I was under the impression that literally none of them were sure things because we don't actually have, y'know, a product to sell yet.
Is that incorrect?
Project Knight [Mecha Design Bureau]
- Thread starter Verisaimilitude
- Start date
- Original Sci-Fi Fantasy
Is that incorrect?
Verisaimilitude
Meridian 'Mira' Visari
- Location
- Great Library of Verisaimilitude
- Pronouns
- She/Her
You're correct, none of them are sure things unless specified otherwise. I just wanted to make sure you're aware that they've called out concerns that the other buyers haven't, so putting your eggs in that basket carries some added level of risk!
Last edited:
Yeah, I was aware of that.
My plan for addressing it, should it become necessary for securing a Sat contract, was either budget boosting or taking hits elsewhere to improve Weapon Control, probably in the form of adding more traverse and targeting.
- Location
- Chelsea Alabama
I think the Central Hull would be much better.
[+3] Acceleration
[+2] Top Speed
[+2] Power Control
[+1] Build & Repair Speeds
[+1] Ease of Maintenance
[-1] Skeletal Stability
[Heavy] This engine requires 1 of your remaining Usable Tonnage.
As you can see the combination of Spinal Mount and Central Hull makes it heat neutral and the only thing we use is 1 ton and a slight dip in Skeletal Stability which is nothing for this mech. The Front Hull puts the engine in the crosshairs of enemy combatants and it is already so cramped in there.
- Location
- Canada
- Pronouns
- He/Him
As I said before, I'd rather have the engine take the hit then the pilot. If we leave the middle free then it will be easier to fit the cockpit in there, along with whatever subsystems we want.
We've designed the first boss of a video game. Fighting this thing tests whether you learned the movement mechanics
[X] [Engine Tech] Model 1 Power-Cell Engine (In-House Build)
[X] [Engine Tech] YT-22 Petchem Engine (Eurasian Khanate)
[X] [Engine Mounting] Spine Mount
[X] [Engine Placement] Frontal Hull
Last edited:
Also if you can dodge the suicide and bomb drones that spawn out of the rear.
To be completely fair, I proposed and voted for a Belly mount for the drone, which would have been inherently much better protected to peer scale opponents and air power, at the cost of being more vulnerable to mines and infantry, both of which can be screened out by Drones and friendly forces.
- Location
- Chelsea Alabama
And if the engine is taken out the mech becomes a useless metal coffin. That's a really bad idea. The middle currently has little to nothing there so you don't have to worry about it being cramp.
Eh, It depends on your logistical situation. f the pilot survives, they can catch a ride back to base, Hop in a new mech and get out to sthe frontline again without breaking a sweat. That was part of teh reason why the Sherman tanks and western tanks in general put so much into crew survivability, Because if you have the crew and the tank suffers a failure, and teh crew is alive, they can be back on teh frontline in a matter of hours, compared to trying to fix a Mech up and get a new pilot.
If the Engines fucked and the pilots alive, The pilot can get a new mech and the old one head sto the shop, If the engine is fine and the pilot is dead, You still need to recover and wash out the old pilot and fix the damage, and then wait for a new pilot.
Of course, this philosophy of design requires you have a steady supply of tanks, like allied powers did in ww2, but considering the price tag and simplicity, its not unreasonable for our wealthier customers to manage something similar.
Once you hit Battletech levels of "This is fucking expensive to fix" Then you Let the squishy meat bite it, but in general the pilot is the more combat important part for a war.
of course, For tanks its an entire well trained crew with teamwork, For mechs i'm not sure if we are working in crews or if the quad is single pilot, so that might change the math.
Last edited:
- Location
- Canada
- Pronouns
- He/Him
If the pilot is alive then you can pull them out, give them some rest, and then put them into a new mech. Failing that they can train other pilots with what they have experienced.
If the pilot is dead, the mech is dead. Both results are mission kills. Replacing the cockpit or the engine is going to be a fair amount of work. Training a new pilot takes longer then building a mech. Even with the option we took they pool for new pilots is somewhat limited. Even if it wasn't, I value the lives of people over making sure the fuel cell doesn't take a hit.
There is a reason that modern western MBTs put such a premium on crew survivability.
The Battletech tagline of 'Life is cheap, 'mechs are not' is one that only really holds true to the very earliest incarnations of the setting. Within a few years it went from "Battlemechs are super rare and salvage is the only way to get a new one" to having a fairly large number of factories building them across all of the great houses. Those same books show that training a good Mechwarrior takes time and effort. It just makes sense there to keep your good pilots alive if you can.
Battletech is a very particular set of circumstances. In order to facilitate that kind of protect the Metal and not the meat, your essentially looking at the universe being almost literally post apoc in terms of knowledge retention.
[X] [Engine Tech] Model 1 Power-Cell Engine (In-House Build)
[X] [Engine Mounting] Interior Mount
[X] [Engine Placement] Frontal Hull
Provides a good mix of bonuses without any malus. Should also help keep pilots alive, which will be especially important for these early mechs as everyone needs to build up an experienced pilot corps.
[X] [Engine Mounting] Interior Mount
[X] [Engine Placement] Frontal Hull
Provides a good mix of bonuses without any malus. Should also help keep pilots alive, which will be especially important for these early mechs as everyone needs to build up an experienced pilot corps.
Even battletech eventually developed full-head ejection systems. The period where mechs were incredibly rare and valuable only really lasted for a hundred years or so after they nuked everything into oblivion.
Last edited:
- Location
- Chelsea Alabama
And if the engine is gone you got a pilot potentially stuck in a heap of useless metal and spent dollars with no ability to do their job or get to safety for repairs. We already got a defender mech with a weak spot in the back. There is no reason to put another weak spot in the front where people will be directly aiming at. Add in the penalty to rolls where the dice has proven itself to be incredibly unreliable and that little bit of pilot protection isn't worth it. Our competition can do what you suggested, but ours is a bit more of an investment as well as not a tank. If we want our mech to be good we do not want to place extra weak spots for enemies to take advantage of.
Last edited:
But like
that's still better than the pilot being dead, with the engine soon to follow? Our cockpit is hardly going to be protecting the engine, and the thought of using your cockpit to protect your engine is absolutely absurd.
There's no scenario in which you would prefer to lose the pilot than the engine, especially not on some cheap grunt platform like what we're building. And it's not a weak spot, especially not with the internal mounting that'll probably win. The argument for central hull should be that it's the easiest option, not that it actually provides any tactical benefit. Frontal engine mount has the strategic benefit of reducing pilot attrition.
- Location
- Canada
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Exactly my point.
I can see I am not going to convince you. It's kind of moot for this vote because the front mount is so far behind.
- Location
- EcksEcksEcksEcks
just letting you know in order for your vote to count you'll need to put a X in the first set of brackets like this [X]
Thanks. I misread the vote close time as a really long moratorium.
- Location
- Chelsea Alabama
That's what armor is for. If you are going to use something as a makeshift barrier don't use the power source for your own device! At best you loose all power and become useless, at worst the internals, including the pilot, got fried due to feedback because the engine just got blown up.
Our guns are mostly facing forward which means that often opposing guns will be pointing back in response. So you got a weak spot in the back and the engine is in the front just begging to be shot, and that's on top of decreasing our rolls because that area is already stuffed with systems. There is no reason to do this. If the pilot lives but gets captured or killed anyway because someone had the bright idea of putting a gaping hole in a defender mech then it defeats the entire point. How is it supposed to hold the line or deal with raiders when someone can just shoot a few rockets into the engine department and shut the whole thing down? Deployed drones also become useless because the controller and dock no longer has power either.
Pilot safety is important, but when it costs the mech's ability to function as a reliable defender it becomes pointless and people don't want a mech that can be so easily shut down.
Last edited:
I feel like you're ignoring the very important fact that if someone has managed to damage our front interior mounted engine, they have in fact already punched through the frontal armor and the mech is going to die. At that point, we're just hoping that the pilot wasn't killed, which will be much more likely if we can centrally mount the cockpit behind the front engine.
- Location
- Chelsea Alabama
Oh no, but how much armor will one have to place to make up for the poor decision of putting the engine right in front where people can shoot it? This is on a mech that already has a weak spot in the rear due to the drone dock. If the mech can't do its job then it is pointless regardless on whether or not the pilot lives.
If that place gets punctured and the engine is in the central hull then the pilot can still operate the drones as assistance or better yet retreat to safety. Under no circumstances should you be using the engine as a shield. That's just poor design and of the kind that will drive buyers away.
Last edited:
How do you think armor works
Do you think we're going to strap the engine to the front of the mech as an exercise in precision aiming for our enemies?
And how big do you think this mech is? If there's a hole in the front armor the mech is dead. The entire cross section of the mech is like 3x4 meters, any penetrating shot will annihilate the internals. If the pilot is there they're going to turn into salsa. If, on the other hand, the pilot is in a spacious cabin behind the engine, preferably with some citadel armor or perhaps a nice ejection system, they could plausibly not turn into raw human chili.
[X] [Engine Tech] Model 1 Power-Cell Engine (In-House Build)
[X] [Engine Tech] YT-22 Petchem Engine (Eurasian Khanate)
[X] [Engine Mounting] Interior Mount
[X] [Engine Placement] Frontal Hull
[X] [Engine Tech] YT-22 Petchem Engine (Eurasian Khanate)
[X] [Engine Mounting] Interior Mount
[X] [Engine Placement] Frontal Hull
- Location
- Chelsea Alabama
Spinal Mount, Front Hull. Yes that is exactly what that combination says. You are quite literally doing just that, and it will take an idiot to not want to shoot at it.
Congratulations the pilot lives but the mech failed to do its job. With the engine out in front one doesn't need to shoot a hole into the mech which also means that nice ejection system won't activate because it doesn't have power. Congratulations you just trapped the pilot in a metal coffin.