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White Wolf's World of Darkness

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beowolf said:
They might actually still be with the Technocracy, if they've succeeded this well.
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Not really a guaranteed outcome.
Technocracy needs Virtual Adepts more than Virtual Adepts need the Union.
None of the mutual hatreds are going away just because Cyberpunk faction of Virtual Adapts got predominance with sleepers.

beowolf said:
They might actually still be with the Technocracy, if they've succeeded this well.
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Generalissimo said:
Not really a guaranteed outcome.
Technocracy needs Virtual Adepts more than Virtual Adepts need the Union.
None of the mutual hatreds are going away just because Cyberpunk faction of Virtual Adapts got predominance with sleepers.
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That being said the other 1/2 of a Cyberpunk setting usually is the MegaCorps.
Syndicate, now possessing crazy political dominance, isn't going to share power with *those* guys.
Virtual Adepts' dominance of technological consensus doesn't change Syndicate's political and economic domination.
 
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So, I've been thinking on the early days of New World of Darknesss...

My laptop crashed a while back and I lost tons of nWoD PDF's, leaving my collection of nWoD books reduced to old physical copies of the World of Darkness corebook, the Vampire: The Requiem corebook, and well, not much else. They're all 1e, which is awesome (It's a well-known fact around here that I despise 2e/CofD and the changes it made), but I've recently begun to re-read these books after a long while and I'm wanting to run a chronicle on here that takes New World of Darkness/Chronicles of Darkness back to its roots, the way it was back in 2004-2005 before it truly defined itself.

A time when the God-Machine was only a throwaway line in the Mortals corebook and the Strix weren't even thought of yet, a time before the likes of Demon and Beast or any of the other newer gamelines, really, a time when oWoD ended in a mess and it was time to start over anew. A clean slate.

I want to run a Chronicle like that, using only the materials found in the World of Darkness and Vampire: The Requiem 1E corebooks, and then adding more material as the story progresses. I won't use any 2e material such as the God-Machine, Demon, or Beast, and the Strix will be written out of the setting and declared non-canon.

There will be a few minor tweaks to the 1e setting, namely in regards to the "emotionally dead" bullshit found in the 1e Requiem book, that will be removed and Vampires can have the full range of emotions and creativity and there are even some heroic Kindred (though it is difficult, given the cutthroat nature of vampiric politics). The emotional deadness angle was a holdover from Revised Edition Masquerade that nobody even really used anyway and 2e even did away with it officially (although 2e has its own issues in my book).

Anyway, I want to run a "Throwback" game for New World of Darkness, focusing on Vampire: The Requiem, but with playable mortals as well, and I may introduce the other gamelines from 1E if the game grows.

Anyone interested?
 
Paulie Romanov said:
So, I've been thinking on the early days of New World of Darknesss...

My laptop crashed a while back and I lost tons of nWoD PDF's, leaving my collection of nWoD books reduced to old physical copies of the World of Darkness corebook, the Vampire: The Requiem corebook, and well, not much else. They're all 1e, which is awesome (It's a well-known fact around here that I despise 2e/CofD and the changes it made), but I've recently begun to re-read these books after a long while and I'm wanting to run a chronicle on here that takes New World of Darkness/Chronicles of Darkness back to its roots, the way it was back in 2004-2005 before it truly defined itself.

A time when the God-Machine was only a throwaway line in the Mortals corebook and the Strix weren't even thought of yet, a time before the likes of Demon and Beast or any of the other newer gamelines, really, a time when oWoD ended in a mess and it was time to start over anew. A clean slate.

I want to run a Chronicle like that, using only the materials found in the World of Darkness and Vampire: The Requiem 1E corebooks, and then adding more material as the story progresses. I won't use any 2e material such as the God-Machine, Demon, or Beast, and the Strix will be written out of the setting and declared non-canon.

There will be a few minor tweaks to the 1e setting, namely in regards to the "emotionally dead" bullshit found in the 1e Requiem book, that will be removed and Vampires can have the full range of emotions and creativity and there are even some heroic Kindred (though it is difficult, given the cutthroat nature of vampiric politics). The emotional deadness angle was a holdover from Revised Edition Masquerade that nobody even really used anyway and 2e even did away with it officially (although 2e has its own issues in my book).

Anyway, I want to run a "Throwback" game for New World of Darkness, focusing on Vampire: The Requiem, but with playable mortals as well, and I may introduce the other gamelines from 1E if the game grows.

Anyone interested?
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I might be - although if we're doing Vampire, my participation would be at least semi-dependent on being part of one of the bloodlines introduced in supplements (since to me, those help massively with creating characters who escape the V:tM box of 90s, and also just help add flavor to proceedings). Nothing bugshit crazy, just a Nelapsi or a Bron or a Gulikan or something to help me direct my PC's character a bit beyond their clan/covenant.

Also, info on when the sessions happen and what site/program will be used to run them would be just dandy.
 
GardenerBriareus said:
I might be - although if we're doing Vampire, my participation would be at least semi-dependent on being part of one of the bloodlines introduced in supplements (since to me, those help massively with creating characters who escape the V:tM box of 90s, and also just help add flavor to proceedings). Nothing bugshit crazy, just a Nelapsi or a Bron or a Gulikan or something to help me direct my PC's character a bit beyond their clan/covenant.

Also, info on when the sessions happen and what site/program will be used to run them would be just dandy.
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I'm not too familiar with most of the bloodlines, so maybe we can hold off on them for now and work them in later.

I'm thinking of running the 1e Requiem game right here on the forums with the help of an online dice roller.
 
Generalissimo said:
I also forgot mentioning Teleinformatics being VASCU's endowment from Slashers. :oops:

So what is difference between "employee" vampire hired for "acquisitions" . . .
. . . and 'monster' vampire you have in your basement for harvesting eyes on each regeneration?
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I actually came up with a way to reliably create an army of loyal vampires. It only works in Masquarade, though, due to Requiem's Willpower expenditure requirement for the Embrace.

It's really rather simple.

You keep the donor vampire is chained down and mostly encased in in concrete, immobilized. His mouth is permanently sealed with concrete. He's force-fed through an NG tube to keep his blood supply up. A flame hanging right above his eyes keeps him in a constant state of Rötschreck so that he can't use disciplines, while the encasement prevents him from moving so much as an inch.

Candidates are wheeled in 10 at a time, strapped to gurneys, and drained of blood using a hypodermic needle. The blood is saved to feed the donor and the new inductees.

Once a recruit has been drained of blood, they're wheeled into the room with the donor, in a trench that placed them slightly below his exposed and shaved head. The back of the donor's scalp is opened with a blade designed for that specific purpose and vitae allowed to drip directly into the recruit's mouth. This is repeated for all ten recruits. Each inductee is then fed a few pints of blood (usually his own) via NG tube and released when the doctors are sure that they're not going to frenzy.

By using multiple teams and assembly-line efficiency, they're able to induct 50-100 recruits an hour.

Which is how the SS got an army of vampires that the Inglourious Basterds had to fight.
 
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hyzmarca said:
Which is how the SS got an army of vampires that the Inglourious Basterds had to fight.
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That's brilliantly devious while terribly broken!

hyzmarca said:
I actually came up with a way to reliably create an army of loyal vampires.
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Your logic inspired a new exciting Sorcerer trap for enslaving vampires.

Potent Blood Flaw gives 2 dots vitae for every 1 vampires drink off you.
Also makes Kindred will desire to drink it across the room.

Multiplied by x2 with Fountain of Life Merit giving 4 dots vitae for every 1 vampires drink off you.
Increases the previous Kindred will desire to drink it across the room.

With a level 3 artifact it's possible rising your blood potency +2 giving 6 dots vitae for every 1 vampires drink off you.

With level 3 alchemy it's possible rising your blood potency +2 giving 8 dots vitae for every 1 vampires drink off you.

Being so potent a vampire can't help drinking from you but will be full after single point of drinking.
Anything drunk to 3 blood points (24 vitae) will be regenerated with Fountain of Life without consequence.

With the level 4 Sorcerer's ritual "Invigorate Vitae" featured in Hunter's Hunted (and elsewhere) vampires can be blood bonded to you.
Thus using typical weapon of vampires against them while making them effectively ghouls to you!

Any flaws or holes in tactic as initially devised?
 
Generalissimo said:
That's brilliantly devious while terribly broken!

Your logic inspired a new exciting Sorcerer trap for enslaving vampires.

Potent Blood Flaw gives 2 dots vitae for every 1 vampires drink off you.
Also makes Kindred will desire to drink it across the room.

Multiplied by x2 with Fountain of Life Merit giving 4 dots vitae for every 1 vampires drink off you.
Increases the previous Kindred will desire to drink it across the room.

With a level 3 artifact it's possible rising your blood potency +2 giving 6 dots vitae for every 1 vampires drink off you.

With level 3 alchemy it's possible rising your blood potency +2 giving 8 dots vitae for every 1 vampires drink off you.

Being so potent a vampire can't help drinking from you but will be full after single point of drinking.
Anything drunk to 3 blood points (24 vitae) will be regenerated with Fountain of Life without consequence.

With the level 4 Sorcerer's ritual "Invigorate Vitae" featured in Hunter's Hunted (and elsewhere) vampires can be blood bonded to you.
Thus using typical weapon of vampires against them while making them effectively ghouls to you!

Any flaws or holes in tactic as initially devised?
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The biggest hole is that the vampire actually has to stop drinking. This isn't guaranteed, particularly when the blood at hand is especially delicious.
 
hyzmarca said:
I actually came up with a way to reliably create an army of loyal vampires. It only works in Masquarade, though, due to Requiem's Willpower expenditure requirement for the Embrace.

It's really rather simple.
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Yes. It is very simple.

Given that even Sabbat shovelhead parties don't do that, we can conclude that the system does not actually work that way in-setting and that fails. It's very simple.

(There is a very good reason that mandatory wp spend for an embrace, either a point or a dot, is an ultra-common houserule for oWoD - and that's because utterly stupid doesn't-occur-in-setting things get made by people who think they're being all-so-clever)
 
EarthScorpion said:
Yes. It is very simple.

Given that even Sabbat shovelhead parties don't do that, we can conclude that the system does not actually work that way in-setting and that fails. It's very simple.

(There is a very good reason that mandatory wp spend for an embrace, either a point or a dot, is an ultra-common houserule for oWoD - and that's because utterly stupid doesn't-occur-in-setting things get made by people who think they're being all-so-clever)
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To be fair, there is a way to make a bunch of vampires in Requiem. Sorta. Except not really. :p
 
EarthScorpion said:
(There is a very good reason that mandatory wp spend for an embrace, either a point or a dot, is an ultra-common houserule for oWoD - and that's because utterly stupid doesn't-occur-in-setting things get made by people who think they're being all-so-clever)
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We're just having a bit of harmless fun playing with the rules as written! ;)
 
EarthScorpion said:
Yes. It is very simple.

Given that even Sabbat shovelhead parties don't do that, we can conclude that the system does not actually work that way in-setting and that fails. It's very simple.

(There is a very good reason that mandatory wp spend for an embrace, either a point or a dot, is an ultra-common houserule for oWoD - and that's because utterly stupid doesn't-occur-in-setting things get made by people who think they're being all-so-clever)
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Mass embrace on that scale would create massive logistical issues even for Sabbat shovelhead parties. The most pressing of these logistical issues is actually feeding that many vampires, one that the Sabbat is incapable of solving, and certainly not without breaking the Masquarade.

On the other hand, the industrial death machine of the Third Reich is easily able to answer this question. And its unlikely that they'd care that they're sending an army-sized Masquarade breach against the Allies.
 
hyzmarca said:
Mass embrace on that scale would create massive logistical issues even for Sabbat shovelhead parties. The most pressing of these logistical issues is actually feeding that many vampires, one that the Sabbat is incapable of solving, and certainly not without breaking the Masquarade.

On the other hand, the industrial death machine of the Third Reich is easily able to answer this question. And its unlikely that they'd care that they're sending an army-sized Masquarade breach against the Allies.
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If mass embraces on that scale function, there is no legitimate reason for the Masquerade. There is no reason whatsoever for vampires to retreat into the shadows. It snaps everything over its knee.

Therefore it is not possible, and it's stupid to act like it's possible. Hence why Requiem, whose 1e core can basically be considered "all those patches Masquerade needed but never got due to legacy issues" put in the "WP dot per childe made" limit and burned such stupid exploitative mass embraces to the ground.
 
EarthScorpion said:
If mass embraces on that scale function, there is no legitimate reason for the Masquerade. There is no reason whatsoever for vampires to retreat into the shadows. It snaps everything over its knee.
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Vampires obviously keep to shadows to avoid getting shanked by Mages.
That vampire army isn't going to stand up facing equivalent Hit Mark force.
 
EarthScorpion said:
If mass embraces on that scale function, there is no legitimate reason for the Masquerade. There is no reason whatsoever for vampires to retreat into the shadows. It snaps everything over its knee.
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The problem is that humans reproduce rather slowly. Mass embrace on that scale would quickly lead to over-hunting and then all the vampires either turn on each other or starve. It would basically be a Daybreakers situation, where the vampire majority is slowly and inevitably turning into mindless beasts because they don't have enough to eat.

The sect that builds massive neonate armies then has to turn around kill those massive neonate armies before the herd becomes too thin. If this massive neonate army was powerful enough to stop their enemies, it's probably powerful enough to stomp them, so that's a no-go.

Vampires must always be outnumbered by their food, significantly so. If they're not killing people, then they need at least 30 humans per vampire, more if they spend blood with any regularity. If they are killing people, this requirement is actually increased, because some of those people have to live long enough to breed the next generation of cattle.

Reasonably, anything less than a 100:1 ratio of human to vampire within a feeding area is going to be at risk of unsustainability in the event of an unexpected disaster or plague. And anything less than 50:1 will risk being unsustainable in the event of one idiot spending blood points carelessly.
 
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Generalissimo said:
Vampires obviously keep to shadows to avoid getting shanked by Mages.
That vampire army isn't going to stand up facing equivalent Hit Mark force.
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Actually according to the amazing mass combat system, since the HITMarks don't have dots in any magical powers but are instead built with high Attributes and Abilities, the HITMarks are about as useless as an army of old grandmothers, as opposed to a single Neonate with three dots of Celerity, who can single-handedly slaughter an army of modern spec ops.

Likewise, an Exalt or a Werewolf would be reduced to dust by a sorcerer with even a single dot of the most combat-worthless Path.

However, all of these are then summarily destroyed by @MJ12 Commando's Iterator who eats nuclear weapons for breakfast. :V
 
ManusDomine said:
Likewise, an Exalt or a Werewolf would be reduced to dust by a sorcerer with even a single dot of the most combat-worthless Path.
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I would love to see a serious attempt handling the lunacy in character.

"Sir, entire frontlines are collapsing!
Our combined arms backed Werewolf-Hit Mark army has been decimated by Facination-ONEIROMANCY platoon.
Somehow.
I can't explain it?"
 
ManusDomine said:
Actually according to the amazing mass combat system, since the HITMarks don't have dots in any magical powers but are instead built with high Attributes and Abilities, the HITMarks are about as useless as an army of old grandmothers, as opposed to a single Neonate with three dots of Celerity, who can single-handedly slaughter an army of modern spec ops.

Likewise, an Exalt or a Werewolf would be reduced to dust by a sorcerer with even a single dot of the most combat-worthless Path.

However, all of these are then summarily destroyed by @MJ12 Commando's Iterator who eats nuclear weapons for breakfast. :V
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No no, it takes him like, two weeks to recover from being hit by a nuclear weapon.

So it's more of a bad sprain.
 
Brother Mouse said:
I believe im out of the loop on this one.

Theres an Iterator that can face tank nukes?
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He was built as an example of how the Enhancement Background is broken. I'm fairly sure his actual Spheres are irrelevant to it. I'm also fairly sure that, despite his massive bias towards the 'cracy, MJ would never actually use the build that gets it. He saves that level of BS for notably high level and rare to unique units.
 
hyzmarca said:
I actually came up with a way to reliably create an army of loyal vampires.
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As far as I can tell, these vampires are only going to be loyal to the donor vampire being tortured by the SS.

hyzmarca said:
A flame hanging right above his eyes keeps him in a constant state of Rötschreck so that he can't use disciplines
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I'm preeeeeety sure you have to take to downright tortured interpretation of the rules to have the captured vampire not eventually grow used to the fire in front of it and stop Rötschrecking.
 
Eukie said:
As far as I can tell, these vampires are only going to be loyal to the donor vampire being tortured by the SS.
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On this I agree, but . . .

Eukie said:
I'm preeeeeety sure you have to take to downright tortured interpretation of the rules to have the captured vampire not eventually grow used to the fire in front of it and stop Rötschrecking.
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Does being psychologically tortured by one's phobia* make one grow used to it? Somehow I thought that nobody seriously advocates 24/7 nonstop psychological torture as the cure for PSTD, for example.

* == As opposed to being exposed to it in carefully managed doses of a training/healing regime, or at least the normal casual exposure of normal [un]life.
 
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