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Monster Marriage Quest

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Ignoring the plans that were starting up, right before being completely derailed, feels about as manipulative as saying there were no plans or that Caras has yet to share them. There were plans, but perhaps not as complex or as long reaching as the council would prefer.

[x]"We were in the middle of executing such a plan regarding the Commoners and their Burner Worms when your agent showed up, actually." True! Albeit this was mostly your work rather than plotted out by Caras, and you're not entirely sure how the Council would view that aspect.
 
Ghoul King said:
"Especially to make an adequate accounting so that this second part becomes necessary."
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Yup. Woulda killed us right dead if we didn't have a good reason to be late. Good on Caras for being acceptably unlucky, I guess.

I'm a little nervous about the "we were in the middle of executing a plan" answer. I'd put decent odds on that being interpreted as desiring territorial expansion into the Commoner's land rather than merely stopping the worm spreaders.
 
As an aside... this was 7 IRL years ago, so it's hard to remember, but Caras did have a plan, and the plan was us.
Ghoul King said:
Tunnels... Virmire has tried to argue for those before, but it would be quite resource-intensive up front, and it wouldn't do much to help me take the fight to the Burners. I would very much like to get at them at their source." He pauses a moment. "It's part of why I agreed to a bride, as it happens."

Oh? You were meant as a... warbride?

...

Suddenly Caras' concerns that you would kill other brides seem rather more reasonable.

"Speaking of, what all do you know of the Common People? If I am to wage war upon their soldiers, it would be useful to know more."

"Ah? Hm, yes, point. Though- the plan was to give time for the integration to settle in, ease you into your duties with overseeing the core trade, and then consider mounting a campaign of war.
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It's pretty much busted by that point, but only because we are sure we can come up with something better. So here we are, bargaining with the Council on his behalf and thinking of ways we can help him protect the border: studying Breed designs, talking with the Scaled Folk, and of course, raising awareness of the Burner problem so we can trade the Gatekeeper design favorably.

We can talk about our own ideas and methods, and we wouldn't be too far off from what the Council requires of us.
 
Will Sabrina have to explain why they have Commoners among their rank if we go with the current route? They seem inclined to just having them be killed over trying to incorporate them for any plans.
 
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Metarite said:
Will Sabrina have to explain why they have Commoners among their rank if we go with the current route? They seem inclined to just having them be killed over trying to incorporate them for any plans.
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My guess is that because breeds are just "decommissioned" whenever they become outdated or problematic, there's a cultural expectation among the genderme of doing that to inconvenient humans as well. The commoner peoples aren't protected under an overlord, and they're very problematic.

If the commoner peoples are ever reported with both useful and killed as descriptive categories at the same time, the council would be actively looking to decommission the involved overlord in question for wasting presently valuable people.

As long as Sabrina specifies their ongoing utility first, and then that they're still alive, I doubt the council will care.
 
[X]"We trust in the Great Plan, of course." With meeting the Breed priest a few days back, you've been thinking about religion a bit since then, and it is true you and Caras behave as priests say one is supposed to. You were explicitly told the Council has little love for religion, of course, but that doesn't mean they won't accept such an answer as real. It'll probably lower their opinions of Caras, admittedly...


Worst possible choice, but also? Funniest possible choice and it feels extremely in character for our poor overstressed and confused MC.
 
Based on what Nevill quoted and what we've been doing... This seems an accurate answer.

[x]"We were in the middle of executing such a plan regarding the Commoners and their Burner Worms when your agent showed up, actually." True! Albeit this was mostly your work rather than plotted out by Caras, and you're not entirely sure how the Council would view that aspect.
-[X] My husband's plans are focused on removing the Burner Worm threat, whether by war or by subversion, with myself as his instrument.
 
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[x]"We were in the middle of executing such a plan regarding the Commoners and their Burner Worms when your agent showed up, actually." True! Albeit this was mostly your work rather than plotted out by Caras, and you're not entirely sure how the Council would view that aspect.

Caras did in fact marry us to run the war for him - partly because as a human we're capable of operating in daylight, and partly because he just doesn't do low-level tactical command stuff and he really needs someone to handle the details for him.

And I think admitting this fact is better than admitting that Caras doesn't actually have a long-term plan and has just been haphazardly jumping from one crisis to the next.
 
[x]"We were in the middle of executing such a plan regarding the Commoners and their Burner Worms when your agent showed up, actually." True! Albeit this was mostly your work rather than plotted out by Caras, and you're not entirely sure how the Council would view that aspect.
 
[X]"We were in the middle of executing such a plan regarding the Commoners and their Burner Worms when your agent showed up, actually." True! Albeit this was mostly your work rather than plotted out by Caras, and you're not entirely sure how the Council would view that aspect.

Maybe we should shy away from calling them "defectors" and try to pass them off as "captives we talked into surrendering who we're going to interrogate instead". I kinda doubt we'll be using them as frontline soldiers anyways, given how squishy they are and their lack of willingness to shiv their own people.
 
MilitantBird said:
Maybe we should shy away from calling them "defectors" and try to pass them off as "captives we talked into surrendering who we're going to interrogate instead". I kinda doubt we'll be using them as frontline soldiers anyways, given how squishy they are and their lack of willingness to shiv their own people.
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I think the opposite. The problem with calling them captives that we are going to interrogate is what happens to them afterwards. I find it unlikely that freeing them will be an option, which leaves killing and rendering. On the other hand, a defector can have continued use in non-combat roles, like convincing captives into becoming defectors or regular jobs. Integration is unfortunately going to be a continues problem.

[X]"We were in the middle of executing such a plan regarding the Commoners and their Burner Worms when your agent showed up, actually." True! Albeit this was mostly your work rather than plotted out by Caras, and you're not entirely sure how the Council would view that aspect.

Sabrina is the plan and by leaving Caras alone to his own devices, he will deviate from the plan. :V
 
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Metarite said:
Will Sabrina have to explain why they have Commoners among their rank if we go with the current route? They seem inclined to just having them be killed over trying to incorporate them for any plans.
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The report summary was vague in the update, but I'll point out that either Sabrina mentioned the captives and the Council didn't care enough for it to make it into the update, or Sabrina didn't mention them, and either way the topic seems unlikely to be a concern.

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So far 'we were in the middle of such a plan' is very firmly winning. Which is fair. It is true.
 
I was looking back at the update and thought this was interesting.

Ghoul King said:
"Are those figures correct? You should be taxing harder. That rate is only appropriate for lean times."
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Caras has been taxing at a lower rate then expected. This is bad because he uses the sheep from the tax to maintain and build his forces. I'm wondering why this is and I have a theory.

Caras doesn't have the best census records and he has been very hands off in the management of his land. I would bet that some of the villages will be under reporting some things in order to do the longstanding tradition of tax evasion. Going on a tour to get more accurate numbers and check on how things are actually going would be good.

It also gives a good excuse for Sabrina to check in on her hometown, since it is underperforming on the sheep tax.
 
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Lurking_Badger said:
Caras has been taxing at a lower rate then expected. This is bad because he uses the sheet from the tax to maintain and build his forces. I'm wondering why this is and I have a theory.

Caras doesn't have the best census records and he has been very hands off in the management of his land. I would bet that some of the villages will be under reporting some things in order to do the longstanding tradition of tax evasion. Going on a tour to get more accurate numbers and check on how things are actually going would be good.
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I mean we also just know Caras is A Stupid Newbie(affectionate) and doesn't really understand humans or try to. Indeed, Caras literally didn't know taxes vary-

Ghoul King said:
"Zzz." It's a buzzing or rasping sound, but you're pretty sure this is basically 'uh-huh. Yup. Mhm.'

So you poke Caras in the side fairly hard, and when he doesn't react, you prod one of the legs that's a third of a leg now. "-I would really like for this to be implemented soon."

Caras sounds a bit distracted when he speaks up, but he is paying attention. "I'm not sure I want to commit so much to banditry in the here and now-"

You interrupt. "Bandits take away resources from the villages, which means less for them, which means less taxes for you."

Caras stops quite abruptly, even the idle waving or twitching of limbs and antennae stilled. "Taxes... vary?"

You hear Virmire making a buzzing sigh, and you have to fight to keep your lips from twitching into a smile. You suspect Virmire has talked with him about taxes before and been ignored. "Yes. The more people have, the more they can spare. If you tax per head, more resources means more people means more taxes."

Slowly, Caras' usual idle motions resume. "I see. Hm. The Shellmen should at least have been spooked by the Storm Beasts, I suppose I can be less aggressive about focusing on them..."
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-because he leaves it so up to Virmire. Virmire is even more of an isolated newbie, even though he's good at this stuff- he's by definition significantly younger than Caras and basically only interacts with other people of any type on Caras's behalf, and literally thinks Delegate is insane for trying to do friendship so it's unlikely Virmire has a particularly good idea of what's a Normal Expected Tax Rate.

I'd reckon it's not so much tax evasion as Caras or more accurately Virmire being talked into believing this is What The Villages Can Spare without outside info to the contrary.
 
Terrabrand said:
-because he leaves it so up to Virmire. Virmire is even more of an isolated newbie, even though he's good at this stuff- he's by definition significantly younger than Caras and basically only interacts with other people of any type on Caras's behalf, and literally thinks Delegate is insane for trying to do friendship so it's unlikely Virmire has a particularly good idea of what's a Normal Expected Tax Rate.

I'd reckon it's not so much tax evasion as Caras or more accurately Virmire being talked into believing this is What The Villages Can Spare without outside info to the contrary.
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The flipside of this, is that we're talking about a poor border fief troubled by raids and banditry, which not too long ago had one of its more prosperous towns get obliterated, and is now going to be closing the doors to traders so it can prevent any others.

Even if the tax level was incorrect when it was originally set, the economy just won't bear what a more developed, less generally awful region would consider normal.

Need to talk to Virmire about it, but I can't help suspect we won't be hiking up taxes so easily. We'll probably need a census.
 
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Terrabrand said:
I'd reckon it's not so much tax evasion as Caras or more accurately Virmire being talked into believing this is What The Villages Can Spare without outside info to the contrary.
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Just want to point out that misrepresenting assets and income are pretty much the way of avoiding taxes. We definitely need to investigate if Virmire is being hoodwinked.

065tdsa said:
The flipside of this, is that we're talking about a poor border fief troubled by raids and banditry, which not too long ago had one of its more prosperous towns get obliterated, and is now going to be closing the doors to traders so it can prevent any others.
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The stopping of trade is most likely not a big problem for taxes. Since sales tax doesn't exist and would be impossible to enforce, the only taxes a trader would pay would be for tolls and setting up a stall. With how naïve Caras and Virmire about traveling merchants, I doubt they have set up either. Of course, the mayor of a town might be collecting these and not telling anyone.

The loss of the town is big, but shouldn't be crippling to the surrounding towns. Small towns need to be self sufficient on food and other functions to exist in a medieval setting. The biggest loss is most likely in the skilled labor, manufactured goods, and luxury goods that a more prosperous town would create and attract. That has probably completely destroyed the rate of growth in the region.

I really want to get back to our lands to do some economic planning. Why have you given your wife so much work Caras?
 
Lurking_Badger said:
The stopping of trade is most likely not a big problem for taxes. Since sales tax doesn't exist and would be impossible to enforce, the only taxes a trader would pay would be for tolls and setting up a stall. With how naïve Caras and Virmire about traveling merchants, I doubt they have set up either. Of course, the mayor of a town might be collecting these and not telling anyone.

The loss of the town is big, but shouldn't be crippling to the surrounding towns. Small towns need to be self sufficient on food and other functions to exist in a medieval setting. The biggest loss is most likely in the skilled labor, manufactured goods, and luxury goods that a more prosperous town would create and attract. That has probably completely destroyed the rate of growth in the region.
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We take all tax in kind, so money is not necessarily a problem, true. Unless there's a lean year. At that point, we take what they have and the peasants spend their savings to rebuild the herds. So if they don't have savings because whatever income stream they have on the side got killed off, it becomes our problem the year after.
 
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So to me the taxation issue is a real mix, but there are several towns noted to be underperforming, suspected of underreporting, or are areas of territorial dispute. Additionally, one town seems to be paying triple taxes. Here's a stripped down summary.
Ghoul King said:
Estvallee: Once the second-largest town in Caras' lands, Provided fifty sheep every year, before they were slaughtered.

Ville Lumineuse: The largest town in Caras' lands. Sixty sheep a year, on average. One of the Virmires noted that Ville Lumineuse's inhabitants are somewhat uncooperative, and are probably underreporting their size, but this doesn't seem to have been followed up on...

Terre de Moutons: A small town... [that has] a disproportionately large number of sheep... Thirty sheep a year, with a note commenting the number of humans would normally mean they'd only be taxed for ten.

Abandonne: Usually provides 25~ sheep worth of meat each year, which is apparently 'underperforming'.

Lac de Glace: Usually provides 30~ sheep worth of meat in a year, which is 'about on target'.

And then there's a half-dozen other towns that are so tiny the sheep tax is not imposed on them in a uniform manner -instead there's three points in the year where Caras sends Virmire with a crew of Haulers to pay them for whatever meat they're willing/able to provide...

There's also several more villages upon Ice Lake's shores that are unclaimed or in a dispute between Caras and the Baron of Subterran Maggots.
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I think we're doing okay on taxation, considering we lost our second biggest town, but we definitely need to follow up on some of these under-performers.
 
Terrabrand said:
-because he leaves it so up to Virmire. Virmire is even more of an isolated newbie, even though he's good at this stuff- he's by definition significantly younger than Caras and basically only interacts with other people of any type on Caras's behalf, and literally thinks Delegate is insane for trying to do friendship so it's unlikely Virmire has a particularly good idea of what's a Normal Expected Tax Rate.
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To be fair to Virmire, Delegate's friendship does not appear to be entirely sane. Recall that Delegate gave Sabrina an additional Core beyond what was necessary for the trade. He got this Core by lying his overlord, a deception that by his admission would get him killed and replaced if was found out.
(I actually think Delegate's story(I told the Viscount the Core went bad and that I had to feed it to a breed) might have been a lie to Sabrina. Would the Viscount of Dire Hollows really fall for that?)
 
Chanceseal said:
(I actually think Delegate's story(I told the Viscount the Core went bad and that I had to feed it to a breed) might have been a lie to Sabrina. Would the Viscount of Dire Hollows really fall for that?)
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It depends on how common an occurrence it is. Most of the value of cores appears to be in the fact they hold proprietary designs for Breeds, not in the materials making up the cores themselves and we don't know the retention rate on spares.
 
SolipsistSerpent said:
It depends on how common an occurrence it is. Most of the value of cores appears to be in the fact they hold proprietary designs for Breeds, not in the materials making up the cores themselves and we don't know the retention rate on spares.
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Cores don't hold Breed designs now, that was the early version. The current version is that Cores only hold design elements, Breeds designs are stored in the Heart and are non transferable.

Delegate's lie just gives me "a dog ate my homework" vibes, it doesn't sound believable.
 
Proposal for taxes: if rendering makes worm-infected food harmless, we can tax food that the people weren't going to eat anyway. Allow hunting for tax purposes. Encourage it, even, since getting worms out of the ecosystem is killing two birds with one stone.

More broadly, the burden of what sounds like an impending tax hike could be reduced somewhat by explaining to the peasantry that we're not looking for good meat, just biomass.
 
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