grommile
nasty-minded old cynic
- Location
- NERV-Mercia
- Pronouns
- Traditional/Animate
In any event, murdering Coil, if you can sabotage his self-destruct, is a rational act by a civic-minded citizen.
Vespa
- Thread starter mp3.1415player
- Start date
-
- Tags
- worm
FaerieKnight79
Verified Pixie
- Location
- The Internet
Or in this case, an Insect-Minded citizen.
- Location
- United States
A wasp sting killing a villain at their underground base just as a giant hornet appears seems to be something a sufficiently paranoid person or a thinker power could link together.
Kaiser was just thinking about he arranged Fluers death in a way to benefit him. Plus I don't see Lung really complaining. Sure it's only the first 2 villains she tried to stop but if it happens again. Well, once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. Three times is enemy action.
- Location
- Germany
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I'm sooooo sorry for this nice person to have to go through this ...
Will her pheromone analysis enable her to concoct the exact mixture to put anyone into an anaphylactic shock?
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- Location
- United States
I just explained that I meant parahuman criminals. Parahuman capes is clearly redundant since you have to be a parahuman to even be a cape. And Lisa can be considered a victim as much as a criminal. But you have to realize she has killed the 2 capes she fought and the unwritten rules are clearly against lethal attacks. I also explained why it's not as bad as it seems at first glance but it is something she should worry about before someone tries to take advantage.
FaerieKnight79
Verified Pixie
- Location
- The Internet
Eh, technically Taylor didn't fight Coil. She had no way of knowing that stinging him (in the balls) would be fatal. And even then, he could have survived it... if he hadn't basically punched himself in the crotch.
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You do know that Asian Giant Hornets eat common wasps, right? If anything, him having died from a wasp would make people think the Hornet was nowhere near
4. Guest Omake - 12.1 The Morning After
New
YuffieK
(Verified Ninja Princess)
12.1 The Morning After
The assembled heroes muttered quietly amongst themselves, noting that Deputy Director Renick was keeping a stern eye on the various members of the Protectorate, Wards and New Wave seated around the conference table. Apparently they were all waiting for Director Piggot. Armsmaster had been busy overnight working with Dragon on some critical task and Brandish was arriving with Panacea, who had apparently snuck out to Brockton General during the early morning hours for an impromptu round of healing patients.
No one wanted to openly discuss the bombshells that had been posted and (swiftly, but not swiftly enough) taken down by the PHO moderators last night.
Finally the doors to the room opened and the Director strode in, Armsmaster, Brandish and Panacea rushing in behind the woman who had a look of apoplectic fury on her face that might have frightened Behemoth into reconsidering an attack run.
Because the Director, dressed in slightly ill-fitting PRT fatigues, was notably SLIMMER AND HEALTHIER than she'd been when she'd finally went home last night.
She walked to the head of the table and silenced everyone with a glare.
"Before anyone says anything, yes I am still Emily Piggot and despite what happened yesterday, I am still Director of this command. Normally what happened would be a failure on the part of the PRT egregious enough that Alexandria would be presenting my HEAD to Chief Director Costa-Brown on a silver platter right now. But, for whatever reason, she has decided to show... understanding regarding the current situation in the wake of a potential greater threat."
Emily's steely gaze hardened as she looked around rthe room. "Now, for those of you who did NOT see what was posted on Parahumans Online last night, Brockton Bay Police received an anonymous tip yesterday afternoon regarding Coil and his organization. They, alongside S.W.A.T., the FBI and a National Guard rapid response team were able to use the information to take his entire mercenary cadre into custody as they were evacuating from their base of operations."
"The one we could never pin down?" Dauntless asked.
"Yes. Apparently the James Street Endbringer Shelter in the financial district was not declared unsafe during construction and subsequently backfilled, but was instead turned into Coil's own personal Bond Villain Base. Complete with enough ANFO to destroy four blocks of Downtown. As for Coil himself, he was found dead at the scene." A closeup picture of his unmasked face on the medical examiner's table appeared on the overhead widescreen. "You may recognize him. I certainly did."
"Commander Calvert?" Triumph shouted (thankfully not SHOUTED) in alarm. "You're sure it's him?"
"Yes. The coroner has confirmed to us that he was a parahuman. Armsmaster and Dragon's subsequent investigation has confirmed many of the details that were posted online. The claims regarding his actual Thinker power are unprovable after the fact. However, given the allegations..."
"I'm guessing our systems were totally compromised?" Assault quietly stated.
"With the exception of the ones in my personal lab, yes." Armsmaster replied. "Dragon is doing a thorough sweep of our IT architecture as we speak and will be delivering new hardware for both the PRT building and the Rig by the end of the day. She's also completed an assessment of the data on Coil's servers. The one thing she can confirm is that no information regarding civilian identities was found. however that may have been on the server stack that was destroyed within Coil's base. We can only hope that information died with him."
"And how did he die?" This came from Vista, who had actually raised her hand before asking.
"Anaphylactic shock. The coroner reported he was stung twice, once in his... genitial area and a second time just above his jugular vein. The natural reaction to the first sting caused him to disable himself. The second sting was more potent however, rapidly spreading venom through his bloodstream and causing heart arrhythmia. Coil apparently tried to administer first aid to himself, an unused epipen was found near his body, but apparently his self-inflicted injury rendered him incapable of administering it. With him alone in his secure office, he was unable to request medical assistance."
"Oooh. Slow and painful death. If the HOUS had done it, it would've at least been quick." Clockblocker quipped, earing him a dope slap from Aegis and, if anyone had been looking, a hint of a smirk from the Director.
Emily schooled her face before resuming the meeting. "Regardless, this is obviously not the action of some giant murder hornet that hasn't been sighted for weeks. Whoever gave that tip had details regarding Coil that we're still uncovering. The Mayor and the City Council are furious, Brockton Bay Police and the other law enforcement agencies who performed the raid are absolutely smug about pulling this operation off WITHOUT our assistance, despite it being our remit. The Chief Director expressed her displeasure at me last night and ordered me to both 'Fix this.' and 'Have Panacea heal you immediately, THAT is a Direct Order. I'll not have you escape by dying on me.'"
Emily sighed. "Brockton Bay is now the laughing stock of the rest of the PRT and they will not lift a finger to help us. We are on our own. But now that we're not being sabotaged from within, we may have a chance to fulfill the oaths we swore and do our fucking jobs." She then turned to New Wave, giving a nod to Panacea before addressing Lady Photon. "I cannot order New Wave to help, but I am... formally requesting your assistance in this manner."
The assembled heroes muttered quietly amongst themselves, noting that Deputy Director Renick was keeping a stern eye on the various members of the Protectorate, Wards and New Wave seated around the conference table. Apparently they were all waiting for Director Piggot. Armsmaster had been busy overnight working with Dragon on some critical task and Brandish was arriving with Panacea, who had apparently snuck out to Brockton General during the early morning hours for an impromptu round of healing patients.
No one wanted to openly discuss the bombshells that had been posted and (swiftly, but not swiftly enough) taken down by the PHO moderators last night.
Finally the doors to the room opened and the Director strode in, Armsmaster, Brandish and Panacea rushing in behind the woman who had a look of apoplectic fury on her face that might have frightened Behemoth into reconsidering an attack run.
Because the Director, dressed in slightly ill-fitting PRT fatigues, was notably SLIMMER AND HEALTHIER than she'd been when she'd finally went home last night.
She walked to the head of the table and silenced everyone with a glare.
"Before anyone says anything, yes I am still Emily Piggot and despite what happened yesterday, I am still Director of this command. Normally what happened would be a failure on the part of the PRT egregious enough that Alexandria would be presenting my HEAD to Chief Director Costa-Brown on a silver platter right now. But, for whatever reason, she has decided to show... understanding regarding the current situation in the wake of a potential greater threat."
Emily's steely gaze hardened as she looked around rthe room. "Now, for those of you who did NOT see what was posted on Parahumans Online last night, Brockton Bay Police received an anonymous tip yesterday afternoon regarding Coil and his organization. They, alongside S.W.A.T., the FBI and a National Guard rapid response team were able to use the information to take his entire mercenary cadre into custody as they were evacuating from their base of operations."
"The one we could never pin down?" Dauntless asked.
"Yes. Apparently the James Street Endbringer Shelter in the financial district was not declared unsafe during construction and subsequently backfilled, but was instead turned into Coil's own personal Bond Villain Base. Complete with enough ANFO to destroy four blocks of Downtown. As for Coil himself, he was found dead at the scene." A closeup picture of his unmasked face on the medical examiner's table appeared on the overhead widescreen. "You may recognize him. I certainly did."
"Commander Calvert?" Triumph shouted (thankfully not SHOUTED) in alarm. "You're sure it's him?"
"Yes. The coroner has confirmed to us that he was a parahuman. Armsmaster and Dragon's subsequent investigation has confirmed many of the details that were posted online. The claims regarding his actual Thinker power are unprovable after the fact. However, given the allegations..."
"I'm guessing our systems were totally compromised?" Assault quietly stated.
"With the exception of the ones in my personal lab, yes." Armsmaster replied. "Dragon is doing a thorough sweep of our IT architecture as we speak and will be delivering new hardware for both the PRT building and the Rig by the end of the day. She's also completed an assessment of the data on Coil's servers. The one thing she can confirm is that no information regarding civilian identities was found. however that may have been on the server stack that was destroyed within Coil's base. We can only hope that information died with him."
"And how did he die?" This came from Vista, who had actually raised her hand before asking.
"Anaphylactic shock. The coroner reported he was stung twice, once in his... genitial area and a second time just above his jugular vein. The natural reaction to the first sting caused him to disable himself. The second sting was more potent however, rapidly spreading venom through his bloodstream and causing heart arrhythmia. Coil apparently tried to administer first aid to himself, an unused epipen was found near his body, but apparently his self-inflicted injury rendered him incapable of administering it. With him alone in his secure office, he was unable to request medical assistance."
"Oooh. Slow and painful death. If the HOUS had done it, it would've at least been quick." Clockblocker quipped, earing him a dope slap from Aegis and, if anyone had been looking, a hint of a smirk from the Director.
Emily schooled her face before resuming the meeting. "Regardless, this is obviously not the action of some giant murder hornet that hasn't been sighted for weeks. Whoever gave that tip had details regarding Coil that we're still uncovering. The Mayor and the City Council are furious, Brockton Bay Police and the other law enforcement agencies who performed the raid are absolutely smug about pulling this operation off WITHOUT our assistance, despite it being our remit. The Chief Director expressed her displeasure at me last night and ordered me to both 'Fix this.' and 'Have Panacea heal you immediately, THAT is a Direct Order. I'll not have you escape by dying on me.'"
Emily sighed. "Brockton Bay is now the laughing stock of the rest of the PRT and they will not lift a finger to help us. We are on our own. But now that we're not being sabotaged from within, we may have a chance to fulfill the oaths we swore and do our fucking jobs." She then turned to New Wave, giving a nod to Panacea before addressing Lady Photon. "I cannot order New Wave to help, but I am... formally requesting your assistance in this manner."
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Ah, life hasn't been so great for me lately, so, while I knew that this had grown into it's own big boy fic, I hadn't had anytime to actually continue reading it in it's new and improved home. But tonight, tonight I did so. AND IT WAS GLORIOUS!!! And hands down the best Coil death to date, a totally ignoble and pathetic one.
MWKillKenny84
Lurking from the Trauma Switch.
- Location
- Vado Ligure
Taylor, your Inner Supervillain is showing up too much, please try to reign it the voice called Skitter that is whispering in your ears all the ways you could fix the city with tidal waves of creepy crawlers.
- Location
- Neptune
Hive insects are rather civic at the best of times.
FaerieKnight79
Verified Pixie
- Location
- The Internet
How is that any different then the state of affairs prior to Calvert getting bothered and bee-deviled? After all, the whole idiotic social experiment which Cauldron is trying (badly) to run meant the city was cut off from outside aid already. Seems to me the experiment didn't get called off until Calvert's death and the Undersiders doing exactly what the experiment wanted to have happen.
EDIT:
Of course, because it wasn't Calvert himself that took over the city, Cauldron seemed to come down like the wraith of god on the Undersiders once the experiment was ended. Or maybe it was because in canon Taylor was turning herself in and trying to push for reforms that would make the PRT and Protectorate actually effective law enforcement agencies instead of merely appearing to be effective.
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The PRT was never cut off, neither was the Protectorate. We haven't seen anything in canon that points to them being isolated from the rest of their organisations and, in fact, have heard about therapists rotating through as well as Wards and Protectorate members transfering in (Assault & Battery). They have all the staff and troopers they need, what's holding them back from actually fixing the city is the idiotic worldbuilding which comes with self-defeating ROE to facilitate superhero comic logic, aka. the villain escapes to be an antagonist in the next issue, too.
The goal of the stupid experiment was to see what would happen without Cauldron interference. That's all. The rest of the (federal) law enforcement wasn't affected by that. And while the very idea to perform such an experiment in an US city invalidates it from the very beginning, it is just a convenient excuse to explain why Contessa never did anything to prevent the canon plot. Which in itself is unnecessary because nothing that happened before Echidna would have drawn her attention anyway and the Cauldron reveal was hidden beneath one of her blindspots (Eidolon). So we got an "explanation" that we didn't need and the result makes Cauldron even more incompetent than they already were.
I think you're looking to far 'ahead' with your explanation.
Coil repeatedly split the timeline, and his actions differed in the timelines, but after each time he chose a timeline, his body was right there, so when Taylor stung him, she got him in both timelines, and he didn't have time to shoot Tattletale to take her with him.
That's what he did a lot of in canon - in one timeline he'd work all night in the lair, and in the other he'd spend the night at home, sleeping. In one timeline, he'd spend the day in the PRT building, and in the other, he'd spend the day working in his lair, then he'd pick the timeline that gave him the best results.
I don't know if, in canon, he usually split the timeline and then have one move elsewhere so if there was an issue, one body was more likely to be safe, though I know many fanon wrote him doing that specifically to avoid exactly this scenario.
FaerieKnight79
Verified Pixie
- Location
- The Internet
Even worse, Calvert may be choosing to "split the timelines", but it's NOT done in real time. It's simulating two sequences of events. And since he hadn't left his Bond Villain Barbie Lair office in hours, and had used his powers to vent in a "throw away timeline" multiple times... this means that there was zero possibility of a "safe" timeline. Hell, Calvert didn't even know he's been under surveillance for several hours. Lisa didn't either, until the wasp stung Calvert twice.
If you see Coil, then you can kill Coil. His power is not going to stop you. It's just a simulation and it's all in his mind. Awesome to gather information and learn stuff but it needs intelligent application to be useful outside of that.
The precog elements of it might give him a chance to see an attack coming but even that would require a safe "timeline" where he waits for the result of a decision. Time moves on constantly, which limits the amount of splits he can realistically use before the decision is taken from him.
The precog elements of it might give him a chance to see an attack coming but even that would require a safe "timeline" where he waits for the result of a decision. Time moves on constantly, which limits the amount of splits he can realistically use before the decision is taken from him.
FaerieKnight79
Verified Pixie
- Location
- The Internet
The core problem with Coil's power is one he has no idea of. Coil thinks it's two sets of events running in real time, and he can chose to keep the sequence of events that benefits him more. But it's not. It's two simulations, ran side by side. Even if you assume the simulations can be done start to finish in 0.000001 seconds, this still means he's not actually done anything yet. If he simulated 3 hours of activities, then those three hours of activities have not happened yet. According to Wildbow, his shard then masters Calvert after running the simulations and deciding which one Calvert would have chosen to keep, and forces Calvert to preform that sequence of actions exactly. Possibly while editing the simulation to account for variables which it hadn't known about before guiding it's Calvert puppet through the actions.
Presumably, it then feeds Calvert the second discarded simulation's results in real time. Not that he could actually react to anything in that second simulation by choice, since his reactions would have also been simulated in advance.
Why yes, I do think the way Calvert's power works (according to Wildbow) is stupid as hell. Wildbow basically made a precog ability that's actually useless.
Presumably, it then feeds Calvert the second discarded simulation's results in real time. Not that he could actually react to anything in that second simulation by choice, since his reactions would have also been simulated in advance.
Why yes, I do think the way Calvert's power works (according to Wildbow) is stupid as hell. Wildbow basically made a precog ability that's actually useless.
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- Location
- Here
Having re-read the chapter, the specific explosive used is not named. so while it might be unstable ANFO, it could as easily be any other explosive that a teen thinks can be used in mining.
Seeing how TNT was initially invented as a safer mining explosive, I suspect the list of options in that regard is extensive...
In other news, exactly one more person now has a clue that the HOUS is a Master, and is justifiably terrified by the implications. One must wonder how long it will be before that bit of news gets out wide-scale, and how major of a Code Brown the PRT (and especially the local director) will experience as a result.
After all, three can keep a secret if two of them are dead; since all three that know now are still alive, the secret WILL come out sooner or later...
Seeing how TNT was initially invented as a safer mining explosive, I suspect the list of options in that regard is extensive...
In other news, exactly one more person now has a clue that the HOUS is a Master, and is justifiably terrified by the implications. One must wonder how long it will be before that bit of news gets out wide-scale, and how major of a Code Brown the PRT (and especially the local director) will experience as a result.
After all, three can keep a secret if two of them are dead; since all three that know now are still alive, the secret WILL come out sooner or later...
- Location
- Neptune
You're getting too hung up on the mechanics of his power. The power isn't there to benefit him, it's there to benefit the Shards and Entities. And so what if it is built on a precog engine. That's the hardware that was available. What it actually does is build and refine a psycho-emotive human model
- Location
- The general area. Possibly behind you.
Always glad to help
Yay! The villain is no more!
You're welcome, Brockton Bay
A moment later... "Eh, what's the worst that can happen? More insects! More!"
A bit later still... "Oops..."
Basically, as has been discussed, Coil's power is nowhere near as powerful as he thinks it is, or canon tends to show it, if you approach the problem from the right direction...
Making plans over time that he might pick up on, and of course after Dinah was kidnapped this becomes much harder to avoid, gives him time to test counter-plans. It's not unbeatable but it makes the problem much harder to deal with.
On the other hand, if you find him without him having any idea, or time to run his simulations, he's fucked. Especially if the lethal option is on the table, and honestly considering the sort of person he is and what he regularly did, the lethal option is probably the one to reach for immediately just to be safe. In this case, he was heavily involved in using his power to try to salvage various plans that were falling apart due to, ultimately, Taylor inadvertently triggering Brockton General to kick off a serious effort to deal with Winslow once and for all, the fallout of which fucked up all sorts of nefarious plots. BB being the home of nefarious plotitude, of course
So he didn't have spare 'timelines' to look for external threats other than the ones he was working on already, and had not the faintest idea that anyone was watching him for weeks on and off.He wouldn't have been happy to know that, but even if he did, it was probably too late as soon as Taylor initially found him.
And while he was locked in a room with Lisa, he was using both simulation channels to both question her and torture her, in his head at least. But it's an entirely valid thing to say that if you can see him you can kill him, because the 'other timeline' isn't actually real. It's purely a mental exercise. His physical body is always in the real timeline, regardless of what he may believe, so if you fill it with wasp venom, he's basically screwed. That he was highly allergic to that venom was entirely unexpected by Taylor or Lisa, and obviously wasn't the sort of weakness he was ever going to mention to anyone considering how paranoid the idiot was...
🤷♂️
That's my take on it anyway, and it's consistent with how canon claims his ability works, although not how canon writes his ability in many ways
And ironically, Taylor accidentally finished him off having entirely accidentally started the entire process in the first place two months ago without even realizing it
It's not ANFO, in fact. There are quite a few other possibilities. Assuming it was an ammonium nitrate explosive, which is favored for quarrying work due to the relatively slow detonation velocity being good at moving things rather than shattering them, you can use the stuff in quite a few different compositions. The one I had in my mind was basically ammonal, which is ammonium nitrate and aluminium powder, sometimes with other components mixed in. As long as it's kept dry, which sealed in heavy duty plastic bags it would be, it keeps for a very long time. It used to be used in WWII sea mines for example as it was cheaper than TNT and nearly as effective, and some of those things still sometimes turn up intact and unexploded. They're often still entirely viable after eighty plus years...
He used something he could get early on in his career as a supervillain without raising too many eyebrows. Several tons of quarrying explosives are far less likely to make people wonder than several tons of C4, which is a fuckload even by military terms. Any moderately large quarry on the other hands will go through that much bang powder in months at most. And the shock tube is again very commonly used in quarrying because it's cheap, safe, very hard to have accidents with, and much easier to connect than lots of electrical detonators.
He had almost nothing to go on, no. No one does at this point
Taylor is being surprisingly precog-proof by just not doing things that most Parahumans do. QA is finding this entirely enthralling and can't wait to find out what happens next...
Lisa did the posting from Coil's own computer
With Taylor making suggestions the whole time...It's super-effective!
See above, but basically correct, yes.
Also correct. Lisa was easily able to use her power to make certain no traces of her were left behind, and Taylor was never there to begin with.
Indeed
Bear in mind that at this point, does Taylor even know about the 'unwritten rules'? She's not involved in the actual cape scene, she's just making it up as she's going along, to the point even her own power has no idea how she's doing it. And as they're both unwritten AND followed rather vaguely if at all by people like Kaiser and probably the PRT, except where it benefits them for PR purposes, well... Even if she did know about them, Hookwolf was a legitimate target due to both his kill order and his actions, and Coil was a mildly embarrassing accident
She's not out hunting Nazis for sport, for example.
Yet...
But... The cockroachs! She has so many of them!
Might be
There are other reasons available...
Basically right, but as I explained above, the whole two-body thing is kind of wrong anyway.
Correct.
Also correct
MWKillKenny84
Lurking from the Trauma Switch.
- Location
- Vado Ligure
Lisa did the posting from Coil's own computer
Excuse me for a moment, I have the right img to use as reaction for this post... found it.
Ralyx
Seeking Balance
- Location
- The Realm Between
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I expect that one of Taylor's first attempts at expanding the types of insects her power includes will surely be the multitudes of microscopic insects like mites. Every human will be lit up like a petri dish.
Taylor: "C'mon now, you can't possibly argue that these don't qualify if you're including crabs!"
And then she learns about tardigrades, and suddenly becomes Crawler-lite.
Taylor: "C'mon now, you can't possibly argue that these don't qualify if you're including crabs!"
And then she learns about tardigrades, and suddenly becomes Crawler-lite.
- Location
- 3rd Rock from the Sun
it's a pity that taylor just let lisa go from the base. after the description of the dungeon and how taylor made her way to the base, i thought that lisa should be taken underground too. maybe lisa using her power could have revealed some secrets. maybe she could have figured out whose boat it was and how it got there? (i'm really worried about this). maybe it's a pirate boat? Maybe they could find a pirate treasure?
maybe someone talented could write a little omake about this?
maybe someone talented could write a little omake about this?