Okay, so, that battle was good television but in military history terms it was rather silly. Like, we all know the things that were silly about it, in aggregate as a group; so I don't feel the need to go through it or belabour the points further. Indeed I scrolled through just now, rather than reading your posts (which I'm sure are lovely), because I just watched the episode and wanted to put down my thoughts before I go to sleep.
My three main thoughts were these.
For all that there were a lot of things about the battle that were dumb, it was still really satisfying when the cavalry arrived. That's testament to the fact that the the showrunners are pretty good filmakers even if they aren't great military historians by SV standards, I think. The fact that it could've been exactly as satisfying with a less silly lead-up does not detract from the fact that it was still very satisfying, I think.
Sansa, not Jon, in the end, was the one who won the Battle of Snows, for all that Jon's efforts were instrumental in her victory. I think that's fitting and appropriate, it was clearly foreshadowed and I didn't dislike it at all. She's clearly learning how to play the game of thrones, and I like it. I wonder who she'll choose as a husband; I imagine that may become a plot point next season, although they've given themselves so little fucking time to wrap up the main plot that perhaps not.
I also really liked the point Sansa made to Ramsay about how his hounds were loyal to him, before he starved them for a week. That's a metaphor for his whole diseased style of rulership, and the faults in ruling through fear and acts of blatant terrorism. I also like how the show also demonstrated this in the battle- oh wait they fucking didn't. This is more egregious because Jon mentioned it, and then it didn't fucking go anywhere. The Manderleys showing up and reinforcing the Stark forces, the Umbers turning midway (where were they by the way? there were only Bolton banners in evidence), fucking something to ram that point home. The small number of small Northern houses who sided with the good guys and the Glovers and Manderleys apparently staying neutral wasn't nearly enough. But this is getting into the territory of stuff we all probably agree on, and has presumably already been said at length, so I digress.
There were no main character deaths, I liked that and honestly found it to be really effective. If you make your audience honestly, genuinely scared that any character can die, and make them believe it's entirely possible, which this show certainly has, then it can actually be more satisfying to let them all live through something terrible once in a while. The fact they they felt the need to kill Wun-Wun at the end was genuinely sad and moving, but also felt kind of obligatory and going-through-the-motions, a bit like an orgasm in a failing and lifeless marriage. It also felt a bit like they didn't have the stones to kill an actual main character, on reflection, slightly cheapening the whole thing. But again, I'm sure this is something you guys discussed.
Apparently Dany could handle that fleet fine just by herself! Interesting that all three Dragons listen to her, or maybe they just felt like burning shit lol. Anyway, if they whip out Dragonbinder next season, that could add some genuine tension. Although honestly, they may struggle for time. Dany had to get home and do compelling stuff to secure here throne there before going northwards, and she needs screen time to do that. Euron frankly can't be more than a midseason speedbump without taking up far too much time, and to be honest even that would be pushing it, really. It may seem a bit cheap but I actually hope they give a fairly swift and potentially unsatisfying resolution to his plotline; it's absoluetely necessary for the sake of the main one with the remaining time available.
The compact between the Iron Islands and the Queen of fukken long speeches was cool, although I felt the time constraints weighing on the scene a bit. I dunno what Dany was smoking thinking that 1) making the Iron Islands their own independent nation 2) asking them not to raid the mainland is a workable long-term deal lol. I think she may have been a hankering for a lick of her own Salt Queen, though, so I can forgive her. I imagine the actual final settlement worked out by Tyrion and probably Theon will be a bit more sensible, in the end. Presuming they're both alive at that point.
Wow, that was six points! Looks like I can't count when I'm drunk lol
My three main thoughts were these.
For all that there were a lot of things about the battle that were dumb, it was still really satisfying when the cavalry arrived. That's testament to the fact that the the showrunners are pretty good filmakers even if they aren't great military historians by SV standards, I think. The fact that it could've been exactly as satisfying with a less silly lead-up does not detract from the fact that it was still very satisfying, I think.
Sansa, not Jon, in the end, was the one who won the Battle of Snows, for all that Jon's efforts were instrumental in her victory. I think that's fitting and appropriate, it was clearly foreshadowed and I didn't dislike it at all. She's clearly learning how to play the game of thrones, and I like it. I wonder who she'll choose as a husband; I imagine that may become a plot point next season, although they've given themselves so little fucking time to wrap up the main plot that perhaps not.
I also really liked the point Sansa made to Ramsay about how his hounds were loyal to him, before he starved them for a week. That's a metaphor for his whole diseased style of rulership, and the faults in ruling through fear and acts of blatant terrorism. I also like how the show also demonstrated this in the battle- oh wait they fucking didn't. This is more egregious because Jon mentioned it, and then it didn't fucking go anywhere. The Manderleys showing up and reinforcing the Stark forces, the Umbers turning midway (where were they by the way? there were only Bolton banners in evidence), fucking something to ram that point home. The small number of small Northern houses who sided with the good guys and the Glovers and Manderleys apparently staying neutral wasn't nearly enough. But this is getting into the territory of stuff we all probably agree on, and has presumably already been said at length, so I digress.
There were no main character deaths, I liked that and honestly found it to be really effective. If you make your audience honestly, genuinely scared that any character can die, and make them believe it's entirely possible, which this show certainly has, then it can actually be more satisfying to let them all live through something terrible once in a while. The fact they they felt the need to kill Wun-Wun at the end was genuinely sad and moving, but also felt kind of obligatory and going-through-the-motions, a bit like an orgasm in a failing and lifeless marriage. It also felt a bit like they didn't have the stones to kill an actual main character, on reflection, slightly cheapening the whole thing. But again, I'm sure this is something you guys discussed.
Apparently Dany could handle that fleet fine just by herself! Interesting that all three Dragons listen to her, or maybe they just felt like burning shit lol. Anyway, if they whip out Dragonbinder next season, that could add some genuine tension. Although honestly, they may struggle for time. Dany had to get home and do compelling stuff to secure here throne there before going northwards, and she needs screen time to do that. Euron frankly can't be more than a midseason speedbump without taking up far too much time, and to be honest even that would be pushing it, really. It may seem a bit cheap but I actually hope they give a fairly swift and potentially unsatisfying resolution to his plotline; it's absoluetely necessary for the sake of the main one with the remaining time available.
The compact between the Iron Islands and the Queen of fukken long speeches was cool, although I felt the time constraints weighing on the scene a bit. I dunno what Dany was smoking thinking that 1) making the Iron Islands their own independent nation 2) asking them not to raid the mainland is a workable long-term deal lol. I think she may have been a hankering for a lick of her own Salt Queen, though, so I can forgive her. I imagine the actual final settlement worked out by Tyrion and probably Theon will be a bit more sensible, in the end. Presuming they're both alive at that point.
Wow, that was six points! Looks like I can't count when I'm drunk lol
