Legend of the Ronin (Legend of the Five Rings)

[Sirrocco]

Okay. Looking at a few things. First, I notice that just gettign 2 Rank 7 skills on top of our current skill set is *not* enough to get Rank III. If we don't get Rank III, we don't get Rank IV or Rank V. Plan "Killing Wind" just died a messy death, and I'll have to rebuild. Given all of that, probably best to go the more distributed route. I'll *miss* the paired lvl 7 masteries in Kenjutsu and Iajutsu, but perhaps it is for the best.

Second, what the actual mission actually is. The actual mission is to get the princess back to the Emperor's Court in spite of all of the Kolat who are Really Very Keen on preventing this. Worth noting that that means we probably *won't* be dealing with the court directly before the completion of the mission. Even if there's time between getting to the city and getting her into the palace and to whoever we want to get her to, it's going to be time spent lying low. The real danger is going to be on the trip over there. We need to keep her alive, and we need to deal with... whatever gets in our way. "Mad dash on horses" is explicitly part of the plan, so we should make sure that we have *some* idea how to ride. After that, we're going to be the duel-monkey (we're both trained at it, and the most expendable), so we should tune that stuff up. Social skills are also a must - both because being able to talk your way through things is *always* useful, and because we're going to have to survive (ad, preferably, profit from) the Imperial Court once this is done. Other than that... well, we have this funny "tune in to reality" thing with the Void... and we're probably going to need more of that. Let's see what we can pick up there.

Awareness->6, Reflexes->6 (14 pts)
Willpower->4, Stamina->4 (6 pts)
Agility->5 (4 pts)
Strength->3 (2 pts)
Void->6 (6 pts)
Investigation->5 (2 pts)
Kenjutsu->5 (2 pts)
Iajutsu->5 (2 pts)
Sincerity->5 (3 pts)
Courtier->5 (4 pts)
Etiquette->5 (2 pts)
Riding->1 (1 pt)

Basically, plays "traditional Kakita Duelist, plus funky Void Sense powers". Splittign it up by Tiers...

to Rank III (18 insight)
- Sincerity->5, Courtier->5, Etiquette->5, Awareness->6, Reflexes->4 (+19 insight, 3 rank 5 skills) (work on your social skills. Provide company for the divided princess, and possibly help her work on remembering *her* social skills and/or the inevitable memories that come with them)
to Rank IV (24 insight)
- Investigation->5, Ride->1, Void->6, Stamina->3 (+33 insight, 4 rank 5 skills) (try to get more in touch with that "One with the World" thing you have going on. You know that's going to be pretty critically important for this trip. While you're at it, work on toughening up a bit, and learn how to not embarrass yourself on a horse)
to Rank V (16 insight)
- Kenjutsu->5, Iajutsu->5, Strength->3, Agility->5, Reflexes->6 (+24 insight, 6 rank 5 skills) (Focus on your bladework, and everything that goes with it)
Afterwards
- Willpower->4, Stamina->4 (+10/17 insight - not enough for rank)

(As a side note, the next places to spend training after this would be getting Iajutsu, Kenjutsu, and one other skill up to 7, assuming that the pattern for skill requirements for rank remains the same at VI. It's a bit of a squeak to make 3 7s before we'd hit the insight mark and lose the technique, but it *can* be fit in.)

So...
[x] Plan I Have Three Jobs

Spoiler

Month 1:
Sincerity->4 (2 pts)
Etiquette->5 (2 pts)
Courtier->3 (2 pts)
Awareness->5 (2 pts)

Month 2:
Courtier->5 (2 pts)
Awareness->6 (4 pts)
Reflexes->4 (2 pts)

Month 3:
Sincerity->5 (1 pt)(Rank up)
Investigation->5 (2 pts)
Void->5 (2 pts)
Stamina->3 (2 pts)
Ride->1 (1 pt)

Month 4:
Void->6 (4 pts) (Rank up)
Agility->5 (4 pts)

Month 5:
Kenjutsu->5 (2 pts)
Iajutsu->5 (2 pts)
Reflexes->5 (2 pts)
Strength->3 (2 pts)

Month 6:
Reflexes->6 (4 pts) (Rank up)
Willpower->4 (2 pts)
Stamina->4 (2 pts)

 

[gman391]

@Sirrocco
Uh What's up with reflex 4 being divided like that?

 

[Simonbob]

The group we're in?

One high ranking Courtier, and a combat monk.

We don't need all the social skills. Or, better still, dump Awareness to 4, and give us some space for other stuff. Heck, we could lose Sincerity, and grab something else. Frankly, we're spreading a little too far, for my liking.

 

[Sirrocco]

@Sirrocco
Uh What's up with reflex 4 being divided like that?

Click to shrink...

Is that not legal? I was trying to arrange things into training blocks. The "hard requirement must get skills X before insight breakpoints or you lose the rank-up" combined with "the stuff that you learn during a rank determines the school techniques you might gain for that rank" leads to some pretty tight time requirements, and I hadn't thought it would be problematic. If it's not allowed, though, I can go back and rebuild.

The group we're in?

One high ranking Courtier, and a combat monk.

We don't need all the social skills. Or, better still, dump Awareness to 4, and give us some space for other stuff. Heck, we could lose Sincerity, and grab something else. Frankly, we're spreading a little too far, for my liking.

Click to shrink...

The social is partially for the group benefit (Because running the social often works better with multiple people to do the talking. Also, because social is one of those things that sometimes you don't have the best person for.) and partially personal benefit (because part of the point of this is to improve our station, and our ability to social is going to be a big part of our ability to manage that and then survive it)
Also, the skills that we have reasonable levels in already are heavily weighted towards the social, which saves us skill points. Dumping awareness to 4, incidentally, costs us 20 insight

 

[Simonbob]

-Snip-

Click to shrink...

Ok.

Surviving the trip. Hunting? Stealth? Spear? Athletics? Defence? Kyujitsu? Animal Handling? All potentialy useful on the way, if not so much at Court itself. Still, there can be social contacts based on shared interests. All of these might be useful, that way as well.

Or, we dump social for the trip, and go Stabbin's only. Kenjutsu and Iajutsu to 7, only, and keep Ride as well. 2 7's is enough for Rank 5.

Lot's of ways.

Are we prepareing for Court, or getting there?

 

[gman391]

Is that not legal? I was trying to arrange things into training blocks. The "hard requirement must get skills X before insight breakpoints or you lose the rank-up" combined with "the stuff that you learn during a rank determines the school techniques you might gain for that rank" leads to some pretty tight time requirements, and I hadn't thought it would be problematic. If it's not allowed, though, I can go back and rebuild.

Click to shrink...

No it's not allowed, but you have to get the skills for the technique before your next rank up. So there's a bit of lee-way there.

Ok.
Are we prepareing for Court, or getting there?

Click to shrink...

There will be talky and fighty challenges.

 

[Sirrocco]

No it's not allowed, but you have to get the skills for the technique before your next rank up. So there's a bit of lee-way there.

Click to shrink...

Ah! That's much easier than I'd remembered. Fixed.

 

[Dark as Silver]

Could we reorganise stuff to put our combat stuff as the IR3 technique, it is typically where simple attacks come from and assuming that Ranks awarded are based on what we've recently been doing.

 

[Simonbob]

Appears nobody has a better plan.

[x] Plan I Have Three Jobs

 

[gman391]

Hate to be a bugger, but can I have more votes please?

 

[Sirrocco]

Possibly even an opposing write-in?

 

[Simonbob]

Possibly even an opposing write-in?

Click to shrink...

I did one. Well, two, but the first was missing some skills.

Yours is ok. I'd still like to add Tea Ceremony in the place of Sincerity. Frankly, I think we're massively over-socialed.

Your plan will have us comparing well with Rank 5 Courtier's, in general.

We can go that way, and work it, but I'd like something more interesting.

 

[Sirrocco]

I did one. Well, two, but the first was missing some skills.

Yours is ok. I'd still like to add Tea Ceremony in the place of Sincerity. Frankly, I think we're massively over-socialed.

Your plan will have us comparing well with Rank 5 Courtier's, in general.

We can go that way, and work it, but I'd like something more interesting.

Click to shrink...

You wrote up a rough plan, but didn't smith it into votable format... and then you voted for mine. If you think yours is better, write it up and vote for it. Given that, thus far, the two of us are the only ones who ave voted, it's not like I'm the runaway favorite who cannot be matched.

 

[Dark as Silver]

Yours is ok. I'd still like to add Tea Ceremony in the place of Sincerity. Frankly, I think we're massively over-socialed.

Click to shrink...

I think you're massively over valuing tea ceremony as its not a Void regen/ Social technique you seem to think it is. Its an extremely niche Social technique for an elaborate ceremony, that to my remembrance has only been done once on SV (Minor Clan Quest when another champion demonstrated it as a passive aggressive way of telling us to get our social ranks up before someone exploited them.). As a social technique we're unlikely to ever use it as we're a yojinbo/duelist therefore we're expected to sit in the background while who ever we're protecting (Or that persons guest) does the ceremony and talks. And as a Void Regen technique its massively inferior to Meditation or even sleeping as it refuels a mere 2 Void points with a ceremony that might be 4 hours (granted 30 minuites is required by definition, however I doubt whoever we're performing it with will be happy with us taking shortcuts) whereas meditation restores the same with a guarantee of the shorter period with a minor (at our stats at least) increase in TN, and sleep restores all points after a good nights sleep. Additionally if everything goes to hell on the way there Meditation lets us strech our food supply for days by just ignoring our need for it.

 

[Sirrocco]

I think you're massively over valuing tea ceremony as its not a Void regen/ Social technique you seem to think it is. Its an extremely niche Social technique for an elaborate ceremony, that to my remembrance has only been done once on SV (Minor Clan Quest when another champion demonstrated it as a passive aggressive way of telling us to get our social ranks up before someone exploited them.). As a social technique we're unlikely to ever use it as we're a yojinbo/duelist therefore we're expected to sit in the background while who ever we're protecting (Or that persons guest) does the ceremony and talks. And as a Void Regen technique its massively inferior to Meditation or even sleeping as it refuels a mere 2 Void points with a ceremony that might be 4 hours (granted 30 minuites is required by definition, however I doubt whoever we're performing it with will be happy with us taking shortcuts) whereas meditation restores the same with a guarantee of the shorter period with a minor (at our stats at least) increase in TN, and sleep restores all points after a good nights sleep. Additionally if everything goes to hell on the way there Meditation lets us strech our food supply for days by just ignoring our need for it.

Click to shrink...

I thought sleep was only one void per day. Was I incorrect?

Also, it's reasonable that our boss might pull the "and now my yojimbo will serve us tea" trick, if in the correct situation to deploy it.

Still, it's niche, and there's a good change that we'll never be in a position to use it socially at all. Certainly Sincerity is a lot more directly applicable for social things - especially when "convince important people of crazy things" is almost explicitly on the list of things we have to do.

Also, @Dark as Silver - could I impose on you to cast a vote? We need more votes.

 

[gman391]

@Sirrocco
Sleep assuming it's for the required eight hours, restores all void points.

 

[Dark as Silver]

@Sirrocco
Sleep assuming it's for the required eight hours, restores all void points.

Click to shrink...

Thanks I was trying to find something to cite but couldn't find it in the index.
Anyway not a clue if its better but heres an opposing plan

Spoiler: Plan low hanging fruit

Month 1:
Kenjutsu->5 (2 pts)
Iajutsu->5 (2 pts)
Reflexes->4 (2 pts)
Strength->3 (2 pts)
Insight 171

Month 2:
Void->5 (2 pts)
Agility->5 (4 pts)
Reflexes->5 (2 pts)
Insight 181 Rank up

Month 3:
Sincerity->3 (1 pt)
Investigation->5 (2 pts)
Intelligence ->3 (2 pts)
Stamina->3 (2 pts)
Ride->1 (1 pt)
Insight 205 Rank up

Month 4:
Sincerity->5 (2 pts)
Etiquette->5 (2 pts)
Courtier->3 (2 pts)
Awareness->5 (2 pts)
Insight 221

Month 5:
Willpower->5 (4 pts)
Stamina->5 (4 pts)
Insight 241 Rank up

Month 6:
Courtier->5 (2 pts)
Jijutsu->1 (1pt)
Meditation->1 (1pt)
Artisan Poetry->1 (1pt)
Perception->3 (2pts)
Games Sadane ->1(1pt)
Insight 257 Rank up (probably won't get it as I assume there are skill requirements I'm not meeting)

I would appreciate it if people could double check my maths. However my thinking on this was that after 5 the cost of things doubled, therefore by dropping our air ring down to 5 I was able to pick up (technically it probably won't actually happen) an extra insight rank as well as a few things to do in court.
My concern is that we have been told that Gman is giving us this because we might not survive what he has planned and saying if we cut down our important skills and attributes just a little we'll probably be fine sounds like its tempting the devil.

 

[Sirrocco]

@Dark as Silver, about plan
- I'm pretty sure that Rank 5 is a hard max, given that we haven't been given skill-level reqs for Rank 6 If that's not correct, I'd want to take a serious look at a Rank 6 version myself.
- I'll note that if you really want to crank Insight, you could ditch the four month 6 one-pointers (4 trains, 4 insight) and replace them with Void 6 (4 trains, 10 insight)
- Skill req for Rank 3 is 3 skills at 5 or 6 at 3. I'm pretty sure yu don't meet that at the point you're claiming the rank up. Its important for timing purposes, because if you hit the insight bracket for rank 4 without hitting the skill req for rank 3, you effectively lose a school technique.

 

[Simonbob]

If you simply ignore the Month by Month stuff, leave that to gman, it makes things much simpler.

Alternitively, skills first, and we're done.

Question, @gman391, can we get Rank 6 or higher?

 

[gman391]

Month by month helps me decide what techniques to give as vote options.

As for getting rank 6 or higher. It's theoretically possible, desirable, not really.

 

[Simonbob]

@Dark as Silver, you have Void 5 twice.

Outside that, seems fine, in terms of maths, anyway.

 

[Dark as Silver]

As for getting rank 6 or higher. It's theoretically possible, desirable, not really.

Click to shrink...

Let me guess the requirements are two rank 10 skills or 5 rank 7.

 

[gman391]

Three rank sevens actually. For the tech anyways

 

[Simonbob]

Three rank sevens actually. For the tech anyways

Click to shrink...

That's.... quite doable, actuly.

Still, not easy. Need 250 insight, as well as those 3.......

So, 93 points of insight, and three 7's.


So. Void to 5, 2 actions, 10 insight.
Reflexes 4, 2 actions, 10 insight.
Stamina 3, 2 actions, 10 insight.
Int 3, 2 actions, 10 insight.

That's low hanging fruit.

Then, raising either Fire or Earth ring to 4, 4 action, 10 more insight. Heck, both. 20 for 8. We're up to 16 actions, and 60 insight.

Water to 3, another 4, and 10. Only need 20 more, plus skills.

So, Air to 5, and Fire to 5, that's 8 more actions. 32 actions, and we're 3 insight short, and skills will cover that. 14 actions left.

So, skills.
Iaijutsu 3
Kenjutsu 3
Etiquette 3

Needs 6 actions each, to hit 7. Not enough left. Just need 4, though......

So, Fire back to 4. Skills to 7. 2 actions left over, and with Etiquette 7, we get extra 7 insight. Ok. Insight covered, and the last 2 actions can go to Agility 5.

Cool.

Call it [X]Plan Piss of the QM.

 

[Dark as Silver]

Three rank sevens actually. For the tech anyways

Click to shrink...

Only one extra rank 7? Thats very tempting.

Alright so from 0, 3 rank 7's are 9 actions each and 2 10s are 15. Its not a cheap option is it.

I'm looking to see what I can strip out of Siroccos plan. The best way to get insight is Ring training as thats 4/8actions per 10 insight and skills are 1/2 per one insight. Also Courtier and Ettiquete masteries.
Drop Courtier and Sincerity to leave ettiquette at 7, bring Iajutsu and kenjutsu up to 7 so that we focus on being unoffensive and let our colleagues do the convincing while we kill people who threaten this?
[X] Plan Cue Rocky Music.

Spoiler

Month 0: Cue Rocky music
Insight 157

Month 1:
Awareness->5 (2 pts) 0 insight
Reflex->5 (4pts) 20 Insight
Iajutsu->5 (2 pts) 2 Insight
Insight 179 Rank up (3)

Month 2:
Kenjutsu->7 (6 pts) 4 Insight
Strength->3 (2 pts) 0 Insight
Insight 183

Month 3:
Iajutsu->7 (4pts) 2 Insight
Willpower->4 (2 pts)
Stamina->3 (2 pts) 10 insight
Insight 195

Month 4:
Void->5 (2 pts) (10 Insight)
Agility->5 (4 pts)
Stamina->4 (2 pts) 10 insight
Insight 215 Rank up (4)

Month 2:
Etiquette->7 (6pts) 4 Insight +7 from mastery
Intelligence->3 (2pts) 10 Insight
Insight 236 Rank up (5)

Month 6:
Courtier->3 (2pts) 2 Insight +3 from mastery
Perception->3 (2pts) 10 Insight
Ride ->1 (1Pt) 1 Insight
Defense ->1 (1Pt) 1 insight
Artisan Poetry ->1 (1pt) 1 insight
Tea Ceremony ->2 (1pt)
Insight 255

e:Oops mathed wrong with R1, that means we can swap out Void 6 for something else if we want.

Call it [X]Plan Piss of the QM.

Click to shrink...

The problem is that he might turn around and just tell us we've completed our school and there isn't an advanced school to move into. We might be able to learn from one of our allies, but they also might be unwilling to teach us.
E:E: Have swapped Void 6 for fluff skills Ride 1, Defense 1, Poetry 1 and Tea Ceremony 2.