This surname actually has moderate association with being a complicated sort of traitor, btw. Not very strong association, tho. Prolly accidental.
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The Streetwalker's Guide to the Hierarchy
- Thread starter Birdsie
- Start date
Just to touch upon this, because I mentioned on it in one of my previous analysis posts. Mana itself is a force that strengths conceptual framework of whatever it inhabits, making it more real. Dwindling works by taking mana from the surroundings and putting it inside a single object, effectively making things around less real to make object more real.
During the pen test, we have seen that Japhris could also syphon our own pool of Distortion power. This would make it a sort of dark mana, which make sense given the stuff we talked about in previous world, how Towers work on mana while evil Towers are reverse of it. Also Contamination ultimately results into a thing ultimately completely losing its conceptual framework, while Mana strengthens it.
The outcomes are that a) as mentioned here, we are less capable of Contamination relics b) it is likely that Dwindling can be used to undo Contamination by reinforcing objects original concept c) Similar to contamination, it is likely that Dwindling can be used on stuff such as gravity of feelings, although Japhris likely lacks skill required and d) Tower gifts are probably mana-based, so there is something interesting there.
Additionally, we should mention how similar Facelessness is to Mana and Contamination, what with turning people into monsters, artifacts creating and so on.
But while all of this is interesting, I don't quite have a practical use for this speculation.
Regarding vote,
[] Maximum Greed
-[] Give five artifacts, take Glasses
--[] Enhance Glasses(1 Dwindling)
-[] Crown(6 Import, 4 Dwindlings)
-[] Enhance Arcanist(1 Dwindling)
-[] Enhanced Noble Cloak(1 Dwindling, 2 Import)
This gets us max social plus max crown. We use our high social to reduce effect of bringing in less artifacts, then on later date we buff up Artificer, Streetwalker and so on.
Fact that we can just power level a mask is super interesting. That means that we can make virtually any mask we can think off, and then power it up. Birdsie, would it be possible to write in something like
-[] Craft Viscerality Mask
--[] Enhance Viscerality Mask x2
--[] Focus Crown on Viscerality Masj
?
E: We could also try putting all Dwindlings into Arcanist. That should be absolutely hilarious, given that each Dwindling will also improve the next one; perhaps we could get that Mask all the way up to 80
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Birdsie
Sharp Talons Cleave The Worthy
- Location
- Poland
If you're referring to Pavlik Morozov, I was aware of that actually, but the surname use is actually simply coincidental here; I pulled that name out of a hat (not literally but you get the idea.)
Good poiit, although we can likely just use plants to make masks at some point.
That being said, I am now super interested in Arcanist build. So
[X] Minimax
-[X] Give back all artifacts
-[X] Enhance Mask(Arcanist): 7 Dwindlings
Arcanist increases Jephris' ability to Dwindle, and given the environment it should be fuck broken. We can make other stuff later when Jephris has like 70 point mask to do whatever with all this mana round us.
Birdsie
Sharp Talons Cleave The Worthy
- Location
- Poland
It should be noted that as a result of [complex Arcane glossolalia you don't even pretend to understand], enhancement of whole-ass living beings either:
a) results in various physical enhancements only, or
b) is dangerous and fraught with side effects, or
c) doesn't work
(Enhancement of your Visceral implants should be very narrowly possible since they are not 100% integrated yet, only close to it.)
Sure, you could do this within the timeframe you have for all of this.
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Birdsie
Sharp Talons Cleave The Worthy
- Location
- Poland
Ah, then that is eminently doable, yes - the lack of the mask there threw me off a bit.
So with that info, I think we have three main builds
Social build: Bring more stuff back, go cloak plus glasses for maximum social, work your way through military
Verdant King: Make Verdant Mask, get it to ~45 Potential, then combine it with maxed out Crown
Arcana XX - ZA WARUDO: Arcanist's Mask positive feedback loop
Should be noted that none of this shit is unique, so we can do Social into Arcana loop later etc.
Social build: Bring more stuff back, go cloak plus glasses for maximum social, work your way through military
Verdant King: Make Verdant Mask, get it to ~45 Potential, then combine it with maxed out Crown
Arcana XX - ZA WARUDO: Arcanist's Mask positive feedback loop
Should be noted that none of this shit is unique, so we can do Social into Arcana loop later etc.
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Alright, I think this is the best
[X] Plan Minimax plus social
-[X] Give back six artifacts, keep Glasses and Earphones
--[X] Test out Pin by incorporating it into a Mask before giving it away
-[X] Enhance Mask(Arcanist's Mask): 6 Dwindlings
-[X] Enhanced Noble Cloak: 1 Dwindling, 2 Import
This build is probably the best. 6 Dwindlings should make Arcanist broken af still, and we get majority of social build as well. Great social and god tier mana manipulation should set us up really nicely going forward in this world.
[X] Plan Minimax plus social
-[X] Give back six artifacts, keep Glasses and Earphones
--[X] Test out Pin by incorporating it into a Mask before giving it away
-[X] Enhance Mask(Arcanist's Mask): 6 Dwindlings
-[X] Enhanced Noble Cloak: 1 Dwindling, 2 Import
This build is probably the best. 6 Dwindlings should make Arcanist broken af still, and we get majority of social build as well. Great social and god tier mana manipulation should set us up really nicely going forward in this world.
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- Location
- Louisiana
The earbuds are the star of the show for me. What's better than a somewhat snarky voice telling you information we have no way of knowing? With all of the random worlds we're getting dropped in, I think it's an incredibly useful tool. I'd even argue we should empower it further, using it to unlock secrets on worlds and vastly improve our information gathering.
Because a) most of information we've gotten from them is not very useful, as seen in this update and b) we can make them/better shit later.
Boosting Arcanist's Mask unlocks full potential of this world and boosting social helps with immediate actions and ensures that we don't have much issue with Jephris, especially as we try to get her to some level of Fixation.
Boosting Arcanist's Mask unlocks full potential of this world and boosting social helps with immediate actions and ensures that we don't have much issue with Jephris, especially as we try to get her to some level of Fixation.
Rihaku
The Internet
Some observations:
*The Cloak's enhanced effect is extremely good value. Social augmentation equal to our previous strongest mask and it doesn't even consume a mask slot! We should definitely get this.
*Dorian is pretty weak despite his substantial versatility. He has a lot of magic system but isn't particularly proficient with any of them - save for Maskmaking, but we refuse to Fixate and seize the true power available to masks. We've tried to train but it seems Dorian won't get anywhere close to master-level without long timeskips.
*Because we're weak, we can't explore many of the plot options safely. We couldn't fight the deathknight, we couldn't travel around Musurov's world because we were to weak to handle street-level werewolves, etc. Had we had a combat mask at >100 Potential (via some level of Fixation), these would likely have been feasible and trivial, respectively. A combat mask at 40 Potential is weaker than Spider-Man; at 100 Potential has skyscraper-busting strength and durability plus numerous utility effects.
*Strength comes from either a powerful synergy between numerous well-developed systems or one mastered system.
To that end, two plans:
[X] Plan Antediluvian
-Noble Cloak: 1 Dwindling + 2 Import Enhanced Effect
-Crimson Lost: 1 Dwindling
-Japhris' Arcanist Mask: 1 Dwindling
-Verdant Crimson Crown: Dye the Crown in Dorian's blood to emphasize Visceral and blood-based biological themes over woodland ones, then fuse to the Crimson Lost. 4 Dwindlings + 6 Import Enhanced Effect (equal to 7-Dwindling level).
-Give up the other relics besides the earphones, glasses and pen
-If Dorian considers the risk of Final Fixation low, Moderately Fixate on Crimson Lost, and encourage Japhris to Moderately Fixate the Arcanist Mask. This is a temporary measure to get raw power up to snuff (45 -> 55 is a rather large jump in actual effectiveness)
This plan is pretty simple, go all-in on Mask + Viscerality synergies. Crimson Lost at 45+ Potential combined with a tier 7 Verdant Crown and three months in this world means Dorian will have a near-perfect opportunity to train this combo to impressive levels, especially with a ~40 Potential Arcanist mask aiding in future Dwindlings. The double social boost of Crown + Cloak will aid in securing more away trips, as will Dorian's sheer effectiveness in healing henceforth. With the Crown we can command beasts and fuse or augment them with Viscerality to use as powerful frontline troops. A Crown of this level provides significant resistance against a hostile forest itself, which synergizes well with the enhanced Arcanist Mask providing future Dwindlings.
[X] Plan Solomon
-Noble Cloak: 1 Dwindling + 2 Import Enhanced Effect
-Artificer Mask: 1 Dwindling
-Craft a new Mask: The Magician. A mask that straightforwardly enhances the bearer's talent, skill and raw power in their magic systems, focusing most on the areas where they are deficient; if they possess no magic grants them a generic-but-versatile magic system (think D&D) at a level proportional to the Mask's potential. At Potential 50, a Visceral novice under the influence of this mask might operate with the insight and effectiveness of an experienced journeyman; an actual journeyman might rise to the level of a master gifted with deep biological knowledge and fearsome emotional range.
-The Magician: 2 Dwindlings (to Potential ~55, assuming the boosted Artificer creates Masks with higher base Potentials)
-Either Japhris or Dorian will use the Magician at all times, depending on which of Viscerality + Kingship or Arcane Magic are needed in the situation. Alternatively, one of them can Moderately Fixate the Magician (to Potential ~65!) if Dorian deems the risk of FInal Fixation low. Decide in-character who will do so.
-The Earphones: 1 Dwindling
-The Pen: 1 Dwindling
-The Glasses: 1 Dwindling
-Give up the other un-augmented relics - steak, vase etc
This build focuses on improving Dorian's overall competence and makes him a master of social maneuver. Dorian with the Cloak + Glasses buff and Earphones for information-gathering should be able to achieve near-peak human levels of social performance, perhaps even a bit beyond. If necessary he can craft a pure social mask with the buffed Artificer to even further augment this. Meanwhile, a Moderately Fixated Magician on Japhris will get her to effective Potential ~65 with a pure wizard's mask. Saves Import; lacks raw might but commands extreme versatility when given any level of room to maneuver.
*The Cloak's enhanced effect is extremely good value. Social augmentation equal to our previous strongest mask and it doesn't even consume a mask slot! We should definitely get this.
*Dorian is pretty weak despite his substantial versatility. He has a lot of magic system but isn't particularly proficient with any of them - save for Maskmaking, but we refuse to Fixate and seize the true power available to masks. We've tried to train but it seems Dorian won't get anywhere close to master-level without long timeskips.
*Because we're weak, we can't explore many of the plot options safely. We couldn't fight the deathknight, we couldn't travel around Musurov's world because we were to weak to handle street-level werewolves, etc. Had we had a combat mask at >100 Potential (via some level of Fixation), these would likely have been feasible and trivial, respectively. A combat mask at 40 Potential is weaker than Spider-Man; at 100 Potential has skyscraper-busting strength and durability plus numerous utility effects.
*Strength comes from either a powerful synergy between numerous well-developed systems or one mastered system.
To that end, two plans:
[X] Plan Antediluvian
-Noble Cloak: 1 Dwindling + 2 Import Enhanced Effect
-Crimson Lost: 1 Dwindling
-Japhris' Arcanist Mask: 1 Dwindling
-
-Give up the other relics besides the earphones, glasses and pen
-If Dorian considers the risk of Final Fixation low, Moderately Fixate on Crimson Lost, and encourage Japhris to Moderately Fixate the Arcanist Mask. This is a temporary measure to get raw power up to snuff (45 -> 55 is a rather large jump in actual effectiveness)
This plan is pretty simple, go all-in on Mask + Viscerality synergies. Crimson Lost at 45+ Potential combined with a tier 7 Verdant Crown and three months in this world means Dorian will have a near-perfect opportunity to train this combo to impressive levels, especially with a ~40 Potential Arcanist mask aiding in future Dwindlings. The double social boost of Crown + Cloak will aid in securing more away trips, as will Dorian's sheer effectiveness in healing henceforth. With the Crown we can command beasts and fuse or augment them with Viscerality to use as powerful frontline troops. A Crown of this level provides significant resistance against a hostile forest itself, which synergizes well with the enhanced Arcanist Mask providing future Dwindlings.
[X] Plan Solomon
-Noble Cloak: 1 Dwindling + 2 Import Enhanced Effect
-Artificer Mask: 1 Dwindling
-Craft a new Mask: The Magician. A mask that straightforwardly enhances the bearer's talent, skill and raw power in their magic systems, focusing most on the areas where they are deficient; if they possess no magic grants them a generic-but-versatile magic system (think D&D) at a level proportional to the Mask's potential. At Potential 50, a Visceral novice under the influence of this mask might operate with the insight and effectiveness of an experienced journeyman; an actual journeyman might rise to the level of a master gifted with deep biological knowledge and fearsome emotional range.
-The Magician: 2 Dwindlings (to Potential ~55, assuming the boosted Artificer creates Masks with higher base Potentials)
-Either Japhris or Dorian will use the Magician at all times, depending on which of Viscerality + Kingship or Arcane Magic are needed in the situation. Alternatively, one of them can Moderately Fixate the Magician (to Potential ~65!) if Dorian deems the risk of FInal Fixation low. Decide in-character who will do so.
-The Earphones: 1 Dwindling
-The Pen: 1 Dwindling
-The Glasses: 1 Dwindling
-Give up the other un-augmented relics - steak, vase etc
This build focuses on improving Dorian's overall competence and makes him a master of social maneuver. Dorian with the Cloak + Glasses buff and Earphones for information-gathering should be able to achieve near-peak human levels of social performance, perhaps even a bit beyond. If necessary he can craft a pure social mask with the buffed Artificer to even further augment this. Meanwhile, a Moderately Fixated Magician on Japhris will get her to effective Potential ~65 with a pure wizard's mask. Saves Import; lacks raw might but commands extreme versatility when given any level of room to maneuver.
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Why not just get both? You can get most of social for cheap, then just boost Japhris. We could boost ourselves instead, of course, but we can also just do that latter and boosting Japhris should have better return on investement due to obvious reasons. Focusing on Japhris makes sense given that we can snowball like crazy. 6 Dwindlings to about 70 and 1.4 Fixation would get Arcanist's Mask close to 100, which in turns means insane Dwindling and buffing of everything else.
Its not even greedy, Japhris being super powerful and our enhanced social should cover most scenarios rather comfortably.
Its not even greedy, Japhris being super powerful and our enhanced social should cover most scenarios rather comfortably.
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Could I convince you to hang on to the earphones? They seem quite valuable as a divinatory tool and potential future Dwindle target.
Some other ideas regarding Dwindling, since we're likely to get at least one more shot at this
- Could we Dwindle and spend Import to get a novel type of boost out of the earphones?
- Could we use a relic (Dwindled or otherwise) as material for a mask?
- Do Japhris and Linneas have Visceral implants? (I know we Viscerally enhanced them, at least.) If they have newer implants than us, would those be better targets for Dwindling than our own implants?
OctarineShrike
Avatar of Mandos
Base Relic Haul(8)
Jacket
Pen
Earphones
Steak
Safety Pin
Acoustic Guitar
Glasses
Crystal Vase
We're expected to provide 7 relics at minimum and have 8.
Dwindling Proposal:
[x]Plan Utility and Balance
-[x]Backpack of Holding
-[x]Enhance Mask: Artificers Face
-[x]Enhance Mask: Arcanist's Mask
-[x]Enhance Mask: The Icarelian
-[x]Enhance Mask: Andrei's Warmask
-[x]Infuse PDA
-[x]Infuse Shoes
-[x]YIELD:Jacket, Steak, Safety Pin, Glasses, PDA, Shoes, Pen
-[x]KEEP: Backpack, Acoustic Guitar, Earphones, and Vase
-[x]Craft the Mask of the Psychonaut to hide relics in dreamspace inventory and/or a Miniaturization mask to conceal the relics if necessary.
Reasoning:
If you include the Backpack, PDA, and Shoes that gives us 11 Relics we can conceivably surrender. We are probably going to need the backpack or some kind of storage mask if we hope to conceal the guitar/vase.
The Artificer's Face seems like a no brainer, helps Dorian help himself and all the other members of the party.
The Arcanist's mask for Japhris is good considering she's the reason this scheme is possible and it helps her be more useful in the future.
The Icarelian gives us another mask with combat options and/or buffs our control over Gamaliel so that we might use it with more confidence to heal our creativity. We could also give it to Linneas when we aren't using it to give him more combat options.
Andrei's Warmask is a benefit for him we can get without needed the Pen and the Journal as Relics for him. To clarify, I think he'd get useful synergy from using the relic pen with his journal elevated to a relic. Being able to yield the pen enables us to conceivably keep the backpack, which makes the Guitar and Vase plausible to keep.
The PDA and Shoes are ablative armor and I have no idea what they'd do, they're stuff to surrender to keep the relics this plan actually wants. Besides the pen for which I've already explained my reasoning, Dorian has singing background and the earphones have encouraged us to try playing the Acoustic Guitar. It gets his heart rate up, which can be associated with passions which is useful for viscerality training if you stretch things a little. Plus Musicality is associated with the Street. The Earphones are just... good. The Vase is to facilitate viscerality experiments.
Variation brainstorming: I might also consider buffing streetwalker masks. I'm kind of curious about the steak. We may be able to give up the backpack as a relic if we make the Mask of the Psychonaut with a dreamspace inventory aspect here and now, or a miniaturization mask.
Jacket
Pen
Earphones
Steak
Safety Pin
Acoustic Guitar
Glasses
Crystal Vase
We're expected to provide 7 relics at minimum and have 8.
Dwindling Proposal:
[x]Plan Utility and Balance
-[x]Backpack of Holding
-[x]Enhance Mask: Artificers Face
-[x]Enhance Mask: Arcanist's Mask
-[x]Enhance Mask: The Icarelian
-[x]Enhance Mask: Andrei's Warmask
-[x]Infuse PDA
-[x]Infuse Shoes
-[x]YIELD:Jacket, Steak, Safety Pin, Glasses, PDA, Shoes, Pen
-[x]KEEP: Backpack, Acoustic Guitar, Earphones, and Vase
-[x]Craft the Mask of the Psychonaut to hide relics in dreamspace inventory and/or a Miniaturization mask to conceal the relics if necessary.
Reasoning:
If you include the Backpack, PDA, and Shoes that gives us 11 Relics we can conceivably surrender. We are probably going to need the backpack or some kind of storage mask if we hope to conceal the guitar/vase.
The Artificer's Face seems like a no brainer, helps Dorian help himself and all the other members of the party.
The Arcanist's mask for Japhris is good considering she's the reason this scheme is possible and it helps her be more useful in the future.
The Icarelian gives us another mask with combat options and/or buffs our control over Gamaliel so that we might use it with more confidence to heal our creativity. We could also give it to Linneas when we aren't using it to give him more combat options.
Andrei's Warmask is a benefit for him we can get without needed the Pen and the Journal as Relics for him. To clarify, I think he'd get useful synergy from using the relic pen with his journal elevated to a relic. Being able to yield the pen enables us to conceivably keep the backpack, which makes the Guitar and Vase plausible to keep.
The PDA and Shoes are ablative armor and I have no idea what they'd do, they're stuff to surrender to keep the relics this plan actually wants. Besides the pen for which I've already explained my reasoning, Dorian has singing background and the earphones have encouraged us to try playing the Acoustic Guitar. It gets his heart rate up, which can be associated with passions which is useful for viscerality training if you stretch things a little. Plus Musicality is associated with the Street. The Earphones are just... good. The Vase is to facilitate viscerality experiments.
Variation brainstorming: I might also consider buffing streetwalker masks. I'm kind of curious about the steak. We may be able to give up the backpack as a relic if we make the Mask of the Psychonaut with a dreamspace inventory aspect here and now, or a miniaturization mask.
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- Location
- 1
[X] Enhance Mask - the Mask that Japhris is using for Arcanism
-[X] If this Mask doesn't already include the ability to generate the Mana Arcanism uses and the Vase doesn't cover it, attempt to make a Mask or Artifact for the purpose (perhaps using a small well-like trinket or something if you can find one?). Preferably immediately so as to dwindle it up to 40, but if infeasible it's an issue for later.
[X] Enhance Relic - A pair of earphones, if the above makes the process unlikely to backfire; else, the Vase.
[X] Empowered Armor
[X] Noble Cloak
[X] Give up: Steak, Safety Pin, Acoustic Guitar, Glasses.
Not much of an opinion for the remaining 3 Dwindlings as yet.
-[X] If this Mask doesn't already include the ability to generate the Mana Arcanism uses and the Vase doesn't cover it, attempt to make a Mask or Artifact for the purpose (perhaps using a small well-like trinket or something if you can find one?). Preferably immediately so as to dwindle it up to 40, but if infeasible it's an issue for later.
[X] Enhance Relic - A pair of earphones, if the above makes the process unlikely to backfire; else, the Vase.
[X] Empowered Armor
[X] Noble Cloak
[X] Give up: Steak, Safety Pin, Acoustic Guitar, Glasses.
Not much of an opinion for the remaining 3 Dwindlings as yet.
OctarineShrike
Avatar of Mandos
Let me be clear. We have 8 relics baseline and are expected to yield 7 at minimum. I'd consider some ablative armor relics to mask the relics we want to keep unless you're willing to just keep one or have another plan like banking on the cloaks social boosts to talk us out of whatever issue comes up.
- Location
- Poland
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X]Plan Utility and Balance
No, because they are bad. Literally go over things we gained for them - out of dozen or so full on divinations we got, only two were even remotely useful, and those not much either. We can make better divinatory items in the future.
You people are not voting dogshit good stuff plans. That particular plan is not even a good goodstuff plan.
Let me spell this out. The way Mask buffing work, we can expect Arcanist to go 11 > x2D > 55 > x2D > 65 > x2D > 71 Potential. The reason we spend last two dwindling is because 71x1.4 gets us to just about 100 Potential total, which is a major milestone. At the very least we can expect Japhris to do city wide Dwindlings now(this appears to be area of most 100 potential masks), which is anywhere near 20-200 increase in power of Dwindling area, Which is why we do this in the first place.
Now, to go on a Fixation tangent - between how powerful Mask naturally is(~70) and how close it is to Japrhis, we can expect swift Fixation. If needed, we will take necessary actions to accelerate fixation to get to that 1.4 point. Her being an elf might make it harder for her to fixate, which is why those actions might be needed. Finally, Fixation brings personality change which might make Japhris unwilling to work with us, but that is precisely why we took social, so we can keep up with her and ensure that she is in our camp(OOC at aleast).
While going from city block to city range might seem impressive(and indeed it is, and we can expect a lot of value), we don't want to stop there. We hope that Jephris also gets increased skill that would let us construct a ritual that would let us Dwindle a country, continent or even entire planet surface worth of mana.
So for fucks sake, stop voting for aimless shit that boosts our fucking boots andy
you know what fuck it, im not explaining why positive feedback loop is good. vote random shit, its a birdsie quest its not like we can lose who fuckinbg cares
- Location
- Earth
Many nice items here, but I'm surprised the less interest in the armor.
This world has computers and such, so the armor could integrate some some hand held stuff.
We find another world with talismans for some kind of necessary protection, the armor can integrate that most likely.
For how I interpret things, this armor would likely make anything handheld and not special enough to require effort in acquiring easy to integrate in the gear of the party.
The headphones are a clear winner in my book, but self-upgrading gear means freeing up crafting actions for more important work.
Long term, viscerality will do a lot, it'll be huge. These armor suits though would make getting there faster and of imagine there might be some long term really excellent synergy between armor upgraded with cybernetic connectivity and viscerality enhanced wearers.
@Birdsie, am I chirping up the wrong tree here in my assessment of this armor?
Bolded for emphasis, the armor will markedly cut down on incidental crafting time for team upgrades.
This world has computers and such, so the armor could integrate some some hand held stuff.
We find another world with talismans for some kind of necessary protection, the armor can integrate that most likely.
For how I interpret things, this armor would likely make anything handheld and not special enough to require effort in acquiring easy to integrate in the gear of the party.
The headphones are a clear winner in my book, but self-upgrading gear means freeing up crafting actions for more important work.
Long term, viscerality will do a lot, it'll be huge. These armor suits though would make getting there faster and of imagine there might be some long term really excellent synergy between armor upgraded with cybernetic connectivity and viscerality enhanced wearers.
@Birdsie, am I chirping up the wrong tree here in my assessment of this armor?
- Location
- Poland
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] Plan Minimax plus social
Alright, let's take deep breaths.
Alright, let's take deep breaths.
ThatGuyWithIdeas
Treize died for our sins
- Location
- Romania
[X] Plan Minimax plus social