 14, 2018 at 2:08 PM, finished with 45 posts and 28 votes.
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Adhoc vote count started by Japanime on Mar 14, 2018 at 4:20 PM, finished with 47 posts and 30 votes.
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The vote is weird right now. Focus on Defense (i.e. let the raiders go and build a better wall) is winning the Action vote while the Lesson the People take away from this experience is that it was foolish to let a known enemy recover. Doesn't this seem a bit schizophrenic to anyone else?
 
Redium said:
Pemmican too, they could learn from this. Pemmican is a miracle food. It keeps literally for years with only dry storage, though some people claim to have had it still be edible after decades. It's also extremely energy dense; a fistful is enough to feed a grown, working adult for a full day. It's not healthy to eat exclusively, but when it comes time for winter stockpiling, raiding or trading, it is invaluable.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Redium said:
Everyone is kings of skirmish in the current age. You're actually best at attacking hostile camps because of the Ember-Eyes and their fire tricks. You're not bad at regular confrontations, you just don't have any huge advantages. Of course, that means that if the dice turn against you, you're no more resilient than the Fingers were.
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Taking all of the above in mind, I really do think we need to act more and raid the Big Man who attacked us back before they learn our secrets to Pemmican and Sugar. At the moment if we attack immediately I think we should be able to strike back against the raiding party who attacked us and recover our people.

There are two things which might give us an advantage in this situation. Firstly, the raiding party will likely be weighed down and slowed by the captives which they have taken from us. Secondly, I don't think the Hundred Bands are aware of our Crystal Lake settlement at all, as all of the previous interactions we've had with them have been at the Fingers, firstly from that initial trading party, secondly from subsequent trades which led to the infiltrators, and then these two raids. This may allow us to catch them by surprise when they are complacent and celebrating.

@Redium If we do choose to raid will this be an immediate raid, and are the above considerations I mentioned applicable?

Edit:

Redium said:
The vote is weird right now. Focus on Defense (i.e. let the raiders go and build a better wall) is winning the Action vote while the Lesson the People take away from this experience is that it was foolish to let a known enemy recover. Doesn't this seem a bit schizophrenic to anyone else?
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According to the poll both options are tied. I'm guessing everyone wants vengeance, but some would rather we delay that to shore up our position more.
Adhoc vote count started by Japanime on Mar 14, 2018 at 4:26 PM, finished with 49 posts and 30 votes.
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[X] [Lesson] Allowing a Known Enemy to Recover! (+1 Stab)
[X] [Action] Fight Back! (Raid: Hundred Band, at least +1 Stab)

Changed my vote.
 
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