What are your opinions on the God Emperor of mankind

Honestly the best thing for 40k is to wipeout including the good, bad, and ugly while letting the galaxy because in all honesty there really isn't anything to save
I mean, there are gradients? Craftworld and Maidenworld Eldar seem far less dickish than the Imperium. And even if you accept the Stalinist reimagining of the Tau, they are still far less evil than the Imperium.
 
I mean, there are gradients? Craftworld and Maidenworld Eldar seem far less dickish than the Imperium. And even if you accept the Stalinist reimagining of the Tau, they are still far less evil than the Imperium.
True but you would also have to accept that there human worlds of the imperium that just exist as much possible.
 
True but you would also have to accept that there human worlds of the imperium that just exist as much possible.
True, the problem is not humanity per se, but the Imperium. But what people said was that, given what atrocities the Imperium has visited upon the galaxy, it would be better for humanity to have gone extinct, instead for the Emperor and the Imperium to exist.
 
I've always been iffy on that line of thought that stated all friendly alien empires abruptly turned against humanity during the Age of Strife and that-is-why-we-must-kill-them.

Implying the friendly aliens were just biding their time to strike when mankind was weak.

Then I remembered that the Age of Strife is when humanity's unstable psyker population exploded.
Which makes me think their alien allies were a tad bit freaked out when human beings began exploding into portals leading to hell and frying the brains of everyone around them.

They probably thought the species was utterly unstable and was going to wipe them out with their 'disease'.
Honestly, we, or at least I, know very little about the Age of strife humans. I mean sure they had alien allies but how many of those were actually because of peaceful negotiation and not just humans holding a gun to the alien's head i.e men of iron or whatever. Another, thing is humanity was pretty the second top dog next to the Eldar during that time period and you don't fuck with the guys who could kick your ass easily unless your stupid, have a plan, or see an opening. I'll agree that human psykers becoming literal portals to hell probably didn't help Xenos opinion on humans
 
"All the aliens stabbed us in the back as soon as they had the chance" seems like a pretty useful bit of propaganda for a dictator wishing to commit genocide against all the aliens.
 
And this is why I love Text Speech Device. Characters are not afraid of calling out Empy on his bullshit. Helps that it was Magnus who said it to his face. "No father, you cannot defeat emotions."

TTS makes the characters likeable, even the Emperor.

Also, aside from Magnus, one of the Custodes also calls him out on that podcast and in the latter one he goes completly bonkers from the Emps hipocrisy.
 
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In my honest opinion, the Emperor is less than a character and more of a plot device meant to drive most of the story warhammer 40k. I've heard that authors that wrote scenes involving the emperor pretty varied their perception due to their own views; one has emps as a sorta ok guy, one writes him as the heartless pragmatic, and another makes him an incompetent douche. Honestly, GW should post a book series from the emperor's point just to get an actual solid identity on his character. Then again they'll most likely fuck it up and the fans will get in an uproar.
And even without going into the whole Doyle vs Watson debate - even in-universe you had factions like the Interex, where humans and aliens lived peacefully side by side at a high level of technology and prosperity... and then the Imperium genocided them all in the Great Crusade.

So yeah, dicks under a head dick. No question about it.
the only factions i can actually find co existence between humans and Xenos is the interex and the diasporex. The former actually had Horus make peace talks with them and if it had been annexed by the imperium may or may not changed things. But then chaos fucked that out a window.The later was a mixture of the imperials following policy and a chaos influenced fulgrim.

Honestly, the mention of human/Xeno coexistence favoring civilizations is there only to emphasize how evil the imperium is compared to them.
 
Then I remembered that the Age of Strife is when humanity's unstable psyker population exploded.
Which makes me think their alien allies were a tad bit freaked out when human beings began exploding into portals leading to hell and frying the brains of everyone around them.

They probably thought the species was utterly unstable and was going to wipe them out with their 'disease'.
Here's the thing though; a species that lacks Psykers is a rarity.
Humanity being incapable of birthing Psykers would make them the odd and unnatural ones.
To the point where people believe that the Tau were artificially engineered or altered because they share that trait.
Why did humanity lack Psykers? Well....
Like, he comes off to me like for all his talents, power, and abilities he's still just another monkey hitting things with rocks, but Warhammer and his fans are all like "No, really he knows what he's doing becuase blahblahblahblah".
In my honest opinion, the Emperor is less than a character and more of a plot device meant to drive most of the story warhammer 40k. I've heard that authors that wrote scenes involving the emperor pretty varied their perception due to their own views; one has emps as a sorta ok guy, one writes him as the heartless pragmatic, and another makes him an incompetent douche. Honestly, GW should post a book series from the emperor's point just to get an actual solid identity on his character.
The Emperor is less of a character and more several monkeys hitting things with rocks.
In 40K back during the Stone Age there were these people called "Shamans", which were literally just Psykers that were being honest about using space-magic instead of calling themselves psychics.
Some of them disliked how the world was and decided to change it, they did this through ritualistic mass murder-suicide;
Killing themselves and any of their number that disagreed with them in such a manner that all of their souls would be reincarnated into a single body.
While also stealing humanity's "potential"(read: psychic ability) for hundreds of generations.
The thing that resulted from this was the Emperor, who is actually a mental/spiritual gestalt of many different minds/souls rather than being an individual.
Yes, the Emperor is literally a bunch of cavemen, and cavewomen, duct-taped together on a spiritual level.
And the reason that he seems to have a different personality depending on who is interacting with him is because he uses his powers to determine the best persona to put forward to interact with people. This is much less effective on people who are closer to his level of power, like Malcador and the Primarchs.

Whether or not the Emperor was planning on something like the Age of Strife happening when humans could suddenly be psykers again is debatable.
 
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Of course, IIRC, that is just the origin story from ONE edition, and it is unclear if that is still the current canon.
 
TTS makes the characters likeable, even the Emperor.

Also, aside from Magnus, one of the Custodes also calls him out on that podcast and in the latter one he goes completly bonkers from the Emps hipocrisy.
TTS is pretty good but I admit some parts don't click for me. I think the big problem is that I was around TG at the height of its 40k fandom so a lot of TTS's jokes fall kinda flat since I have heard most of them a hundred times before. That said they do seem to have cut out some of the stuff from that era that has aged like milk cough Angry marines cough. Overall i think their best stuff is their new stuff which I suppose is a great compliment to give something.
 
Wow, it's been two months since I posted this thread and I'm surprised that not many people. It surprises me how people on space battles hold opposite views on the GEOM compared to people on this thread when I posted something similar on SB.

I keep to my opinion that the emperor was a lawful neutral/ morally gray. Honestly, I want to read more opinions on what people think of the GEOM and I want an honest answer to this question: could you have done any better? Could with all the knowledge and power of the emperor have made a better imperium. Could the humanity have survived without the emperor? If so explain how and what difference would your imperium have been to the one in canon. And don't give half ass answers either you have to full detail.
 
could you have done any better?
This is a very dishonest question. As people have said several times in this thread it's not just that we disagree with the emperor's actions it's that we disagree with the writers for setting up a rigged game where his actions are magically justified. Can I win this impossible game? Of course not. If the setting is built on the idea that genocidal fanatasism is the only path to victory of course I would not do any better. Take your shitty trolly problem wrapped in power armor and go away.
 
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Could with all the knowledge and power of the emperor have made a better imperium.
This pre-assumes the creation of the Imperium when this was already a bad thing to do, seeing as how it required galaxy spanning wars of conquest and at times of outright extermination. So what could have been done better? Well, in a way - do nothing.
 
It surprises me how people on space battles hold opposite views on the GEOM compared to people on this thread when I posted something similar on SB.
SB is full of fascists, so, uh, not really.
I keep to my opinion that the emperor was a lawful neutral/ morally gray. Honestly, I want to read more opinions on what people think of the GEOM and I want an honest answer to this question: could you have done any better? Could with all the knowledge and power of the emperor have made a better imperium. Could the humanity have survived without the emperor? If so explain how and what difference would your imperium have been to the one in canon. And don't give half ass answers either you have to full detail.
Replace the Imperium of Man with the Thunder Pact, a mutual defense and trade organization between the Republic of Terra, the Kiavhar Worker's State, the Auretian Technocracy, the Consulate of Macragge, the Diasporex Fleets, the Empire of Inwit, the Interex Alliance, and so on and so forth.
 
Replace the Imperium of Man with the Thunder Pact, a mutual defense and trade organization between the Republic of Terra, the Kiavhar Worker's State, the Auretian Technocracy, the Consulate of Macragge, the Diasporex Fleets, the Empire of Inwit, the Interex Alliance, and so on and so forth.
Okay and what's the political situation between these governments, how do they differ from each other, is their territory larger or smaller than the imperium, do they all respect each other or is there some friction, is the several armies or one Amy, and etc.
 
Don't be a pedant. You clearly get the key thrust of the argument here - that a diplomatically organized alliance between peers is a preferable replacement to the Imperium of canon.

Don't stan for genocide.
 
could you have done any better

The issue isn't whether we couldn't have done better, the issue is whether there are other people in the universe who could have done better. Aside from his seeming all powerfulness, technological know how and charisma, does he ever display any real leadership or organizational traits that make his vision for mankind the most right and most feasible option for humanity?Even within his own inner circle we have people who could very well make for a better leader of humanity who would be able to create a better, more stable system.

Even within the Emperor's own monkey sphere we have guys like Sanguinius, who has y'know, a conscience. Papa Smurf, who is a level headed statesman with an ego well within normal human parameters, and Malcador, who basically did all of the Emperor's nation building for him. Why wouldn't these people be able to create a better more stable order than what the Emperor created?

Frankly for all the guff about the Emperor's wisdom and farsightedness, his Imperium was hardly the pinnacle of stability and advancement of a civilization. It doesn't take much imagination to think of a better way.
 
Don't be a pedant. You clearly get the key thrust of the argument here - that a diplomatically organized alliance between peers is a preferable replacement to the Imperium of canon.

Don't stan for genocide.
I don't stand for genocide and to presume that I do is insulting. I'm asking about some detail on how your changes affect the 40k setting.
 
Essentially the canon version is either a villain or a fuckup. I like some of the alternate fan versions, in particular the version from Lovehammer 40k on SB, where he is a giant troll towards the Mechanicum, banters amusingly with Malcador, treats the Primarchs like real sons, and dies happily, knowing that his sons and daughters (except Lorgar and one of the twins) are going to take care of his empire.
 
Wow, it's been two months since I posted this thread and I'm surprised that not many people. It surprises me how people on space battles hold opposite views on the GEOM compared to people on this thread when I posted something similar on SB.

I keep to my opinion that the emperor was a lawful neutral/ morally gray. Honestly, I want to read more opinions on what people think of the GEOM and I want an honest answer to this question: could you have done any better? Could with all the knowledge and power of the emperor have made a better imperium. Could the humanity have survived without the emperor? If so explain how and what difference would your imperium have been to the one in canon. And don't give half ass answers either you have to full detail.

That depends on how much the emperor knows objectively and which information he accepts as facts. The lore is very sparse on amount of resource he had in the budding period, as well as trigger point of "Grand Crusade" and why it was necessary. The only rational i found was "Aliens being assholes and exterminated/enslaved/murdered innocent humankind en mass", except that's the sort of thing Imperium did regularly afterwords. The effects of wholesale faith purging and declaring his word as law really is obvious had someone read history. I certainly do not think i could make a government as "workable" as the Imperium, but i'm very hostile to the view that GEOM is all knowing, infallible, and completely in control.
 
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