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Halkegenia Online. Thread 2!

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GeshronTyler said:
Er, I think the "auto-translate" only works for speech, and not reading/writing.
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At the very least it works for reading the written language, or the Fae leaders wouldn't have been able to read the legal documents they were given.
Your right, that a good many Fae will have non-combat skills. What isn't certain is how many of those "in-game" and "out-of-game" skills and knowledge can find an application outside of the Fae community.
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Probably all of them, the skills were all based around a fantasy game remember.
One shouldn't forget, that 60,000 plus people are a big chunk to throw on the job market. True, the Fae are spread among Arrun and the "Regional " Capitols. Their arrival is going to serve to disrupt the economy though, and business-men usual react poorly to disruption overall. Without "stimulus", a realization of the market and opportunities for expansion the Fae represent, the economy will most likely become "bearish".
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You really think the local guildhalls would try and blacklist them?
"Simple Math" is a misnomer in this case. This is "basic math" at competitive levels (or something like those memorization olympiads/competitions), because time is money. And like I said, without any "normal" aids a "modern" person would be comfortable with. Oh, I don't doubt there may be a few hundred, even a thousand or more Fae that can use an abbacus, or have some kind of menomnic tricks for calculating. 9 to 5 hours /40 hour work weeks are unknown at this time of course. Any Fae saying they won't work under those conditions, well, good luck.
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Oh right, I always forget that most people can't do math in their head's that easily. :oops:
 
Vaermina said:
Wait so they have no idea what any of the paperwork the Tristain nobles would have given them as part of their deal actually says?
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Its something that hasn't been discussed in story but it will be one of the complications in hammering out the deal. Presumably Tristain's alphabet is phonetic, so they've probably had people carefully sounding everything out and listening to the translation every night to make sure it says what they think it says.
artanis00 said:
Oh God. I forgot about that place.
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Scarron will leap with joy when the first Faerie walks through his door looking for a job :p

As I understand it he's a fair employer, if a little eccentric, so it'll probably work out.
 
Triggerhappy said:
Its something that hasn't been discussed in story but it will be one of the complications in hammering out the deal. Presumably Tristain's alphabet is phonetic, so they've probably had people carefully sounding everything out and listening to the translation every night to make sure it says what they think it says.
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That will help but they are going to want to also hear what the nobles at the capitol are saying to get an idea of the atmosphere of the court. They could ask Argo to join them at the capitol and keep an ear to the ground. Though I can see them also asking some of the sneaker Spriggans to play invisible/illusion covered eavesdroppers.
 
Ryune said:
Hmm, I can actually see the Fae being a rather large boon the service industry. Maybe even a few more "charming Fairy inn" style cafes. Message and small object transportation services inside and between communities. After all, the Fae would probably be a great deal cheaper than hiring a mage with a mount to feed and faster/more secure than hiring a runner. I could also see the Fae eventually working out a spell or a few for taking care of calculation. That being said, a lot of what the Fae have to offer is ideas more than any kind of service. Even school children know how mass production works. Granted the whole "making the tools that make the tools" could be a complication but the fact of the matter is that as long as those tools don't require incredible precision they can always commission a low ranked noble to make them and then use those for further refinement. Sure they aren't going to be back to anywhere near where they were but with inventive use of magic and the general ideas from earth they could simply out produce just about any artisan.
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Actually, school children don't know how "mass production works", anymore than most adults do. They can describe a factory as a big building with a lot of machines that build things. Unless they happen to be a factory manager, or studying mechanical engineering, all that amounts to a vague description, but no concrete information on how to create a factory. Ideas are good, but there's a hell of a lot more to actually creating anything from the ground up.
 
jwolfe said:
That will help but they are going to want to also hear what the nobles at the capitol are saying to get an idea of the atmosphere of the court. They could ask Argo to join them at the capitol and keep an ear to the ground. Though I can see them also asking some of the sneaker Spriggans to play invisible/illusion covered eavesdroppers.
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Fairy Dance of Death's Argo had this really cool ability for Caith sith to use Halkeginian Style "Familiar Sight".

So she went and tamed rats to expand her information network.
 
Vaermina said:
At the very least it works for reading the written language, or the Fae leaders wouldn't have been able to read the legal documents they were given.



Probably all of them, the skills were all based around a fantasy game remember.



You really think the local guildhalls would try and blacklist them?



:oops:
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Yes, but once you have a lot of people with the same skill set, you have lots of people competing for the same jobs, and the wages go down.

As for guilds, yes, they most likely would blacklist them. Guilds are very protective of their perogatives, business, and members (Masters, Journeymen, apprentices)- they usually have the power of law behind them, and can decide who does what, where, in their field. The Guildmasters decide who can become a master, and if you get on their bad side, it's quite possible that going to another city won't help. The "good old boys network" is alive and well. The problem is, the industrial revolution will tend to destroy them, as jobs and techniques and technology change. Many (not all) will fight tooth and nail against progress. I don't want to plug another author's work in this thread, but the 1632 series, and the Grantville Gazette issues cover just these themes and situations. Much research was done, for historical verisimiltude.
 
Triggerhappy said:
Its something that hasn't been discussed in story but it will be one of the complications in hammering out the deal. Presumably Tristain's alphabet is phonetic, so they've probably had people carefully sounding everything out and listening to the translation every night to make sure it says what they think it says.
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Wouldn't it work better for the entire agreement to be hashed out verbally, and then relay it word for word to a pair of scribes who then write out two copies of the agreement in Japaniese/English and two in Halkegenian. That way each side could keep a complete set of the agreement and the Fae wouldn't have to worry about being screwed over.
 
Gotta agree with Gesh on this. Though it does leave the question of what sorts of jobs will be open to the Fae. Obviously there will be people with some agriculture and technical knowledge that might be applied in Halkegenia, and also lots who have received a massive dose of downloaded knowledge. But there's still going to be lots that fall through the cracks as it were.
 
Vaermina said:
Wouldn't it work better for the entire agreement to be hashed out verbally, and then relay it word for word to a pair of scribes who then write out two copies of the agreement in Japaniese/English and two in Halkegenian. That way each side could keep a complete set of the agreement and the Fae wouldn't have to worry about being screwed over.
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Good point, though there could be complications there as well.
 
Vaermina said:
Wouldn't it work better for the entire agreement to be hashed out verbally, and then relay it word for word to a pair of scribes who then write out two copies of the agreement in Japaniese/English and two in Halkegenian. That way each side could keep a complete set of the agreement and the Fae wouldn't have to worry about being screwed over.
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Triggerhappy said:
Good point, though there could be complications there as well.
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Such as the Halk people meant one thing, but the Fae thought it meant another. The Fae will need lawyers of their own IMO, in case stuff like "reasonable self-governance granted to the Fae" gets twisted from the Fae running their own cities to the various Dukes or high nobles muscling in to try and dictate things (or some other example, this probably isn't a good one).
 
Man, it's like this is turning into Maoyuu. Now, I'm expecting crop rotaion and the power of the almighty potato.

It's not like that's a bad thing, but there's kinda a lot of issues to deal with in the story now. There's already the war in Albion, the negotiations between the Faeries and Tristain, Louise working on her magic, Kirito's mission to rescue Asuna and the others, the approaching wild pixie sidequest, and the eventual Operation Dunkirk.

That's not even counting potential character interaction or events that take place further into the future like Reconquista's invasion at Tarbes, the resulting war, Joseph eventually showing his hand, the Windstone Crisis and Vittorio's plan to stop it, and whatever events the presence of the faeries cause.

There are also the factions which still don't have official leaders right now, especially the Puca who are kinda fucked right now, and the general civil unrest. And, as it has been recently discussed, there will be problems with food supply, agriculture, cultural differences, and economic stability.

That's a lot to cram into this thing. So, I'm concerned with how it all fits together without bogging down the narrative. Though, if TH can get it to work it'll be a truly rich experience.

On a side note, Cadenza is apparently located near Tarbes. Being Puca is suffering.:(
 
I really do like "bootstrap" stories, and I'm "rooting" for the Fae to introduce Halk to the Industrial Age, and eventually Democracy- or some form thereof. Unfortunately, the story has to have a focus, and a lot of the "bootstrapping" stuff is complicated, and needs quite a bit of ground work. As is often the case, the "foot in the door" will likely be suggestions and ideas to improve and mass produce firearms and artillery- Tristain doesn't have much of a Navy, and being one of the (if not the) smallest nations doesn't make for a large mage population or army- especially since the nobles may not be all that interested in fighting, and preferring to come to "accomodations" with Reconquista. The Crown and Loyalists will need a force multiplyer, that'll have to be firearms and artillery- Plus Faerie combatants. Well, the Fae won't have a choice but to throw their shoulders' behind Tristain's Crown's cart.
 
Arimai said:
Obasan loosely translates into Aunt. My question is why the line by Leafa? Is it not a bit redundant and out of character for a Nipponai to request to be addressed in the Western convention?
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I've also seen Obasan used/taken as the equivalent of "Old lady" And most places I've seen it used, the lady being referred to corrects someone for being rude.

In this instance, Yui calls Leafa Oba-san meaning Aunt, and Leafa, knowing she doesn't mean it as an insult, corrects her to a more appropriate usage.

Granted, I'm not great at actual japanese words/phrases, but I know a little (not much) about the usage.
 
GeshronTyler said:
I really do like "bootstrap" stories, and I'm "rooting" for the Fae to introduce Halk to the Industrial Age, and eventually Democracy- or some form thereof. Unfortunately, the story has to have a focus, and a lot of the "bootstrapping" stuff is complicated, and needs quite a bit of ground work. As is often the case, the "foot in the door" will likely be suggestions and ideas to improve and mass produce firearms and artillery- Tristain doesn't have much of a Navy, and being one of the (if not the) smallest nations doesn't make for a large mage population or army- especially since the nobles may not be all that interested in fighting, and preferring to come to "accomodations" with Reconquista. The Crown and Loyalists will need a force multiplyer, that'll have to be firearms and artillery- Plus Faerie combatants. Well, the Fae won't have a choice but to throw their shoulders' behind Tristain's Crown's cart.
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Hmm, Military wise, equipment and such would not have drastic changes at least until a decade down. However things like tactics and dirty tricks would catch on almost immediately.

Things like Snipers, recon, guerrilla warfare, urban operations, false flags and other assorted stuff that we see people use when their heavily outnumbered would be seen fast.
 
Triggerhappy said:
Well, I don't have to address everything at once. And I don't intend to.
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Oh, of course I'm not expecting you to handle everything at once. That would be unreasonable. It's just that the story and all the discussion have left a lot of questions in my head. Questions which will remain for a while because many of the things I brought up won't be addressed for a long time.

I'm fine with that though, it's part of the fun after all, and I would rather read it in its complete form than have it spoiled with too many hints, so I'll wait. I'm just wondering about the flow of the narative. I'm mostly pondering to myself so feel free to ignore me.
 
ckk185 said:
Hmm, Military wise, equipment and such would not have drastic changes at least until a decade down. However things like tactics and dirty tricks would catch on almost immediately.

Things like Snipers, recon, guerrilla warfare, urban operations, false flags and other assorted stuff that we see people use when their heavily outnumbered would be seen fast.
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Why do I see any Spriggan players with former military experience, and there are likely to be a small minority with such, lamenting the lack of High Explosives in Halkegenia.
 
Triggerhappy said:
Why do I see any Spriggan players with former military experience, and there are likely to be a small minority with such, lamenting the lack of High Explosives in Halkegenia.
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You do not really need high explosives to make a horrific mess out of a medieval army actually, poison in their food and water, dead commanders killed in the middle of the night by assassins whose blood is then used as paint on sleeping soldiers, catapulting rotting corpses into their camps. "Random" Fires inside ammunition stores, Commando raids into cities that are as brutal as the Mumbai attacks, but directed at important targets. Rats thrown into granaries and assorted creative methods of sabotage.

If you do somehow manage to get explosives, take a page from the terrorist, suicide bombers, roadside IEDs and assorted fun stuff. Considering they have Airships, a 9/11 style attack wouldn't be out of place as well.
Vaermina said:
Only the American ones. :D
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I'm not American, but one thing I know is that all military personnel love their BOOOOOM, unless your the logistics guy or the unlucky fucker who has to account for all of the BOOOOOM.
 
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