True enough, perhaps not just that. But there isn't a lot beyond.
Res Publica: A Quest of Ancient Rome
- Thread starter Telamon
- Start date
- Original Historic
- Location
- Europe
Since our father came up right now and in the update, @Telamon, do you have a character sheet for him? Uptil now you've only posted sheets for legends and the best of what can be achieved (something I hope Atellus will be able to match in a few decades), but what about a simply skilled, good, but not great, Roman like Atellus' father? How do we compare to a man like him, and how does Atellus' father compare to great Romans?
Thought it might be fun to theorycraft a plan for sticking with Sertorius, though I think most of us want to stay in Rome.
With thevacation assignment to Spain locked in, and us pretty thoroughly picking a side, I figured Atellus would want speak to Scaevola. Let him hear the news from us, explain how we're following in our father's footsteps, thank him for the help he's given us, etc, etc. Maybe not pour gasoline all over that bridge by talking to him instead of riding out the front gate flipping him the bird.
Visiting our family seemed like a good choice, say hi to everyone, talk to our sister about that arranged marriage thing, build up our mental health, tell everyone how much we missed them, maybe have Proserpina explain thatpig latin super secret spy code she sent us during our time in the south. You know, typical Roman family stuff.
Had absolutely no idea what to do with our partying though. I thought about doubling down on the bacchanals, get smashed with the poor and the rich, but decided on getting smashed with strictly the poor. Seemed in character for Atellus, who so loves the plebs.
The Blood and Sand choice was a bit of a hail Mary. It's already been pointed out that both camps have reason to not care for Sertorius, so maybe we'll meet someone interesting, someone who could open a door for us in the future, if this progresses how it did historically for Sertorius.
Gameplay wise, Sertorius is extremely capable, and we'd be at his side learning what he knows. We'd be able to gain a lot of experience very fast in all things war, and presumably administration. We'd gain the loyalty of the legions, and possibly that of the cities in Hispania by using our considerable skill in oratory. Sertorius lost the war and was eventually betrayed by his own men, but we might be able to change that, and end up in a very powerful position. Alternatively, we could turn on him and use the gratitude we've cultivated in Hispania to create our own power base or even continue his administrative work in another part of theEmpire Republic. I believe @Publicola was talking about a possibility of reforming the republic, which might be interesting.
[] The Quixotic Quest
-[] Accept Sertorius' offer. Scaevola will doubtless be angered by your implicit rejection of his patronage, but you will gain as a mentor a man who learned at the feet of Marius himself. You will fight in the dusky fields of Spain where your father earned his glory and his name, and learn of war at the feet of a master. Hannibal, Scipio, Sertorius -- some of Rome's most beloved and hated names have arisen in Spain. Might you follow in their footsteps?
-[] A Soldier's Welcome: You pay a visit to your sisters at the apartment Proserpina has rented for your family in Rome. Your old servants will be there as well.
-[] Mentor: You pay a visit to the Pontifex Maximus, your mentor, the old jurist Scaevola.
-[] Blood and Sand: The teeming hordes of Rome gather in the amphitheaters of the city to watch men fight and die and scrabble in the dirt for the glory and the name of Rome. Many of the city's more bloodthirsty elite take a special delight in these festivities, and several influential Senate members often watch.
-[] Revels in the Forum: When night falls, the plebs and the patricians alike join in great revels in the Forum, with wine, flesh, and food abound. The common people will love any who join them in their mad bacchanals.
With the
Visiting our family seemed like a good choice, say hi to everyone, talk to our sister about that arranged marriage thing, build up our mental health, tell everyone how much we missed them, maybe have Proserpina explain that
Had absolutely no idea what to do with our partying though. I thought about doubling down on the bacchanals, get smashed with the poor and the rich, but decided on getting smashed with strictly the poor. Seemed in character for Atellus, who so loves the plebs.
The Blood and Sand choice was a bit of a hail Mary. It's already been pointed out that both camps have reason to not care for Sertorius, so maybe we'll meet someone interesting, someone who could open a door for us in the future, if this progresses how it did historically for Sertorius.
Gameplay wise, Sertorius is extremely capable, and we'd be at his side learning what he knows. We'd be able to gain a lot of experience very fast in all things war, and presumably administration. We'd gain the loyalty of the legions, and possibly that of the cities in Hispania by using our considerable skill in oratory. Sertorius lost the war and was eventually betrayed by his own men, but we might be able to change that, and end up in a very powerful position. Alternatively, we could turn on him and use the gratitude we've cultivated in Hispania to create our own power base or even continue his administrative work in another part of the
[] The Quixotic Quest
-[] Accept Sertorius' offer. Scaevola will doubtless be angered by your implicit rejection of his patronage, but you will gain as a mentor a man who learned at the feet of Marius himself. You will fight in the dusky fields of Spain where your father earned his glory and his name, and learn of war at the feet of a master. Hannibal, Scipio, Sertorius -- some of Rome's most beloved and hated names have arisen in Spain. Might you follow in their footsteps?
-[] A Soldier's Welcome: You pay a visit to your sisters at the apartment Proserpina has rented for your family in Rome. Your old servants will be there as well.
-[] Mentor: You pay a visit to the Pontifex Maximus, your mentor, the old jurist Scaevola.
-[] Blood and Sand: The teeming hordes of Rome gather in the amphitheaters of the city to watch men fight and die and scrabble in the dirt for the glory and the name of Rome. Many of the city's more bloodthirsty elite take a special delight in these festivities, and several influential Senate members often watch.
-[] Revels in the Forum: When night falls, the plebs and the patricians alike join in great revels in the Forum, with wine, flesh, and food abound. The common people will love any who join them in their mad bacchanals.
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- Location
- Austria
Actually, possibility of going with Scaevola is....extremely risky, in a way.
But not without merit.
Having a powerbase all of our own is useful. And frontier will let us get some glory by conquest or, alternatively, better control of Hispania. Either way, while chaos of Rome is a ladder, chaos of Hispania can also be one, if we play our cards right.
Additionally, I just don't want to be in Rome while Marians and Sullans go at it. Not at all.
And finally: it just feels more fun to play as a bigger player in Hispania than just another ambitious youth in Rome. We'd still serve Sertorious, sure, but I think we'd have more power than in Rome?
Better to be first in village than second in Rome, as somebody who will soon totally lose all relevance once said.
But not without merit.
Having a powerbase all of our own is useful. And frontier will let us get some glory by conquest or, alternatively, better control of Hispania. Either way, while chaos of Rome is a ladder, chaos of Hispania can also be one, if we play our cards right.
Additionally, I just don't want to be in Rome while Marians and Sullans go at it. Not at all.
And finally: it just feels more fun to play as a bigger player in Hispania than just another ambitious youth in Rome. We'd still serve Sertorious, sure, but I think we'd have more power than in Rome?
Better to be first in village than second in Rome, as somebody who will soon totally lose all relevance once said.
- Location
- Hyperborea
Was going to make my own plan for going with him to Spain, but I like this one. Building up a powerbase that is truly our own and returning to Rome as a trumphant hero in the future sounds like a great way of gaining power. Rome loves a good conqueror.
Also, this.
This quest is wonderful, kudos to the OP.
So, throwing in with the Marians seems a bit shortsighted. It's not as if Sulla only barely managed to scrape by when he returned with a vengeance. In the OTL he did gain a few lucky breaks in facing incompetent commanders and finagling away their legions, but on the other hand maybe they only look that way because they were facing Sulla.
You would definitely need some measure of counterweight to this 'stain' of this choice.
So, throwing in with the Marians seems a bit shortsighted. It's not as if Sulla only barely managed to scrape by when he returned with a vengeance. In the OTL he did gain a few lucky breaks in facing incompetent commanders and finagling away their legions, but on the other hand maybe they only look that way because they were facing Sulla.
You would definitely need some measure of counterweight to this 'stain' of this choice.
- Location
- Europe
Yes, but better than dead in Hispania.
That's not quite true. It would be Sertorius' power base, one we might be able to inherit when he bites it, but not one that would be at our discretion from the beginning.
Ridiculously Average Guy
I'm you, but stronger
- Location
-
We'd basically be making ourself king of Spain. But I don't want to be kind in Spain, I want to be king in Rome.
Only tangetially related, but I've recently learned that Plus Ultra is the national motto of Spain and I'm highly amused by that.
Only tangetially related, but I've recently learned that Plus Ultra is the national motto of Spain and I'm highly amused by that.
Character Sheet: Lucius Cingulatus Atellus
- Location
- Texas
Certainly.
•CHARACTER SHEET•
•TRAITS•
- Hispania Invicta
- Enmity of the Celtiberians, Rank III
- Soldier, Rank V
•CAMPAIGNS•
- The Invasion of Hispania Ulterior (110-106 BC)
- The Celtiberian Wars (97-92 BC)
- The Celtiberian Rebellions (91 BC)
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- Location
- United States
- Pronouns
- He/Him
To be fair that's not too far off from Caesar was after his exile.
Though he had a hell of a lot more than just small skill, admittedly....
- Pronouns
- He/Him
This is the best line in the whole post.
- Location
- Hyperborea
Are you claiming that we couldn't build a power base of our own in his shadow?
Rome is filled to the brim with young men who want to be king in Rome. The city is overflowing with rivals richer, more experienced, and more influential than us.
Leaving that to gain power, influence, and wealth in Spain is a viable stepping stone to becoming 'king in Rome'.
- Location
- Europe
Dad really put a lot of faith in us. I'll be happy to not disappoint.
Also, just looking through his sheet the major difference between him and the "great" Romans seems to be that he is mono-focused on all things war where the "great" ones have two fields where they truly excell in.
Just by being close to him we would do that, one we could tab into when he dies. You seem to imply playing shadow prince to a man who is likely our betty in everything except intelligence currently. So good luck, but why waste our time in Spain when we can become truly great in Rome?
Yes, one that can easily lead to us stumbling down the ladder on our first step.
- Location
- Hyperborea
Sure, I'll bite. Why do you expect us going to Spain would result in disaster compared to us remaining in Italy?
- Location
- Europe
If Sulla wins we painted a big target on our back and if Marius wins we might still end up at war with the rest of the empire.
Remaining in Italy? For one we wouldn't just be reacting to news. Going to Spain is our equivalent of the Rubicon. We cast the dice and short of killing/betraying Sertorius there isn't much we can do in reaction to the civil war or the developments in the greater Roman world.
In Italy we have a plethora of possible connections to important and future Romans. Spain? Not so much. There is Sertorius and his staff and whatever provincials and natives there are.
Italy opens us up to the Cursus honorum. Allowing us to climb as far as we can on our merit and luck. In Spain we would be Sertorius' second in command and we would stay that way until his death or we betray him. Or we screw up enough for a demotion. That isn't an outcome I want for us.
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Ah, so our father avoided the biggest battles of Cimbrian War? Probably for the better, what's with Arausio.
Whoever wins the civil war at Rome is, in my opinion, extremely unlikely to look at the Sertorius building his power base in Hispania and do nothing. Therefore, we'll have to fight in the Sertorian War, which, notably, ended badly for Sertorius in OTL. And I think it would be very hard to change that fate.
- Location
- Scotland
@Telamon could we get a list of the major players in Italy and a bit of info about them and their relationships and politics? At the moment, I'm aware of:
Marians:
Sertorius - moderate, falling out with Marius and Cinna, looking to Spain, likes us and sees potential
Marius the younger - Marius the elder's heir apparent but lacking his father's will
Cinna - effective ruler of Rome, apparently running things with a bloody hand
Sullans:
Scaevola - extremely conservative, keeping his head down, fond of us as his current protoge
???:
Pompey - away from Rome calling up funds, has three legions here and now, optimate, dislikes us, possible kingmaker
Marians:
Sertorius - moderate, falling out with Marius and Cinna, looking to Spain, likes us and sees potential
Marius the younger - Marius the elder's heir apparent but lacking his father's will
Cinna - effective ruler of Rome, apparently running things with a bloody hand
Sullans:
Scaevola - extremely conservative, keeping his head down, fond of us as his current protoge
???:
Pompey - away from Rome calling up funds, has three legions here and now, optimate, dislikes us, possible kingmaker
I'm curious if our father's traits, positive or negative, would carry over at all.
- Location
- Europe
There is already one in the thread marks.
- Location
- Texas
The legions Pompey now leads loved his father, Pompeius Strabo. Augustus won the love of the armies because of his father Caesar. The descendants of Scipio Africanus are still loved by the legions.
The love of the legions is for generations, not just for a lifetime. Old Tercerus fought at your father's side in the Unconquerable Tenth. There are many like him (and their sons) scattered throughout northern Spain. They may well answer the call of a second Atellus.
Sorry, @Telamon, but to repeat my questions about the update before current one.
4) I'm pretty sure our Subterfuge is supposed to be at 7 right now, since @Ridiculously Average Guy spent his bonus to upgrade it.
- Location
- Texas
Much appreciated.
Military/command studying has been interrupted by the end of the campaign, but everything else is mistakes that need to be fixed. I'm working, as I said, on a big XP post that will award all Omakes and earned points since before the hiatus. Subterfuge will be changed, however.
- Location
- Texas
I do not have the power to control who can post what or when.
Yet.
Whatever is preventing you from posting is likely a forum issue or some bug.