Warhammer 40k General thread

I don't think gene-seed implants are meant to change the DNA of their subject, but they do alter the cells of the host on every level, and a certain amount of genetic affinity to the DNA of the primarch is required to make it work. Basically, the gene-seed DNA sort of "supercedes" the human DNA to turn the subject into a kind of mini-clone of the primarch.
 
Then play a different faction.
I don't play the table top, and you are being needlessly rude. I quite frankly don't care what arguments you make because they are the exact same I see every time the subject comes up. I don't care about the current Horus heresy lore.

Plus I would make Space Marine chapters modern brigade sized formations for good measure.
 
What we do know is that the Progenoid Glands "absorb" genetic material from the other implants (and notably, only from the implants) to mature and make new gene-seed. Every SM gets two glands and this is the only known way to make new gene-seed for an Astartes Chapter.
 
That's just an inversion of the relationship that still keeps them necessarily tied to one another. Chaos Space Marines do have to defend those slave farms from destruction, if not harm, if they want to make more Chaos Space Marines.
Eh, I feel like at this point the stated purpose behind making Space Marines require baseline humans kind of falls apart.

This seems like a self-contradictory statement though, you are saying it's not gene editing because it's gene editing based on the Primarch?
No, they are saying that it's not gene editing of Space Marines themselves, but their implants. It's kind of like how if you graft a pear branch to an apple tree, you aren't going to grow apple-pear hybrids from the seeds of its fruit.
 
The exact science does not matter. The organs make Space Marines, the specifics should facilitate interesting imagery such as the implantation rituals first and foremost.
 
They also do other heretical things, like try and make female Space Marines!


Then play a different faction.
THe Space Marines are the most updated, most likely to get new sculpts, have the largest range of rules and minatures, and so on. They get by far the most attention, the most stuff happening to them. If you can't see why people might care more about a faction that gets in some years half the total updates of the entire gameline, I have to wonder.

I certainly don't wonder why people would want to be represented in the faction that gets that much attention though. The logical comparison faction had two decades out of print.
 
THe Space Marines are the most updated, most likely to get new sculpts, have the largest range of rules and minatures, and so on. They get by far the most attention, the most stuff happening to them.
They give some of the other factions more love! I have zero problems with that. Heck, I'm a Necron fan. We have like four novels! I want some of the Space Marine love, I just don't want the Space Marines themselves to change. I think they're great the way they are.
 
but what will nerds do if we can't debate about the details and exactitude of impossible bullshit science, good sir
Anthropology. Seriously, think it's a missed opportunity to look at how chapter cultures of the founders and successors develop due to events and recruiting world cultures. Like Dark Angels successor chapter finding itself given recruiting rights to a hive world, as opposed to a feudal world I read them as preferring.

Otherwise reformatting chapters with a greater comprehension of recent military developments in mind. On a macro I think making them more analogous in organisation to a modern brigade just makes sense, with micro scale bringing questions such as if a chapters doctrine would place a designated marksman in every tactical squad or not.
 
Actually, there's a new Necron short story that's really good. It's called One Million Years, and it's about an Apprentek fighting off a Votann incursion on her mistress' ship, which harvests material from stars. I don't want to spoil too much, but you should definitely read it. Also, we got the first short story appearance of Kin rather than the Kin getting their own novel. Sorry LoV fans; you deserve better.
 
They give some of the other factions more love! I have zero problems with that. Heck, I'm a Necron fan. We have like four novels! I want some of the Space Marine love, I just don't want the Space Marines themselves to change. I think they're great the way they are.
There is no way for that love to be equalised when there are at least nine different Space Marine factions, compared to how many there are for all the rest. This is a farce of a suggestion, and I suspect you know that.
 
Right, and I'm saying that the "somehow" is definitely genetic editing, or it doesn't make any sense.
Even though I hate the Horus Heresy novels I'm going to bring them up for a specific point here.

Namely that in the Heresy novels the Emperor goes from being a "normal" immortal human to being the Emperor because he stole a bunch of power from the Chaos gods and, among other things, used it to make the primarchs. The primarchs are more or less a boatload of warp energy packed into a bunch of human suits.

The reason I bring this up is because Warhammer 40k has always been a space fantasy with an extremely thin veneer of scifi thrown over it, often without even the veneer - 40k has outright sorcerers and magicians, even though it tries to translate that through "oh they interact with a psychic realm that produces otherworldly beings that look and act like demons because of psychic resonance." yadda yadda

All of which is to say, the process of implanting progenoids and genetic matches and such are all handwavy because at the end of the day it's literal magic. It's warp magic. Primarchs are magic. And because primarchs are magic, progenoids are magic. They work because they're magic. They don't work because you failed at magic.

Implant progenoids -> [then a miracle occurs] -> space marine

It's handwavium. It's always been handwavium. If anything, it's more handwavium now than ever.
 
I, for one, think that even if GW does the right thing and makes FSM¹ canon, "Space Marines as they are" won't go anywhere. Just look at all the variety between Space Marine chapters, even ones that share a primarch! Clearly, even when female recruits become acceptable, that wouldn't stop individual chapters from applying their own criteria, like those bizarre rituals Space Wolves do. Inevitably, some of those chapters will be single-gender-only.


¹Flying Spaghetti Monsters, obviously.
 
There is no way for that love to be equalised when there are at least nine different Space Marine factions, compared to how many there are for all the rest. This is a farce of a suggestion, and I suspect you know that.
Man, now I wish that the different Necron Dynasties got their own books and specific sculpts.

think that even if GW does the right thing and
When you say "right" do you mean morally or financially?
 
Anthropology. Seriously, think it's a missed opportunity to look at how chapter cultures of the founders and successors develop due to events and recruiting world cultures. Like Dark Angels successor chapter finding itself given recruiting rights to a hive world, as opposed to a feudal world I read them as preferring.
Like think of the comedic potential of this: in the early days the new chapters senior leadership, company commanders and sergeant majors speak and act like old fashioned knights, contrasted with their first generation of recruits acting like the marines from generation kill. The space marine physiology would certainly permits some pretty outrageous hazing rituals if nothing else.
 
Like think of the comedic potential of this: in the early days the new chapters senior leadership, company commanders and sergeant majors speak and act like old fashioned knights, contrasted with their first generation of recruits acting like the marines from generation kill. The space marine physiology would certainly permits some pretty outrageous hazing rituals if nothing else.
It's always gets me that one of the Imperial Fist's recruiting worlds is Necromunda. I can't help but picture one of the more traditional Fists interacting with a peer who was clearly an Underhive Ganger in their past life but as far as I'm aware that hasn't actually happened yet.
 
It's always gets me that one of the Imperial Fist's recruiting worlds is Necromunda. I can't help but picture one of the more traditional Fists interacting with a peer who was clearly an Underhive Ganger in their past life but as far as I'm aware that hasn't actually happened yet.
The fiction has rarely taken the opportunity these factoids offer. Way to often the official fiction plays a whole chapter as mono cultural at times when it really should not be.
 
It is a remarkable feature of human culture in 40k that it hasn't really changed much over the last 9,000 years. In-universe, that would make the IoM the most successful and stable human civilization in all of history, which is... bizarre, to say the least.
 
The fiction has rarely taken the opportunity these factoids offer. Way to often the official fiction plays a whole chapter as mono cultural at times when it really should not be.
Generously, I think the reasoning for this is so that you can mine those lore tidbits for ways in which to customize your own dudes. The stated reasoning for why there are two lost legions is exactly this; so that you can make Space Marines that don't conform to any of the norms of the other legions, and just say they were descended from one of the Lost.

The fiction suffers for it, but the modeling hobby benefits from all of these throwaway scraps of lore.
 
If someone unsterilized them then they're committing mega-heresy and thus are almost certainly doing other no-no actions that are a problem to Emp's plans either way. This is not a reason for there to be no female SMs.

Time for the Reasonable Marines! They decided to change things because it is entirely unreasonable to have things like stelized people.

Angry Marines are just too angry to even think about it.
 
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