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King Under the Mountain (Dwarven CK2 Quest)

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[X] Yes to the Book of Grudges

we shall grudge the grudges so hard our enemies will tremble to not be added to the great book!
 
[X] Yes to the Book of Grudges

It lets us keep track of "exactly" what the grudge is hand how bad it was and if anyone tries to complain we can point it out IN DETAIL. No diplomates saying "We didn't do anything worthy of this." and get away with it.
 
yannoshka said:
As for me, @Terenak I need more info.
Just how serious would the grudges take?
I don't want WHF level of spiraling inexorably into self-destruction in pursuit of grudges, that only give birth to new grudges for that was lost in the pursuit in the first place.
So, would our Dwarves consider grudges more important than common sense and self-preservation?
If yes, then no thanks. Otherwise, having grudges would make a good mechanic, methinks.
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That would depend highly on how people end up voting.
I don't intend it to be that nuts. You won't add a grudge if dwarves die in a war for instance unless it's something like this one dude wiped out the army almost single handidly.

But people may see things as added to the book wether it was added or not


Also all you people who have voted so far, at the moment your votes are void and not being counted. If you're not aware of what a vote moratorium means it means that you are not allowed to vote for anything yet because you're supposed to discuss the options instead of just voting for what the first person voted for
 
Terenak said:
That would depend highly on how people end up voting.
I don't intend it to be that nuts. You won't add a grudge if dwarves die in a war for instance unless it's something like this one dude wiped out the army almost single handidly.

But people may see things as added to the book wether it was added or not
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Danke schön for the clarification.
In that case, I shall support the book of grudges.
I don't mind fighting with people over not being stupid.
I'm scrappy :D

That out of the way, onto the regular stuff.
I personally want to go all actions in against the goblins and both ancestors related actions.
 
yannoshka said:
Danke schön for the clarification.
In that case, I shall support the book of grudges.
I don't mind fighting with people over not being stupid.
I'm scrappy :D

That out of the way, onto the regular stuff.
I personally want to go all actions in against the goblins and both ancestors related actions.
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Id be fine with that, we should definitely not let the goblins live any longer then possible.
 
Terenak said:
Martial - Goblins!? In our Hold!? Give the word your Majesty and we shall purge them from our halls

[] Send out patrols to scout the immediate surroundings of the mountain (Intel)
[] We may be few but there are still sturdy warriors among us, have them begin training as the newest members of our army (Gain a small but elite force of warriors) (More population is required to not lose any productivity from dedicated soldiers)
[] Begin training everydwarf as a militia member, all shall know how to defend themselves, (Gain Dwarven Militia, but slightly lose productivity elsewhere)
[] Begin working to clear out the nearby Orcs
[] Declare war on the Duke of Verosa for his insult against Dwarvenkind
[] Send the Axe dwarves into the tunnels after the Goblins, wherever they may be
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Goblins. *Spit.*

Tempting as it is to send the Axes to hunt the scum down, their trespass happened some time ago, meaning they could be anywhere. Better to send the trackers to find out where the goblins and our stolen lore went, and possibly if the latter still exists to be retrieved, then march on them.

Of the remaining options... Duke Verosa has offered us insult, but not violence. We already have two enemies to deal with; we don't need a third.

Orcs, now... Orcs, we can kill with a clear conscience. Doing so would accomplish four things. First, it would give our Axe dwarves some battle experience. Second, a reminder of dwarven battle prowess might convince the good Duke to change his tune; if nothing else, it would provide a certain leverage in future dealings. Third, it would lessen or eliminate a clear and present threat. And fourth, Orc must die.

But. But. The option is to begin working on clearing out the Orcs, implying it may take more than one turn - which fits with our intel about them being divided - and I am hoping we'll be able to hunt down the goblins next turn. If we go after the Orcs, it would be best to not stop doing so until they're all dead or gone, because otherwise we're giving them time to recover and unite against us.

So with that in mind, and the argument against reducing our productivity this early on still applying, maintaining patrols for one more turn may be our best option. It certainly wouldn't hurt if we got additional intel in the process.
Diplomacy - It is good that King Ironhand was able to respond, perhaps we can get some craftsdwarves to help repair some of the stonework

[] There are still those that know the old roads beneath, send them to inquire at the other Dwarven Halls. They have not been maintained since the Great War however
[] Try to better relations with Duke Ferivos, try to establish some form of trade instead.
[] There once was an Elven kingdom to the north that, while not friendly with you, were at least not your enemy. Find out if they are open to being friendlier, or if their elvish minds have decided to ignore our plight.
[] Send a message to King Ulfraz requesting aid
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While it is good to know that our brother-King thinks well of us, I don't believe we truly need his aid just yet. And it would send a better message if we could trade for his help, rather than presuming upon his goodwill.

Speaking with the Duke seems pointless for the moment, as nothing has happened to sway his mind, nor do we have much to offer to do so.

Hard to say whether seeking to contact another Dwarf-hold or checking up on the Elves would be a better use of our time. We had a good roll making contact with Kurum-Tharaz, but we can't count on that happening every time; against that, finding out the state of our last major flank on the surface would be wise, but, well... elves.
Intrigue - Goblins are a tricky lot and won't be easy to find. Allow me to send out scouts to find where they are before the trail gets destroyed by careless feet

[] More information on the Orcs is always a good thing
[] While dwarves have never been good at spying, we may be able to get information from travelers, bribes would certainly help loosen a few tongues.
[] There was a human Empire that desired our riches, but empires rise and fall constantly, find out if this one has gone like the rest
[] The Wild Elves have never been fans of dwarven kind, raiding our patrols and caravans, always hard to find, but if there are signs of them being out there it's better to know than to suspect.
[] Search out the Goblins lair and try to find what they did with our lorestones
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There can be no question. The state of the lorestones must be confirmed, that we may know whether to plan for their recovery, or for vengeance upon their desecrators.

...that's on top of the vengeance for their theft, of course.
Stewardship - Morale is high and bellies are full my lord, perhaps we can see to refilling the treasury as well

[] Begin crafting wares to sell, {whoever you trade to will require a diplomacy action next turn to set it up}
[] Set the Mines to full bore, there must be precious metals hidden within this mountain
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I am tempted to craft some goods for trade with our brothers, but the possibility of precious metals also calls to me.

Gold, gold, gold, gold,
gold, gold, gold, gold...

Bah. If there is gold, it's not going anywhere. And if there isn't, all the better to have something to sell sooner.
Learning - Now that the reason the lore is missing has been discovered there is little to do but wait for it to be found or truly lost. In the meantime a few of the scholars had a bizarre idea that they're requesting investment in. They claim it will help the rebuilding efforts

[] Invest in the scholars' work, will require a minimum of 10 gold spent
[] Commune with the Ancestral spirits ask them for their aid
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Hmmm. 10 gold is almost a quarter of our available funds, which don't yet have a steady source of replenishment. That said, I'm not sure if we want to disturb the Ancestors just yet; that feels like an action better left until we've confirmed the state of the lorestores, and brought back the heads of the thieves and desecrators. And we did earn 15 Gold from recycling and mushroom beer over the last couple of turns.

Leaning towards giving the scholars their money, to see what they can do.
Personal Actions

[] Add yourself to one of the other actions to increase its chances
[] Study the actions of your ancestors, perhaps they will have guidance for you
[] Train one of your stats, the King is to be the Pinnacle of his race, make it so.
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I already noted the likely benefits of sending the Axe-dwarves to clear out the Orcs. When our warriors march into battle against their ancestral enemies for the first time, it would make sense for their King to be with them.

That said, our chosen motivation wasn't martial glory, but to rebuild the kingdom. Staying back and lending our skills and our hammer to the craftsmen would help with that, and this is part of the reason why I decided that holding off on an Orc-stermination for a couple more turns would be acceptable.
[] Yes to the Book of Grudges
[] No to the Book of Grudges
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I do like the added flavor that the Book of Grudges would bring...
 
I'm more in favor for dwarven militia, because greenskin raiding is a thing and the defences would be undermanned if we go for goblins with dwarven lore
 
On a note to the Productivity, if you have a dedicated military force of greater than half your total population (Current military 200 dwarves, current pop 500) then you start to lose out on productivity. To be fair if it is desired you can be a military hall with nothing but soldiers and hire yourselves out as mercenaries in order to buy the required food and materials.

Training people as a militia is a much lower hit to productivity to represent the occasional training that they do to make sure they're in shape, essentially it makes everyone not military dedicated into a member of the Reserve forces, 1 weekend a month 2 weeks in the summer type thing, staggered so everyone isn't training at the same time.
 
In addition to flavor, the Grudges would give us a goal to strive towards. The bad thing is if we fail, we'd likely add a grudge, and get drawbacks.
 
[] Plan: Mountain
-[] Begin training everydwarf as a militia member, all shall know how to defend themselves, (Gain Dwarven Militia, but slightly lose productivity elsewhere)
-[] There once was an Elven kingdom to the north that, while not friendly with you, were at least not your enemy. Find out if they are open to being friendlier, or if their elvish minds have decided to ignore our plight.
-[] Search out the Goblins lair and try to find what they did with our lorestones
-[] Begin crafting wares to sell, {whoever you trade to will require a diplomacy action next turn to set it up}
-[] Invest in the scholars' work, will require a minimum of 10 gold spent
-[] Add yourself to one of the other actions to increase its chances
--[] There once was an Elven kingdom to the north that, while not friendly with you, were at least not your enemy. Find out if they are open to being friendlier, or if their elvish minds have decided to ignore our plight.
[] No to the Book of Grudges

I don't want the Book of Grudges mechanic because that is Warhammer. It's a thing related to Warhammer dwarves, not a universal dwarf trait. And I want these dwarves to not be a perfect Warhammer dwarf expy.
 
At this point the Vote Moratorium is now finished and you may vote without worries now.

As stated before any votes made before this post will have no effect on the vote tally
 
[X] Plan: Great grubby gobbo grudge
-[X] Send the Axe dwarves into the tunnels after the Goblins, wherever they may be
-[X] There once was an Elven kingdom to the north that, while not friendly with you, were at least not your enemy. Find out if they are open to being friendlier, or if their elvish minds have decided to ignore our plight.
-[X] Search out the Goblins lair and try to find what they did with our lorestones
-[X] Set the Mines to full bore, there must be precious metals hidden within this mountain
-[X] Commune with the Ancestral spirits ask them for their aid
-[X] Study the actions of your ancestors, perhaps they will have guidance for you
-[X] Yes to the Book of Grudges
 
[X] Plan: Mountain
-[X] Begin training everydwarf as a militia member, all shall know how to defend themselves, (Gain Dwarven Militia, but slightly lose productivity elsewhere)
-[X] There once was an Elven kingdom to the north that, while not friendly with you, were at least not your enemy. Find out if they are open to being friendlier, or if their elvish minds have decided to ignore our plight.
-[X] Search out the Goblins lair and try to find what they did with our lorestones
-[X] Begin crafting wares to sell, {whoever you trade to will require a diplomacy action next turn to set it up}
-[X] Invest in the scholars' work, will require a minimum of 10 gold spent
-[X] Add yourself to one of the other actions to increase its chances
--[X] There once was an Elven kingdom to the north that, while not friendly with you, were at least not your enemy. Find out if they are open to being friendlier, or if their elvish minds have decided to ignore our plight.
[X] No to the Book of Grudges
 
Plan training and planning a lore raid:
Martial

[X] Begin training everydwarf as a militia member, all shall know how to defend themselves, (Gain Dwarven Militia, but slightly lose productivity elsewhere)

Needed against greenskin raid, because we are going in raid ourselves.

Diplomacy

[X] There are still those that know the old roads beneath, send them to inquire at the other Dwarven Halls. They have not been maintained since the Great War however

More allies/trade partners.

Intrigue

[X] Search out the Goblins lair and try to find what they did with our lorestones

Stewardship

[X] Set the Mines to full bore, there must be precious metals hidden within this mountain

More resources for trade.

Learning

[X] Commune with the Ancestral spirits ask them for their aid

Personal Actions

[X] Add yourself to one of the other actions to increase its chances
-[X] Intrigue
 
[X] Plan training and planning a lore raid
-[X] Begin training everydwarf as a militia member, all shall know how to defend themselves, (Gain Dwarven Militia, but slightly lose productivity elsewhere)
-[X] There are still those that know the old roads beneath, send them to inquire at the other Dwarven Halls. They have not been maintained since the Great War however
-[X] Search out the Goblins lair and try to find what they did with our lorestones
-[X] Set the Mines to full bore, there must be precious metals hidden within this mountain
-[X] Commune with the Ancestral spirits ask them for their aid
-[X] Add yourself to one of the other actions to increase its chances
--[X] Intrigue

We absolutely cannot even think about bothering with surface problems until we take care of all of our problems underground, and our most pressing manner are the goblins and missing lore, we take care of this and then we might consider taking action above ground. Not to mention, we are better off strengthening bonds between our own kin. We are not some nation that will just ask to be friends with asshat duke that decided to insult us, and his actions will have consequences, whether it will be a full blown war or something more subtle is up to debate, but either way we need to have some might if we want him to pay, might that will comes from other dwarves.

That being said, the book of grudges is an absolute yes in my opinion, it won't be just a shit-list but rather an archive that will forever change our culture. Some might see it as xenophobic or barbaric, but I see it as a way to show the world that dwarves are not just some pushovers.

[X] Yes to the book of Grudges.
 
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