Bursting Eagerness Soul
Threadwalking Rating Machine
- Location
- Wisconsin
These seems like good, and fairly simple hacks. They would likely work well in 3E, with minimal rejiggering of armor stats.
General Exalted Thread
- Thread starter Aleph
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Fortuna
Graceful Topiary Artist
- Pronouns
- She/Her
But again, the problem is not "It wasn't there from the beginning", the problem is "This doesn't align at all with the themes and ideas laid down in the beginning, and also is worse".
azoicennead
Overly-Affectionate Zombie Squad
- Pronouns
- He/They
... That's what's being said. You're just focusing on the "introduced in 2e" part.
The second one doesn't actually make sense in 3e - there's only one soak rating, and mortals already get (Stamina) to it just like everyone else.
Fortuna
Graceful Topiary Artist
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Yes, I am. Because it's irrelevant and annoying.
Bursting Eagerness Soul
Threadwalking Rating Machine
- Location
- Wisconsin
Kinda forgot I had quoted that one about halfway through my reply...
Having just reread the Kerisgame transcripts, I now realize that Keris can summon a Stomach Bottle Beetle and learn that flesh weaving medicine Style she was wishing for in An-Teng. I wonder if she remembers...
UrsaTempest
Don't Panic!
Anyway. I'm... trying to grasp the distance between Wavecrest and Corral is like 5000 km, and how it doesn't make much sense they become rival because of it. First, though, how would sea wind works on Creation?
vicky_molokh
Posthuman spidery thingy.
- Location
- Kyïv, Ukraine
Subverting? I'm not sure about Zoroastrianism, but the four Abrahamic-derived monotheistic religions do have their deities behave in a 'I am almighty and what I say is right, and those who do not listen when told by me or my messengers, will be punished, possibly for all eternity'. Really, Cecelyne and Theion/Malfeas just have some sort of division of responsibilities, that is all.
That's canonical, in fact. There's some guy in Malfeas who got an immunity to the miasma and now has significant (indirect) power thanks to being able to do stuff that dæmons can't legally do, such as reading those tablets with Cecelyne's laws. OTOH, he also has limitations due to not being legally a dæmon. So it's a quid pro quo, even if it's in his favour.
The "some guy" is immune to it because... uh. He's a Dragonblooded.
Dragonblooded are Exalts too, you know.
Yeah, but instead of the holy, divine authority remaining chief above all, Sol (the morningstar, the satan-analogue) wins the rebellion and locks up his father.
A similar thing happens in WoD: God is an uncaring machine and Lucifer rebels for the sake of humans, or something to that effect. I'm not entirely certain.
azoicennead
Overly-Affectionate Zombie Squad
- Pronouns
- He/They
They're rivals for the same reason Gem and Paragon are rivals despite a comparable distance: the writers forgot that travel time is a problem that does a good job of preventing rivalries across large distances.
That they're some of the only mentioned settlements in the West really doesn't help matters.
UrsaTempest
Don't Panic!
Yes, I've written that out. Still need information about wind, though.
vicky_molokh
Posthuman spidery thingy.
- Location
- Kyïv, Ukraine
I've heard (which means that it might be apocryphal) that the miasma is just another method for dæmons to get more power over mortals who travel to Malfeas, for the arrived mortals do not know how to make themselves immune to it, while some powerful dæmons surely have their ways of doing it. Not sure if they can apply this to millions of refugees, though, even if this is canonical (which it might be not).
I have to agree with Random Entity here: we can argue all we want about what is and isn't a good idea, but 'it was not in 1e' and 'it was not in the original conceptions' are not appropriate arguments. Frankly it kinda sounds like some veteran D&D'ers who say something like
Times change. Worlds evolve. Ideas change. Not always for the better, but clinging to the past can make one less inclined to objectively examine the new stuff and evaluate it against old stuff.exaggerated stereotypical old D&D veteran said:
Back in the 1980s, our world had these big glorious computers operated by venerable scientists . . . then the millenium came, and now everyone has an ultra-powerful computer in one's pocket. That's a concept that wasn't part of the original Modern Age. It ruins all sorts of plots hinging on people not being able to look up or calculate stuff. Now the Modern Age is ruined forever, because ubiquitous computing was never a part of the conception of modernity as seen in the 1960s.
Furthermore, loudly laughing in the face of anyone who quotes a (non-1e) source when talking about Exalted is disrespectful people who came to Exalted in 2e and/or to the game line and its authors.
Now, don't get me wrong: I'm all in favour of constructive criticism, and I am known on the other forum to be quite nitpicky and 'oh, v_m is never happy with settings', but there is still a line between being unhappy with parts of a setting, and displaying contempt like that.
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vicky_molokh
Posthuman spidery thingy.
- Location
- Kyïv, Ukraine
Oh, I didn't remember that he was a DB. Thanks for the correction.
vicky_molokh
Posthuman spidery thingy.
- Location
- Kyïv, Ukraine
I'm not an expert on near-eastern religions*, but I seem to recall that this is actually true in
* == Nor far-eastern, nor religions at all, but hey.
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- Location
- Spain
Gnosticism, not deism.
Aaron Peori
Rest in Peace
Wind is produced by the constant susurration of the Elemental Pole of Air, diverted around the Omphalos and consumed by the Pole of Fire (this is why fire sources in sealed rooms rapidly render you unable to breath as they consume the Air essence). In the East the wind is caught by the stretching limbs of the Pole of Wood and converted into food. In the West the Air and Water clash violently, Air constant wants to freeze and push water around and water constantly wants to push air out of it (thus why the further you go under water the harder it is to hold your breath, its the water trying to squeeze the air out of you). Multiple wars have broken out between air and water elementals and their associated courts because of this.
In theory the air currents are supposed to be regulated by the Five Bears; yes the highest air spirits are winged bears what are you talking about that's crazy its perfectly natural. In practice they are a chaotic mess and frequently erupt into storms and hurricanes and monsoons. Blame the Storm Mothers. Also, blame them for all the sexism in the West.
In general however, wind goes North to South. This means sailing ships travel fastest when going south. However water naturally abhors air and is notoriously contrary so it resist being pushed South by flowing mostly Northward. So there are huge currents of water that flow North. If you want to travel North the best bet is to draw in your sails and locate one of these currents and let it pull you with it. Water, being naturally contrary, is frequently changing so you need to have good navigators to be able to spot and stay in the right currents (they love smashing ships into reefs). Hefty bribes for the water court spirits are recommended as well.
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UrsaTempest
Don't Panic!
Thanks! That's veeeery helpful!
azoicennead
Overly-Affectionate Zombie Squad
- Pronouns
- He/They
Actually, the laughter was because Scroll of Heroes is shitty and introduces concepts like Dragon-Blooded breeder manses, not because it was a non-1e source.
Though, uh, I can say from experience that the books for 1e are widely much more useful for setting information than 2e, and paint a more interesting and believable picture of Creation. Games of Divinity paints a more interesting - not to mention usable and less abhorrent - picture of Malfeas, which doesn't make it lethal to anyone who doesn't buy protection. Scavenger Lords actually gives useful information about the Scavenger Lands. CoCD: Malfeas is... acceptable. CoTD: Scavenger Lands is crap. I'd rather run the game with setting information from 1e than from 2e.
vicky_molokh
Posthuman spidery thingy.
- Location
- Kyïv, Ukraine
I've seen a laugh at the mention of Glorious Divinity too. As I said, it's either/or: either contemptuous of the people who play 2e, or of WW/OPP, or maybe both. It's not constructive discussion. Your mention of a specific flaw of Scroll of Heroes is indeed constructive.
As for Scavenger Sons (I think you meant it by Lords, right?), as I already said:
I came to SS in the search of more (and more useful) info on the city from which my character hails. The only extra useful bit of info I found is the number of citizens and number of slaves. In all other aspects, the entry looks 'gutted'*, with no info on how the society is organised, no info on significant people, a rather short two-paragraph entry on each of the most significant and might people, no info on the military units of the city, and no systemised info on cultural/logistical/scientific/etc. comparisons to other dominions. I yeah, I was disappointed. Perhaps more info than CoTD provides can be found elsewhere in 1e?
* == Yes, I know it's not gutted because it was that way before CoTD:SL.
Revlid
blob of bugs
- Location
- England
Scroll of Heroes is generally considered less useful, as a source book, than Dreams of the First Age. Its only usable parts are an opening chapter about mortal life, and a closing chapter on Storytelling written by Neall Price (he who wrote the only good non-mechanical chapter of Infernals, also a Storytelling guide). The intervening chapters might as well be torn out on purchase, just to save time flicking through it.
As far as the 1e/2e split... 1e introduced far more new concepts than 2e did. Obviously, but bear with me – what I mean is that 2e's setting material tended to be deeper examination and elaboration on places and people and plots that 1e had introduced with a few paragraphs and then moved on from (and sometimes expanded upon in later dedicated sourcebooks). This is primarily useful for cracking open a book and finding everything you need to run a game on a given city-state. Unfortunately, it's not so useful for Storytellers just looking for inspiration or a general overview that they can adapt to their own story, and also had the effect of making Creation feel smaller (since it felt like only these places mattered). That's setting aside the actual quality of the elaboration, of course.
vicky_molokh
Posthuman spidery thingy.
- Location
- Kyïv, Ukraine
Well, it's the only source of Merits and Flaws, IIRC. Which are badly written, I know. But the GM wanted to run this game without having to change or reinvent any game-mechanics (i.e. no houserules).
Plus, Half-Castes are fascinating as a concept, even if, again, not ideal as a work of writing. (We met a Ghostblood in the beginning of the campaign, and that was a cool and unusual experience.)
Hmm. Indeed, that is indeed my impression of SS vs. CoTD: the former has some raw ideas, while the latter has them in developed and detailed form. I find the latter to be necessary if one wants to roleplay a character in a given region. Yes, the authors cannot detail each and every city, but at least that creates enough details for figuring out the regions influenced by cultural centres.
Another consideration is that the closer one looks at a given phenomenon, the more visible its flaws become. Just something to keep in mind when a setting looks more flawed as it gets more developed/evolved/etc.
Aleph
Princess of Stabbity
- Location
- The sixth circle of Hell (second on weekends)
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Given that most Merits and Flaws are unbalanced, would it not be easier to just not have anyone take any?