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Halkegenia Online. Thread 2!

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This story is amazing. Massively awesome world building and epic uses of canon material of OCs to create an adventure beyond my expectations! I like what you've done with ALL the characters, and the Pixies are interesting. Can't help but wonder how Yui's going to get out of this mess... and looking forward to the aftermath! You may have buckets of attention and a swarm of piranhas, but it's because you keep feeding them well. You deserve the attention! (So long as you want it anyway. lol)

Also, something that occurred to me regarding the language and story of Alfheim Online... is that Sugou got REALLY into the whole "King of Faeries" roleplay thing, which was probably the creepiest thing about him. I wouldn't be surprised if Alfheim was his brainchild, and he wrote that language as part of his college linguistics elective. It has been established that as much of a two-bit hack he is, he is still a genius... albeit not on the same level as Kayaba Akihiko (who created an un-hackable quasi-sentient game engine apparently). I wouldn't be surprised if he wrote it in a flight of childhood fancy and dug it up to throw into an MMO when it became relevant.
 
Triggerhappy said:
Yeah, considering that this one is pushing 14,000 words and sets up the entire conclusion of the Tarbes Arc . . . Probably best I open the new thread when I post it later today.
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Wait, does that mean giant flying demon axolotl, Sayuri's grudge, Tarbes, the destruction of the first Pixie Garden, and new weapon for Klein will all be done and resolved within one chapter?

I may have underestimated the initial measure of 'big' size.
 
GeshronTyler said:
That would seem to be more or less true, but if you look at the "fair play" culture being encouraged in "League of Legends" (unless your a "Timo " player) , it seems possible to create a much less antagonistic atmosphere in a MMO.
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Just thought I'd point out (again) , there's at least one MMO game that is deliberately working towards instilling a "play fair" atmosphere, and it seems to be working.
 
Exsequens said:
Wait, does that mean giant flying demon axolotl, Sayuri's grudge, Tarbes, the destruction of the first Pixie Garden, and new weapon for Klein will all be done and resolved within one chapter?

I may have underestimated the initial measure of 'big' size.
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"Sets up", not "finishes".
 
Exsequens said:
Wait, does that mean giant flying demon axolotl, Sayuri's grudge, Tarbes, the destruction of the first Pixie Garden, and new weapon for Klein will all be done and resolved within one chapter?

I may have underestimated the initial measure of 'big' size.
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This is becoming less of a chapter and more a whole other miniature arc.
 
ecs05norway said:
There definitely were guilds in SAO that were deliberate asshats. They ranged from "We're going to PK even if we know they'll die for real" Laughing Coffin, to "We'll just take what we want" Titan's Hand, to "We'll hog the good stuff for ourselves rather than share with others so we can be cooler" Divine Dragons Alliance.
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No one is claiming there are/weren't any, since that obviously isn't true. The basic theory is, once your own life is on the line, "griefer" tendencies get suppressed, because if you make yourself some real enemies, they just might literally kill you.

Sort of the apocryphal theory "an armed society is a polite society"- if you actually die if you manage to piss of enough people that they swarm you, you'll be fairly cautious, and try to stay at or below "damned annoying". Hey, "Titan's Hand", may have PK'd their "last" target down to one survivor, but that one survivor managed to get the attention of one of the Front Liners (Kirito, of course), to take them out of action. SAO did have the "Anit-PK guild" campaign of course, in that sense, once the PKers got too disruptive, "corrective" action was taken by the combined might of the Frontliners.
 
Triggerhappy said:
Not playing EVE online and only knowing a very small amount about in game events, didn't that work out rather poorly for one of the early Corps.?
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If someone is being nice to you in EVE, that usually means one of two things: they're either in your corp/alliance, or you're being scammed. Members of PVP-focused groups or alliances wage full-scale culture wars against each other in a shockingly bitter fashion (ask someone from, say, NCdot how they feel about goons, or ask a goon how he feels about 'pubbies' if you want to see this in action). Terroristic attacks on risk-averse miners and traders are the rule, not the exception, and the practice is seen as morally acceptable and even justified. The more impotent outrage and emo whining you can wring from your victims, the more accolades you will receive from the PVP community.

Basically, the only morality is the kind that you enforce with your fists, and the only people strong enough to do so are the ones who get the most pleasure from ruining someone else's day.

Full disclosure: While I don't play EVE, I support the conduct mentioned above and openly believe that the risk-averse masses have it coming.
Ryune said:
It's one thing when you go through something as impersonal as the current games and quite another thing when you are doing it "face to face" as it were.
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I think this is true, but only to a point. If you ask any EVE ganker whether he'd rather have his victim's impotent whining in text or as an audio recording, he'd almost always go for the recording because actually hearing your victim reducing himself to a blubbering mess only makes the kill sweeter. This usually isn't an option, but there is no better feeling than listening to an alliance meeting of an enemy you're crushing devolve into a flurry of whinging and recrimination. I think it's safe to say that this subset of the gaming public would thrive on the realism provided by a VRMMO.
GeshronTyler said:
No one is claiming there are/weren't any, since that obviously isn't true. The basic theory is, once your own life is on the line, "griefer" tendencies get suppressed, because if you make yourself some real enemies, they just might literally kill you.
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This is about ALO, not SAO. Without life-or-death stakes, you're free to be as much of a jerk as you want. You aren't even wearing your real face.
 
75% Certain said:
If someone is being nice to you in EVE, that usually means one of two things: they're either in your corp/alliance, or you're being scammed. Members of PVP-focused groups or alliances wage full-scale culture wars against each other in a shockingly bitter fashion (ask someone from, say, NCdot how they feel about goons, or ask a goon how he feels about 'pubbies' if you want to see this in action). Terroristic attacks on risk-averse miners and traders are the rule, not the exception, and the practice is seen as morally acceptable and even justified. The more impotent outrage and emo whining you can wring from your victims, the more accolades you will receive from the PVP community.

Basically, the only morality is the kind that you enforce with your fists, and the only people strong enough to do so are the ones who get the most pleasure from ruining someone else's day.

Full disclosure: While I don't play EVE, I openly support the conduct mentioned above and openly believe that the risk-averse masses have it coming.


I think this is true, but only to a point. If you ask any EVE ganker whether he'd rather have his victim's impotent whining in text or as an audio recording, he'd almost always go for the recording because actually hearing your victim reducing himself to a blubbering mess only makes the kill sweeter. This usually isn't an option, but there is no better feeling than listening to an alliance meeting of an enemy you're crushing devolve into a flurry of whinging and recrimination. I think it's safe to say that this subset of the gaming public would thrive on the realism provided by a VRMMO.


This is about ALO, not SAO. Without life-or-death stakes, you're free to be as much of a jerk as you want. You aren't even wearing your real face.
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And once again, I'll reference "League of Legends", and the fact that there are ways of encouraging "fair play" behavior.
 
Ryune said:
In HO you rob someone and then could become homeless or if you injure them they may just starve to death.

tl;dr real consequences make being a complete and utter dick to people harder. But as real life has shown us, not impossible.
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I believe 75% Certain was talking about games. That is, players in MMOs, and how they might react to a VRMMO.

That said, 75%, I feel you're being obtuse. There are plenty of MMOs that discourage such behavior. EVE is interesting because it is one of the exceptions, not the rule. And there's nothing to suggest ALO was designed in such a way. (It was even considered relatively "girly", albeit with other characteristics that gave it a broader appeal.)
 
Mysterius said:
I believe 75% Certain was talking about games. That is, players in MMOs, and how they might react to a VRMMO.

That said, 75%, I feel you're being obtuse. There are plenty of MMOs that discourage such behavior. EVE is interesting because it is one of the exceptions, not the rule. And there's nothing to suggest ALO was designed in such a way. (It was even considered relatively "girly", albeit with other characteristics that gave it a broader appeal.)
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Considering a lot of the plot in ALO is about PVP issues, backstabbing, etc I think we can safely say that ALO wasn't the nicest of MMOs. Though with real life consequences added, the new HO world I imagine will have a good deal less of that. This would also match the canon reduction of such things in SAO, where a lot of people took much lower risk strategies when they had to be willing to risk everything.
 
Mysterius said:
I believe 75% Certain was talking about games. That is, players in MMOs, and how they might react to a VRMMO.

That said, 75%, I feel you're being obtuse. There are plenty of MMOs that discourage such behavior. EVE is interesting because it is one of the exceptions, not the rule. And there's nothing to suggest ALO was designed in such a way. (It was even considered relatively "girly", albeit with other characteristics that gave it a broader appeal.)
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ALO features nine factions competing against one another in a zero-sum 'grand quest' that features constant fights between factions and enough realpolitik to where someone can just say "oh I represent this random new alliance of powers" and have it be a believable excuse. I think ALO has much more in common with the atmosphere of EVE than it does with any other MMO in existence.

'Girly' is particularly meaningless, since it's both a fallacy and also vaguely sexist to assume that women don't participate in political backstabbing or 'aggressive' behavior. Oh, and we see women doing exactly that (see: every single female character in ALO). And nobody is surprised at all. Because it's normal.

Also if you're going to characterize my post with something random and negative, can you at least use something more offensive and overblown than 'obtuse' so that I can stick it in my sig for irony points?
 
Vaermina said:
GGO brings up a good point on why people in VRMMO's are not likely to be as bad as EVE players, though it does so in a creepy way. The reason is that it entirely possible that if you do something that bad like steal thousands of dollars from someone that person can hunt you down in RL.
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You're obviously not familiar with Russian EVE players.
 
75% Certain said:
Also if you're going to characterize my post with something random and negative, can you at least use something more offensive and overblown than 'obtuse' so that I can stick it in my sig for irony points?
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Umm, I apologize? I felt it was clear I meant you were trying to mold ALO into your experience with EVE (or your vision of it as a spectator), while ignoring the posts which described less acrimonious gaming cultures. Some people may enjoy nettling others, but I find that it just raises my blood pressure.

Regarding your other points, I put "girly" in quotes because I do not trust gender stereotypes, but it is what has been used in-universe to describe the game, with all that entails. As for actual gameplay witnessed, it was a spectacular bluff on Kirito's part to claim he was a representative of a Spriggan-Undine alliance. I could just as well argue that it worked because such prevarication was unexpected. Skarrip's machinations were also notable because they were out of the norm, and viewed disfavorably (beyond just the fact that his actions would have hurt them).

And this is getting really far from the initial question of whether ALO players commonly harvested pixies for "XP and vendor trash".

(Sorry for posting in old thread, but I'm hoping to wrap this up here.)
 
741AuthorNCS said:
Aha!

Spoiler: It was revealed that the «Cardinal System» has a human avatar.

Edit: (Is this late knowledge?)
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Here is what I know:
Yes that is Cardnal. Her avitar is simerlar to Yui's. It was created by a sheer accident after a certain person tried to kill her (with near sucess). She is technicaly still a top-down AI (like Yui), yet became sentinent after being forced into the avatar.

In the picture she is somewhere having tea with Kirito.

As for how she regards Yui, that hasn't been revealed yet. However she did order a certain someone to keep an eye on Kirito. That same observer disobeyed the orders and interfeered. Possably a clone of Yui?
 
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