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I'm rewatching the scene where he gets booted from the council. He made the attempt to fix things before Jayce betrayed him over Hextech. He's apathetic until something throws it in his face.

He absolutely didn't. He made a speech about togetherness and overcoming division. But a speech about togetherness and overcoming to division to a people you are actively oppressing is pretty worthless. And he wasn't even making the speech to them, it was to his fellow councilors. There wasn't a plan here.

Do they really care or did they start caring after the enforcers came down? If they cared all the time Silco wouldn't have felt the need to spread Shimmer to force everyone onto the same page.

As for the kids I don't take them seriously. They're regurgitating what they've heard from Vanders people and due to their parents dying. We see in part 2 and season 2 Vi is the one to push for the council to deal with Silco, pushes Jayce to go down there, becomes an enforcer. She doesn't seem to feel so strongly as an adult even after being in Stillwater.

I don't think he did spread Shimmer to force everyone onto the same page. We don't even know that he was even pushing Shimmer, just that he "flooded the lanes." But plenty of people take drugs and become addicts without it being pushed on them. I think the point of Shimmer was that first it's a combat drug. Second selling it made money that he could use to try to prepare for a war against topside.

If you're just going to ignore every single person we see at all except post-Stillwater Vi, and then generalize from an assumption that since we don't really know they must all be ambivalent, that's a choice I guess. I agree Vi (particularly Ep 4-9 + S2) isn't really someone who's ideologically motivated.

jayce and hediemer are not polaticans which is kinda obivious from their first meeting one is to guilable and the other sees things only in the long term and ignores the current like he legit says oh I went down there 300 years ago and everything was fine like it was last tuesday

Again, if someone finds themselves in a job that they are unable to do, and that job is a serious one that it is important is done right, they have a duty to figure that out and quit. Which to his credit, Jayce even does, since he doesn't seem to be on the Council in S2. Although unfortunately he might actually have been the best of them. In Heimerdinger's case though, this absolutely applies.

But the idea that there isn't anyone on Piltover's side who could ever take sympathetic action on Zaun's behalf no matter what and the only solution that could ever exist is force of arms just isn't true

I think the idea that there's a strict division between totally peaceful methods and only violent ones is a false one. Politics is war by other means, war is politics by other means. All wars end either in annihilation or at the negotiating table. I'd agree that the only way this situation is resolved is at a negotiating table with people like Mel and maybe Jayce and maybe Caitlyn or her mom, and that at that negotiating table a mixture of sympathy for Zaun and strength from Zaun will be necessary. It's a question of the mixture.
 
gonna be honest while this stuff is good to keep in mind this isn't really a thing we can do all we can do is react to whatever plot silco comes up with to improve his position cause really we have no position to do anything (after all silco clear way of doing it was cut out from him)
 
I think the idea that there's a strict division between totally peaceful methods and only violent ones is a false one. Politics is war by other means, war is politics by other means. All wars end either in annihilation or at the negotiating table. I'd agree that the only way this situation is resolved is at a negotiating table with people like Mel and maybe Jayce and maybe Caitlyn or her mom, and that at that negotiating table a mixture of sympathy for Zaun and strength from Zaun will be necessary. It's a question of the mixture.
Sure?
That isn't what Swordswain responded to me with though

Nor have I ever argued that the solution is to be entirely passive
 
If you're just going to ignore every single person we see at all except post-Stillwater Vi, and then generalize from an assumption that since we don't really know they must all be ambivalent, that's a choice I guess. I agree Vi (particularly Ep 4-9 + S2) isn't really someone who's ideologically motivated.
I'm asking for examples because it seems Zaun is everyman for themselves. We see Silcos and Vanders people care but the average person on the street not so much. Give me an episode or a scene.

The example of them not saying anything to the police is probably just criminal culture. It's not like the kids are the only ones that steal from Piltover.

When Jayce and Silco talk on the bridge, what does Silco want? Access to the Hexgates, trade routes and to be declared independent. Does it seem like Piltover has much control over Zaun of that's all he's asking for?

My point about Vi wasn't her not being ideologically motivated. My point there was she's doing all the things she accused Piltover of doing. All because the Councilors were apathetic about what was going on in Zaun and didn't want to interfere. The season 2 bit, how long did it take Vi to change her mind on wearing the uniform of the people who killed her parents? It shows she likely didn't feel all that strongly about it if she just dropped it. Which is what makes me think the kids are the same, just repeating what they've heard.
 
vi ideology starts and ends with f silco and gonna be honest so does a lot of peoples (firelights)
edit: silco makes it so easy for everyone to hate him in universe and by in universe I mean the people living in zaunn would not be suprised if silco is super hated by the people
 
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The funny thing about 'Piltover residents who could help Zaun but don't' even Viktor is guilty of it (and he's an Undercity native).
I've always felt that Viktor resents and represses his undercity origins, enough that half his workaholic leanings are to push down memories he doesn't want to think about. Naturally, that means he isn't exactly thinking about what he can do for his old home, since he isn't thinking about it at all if he can help it.
I don't think he did spread Shimmer to force everyone onto the same page. We don't even know that he was even pushing Shimmer, just that he "flooded the lanes." But plenty of people take drugs and become addicts without it being pushed on them. I think the point of Shimmer was that first it's a combat drug. Second selling it made money that he could use to try to prepare for a war against topside.
My opinion is that Silco developed shimmer as a combat drug, and as is usually the case, some idiot on the production line had the bright idea of "Maybe I can take some of the run off and make it into some kind of pleasure drug" and followed through on it, turning a small profit, starting up a demand for recreational shimmer, and forcing Silco to either step in and make sure the shimmer being sold to the public was refined enough that there wasn't a 1 in 3 chance of fatality do to being made in some back alley lab instead of an industrial plant, or watch as it happened anyways and more Zaunites died to poorly made shimmer variants. It was a lose lose situation and Silco chose the loss that let him fund his operation.
vi ideology starts and ends with f silco and gonna be honest so does a lot of peoples (firelights)
edit: silco makes it so easy for everyone to hate him in universe
Yeah. VI was a kid when she was big on Zaun and even then it was more because a lot of the people in her life cared about it. After losing them all, and spending years in jail getting dissociated from society, the lines weren't so obvious. She had her grudge against Silco, and an interest in reclaiming Powder. Once she gave up on the latter all she has is a grudge against Silco. Lots of people hate Silco because he started his whole endeavor with an emotional outburst against Vander. Silco is his own worst enemy, though admittedly the show writers weren't exactly interested in writing him as anything else.
 
My opinion is that Silco developed shimmer as a combat drug, and as is usually the case, some idiot on the production line had the bright idea of "Maybe I can take some of the run off and make it into some kind of pleasure drug" and followed through on it, turning a small profit, starting up a demand for recreational shimmer, and forcing Silco to either step in and make sure the shimmer being sold to the public was refined enough that there wasn't a 1 in 3 chance of fatality do to being made in some back alley lab instead of an industrial plant, or watch as it happened anyways and more Zaunites died to poorly made shimmer variants. It was a lose lose situation and Silco chose the loss that let him fund his operation.

...I think that's a very generous read of his character when in series he explicitly used it as a way of controlling people by getting that one drug addict guy to sell out Vi and even before then he grabbed some random street thug kid as a test subject in the earlier episodes (which screwed that kid up good). I personally don't think Silco cared that much about the negative effects Shimmer had on Zaun when being a drug kingpin with the stuff was an easy way to amass power, money, and most importantly control.
 
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we know silco was already trafficking the drugs that was the entire scene in ep 4 with jinx and servika vs firelights and ekko was them smuggling the drugs into piltover so its safe to say silco is responsible for all that shimmer production
 
Why not both? Either way, our maluses are kind of insane right now, and if we slip too much, we can easily result in a failure spiral (game over) since we'd fail at nearly everything, thus worsening those afflictions. Though they might tier up proverbially at some point, causing her to become unstable under certain circumsrances and taking away our control (e.g. canon yandereness over Vi), but also not act as a numerical malus (also like canon Jinx). Also would be more engrained and far harder to lose.

I will say a failure spiral isn't necessarily going to be game over. After all, Jinx goes through a couple of those during the show. Granted, Jinx kidnapping Vi and telling her that unless she kills Caitlyn they aren't sisters anymore, attempted murder/suicide by Vi in S2 E3, or her repeated suicide attempts in S2 E9 are definitely still bad.

Issues can also definitely mutate at some point. Like Powder's "Jinx" issue turning into Jinx's "Powder" issue.
 
Jinx is the endpoint of the failure spiral. It's acceptance that all she can do is destroy. She tried to fix that with Isha but when that failed it was the knockout punch.
 
...I think that's a very generous read of his character when in series he explicitly used it as a way of controlling people by getting that one drug addict guy to sell out Vi and even before then he grabbed some random street thug kid as a test subject in the earlier episodes (which screwed that kid up good). I personally don't think Silco cared that much about the negative effects Shimmer had on Zaun when being a drug kingpin with the stuff was an easy way to amass power, money, and most importantly control.
Right. It gets hard to keep all the weird contradictory sides of Silco the studio introduced straight sometimes. Golum/Smeagle was more consistent in my opinion.
 
Call it wishful, milquetoast writing on Arcane's part if you want, that's a whole different discussion that I'm not interested in having because I don't have the energy for it and I don't think it'd be healthy for the thread
But the idea that there isn't anyone on Piltover's side who could ever take sympathetic action on Zaun's behalf no matter what and the only solution that could ever exist is force of arms just isn't true
If it were then the story wouldn't have been a tragedy

It's not that there's nobody from Piltover who's nice. On the contrary, I'm certain there's plenty among the lower ranks who would be perfectly happy to help Zaun if they understood the struggle.

As you yourself pointed out, there's likely a fairly large contingent of non-rich, non-ruling topsiders who do the every day work. Common grocers, messengers, etc. (I still contend there's probably a lot of menial Zaunite labour for factories and such, but this doesn't preclude the existence of a Piltoverian middle-class). These people aren't doing much but living their lives, and likely don't have much to do with Zaun either way (They aren't the ones owning the mines, for example).

Im certain many of them only know Zaun by reputation, and would be rightfully horrified to learn what actually goes on down there.

But those people don't make decisions.

As far as I can tell the council works entirely on a system of those who are already in the council deciding as a group who else can join, and who gets kicked out.

The effect of this is that the rich upper class Piltover house members pick other rich upper class Piltover house members, and those they form a mutually beneficial relationship with, such as Heimerdinger.

For the reasons I laid out, these people, our named cast members unfortunately included, proceed to use that position of power to benefit themselves, and maintain the status quo. No matter how much Zaun suffers. They have all the power, they make the decisions, they know exactly what is going on.

They choose to change nothing. Because they don't want it to change. They prioritize the profit they get from it over the wellbeing of an entire population under their rule. That's not an accident, or a mistake, or a slip of the mind. That's a very deliberate, and very evil choice.

Every time we see positive change in the government of Piltover, or even just the potential for a good decision, it's never because one of its supposedly good members wanted anything to change. It's because of very intense pressure due to outside factors and changing circumstances, and it is always begrudging at best.

Im sorry, it fucking sucks, but the people who willingly and knowingly prop up the system keeping us down will never be our allies. They cant by definition. If they wanted to do anything other than evil, they would have done so long before S1E1.

And the Good people of Piltover, who could be be genuine allies, unfortunately, they dont have the power to do anything.

Save perhaps were we to organize some sort of massive campaign to get the entire public on our side to pressure the council, but our chances of winning that uphill battle are nil with the council working against us.

I'm asking for examples because it seems Zaun is everyman for themselves. We see Silcos and Vanders people care but the average person on the street not so much. Give me an episode or a scene.

There's a very consistent pattern of Piltover's control over Zaun, and the local resistance to it.

Literally, the opening scene of the first episode is of a mass revolt on the bridge and its bloody fallout. Tons of people dont throw themselves at a line of armoured gun-toting police goons with little more than their fists and grit unless they genuinely believe in what they are fighting for.

Later, when Jayce closes the bridge, there are Mass protests. Again, the kind of thing that happens due to popular support.

Piltover is at it's leisure to send squads of enforcers down to the undercity on a manhunt for some kids. Were it not in control of Zaun, it would not be its prerogative to do so. The locals respond to the enforcers negatively, because, just like IRL cops, enforcers are all bastards who love to abuse their power (Marcus smashing up the last drop being a good example).

It is repeatedly noted that Piltover has literal legal dominion over Zaun, there would be no point in independence otherwise. Zaun is not at liberty to set any of it's own policy or conduct diplomacy with foreign powers, or set its own laws.

It is clear that Zaun generates profit for the rich houses of Piltover, at least via the fissure mines, and I would argue probably through labor as well. Regardless of the method, it is clear there is at least some ongoing level of profit extraction. If there werent, the houses would have allowed a completely independent Zaun. They have to be getting something out of the relationship, otherwise they wouldnt bother keeping it around. The introduction of Hextech and the opportunities it provide changes this dynamic, providing a new, far more lucrative source of revenue, with Zaun therefore becoming less important to their coffers. This goes part of the way to explaining why they were willing to let it go (Still, begrudgingly) when Jayce tries to make a deal with Silco.

Piltover directly dumps tons of toxic waste directly into Zaun. See: Viktor.

While show skips many specifics to focus on it's plot, it goes to great length to illustrate the general nature of the relationship between the two cities, and the narrative intent is very clearly one of power imbalance and class divide. It's a really important pillar of the entire setting.

jayce and hediemer are not polaticans which is kinda obivious from their first meeting one is to guilable and the other sees things only in the long term and ignores the current like he legit says oh I went down there 300 years ago and everything was fine like it was last tuesday


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UA_E57ePSR4
 
Which to his credit, Jayce even does, since he doesn't seem to be on the Council in S2.
I mean, he more or less states that he's quitting in the last episode of s1.
Jayce: Councilors... My recent unsanctioned activities in the underground have shown me two things. I'm not fit to govern the people who live there. And neither are you. Our opportunity to demonstrate our compassion, our dedication, our solidarity has passed. They're right not to trust us.
Cassandra: You're walking a fine line,
Jayce. (Rolls eyes) With respect, I don't give a shit what any of you think of me anymore. Except you (Mel). You were right. You were always right.
My days here are numbered, but I've come with Viktor, my partner and a Zaunite, with one final proposal.
Viktor: Jayce has brokered a peace with Silco. In exchange for the undercity's independence.
Cassandra: What? Nonsense! We have procedures...

As for Silco's situation; one possibility is that he had wanted to launch the 'force Piltover into giving us independence' stunt/attack a lot sooner but the sudden appearance of Hextech threw a massive monkey wrench into the works. Because Hextech caused an economic boom etc in Piltover meaning that the Enforcers would have been bigger and likely better armed etc. Sure he had Marcus in his pocket but making the enforcers not reporting various dealings etc would be a lot different than getting them to not do anything when an attack is launched at Piltover or whatever.

So he needs more/better weapons than just gangsters hopped up on Shimmer etc. Resulting in him turning to the Chembarons which results in the Chemtanks and similar tech. But that also resulted in general distribution of Shimmer into the populace etc etc. A problem but something that could be left until after Piltover was dealt with.

And then Jinx found a stable/portable Hextech crystal and everything after that was more or less his final gamble. He needed grab a deal that would get peace/independence before they fully weaponized Hextech and could just crush the Undercity.
 
I mean, he more or less states that he's quitting in the last episode of s1.

Yeah. It came off as a little weird that he stuck to that in the immediate aftermath of the attack - I mean, I imagine that his political capital would have been garbage after he lobbied for independence in a meeting which ended with Jinx's attack. But we immediately see that it changed the balance of power in ways he might not have wanted - if he was on the council, and he voted with Mel, he could have tied the vote regarding invasion. And "days here are numbered" doesn't necessarily mean he's committed to quitting literally the next day no matter what happens, which seems to be what did happen.

Jinx is the endpoint of the failure spiral. It's acceptance that all she can do is destroy. She tried to fix that with Isha but when that failed it was the knockout punch.

I mean, idk, the quest is called "Get Jinxed" and has the tags "steampunk (punk)" and "be gay do crimes" not "Get Powdered" and I'm not sure what the equivalent would be so I question that becoming Jinx is necessarily a failure or a bad thing. I'd prefer to play Jinx, tbh.
 
Yeah. It came off as a little weird that he stuck to that in the immediate aftermath of the attack - I mean, I imagine that his political capital would have been garbage after he lobbied for independence in a meeting which ended with Jinx's attack. But we immediately see that it changed the balance of power in ways he might not have wanted - if he was on the council, and he voted with Mel, he could have tied the vote regarding invasion. And "days here are numbered" doesn't necessarily mean he's committed to quitting literally the next day no matter what happens, which seems to be what did happen.

I mean, idk, the quest is called "Get Jinxed" and has the tags "steampunk (punk)" and "be gay do crimes" not "Get Powdered" and I'm not sure what the equivalent would be so I question that becoming Jinx is necessarily a failure or a bad thing. I'd prefer to play Jinx, tbh.
I assume Jayce was too busy stressing about trying to figure out what on earth he just did to Viktor
As well as just reeling from the Council attack and second guessing his own judgement too much to put himself back into a leadership role


I'd be shocked if Jinx doesn't show up in some form or fashion
Though the specifics could vary greatly, depending on how we play it and the grace of rng
And may not necessarily replace Powder's current identity as Powder

Could end up Powder's revolutionary/vigilante persona for example
 
For all he knows they could wipe Zaun off the map with the push of a button. This would explain why he doesn't really put any pressure on topside for official concessions during the 6-7 year timeskip. Since it seemed to me like he was gearing up for something soon in Episode 3.

It's darkly funny but they really could and they didn't even feel the need to know it. Jayce and Cait both had their own independent WMDs to use on Zaun and might have realized it if they were pushed far enough.
 
[X][Piltover]: If he Thinks it's My Chance for a Better Life, I Should Try

[X][Downtime]: Keeping Working on her Mouser Bombs Alone
 
The Black Eyed Man
The Black Eyed Man

"How do you kill a hero?"

"Wh-what?" Deckard the pathetic little gang leader stared up at me. "Um—I don't know?"

He actually looked afraid when he answered. As if he thought I expected him to have a good answer to that question. I knew exactly how useful Deckard was. I hadn't expected more from him than tailing Vander's children, and somehow he managed to fail even that simple task. Still, even a crude and imperfect tool had its uses.

I decided to see if I could enlighten him. "A fool would say that a hero is just a man, all too easily killed with a bullet or a knife in the dark just like anyone else. Those would suffice to kill the man, to be sure, but they would leave the hero utterly unscathed. Such people forgot that dead heroes became martyrs, and not only could martyrs never disappear, their deaths became a new source of power.

"No, the real source of a hero's power comes from their story. People love a good story. The Hound of the Underground, the brave leader of the Revolution who fought back against the forces of Piltover, taking down Enforcers with his bare hands. A presence so powerful that even now, years after the war, Enforcers rarely entered Zaun. On the rare occasions they do, they always start by visiting The Last Drop. On their paperwork they might claim it was just a meeting with a community leader, but everyone knows it's closer to a mixture of paying homage and asking permission. If Vander didn't want the Enforcers in Zaun, their bodies would be at the bottom of the Pilt before sunrise."

I turned to face him. "So back to the original question: how do we kill a hero?"

Deckard actually tried to think this time. "Um... get rid of his story?"

"A better effort, but still flawed. Oh, there are ways we could undermine his reputation. Vander's truce with the Enforcers is a tenuous thing, and one that requires him to provide his share of concessions to them. He's drawn his lines in the sand, he's no snitch or collaborator, but those lines can always be blurred. Tell the truth mixed with a few strategic lies and suddenly the story of him offering restitution for a crime becomes him paying tribute to Piltover."

Deckard's face lit up hopefully. "So is that what we're going to do, then?"

"Do you always go for the simplest answer? Wait, don't answer that." I already knew he would only disappoint me. "Too many people know the truth, and others would refuse to believe anything that challenged their picture of their hero. Even if we succeeded in casting their hero down into the dirt, what would that truly accomplish? Do we want to crush the spirits of everyone in Zaun? Would we replace the fire that drives them to resist occupation with weary resignation that even the best among them will suckle at Piltover's teat? No, that won't do at all. We need that fire."

A treacherous thought slipped into my mind. Perhaps we could convince the hero to

No. That road closed a long time ago. He might be The Hero to the Lanes and the rest of Zaun, but I'd seen his real face.

But in the very moment of realizing one plan had failed, a new one emerged.

"Yes. We need that fire. But the Lanes also need to see his real face." I pulled out a vial of Shimmer. Such a simple thing, but it would be the key to achieving everything I ever wanted. "I've always believed that there's a monster inside all of us. We can hide behind our masks, call ourselves a hero or a father, and say that we evil we do isn't who we truly are. The people we hurt, killed, and betrayed deserved their fate, or we just lost our temper, made a mistake, or did something impulsive we regret."

I smiled. Watching Deckard flinch back when I did so was amusing. I swirled the vial of Shimmer in my hand, staring at the bright pink liquid. "I wonder what would happen if we let Vander's monster out?"
 
and I'm not sure what the equivalent would be so I question that becoming Jinx is necessarily a failure or a bad thing. I'd prefer to play Jinx, tbh.
That sound exhausting roleplaying that character with all her crazy flaws.

Would be bloody ironic if Powder make Silco drink the Shimmer and throw the creature into a Council meeting.
 
That sound exhausting roleplaying that character with all her crazy flaws.

Would be bloody ironic if Powder make Silco drink the Shimmer and throw the creature into a Council meeting.
Jinx isn't hugely different from powder. Powder lacks self confidence and thus can't do anything big. Jinx doesn't care about much and dissociate allowing her to build better things, but only weapons.

I'm wondering if Jinx has a special Shimmer procedure, or is she predisposed to Shimmer enhancement?
 
Jinx is inevitable, but the devil is in the details. By which I mean that the details of how Powder becomes Jinx are a big factor in the Neurosis fueled mannerism which define the line between Powder and Jinx. The journey matters, and even if Jinx is inevitable, where she's standing what she wants from life isn't.
Would be bloody ironic if Powder make Silco drink the Shimmer and throw the creature into a Council meeting.
Ideally we'll never work with shimmer. I like the idea of their stupid council chamber coming to life and mechanically turning into a giant fancy war spider robot and a wrapped and gagged Silco strapped to it's chest, complete with jinxes resignation strapped to his chest.
I would much rather use Jayce or Heimerdinger for something like that
I'd rather move away from shimmer entirely. That's canonical Jinx. I have my spider bot Idea earlier, but there is also the Idea of just, rigging the entire council chamber to be launched into the sea. Granted, we might not even end up as a powder who cares about Silco or the council rather than fixated on V or something else none political, especially if Silco isn't whispering in her ear.
 
[X] [Piltover]: Getting Tools, Training, and Knowledge is Worth Playing Nice

[X][Downtime]: Keeping Working on her Mouser Bombs Alone

Reading the discussion in the thread, I think "getting a nice life" is the same trap the other named characters fell into.

If we go that route, Powder's neuroses will become even worse as she needs to sacrifice her goodness to get that better life.
Which means Jinx is coming up far quicker and more violently than I'd prefer.
 
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It's darkly funny but they really could and they didn't even feel the need to know it. Jayce and Cait both had their own independent WMDs to use on Zaun and might have realized it if they were pushed far enough.

Eh, it's worth noting that Caitlyn's gas let's her get the drop on Jinx once - after that in the episode 3 montage we see traps in the ventilation pipes placed by Jinx. And I think in S2E3 what Jinx did completely eliminated the ability to use the system as a weapon against Zaun (although that might be subject to interpretation).

Jinx is inevitable, but the devil is in the details. By which I mean that the details of how Powder becomes Jinx are a big factor in the Neurosis fueled mannerism which define the line between Powder and Jinx. The journey matters, and even if Jinx is inevitable, where she's standing what she wants from life isn't.

I kind of doubt this? Like, if we always pick maximally Powder-y actions, and we roll high, it'd be weird if we became Jinx. In canon, we literally see in S2E7 that Jinx isn't inevitable. FWIW I'd like to play Jinx. But if we're vote to try for a better life by impressing Jayce and talking to Heimerdinger and eventually going to Piltie school and role-swapping with Vi, I'm not sure why we couldn't do that.

Ideally we'll never work with shimmer. I like the idea of their stupid council chamber coming to life and mechanically turning into a giant fancy war spider robot and a wrapped and gagged Silco strapped to it's chest, complete with jinxes resignation strapped to his chest.

If it never naturally comes up I'm not saying we should try to force it. But working with Shimmer seems interesting to me - it's one of two Phlebotinums in Piltover & Zaun, and we're one of the people who has potential access to both. The fact that it is both a powerful combat drug which can make up for a vast disparity in wealth and other technology but also a recreational drug that is addictive and damaging is some moral texture that's more interesting than just totally morally clean automata. The later may be non-canon but it's (IMO) pretty generic and uninteresting. And like, in universe, why wouldn't we work with shimmer? Are we, a zaunite orphan who is totally happy to build nail bombs to use on law enforcement, committed to like a D.A.R.E. pledge? Or do we know that in canon using it makes you a bad guy?
 
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