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Strange Tides

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FortTell said:
As much as the mathematician in me likes this, it is unfortunately unavailable as it was formalized by Kantor and Dedekind in XIX century AD.
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I know, I just couldn't resist the joke.

FortTell said:
Also, please not assassinate neither Argurios nor Semni. He returned learning a tale about breaking marriage leading to dead villages. If Isidoros can assure Argurios that this marriage is not looked down upon, Argurios will be fine. He has already acknowledged there is hardly a better match for him it terms of wife status.
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There is a reason I didn't actually do the assassinate write in. As toxic as Argurios is, it would still be a huge mistake to off him, and I actually think Semni would be a good influence.
 
[X] Write-in: Speak with Argurios to salvage this marriage. If he can learn to accept his wife, so might she accept him. And, if you are about it, also speak to Semni.

// With veekie's analysis, trying to salvage the marriage seems like the least likely to backfire, given the flexibility of the prophecy. Because removing the children can backfire any way, including running into the invalidation of "a union pure".
 
Vote closed.
Adhoc vote count started by DragonParadox on Dec 10, 2018 at 1:21 PM, finished with 804 posts and 11 votes.
  • [X] Speak with Argurios to salvage this marriage. If he can learn to accept his wife, so might she accept him.
    [X] Declare Argurios and Semni unfit to care for the children and take them in as Isidoros' wards. This prophecy might yet turn into a boon if the children are taken proper care of.
    [X] Do nothing. To meddle with the designs of the gods rarely ends well for mortals.
    [X] Write-in: Speak with Argurios to salvage this marriage. If he can learn to accept his wife, so might she accept him. And, if you are about it, also speak to Semni.
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Part XIV: Words Tangled and Deft
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    • Words Tangled and Deft​

    Isidoros did not consider himself a softhearted man, for none such could have climbed so high in the service of the kings of Orchomenos, yet the thought of slaying babes in arms over what they may yet do sickened him. He would not see Hyphyria raised upon such a legacy of butchery. Briefly, very briefly, he had considered simply taking the children himself, but the notion could not withstand a serious weighing, He had no heirs of his body and precious little experience with children and their ways. To tear them from their mother's breast thinking that he would do a better job raising them seemed thus a fool's presumption.

    All other options expended he was left with trying to mend the chasm that had grown between Argurios and Semni. Thus did the king of Hyphyria call upon the young warrior who had stood at his right hand and asked of him that he try to salvage something of his marriage for the good of Hyphyria for the good of the city. Alas that those were not the words he aught to have spoken.

    "The city?" Argurios' voice was dangerously soft. "Did I not wed the wench for Hyphyria's sake? Do I not let her wander loose to over the hills to dicker with the rest of her savage kin? What more would you ask me to surrender? Should I abandon my own manhood before my hearth and pour ashes in my head for her pleasure? To that I say nay. A king you may be, but you are no god to command my heart and soul."

    With that Argurios swept from the room without a backwards look, leaving Isidoros to stare at his retreating back with helpless foreboding.

    Diplomacy Check: Critical Failure (Argurios offended)

    In response Isidoros threw himself into his work, for the ordering of numbers he knew and he reasoned that a well-ordered court would be better suited to dealing with the turmoil to come than he alone ever could.

    Court Organization Success: A task well begun

    ***​

    Sometimes when walking through the steep hills and rich vales of this new land you could almost trick yourself into thinking it was home, thought Karpathia once of Orchomenos. The whisper of the wind though aspen leaves was no different, nor the murmur of a mountains stream. Then she would look to the faces of her traveling companions and see the weariness there that was more than the simple watchfulness of any traveler upon the road, the understanding that they were well and truly alone here, strangers in a strange land.

    When Karpathia was still a child hanging by her mother's skirts she dimly recalled one of her uncles, a captain of some note, saying that the worst thing about sailing was the loneliness. She had not been able to understand how sailors could be lonely packed together in a boat until they were practically falling into each other's laps. When she had asked her mother how that could be, the young woman remembered getting a pat on the head and a reminder that she would not be sailing to any far off lands in any case.

    The Fates had a sense of irony it seemed, for she had sailed farther than her mother ever could have imagined along with all that was left of Orchomenos, but that was not when she got her answer. No, it was here and now, feet firmly planted on dry ground and aching from all the walking that Karpathia understood what true loneliness was, seeing fires in the distance and knowing that those around them new not your gods and kept not to your customs. Of face and even of dress the folk of this land were not so different from the poor shepherds of the heights but the very way their tongue shaped their faces as they spoke was strange, a reminder of how very few the Hyphyrians truly were.

    Yet looking towards the new lady of the House Alexis, Karpathia could not keep back a small smile also. Here was one high in the counsels of the king, one upon which rested the wealth and prosperity of all Hyphyria, and she had been chosen as a companion. Granted there had not been than many noble ladies clamoring for the honor given the danger of the journey and the... unusual circumstances of the lady's marriage, but the more fool those who kept silent, Karpathia thought. Just as it had been with the twins new-born the soul of Hyphyria would be blood and bone of both peoples, just as it was said Orchomenos was begotten when the Achaians came down into the lowlands of Boeotia and and found there the sons and daughters of Pelasgus. Did not the gods themselves proclaim the grand fate of her children?

    Trade was a good field to sow, but it would not be the last nor the most enduring Hyphyria would bring forth.

    Trade Success: Gain 1d6 Wealth income

    As the traders returned and spring gave way to summer, the people of Hyphyria found their granaries slowly gathering stocks, though still not as many as the more cautious among them would have liked, especially with more mouths to feed.

    Supplies: 0 (Stocks) +19 (Farming) +1 (Herds) -17 (Upkeep) = 3

    Wealth: 1 (Stocks) + 10 (Industry) +1 (Trade) -7 (Upkeep) = 5

    Summer is upon you once more the best time for bold deeds under Helios' burning gaze
    [] Isidoros
    [] Argurios
    [] Semni

    Available actions:
    -[] Organize Patrols
    Now that some order has been reestablished in the military, it might be time to organize a better defense for Hyphyria. The lands around the city are full of hidden tracks and passages that could be used to move undetected, so patrolling them might make all the difference if foes approach. (Requires one action per area to set up.)
    --[] The Northern Forests
    --[] The Eastern Mountains
    --[] Along the river to the sea.
    --[] The Southern Forests (may cause issues with the Woodsfolk if done without their agreement).
    --[] By ship, along the coastline. (Requires one Galley Squadron, can take along one land unit per squadron).
    --[] Write-In units to station in the area.
    Check: Warfare - Strategy

    -[] Start an Expedition
    The immediate surroundings of Hyphyria are decently explored by now, but what lies beyond the mountains and the forests? It will require a decent force and quite some time to learn more about the lands, but it might yield interesting finds.
    --[] Write-In Target
    --[] Write-In Units to send
    Check: Warfare - Strategy
    Hero Unit will not be available while the expedition is ongoing and might need to perform other checks, depending on the events.

    -[] Start an Invasion
    So far you have not seen any place in these lands that boasted a decent force of warriors. The people here might be quarrelsome, but they are no match for Greek soldiers. It might be time to exploit this.
    --[] Write-In Target
    --[] Write-In Units to send
    --[] Write-In War-Goal (Salve Raid, Conquest, etc.)
    Starts War-Turns
    -[] Organize a proper court.
    It is past time that Hyphyria gains a proper court. With the military, the artisans and the priests having returned to some semblance of order, all the is left is to fill the palace with life as it deserves. Hyphyria will be a refugee camp no longer, but a proper Greek city.
    Time Needed: Unknown
    Check: Rulership - Administration
    Note: A construction project takes one action to start and will then continue without the need for further attention. Costs are consumed per turn, and if the costs can't be paid, construction stalls. Should the construction stall too long, progress might be lost.

    -[] Small Palisade
    While the amount of lumber left over from the ships doesn't suffice anymore to see this done, you could still build a small palisade around each hill. It would separate parts of the city in case of an attack and not protect the farmlands, but it is cheap and better then nothing.
    Construction Cost: 4 Wealth / Turn
    Time: 1 Turn
    Upkeep: 1 Wealth / Turn
    Check: Rulership - Administration

    -[] Large Palisade
    Some of proposed to use the fresh lumber for a grander defensive work. By encircling all the villages and some land around it too, you could protect Hyphyria much better and even the farms would be wholly enclosed by this defense.
    Construction Cost: 4 Wealth / Turn
    Time: 4 Turns
    Upkeep: 2 Wealth / Turn
    Check: Rulership - Administration

    -[] Logging Camp
    The forest to the north is ample and there is little reason to not expand your logging operations.
    Construction Cost: 3 Wealth / Turn
    Time: 1 Turn
    Upkeep: 1 Wealth / Turn
    Income: 1d6 Wealth / Turn
    Check: Rulership - Trade

    -[] Limestone Quarry
    The masons who have fled Orchomenos would like to get back to work and a source of stone would certainly help other construction efforts.
    Construction Cost: 5 Wealth / Turn
    Time: 4 Turns
    Upkeep: 3 Wealth / Turn
    Income: 2d6 Wealth / Turn
    Check: Rulership - Trade

    -[] Pottery Kilns
    With pottery being so appreciated by the locals the city might be well served increasing production.
    Construction Cost: 2 Wealth / Turn
    Time: 3 Turns
    Upkeep: 1 Wealth / Turn
    Income: 1d6 Wealth / Turn
    Check: Rulership - Trade

    -[] Olive Grove
    Back in Greece, one of the most common trading goods is olive oil, highly sought after for its taste and the ability to preserve foods.
    Converts one Farmstead to a Olive Grove. The building will not produce anything during conversion.
    Construction Cost: 1 Wealth / Turn
    Time: 20 Turns
    Upkeep: 1 Wealth / Turn
    Income: 1d6 Wealth / Turn
    Check: Rulership - Trade

    -[] Vineyard
    What would a feast be without wine? And what drink should be sacrificed to the gods? Goat milk? It is time to produce wine in Hyphyria, lest it forget the taste altogether.
    Converts one Farmstead to a Vineyard. The building will not produce anything during conversion.
    Construction Cost: 2 Wealth / Turn
    Time: 4 Turns
    Upkeep: 1 Wealth / Turn
    Income: 1d6 Wealth / Turn
    Check: Rulership - Trade

    -[] Drain the Valleys
    The valleys between the hills of Hyphyria are fertile, but too wet to grow anything there. With the preliminary plans drawn up, it is time to start the long project of claiming this rich soil.
    Construction Cost: 2 Wealth / Turn
    Time: 12 Turns
    Upkeep: 2 Wealth / Turn
    Check: Rulership - Administration & Learning - Sciences
    -[] Send someone to negotiate with the local people to deepen ties or heal past insults.
    --[] The Woodsfolk
    --[] The Northern Villages
    --[] The Mountain Shepherds
    ---[] (Optional) Bring gifts: Write-In amount of Supplies or Wealth to gift

    -[] Attract Workers
    Hyphyria is yet small and able hands sometimes in short supply. It might be possible to convince some people from the other settlements to settle under Greek rule.
    --[] Write-In Target
    --[] (Optional) Offer incentives: Write-In how much Wealth to spend.
    Check: Diplomacy - Charm

    -[] Start Trading
    While the locals have no great desire for lumber or wool, the talks with the shepherds have revealed that many would be keen to buy Hyphyrian pottery. With some effort, regular trade could be established, profiting all involved and forging closer ties between them.
    --[] Write-In Target
    Check: Diplomacy - Multiple
    -[] Sacrifice to the Gods
    The gods are fickle beings and demand obedience and sacrifices from mortal men. Those who do not make offerings to them tend to draw their ire while those willing to render unto them great riches might earn their love.
    --[] Write-In which God
    --[] Write-In amount of Supplies or Wealth to offer
    Check: Learning - Mysticism

    -[] Study Local Legends
    Strange tales are told by those daring to venture close to the Woodsfolk's forests, and even Argurios seemed spooked by something uncanny on his latest journey. Maybe it would help to learn from the local people what manner of things stalk the nights in these lands.

    Check: Learning - Mysticism

    -[] Study Local Faiths
    Little do the Hyphyrians know about the gods of the land, even though they seem to somewhat resemble those of Greece. It would be wise to learn more about these beings, lest the people draw their ire unknowingly.
    Check: Learning - Mysticism

    OOC: The shy low diplo skill character was not the best equipped to handle marriage counseling, but at least you got your trade.
     
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  • Threadmarks
    • "Sigh"

    Because heroes are rare a too precious to be wasted I was against killing this man, it thought that it was too much troubles.

    But now he makes me more and more think of a gangrenous hand that we should cut before it contaminated the body.
     
    [X] Isidoros
    -[X] Organize a proper court.
    [X] Argurios
    -[X] Start an Expedition
    The immediate surroundings of Hyphyria are decently explored by now, but what lies beyond the mountains and the forests? It will require a decent force and quite some time to learn more about the lands, but it might yield interesting finds.
    --[X] Mountains
    --[X] 1x Archer Unit
    [X] Semni
    -[X] Start Trading
    --[X] The Northern Villages
    ---[X] for Food

    Reasons:
    Court for more options
    Expedition to explore the region and maybe find out if some more monsters are hiding
    Kilns for enough money to generate to build the quarry
    Change of plans: using trade now to generate enough food to bring us through the winter
     
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    We need more supplies, the next winter is coming. Any way our soldiers could ... 'gather' some supplies?
     
    MTB said:
    Now, what would you propose next time - choose the option for which the given hero has the best stat, regardless of the option itself?
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    Rather then that I would just prefer that people come down from their high horse in regards to Argurios

    People blame him for all the bad things that happened in the quest when most of it can be laid on the feet of the players

    Take for example him sleeping with Semni, without marrying her

    That was totally within the expectations and boundaries of his culture, which can be known if people read it up and yet people acted so outraged by it that is was just embarrassing to read

    Then there was the point where he failed to built the Kilns, which had people outraged again, despite it being a known factor that his Admin skill was his worst

    Beyond that, yes I would prefer if people would take the skills of the individual into account, instead of setting them up for failure because they send the shy guy to repair an unhappy relationship
     
    I WARNED YOU

    Well, hopefully he doesn't grow to resent his children.

    [X] Isidoros
    -[X] Organize a proper court.
    [X] Argurios
    -[X] Organize Patrols
    Now that some order has been reestablished in the military, it might be time to organize a better defense for Hyphyria. The lands around the city are full of hidden tracks and passages that could be used to move undetected, so patrolling them might make all the difference if foes approach. (Requires one action per area to set up.)
    --[X] The Eastern Mountains
    --[X] 1x Infintry Unit
    [X] Semni
    -[X] Start Trading
    --[X] The Northern Villages
    ---[X] for Food

    -[X] Sacrifice to the Gods
    The gods are fickle beings and demand obedience and sacrifices from mortal men. Those who do not make offerings to them tend to draw their ire while those willing to render unto them great riches might earn their love.
    --[X] Hera
    --[X] 1 Wealth
    --[X] 1 Supplies
     
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    [X] Isidoros
    -[X] Organize a proper court.
    [X] Argurios
    -[X] Start an Expedition
    The immediate surroundings of Hyphyria are decently explored by now, but what lies beyond the mountains and the forests? It will require a decent force and quite some time to learn more about the lands, but it might yield interesting finds.
    --[X] Mountains
    --[X] 1x Archer Unit
    [X] Semni
    -[X] Start Trading
    --[X] The Northern Villages
    ---[X] for Food
     
    Two things to note:

    1. Now that you have a trade-partner, you can trade Wealth for Supplies as a free action at a 1:1 rate. The locals are somewhat limited in the amount of surplus they can produce though, so you can trade at most 1d6 worth of Supplies each turn. The roll comes after the plan vote is called, so you might end up trading only 2 Supplies instead of the planned 4 if the dice decide it so. You can support your farming income from this, but it's inadvisable to rely too much on it.

    2. Since neither sheep products nor lumber are terribly rare resources in these lands, your only big export is pottery. That though is also traded on by the hill tribes, so others in the area would be less inclined to buy much of it from you directly. So in case you want to have a second trade agreement, the income from that will be lower until you produce more different trade goods. It generally pays off when you have a wide range of goods then focusing on one particular thing.
     
    @Azel
    That question was kinda serious. Can we murder him?

    He's unhappy, not very useful and has big influence with the military.
    Unless we get some outside enemies he's useful against soon I'm actually considering to remove him.
     
    Azel said:
    That though is also traded on by the hill tribes
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    are the nothern villages hill tribes?

    Azel said:
    It generally pays off when you have a wide range of goods then focusing on one particular thing.
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    actually it's the opposite since doubling down on a specific trade good create competition within the settlement, which combined with a greater infrastructure from specialization results in more innovation, creating a greater quality product, allowing you to demand more money for it since everybody wants the shiniest product

    But whatever it's your quest, if you want us to diversify then more power to you

    Azel said:
    the income from that will be lower until you produce more different trade goods.
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    Can we just alter the current agreement to produce 1d3 for both wealth and food?
     
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    Artemis1992 said:
    @Azel
    That question was kinda serious. Can we murder him?

    He's unhappy, not very useful and has big influence with the military.
    Unless we get some outside enemies he's useful against soon I'm actually considering to remove him.
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    You can. It would take Diplomacy - Deception checks to set something up.

    sidestory said:
    actually it's the opposite since doubling down on a specific trade good create competition within the settlement, which combined with a greater infrastructure from specialization results in more innovation, creating a greater quality product, allowing you to demand more money for it since everybody wants the shiniest product

    But whatever it's your quest, if you want us to diversify then more power to you
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    While this is generally true, you are making the assumption that demand is large enough to actually consume everything you produce. That is true when you are part of a larger trade-network (which incidentally needs many different goods being traded between many places to come into being), but as you are currently selling very locally, you would just tank the prices for your products if you produce too much.

    Long term, having a specialization is indeed very beneficial, but an economy rooted on a single good is prone to failure. Ask Venezuela.
     
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