Hill Guard is currently in the middle of a low-key civil war because they couldn't agree on someone to lead them. Due to the war last turn, there's a large number of veterans who are returning and making things worse. They are used to using violence to get their way and they have their own strange hierarchies that they created which don't mesh well with what Hill Guard currently has going on.
Crystal Lake would be doing the same thing instead of being utterly paralyzed but they've become leadership snobs. They're so used to having Heroic leaders that they won't accept anyone less than that. Things are fine for now since you do have Priit, but they're going to go for an immediate dive the second that he dies.
The Fingers are doing okay for the most part. They won't be once they realize that Priit now has to resettle in Crystal Lake since the settlement won't function without him. That means not only have Priit, but Aeva and Kaspar been stolen by Crystal Lake, incensing the Fingers.
You're still in the middle of a government transition right now. If you check the 1st page, you're still over your Specialization limit and that's causing a lot of problems. You solved it on the lower level, but on the higher levels, it's now impossible to receive enough training to be a leader; no one is taught how to lead thousands and organize all of the resources and industries you have; it's simply not possible to do so without mechanisms to train for it. Right now, your leaders basically don't receive any training at all; Aeva and Priit can make do because they're Heroes; whoever follows them almost certainly won't.
Government reforms and transitions are dangerous. They're like trying to perform maintenance on an air plane while still flying. You managed to hit the Lakelands in just the right spot this turn that you utterly warped their transition and dealt immeasurable damage to them socially. They're now set on a doomed path. Someone hitting you in the right spot right now could easily make you fly apart.
Ah shit, red flag!
Do not take the Success/Skill options, they double down on the existing problem because we will refuse to give resources to develop an heir until they prove themselves.. We need a succession method which allows us to train an heir before they are fully adults or we generate a Catch-22 where only a genius can get training they don't need to qualify for a position only after they qualify for it.
I took a look at @Azel's quest and his system is pretty close to what I was conceptualizing. I don't want to deliberately copy him so I'll think on it more. Most people seem to be happy with the narrative approach for now.
The one benefit of having codified, numerical stats means that it's easier to give out rewards or demonstrate temporary damage from war or natural disaster.
Narrative works well, though Azel's faction system remains heavily narrative due to layers of obfuscation(i.e. its close to narrative because theres no visible mechanical means to move the numbers other than apply a shove and hope it translates)
No..? The obsidian you have is 100% internally mined at Crystal Lake. The only society which has any source of obsidian outside of you is the Lakelands and they appear to only produce a fraction of what you can produce.
General
Martial: Reduced Hardened Neolithic Warriors and Holy Orders
Economy: Early Aquaculture with Very Early Agriculture Supplemented by Managed Hunting and Herding (Small Surplus)
Agriculture: Extremely Early Agriculture
Aquaculture: Early Aquaculture
Herds: Primarily small-team hunts with animal assistance
Hunting: Carefully Managed Hunting (Safe Hunting Cap: Substantial Room Left)Art: Advanced High-Quality Tools
Diplomacy: A Tribe of Two Faces, Spirit and Demon.
???
So we gained three prestige, one of that from the ensuing factional strife being resolved, and the other two from being it out of the Bitter-Water Tribe, while losing one stability. Considering most of us want us plan to finish the Temple at Crystal Lake, we should be able to raise our stability by one as well as our legitimacy, so that's not really a problem.
Tribe of the West (Prestige: 19, Army: Numerous Professional Neolithic Warriors, Economy: Unprecedented Boom in Agriculture, Art: Innumerable Tools, Magic: All Things Alive)
At this stage, it's rather obvious the Bitter-Water Tribe is the Tribe of the West, as the two prestige they lost compared to last turn is likely the two prestige we just gained. They don't seem that savaged though.
Interesting to see that Arrow Lake has vaulted over the Island Makers. I'm guessing their slaves are proving their worth for them. I'm wondering what exactly is holding the Island Makers back that they're still pissed off.
Peace Builders (Prestige: 10, Army: Greatly Reduced Fanatical Neolithic Warriors, Economy: Broad Agriculture and Aquaculture, Art: Ephemeral Crafts and Imported Advanced High Quality Tools, Magic: Of Song and Story)
Catseye gained a good amount of prestige, likely from that warlord (Heroic?) of theirs. Lakeland has as well due to their gains against the Bitter-Water tribe.
No. The Law is new this turn. You'll have two main choices for The Law megaproject: how it's recorded and what the main theme that the law promotes. Some of those themes project children and Debtors better than others.
Creating a manufacturing base for booze from scratch is hard. You're going to have to plant grain, hire woodcutters or potters to make vessels to hold the alcohol, store and organize everything. This isn't just an experimental action: this is creating an entire industry.
The Cracktooth did not do well. The Hill that they built is made atop countless corpses. They did not integrate well; if Priit had seen how they were treated, he would've had a stroke in pure unadulterated RAGE. He can't do anything about it now since most of the Debtors you took are dead.
Non-Hereditary Orders
Born into a clan, each member of the People is encouraged to strike out on their own and make their mark on the world. They are taught to be ambitious, to look for opportunities to prove themselves and demonstrate the superiority of the clan that birthed them and the one that took them in. Excellence in all things is the creed of the People and each person must start anew to demonstrate their worth on that indomitable path.
Effects: Slightly increased Matriarchal tendency, increased ambition/adventurers seeking their fortune, increased social interconnections
They're extremely decentralized. They are also the remnants of a much stronger civilization that was destroyed in the conflict over the southern peninsula a few generations past. They were going through several major social transitions.
They would've resolved. The Lakelands were actually going to transition fully away from violence and return to a more peaceful lifestyle. Now, that did involve some nasty things like taking anti-Elite values and strong Conformity values, but they would've been the perfect forest Hippies! (At least until one of the tribes around them dominated their neighbours and then turned to the Lakelands to conquer and enslave them all.)
You just happened to hit them in the exact right moment when they were changing their values where they were in an unstable state between a former warrior civilization and a newly peaceful one.
Three generations ago the Peace Builders conquered quite a bit.
They've honestly spent the time just hanging back and having as many children as they possibly could. They were really savaged by the constant wars the last few turns.
Yeah, so we've noticed, it seems like their population has been significantly cut down. I'm guessing the Peace Builders are not very eager to go to war anytime soon?
The Lakelands' elders hate you. Their young generally like you. However, you've unleashed a beast; if you don't work on building a reputation with them, the war mongers that you just unleashed will slowly turn on you.
How long until they turn against us? Do we have to immediately go and raid the Peace Builder's enemies or do we have time to make adjustments and control?
She knew that she was probably going to be buried beside him, but she didn't really want to be. She would've preferred to be buried alongside her wife. Aeva knew that she wouldn't have that option, however: the People wouldn't have listened to her dying wishes.
It is going to be a trend of you creating mummies within the Cave of Stars. The criteria on which you recognize Aeva as unique will be the 'admission requirements' to be interred there.
What are the People's current religious beliefs like anyhow? I get that they're on the cusp of creating a religion, as they have a pantheon of sorts formed, but have the ideas of formal ritual and gods been codified yet?
First thing: I will be adding factions eventually. They were always planned, but you're just not at a high enough level of social complexity for them to be true and distinct powers. They will show up.
I was thinking more along the line of changing things so that new buildings provide a throughput of resources. For example, a Sugar Shack would give +0.5 units of Luxuries in exchange for 1 unit of Wood and 0.5 units of Food. It would take a while to balance the system, but it wold remain relatively stable over time. It would also make settlement destruction a lot more harmful as that would gut an enormous amount of infrastructure. That's ultimately more realistic; a city being destroyed could send the entire region around it into a tailspin that it might never recover from.
Lower Canada doesn't quite mean what you think it does: Lower Canada is the former name for the province of Quebec. It was called that because it was 'lower' on the St. Lawrence River. The region that the Bitter-Water tribe inhabit would either be the Niagara Peninsula, southern Ontario, or (archaically) Upper Canada.
Government reforms and transitions are dangerous. They're like trying to perform maintenance on an air plane while still flying. You managed to hit the Lakelands in just the right spot this turn that you utterly warped their transition and dealt immeasurable damage to them socially. They're now set on a doomed path. Someone hitting you in the right spot right now could easily make you fly apart.
Young men have to carve their own place in the world, starting to build up power each generation from scratch. Now, there's still an advantage to be had as a result of good training and an easy early life, but the network of social connections that defines a true noble caste can't form. That drives the increase in ambition and adventurism. Across centuries, this is a huge disadvantage, but to the average person, those that win look like they come out far ahead.
Considering people are trying to make the Big Man position more centralized and hereditary based on the current vote, how will that affect these Orders?
Also, I'm assuming we can reform this later on, as I don't really like how Non-Hereditary Orders have ended up being, both in terms of gameplay and in terms of the values they represent.
Anywho, here's my vote:
[X] [Debt] Several of the Debtors captured were makers of the tribe's eponymous bitter water. Make them produce some for the People. (???)
[X][Aeva] Aeva was the daughter of Kaspar and born to rule.
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
-[X][Action] Raise Temple (Crystal Lake)
-[X][Action] The Law [Retributive Justice] [Admin]
-[X][Martial] Train Warriors (Warriors)
-[X][Tribute] Megaprojects - Current Megaproject
Adhoc vote count started by Japanime on Jul 22, 2018 at 10:49 PM, finished with 42 posts and 17 votes.
[X] [Aeva] Aeva was the daughter of Kaspar and born to rule.
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
-[X][Action] Raise Temple (Crystal Lake)
-[X][Action] The Law [Retributive Justice] [Admin]
-[X][Martial] Train Warriors (Warriors)
-[X][Tribute] Megaprojects - Current Megaproject
Lack of leadership is the root but:
-Aeva was too busy dying to actually monitor the work closely, she only gets progress reports and those look pretty good on paper.
-Priit was too busy at war a couple of months travel away for the whole period.
-The last Big Man was a compromise figurehead and everyone knows it.
-People really hated the Cracktooth Debtors for corpse desecration. The Warriors in charge of making sure the rules are followed know these guys to be the ones who multilated their Blood Brothers bodies and denied them clean burials.
-The Cracktooth don't really know our language, techniques and tools that well. We know how to build safely, what weathers are good for moving dirt, what situations are risky to build in. They don't. So they get killed in construction accidents much like cheap illegal workers do today. Just need to overestimate the strength of a wood or brick retaining surface, or work with lime mortar without realizing that the powder is corrosive when wet(you can die from chemical burns if not cared for, especially if you're slathered in the stuff when the rain comes down and then you die from horrible scarring and infection.
Its a net plus:
-Matriarchy is slightly more stable than Patriarchy because the ruling class is not subject to death by violence, and hereditary succession is a little more clear(no question of legitimacy in general).
-Adventurism is destabilizing, but thats inherent to heavy elitism, because elites seek to validate themselves.
-Interconnections is stabilizing, though it also means that problems become visible sooner.
How long until they turn against us? Do we have to immediately go and raid the Peace Builder's enemies or do we have time to make adjustments and control?
[X] [Debt] Several of the Debtors captured were makers of the tribe's eponymous bitter water. Make them produce some for the People. (???)
[X][Aeva] Aeva was the daughter of Kaspar and born to rule.
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
I'm not a big fan of monarchy but even less a fan of instability and literally anyone being able to claim power by force. Hopefully the law megaproject will move us toward more centralized governance. Right now each Big Man is equal and that's not very good for coordination.
[X] [Debt] Several of the Debtors captured were makers of the tribe's eponymous bitter water. Make them produce some for the People. (???)
[X][Aeva] Aeva was an Ember-Eye: always in touch with the spirits.
[X][Aeva] Aeva was the daughter of Kaspar and born to rule.
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
-[X][Action] Raise Temple (Crystal Lake)
-[X][Action] The Law [Retributive Justice] [Admin]
-[X][Martial] Train Warriors (Warriors)
-[X][Tribute] Megaprojects - Current Megaproject
[X] [Debt] Several of the Debtors captured were makers of the tribe's eponymous bitter water. Make them produce some for the People. (???)
[X][Aeva] Aeva was an Ember-Eye: always in touch with the spirits.
[X][Aeva] Aeva was the daughter of Kaspar and born to rule.
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
[X] [Debt] Moving dirt builds character. (The Hill: Fingers x2)
[X][Aeva] Aeva was an Ember-Eye: always in touch with the spirits.
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
Alcohol is a fantastic tech and I want it... but not as much as I want to get things locked in for our build tall strategy properly. With all our heroes dying off we're simply not going to have the actions to complete The Hill at Fingers in the coming turns unless we do more slave raiding, and we're going to have a civil war distracting us and no martial hero ensuring that our slave raids are successful. If we don't get The Hill locked in now it might be a half-dozen turns before we ride out this crisis and can spare the actions for it. The Bitter-Water seem stable and will likely still be there to trade or war with and learn alcohol from in a century or two.
Our Holy Orders being hybrid martial/shaman types makes them well suited for theocratic rule of a violent society, and we can use the Holy Orders' apprentice system plus blood adoption as a substitute for basic heredity so it serves many of the same purposes. I don't think they're subject to the same severing of inheritance as most warriors are, though that could be wrong. Plus, they'll have internal competition to weed out incompetents while conventional heredity is much more iffy on that score. I'm inclined to hand them the leadership since we can't really handle the additional push for elitism that Great/Success will demand of our people.
It's a pity that this is likely to result in the standards for being interred being quite low, but there's not much else to be done about it.
It's also a pity that our action set here is turning entirely inward and letting the problems outside our borders get worse, but with a civil war brewing there's little to be done about that.
Its a net plus:
-Matriarchy is slightly more stable than Patriarchy because the ruling class is not subject to death by violence, and hereditary succession is a little more clear(no question of legitimacy in general).
-Adventurism is destabilizing, but thats inherent to heavy elitism, because elites seek to validate themselves.
-Interconnections is stabilizing, though it also means that problems become visible sooner.
I don't particularly care about how the matriarchy aspect of this trait affects us. I don't really have a problem with it. However at the same time I'm also not inherently against a patriarchy either, considering how well off and successful patriarchal societies have been throughout history. I care more pragmatically about how this will affect us in the long run and this excerpt from the mouth of the QM seems to put that into question:
Now, there's still an advantage to be had as a result of good training and an easy early life, but the network of social connections that defines a true noble caste can't form. That drives the increase in ambition and adventurism. Across centuries, this is a huge disadvantage, but to the average person, those that win look like they come out far ahead.
For me the main contention I have is that this system holds us back from gaining a proper noble class, something we might not agree with based on our modern western values today, but one that is likely going to be useful for us for a long time, especially considering how integral it will be to maintaining the powerful armies of the Bronze Age.
When the QM himself calls this a long term disadvantage I am inclined to take him at his word. Meaning that if chances come up I will aim and try to reform this system or replace it if need be with one that is not so disadvantageous to us.
As for the points you raised yourself. I think the matriarchy aspect is not in and of itself something worth keeping this trait for, and that is for a number of reasons. Firstly one of the long term precedents we set a while back with divorce is that the child in a marriage goes to the father, which makes me believe that the matriarchy here will not be as powerful or influential as you seem to imply it is. Secondly, as most people seem to be choosing a hereditary system of lineage for those descended from Kaspar, that seems like that in combination with the earlier point about fathers having claim over children would run counter to this, especially as it seems likely that all future big men will likely be members of the holy orders rather then the non-hereditary warrior orders. However, this is all beside the point for me as I could care less about this aspect.
I do not disagree with you about adventurism or the aspects of social interconnection. I just instead believe one of the other options or a future reform that includes nobility as an aspect would likely include those as well regardless.
That in combination with the QM's words on this being disadvantageous in the long run makes me disinclined to support it and more likely to want to get rid of it in favor of something else.
Not as far as we know l, however there is a big stretch of white on the map that we don't exactly know about and like the Hundred Band remnants long ago they may have a connection to the Great River from one of their rivers that allows them to contact us.
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
-[X][Action] Raise Temple (Crystal Lake)
-[X][Action] The Law [Retributive Justice] [Admin]
-[X][Martial] Train Warriors (Warriors)
-[X][Tribute] Megaprojects - Current Megaproject
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
-[X][Action] Raise Temple (Crystal Lake)
-[X][Action] The Law [Retributive Justice] [Admin]
-[X][Martial] Train Warriors (Warriors)
-[X][Tribute] Megaprojects - Current Megaproject
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
-[X][Action] Raise Temple (Crystal Lake)
-[X][Action] The Law [Retributive Justice] [Admin]
-[X][Martial] Train Warriors (Warriors)
-[X][Tribute] Megaprojects - Current Megaproject
[X] [Debt] Moving dirt builds character. (The Hill: Fingers x2)
[X][Aeva] Aeva was an Ember-Eye: always in touch with the spirits.
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
[X] [Debt] Moving dirt builds character. (The Hill: Fingers x2)
[X] [Aeva] Aeva was an Ember-Eye: always in touch with the spirits.
[X] [Aeva] Aeva was the daughter of Kaspar and born to rule.
[X] [Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
I took a look at @Azel's quest and his system is pretty close to what I was conceptualizing. I don't want to deliberately copy him so I'll think on it more. Most people seem to be happy with the narrative approach for now.
The one benefit of having codified, numerical stats means that it's easier to give out rewards or demonstrate temporary damage from war or natural disaster.
As they say, imitation is the most sincere form of flattery, so go ahead if you want. I would be honoured. Fair warning though that it takes a good deal of bookkeeping.
My system is built to make it easy to model economic interdependence and societies that grow more and more complex around them. That's inherently complicated, but great fun when you throw bricks at it to see what gives. My main goal is to model the rise of interconnected bronze age societies and potentially their downfall.
Narrative works well, though Azel's faction system remains heavily narrative due to layers of obfuscation(i.e. its close to narrative because theres no visible mechanical means to move the numbers other than apply a shove and hope it translates)
These matters are a bit complicated to pour then into numbers without massively dumbing them down. Thus the faction system is mostly meant as a simple visual aid for players to see the current socio-economic order of their civ.
I don't particularly care about how the matriarchy aspect of this trait affects us. I don't really have a problem with it. However at the same time I'm also not inherently against a patriarchy either, considering how well off and successful patriarchal societies have been throughout history. I care more pragmatically about how this will affect us in the long run and this excerpt from the mouth of the QM seems to put that into question:
For me the main contention I have is that this system holds us back from gaining a proper noble class, something we might not agree with based on our modern western values today, but one that is likely going to be useful for us for a long time, especially considering how integral it will be to maintaining the powerful armies of the Bronze Age.
When the QM himself calls this a long term disadvantage I am inclined to take him at his word. Meaning that if chances come up I will aim and try to reform this system or replace it if need be with one that is not so disadvantageous to us.
Uh, from what I've seen it doesn't in fact, preclude a long term noble class forming. It precludes a male long term warrior-noble class forming, which is the easiest way to form a noble class.
@Redium explicitly laid out that it's causing a female non-warrior noble class to form, because the wives are the ones maintaining the clan connections, and choosing husbands.
This means Administrator-Nobles, Trader-Nobles or Shaman-Nobles are more likely to arise.
This is incidentally a side effect of our Trials, since women count as adults younger via the specialist route where they take the male trials, or they can take the politician route where they marry a promising younger warrior via diplomatic arrangements made by their mothers.
As for the points you raised yourself. I think the matriarchy aspect is not in and of itself something worth keeping this trait for, and that is for a number of reasons. Firstly one of the long term precedents we set a while back with divorce is that the child in a marriage goes to the father, which makes me believe that the matriarchy here will not be as powerful or influential as you seem to imply it is. Secondly, as most people seem to be choosing a hereditary system of lineage for those descended from Kaspar, that seems like that in combination with the earlier point about fathers having claim over children would run counter to this, especially as it seems likely that all future big men will likely be members of the holy orders rather then the non-hereditary warrior orders. However, this is all beside the point for me as I could care less about this aspect.
Hereditary + Matrilineal bias is actually easier to set up.
The female line of inheritance is absolutely without a doubt, whereas in the male line, Priit has doubts about whether his sons are all his. Theres a number of ways this works, but a fairly common mode of inheritance is to count descent through female inheritance, but with the males actually inheriting.
Though that has its own issues since it encourages close inbreeding down the line.
These matters are a bit complicated to pour then into numbers without massively dumbing them down. Thus the faction system is mostly meant as a simple visual aid for players to see the current socio-economic order of their civ.
It's also an endless source of amusement for me whenever you gear up to do something and get entirely different results then anticipated.
Social matters are one of the very few areas where I'm comfortable with letting you run headfirst into a wall, since making bumbling mistakes in that area is accounting for 75% of human history.
It's also an endless source of amusement for me whenever you gear up to do something and get entirely different results then anticipated.
Social matters are one of the very few areas where I'm comfortable with letting you run headfirst into a wall, since making bumbling mistakes in that area is accounting for 75% of human history.
No. The Law is new this turn. You'll have two main choices for The Law megaproject: how it's recorded and what the main theme that the law promotes. Some of those themes project children and Debtors better than others.
Do the beliefs and priorities of our current Big Men during the megaproject influence the resulting Law at all? I mean beyond their game mechanical specialty.
Why does it need to be sustainable? In theory we could just get a tradition of building mountains on corpses when we win wars while otherwise simply not doing so. This form of labor is not as inherently dependency creating as using them for agriculture, which I thought was the point for us choosing it.
I assume that the way our people decide who is heroic is not the same as how the game mechanical do, right? What are the criteria for Crystal Lake to see someone as inherently heroic enough to be worthy of leadership?
Essentially, how your system currently works is that children do not receive an inheritance from their families. When the parents die, their private possessions revert to their clan. Kids'll still be raised by their family, but it's expected that they will make their own way in the world, forging their own name and their own destiny.
Isn't that true only for Warriors? Meaning that male hunters, shaman, builders, traders, farmers and whatever else we have still inherit as usual? How many of our male population even are warriors or ex-warriors currently?
@Azel I would also like to enjoy your quest, but I have no idea how to find it, since it seems your profile page is set to private for some reason.
Uh, from what I've seen it doesn't in fact, preclude a long term noble class forming. It precludes a male long term warrior-noble class forming, which is the easiest way to form a noble class.
Which is exactly why I don't prefer this system as its setup, as none of what you've said so far changes the fact that the QM himself said that over the long term this system is a "huge disadvantage", QM's words not mine.
@Redium explicitly laid out that it's causing a female non-warrior noble class to form, because the wives are the ones maintaining the clan connections, and choosing husbands.
This means Administrator-Nobles, Trader-Nobles or Shaman-Nobles are more likely to arise.
This is incidentally a side effect of our Trials, since women count as adults younger via the specialist route where they take the male trials, or they can take the politician route where they marry a promising younger warrior via diplomatic arrangements made by their mothers.
Frankly speaking, none of the points you've raised so far regarding a female noble-class have outweighed the mention by @Redium of how disadvantageous this system is for our male warriors. While I can see the appeal in having a more broad and varied noble class that is not just composed of warriors, I don't believe it outweighs the potential penalties down the line, especially considering how enshrined violence is within the People.
Furthermore, considering how hard it is to go against the grain of established narrative and precedent, I don't see any need to add additional complications in order to get a system which I view as suboptimal in the long term considering our current geopolitical situation.
You moved strongly away from matriarchy during the War against South Lake when you voted that children sired on the Island Makers' women should be adopted by their fathers. That made children from a marriage the 'property' of their father's family and thus dealt an extremely slow, but inevitable, blow to women's rights.
Hereditary + Matrilineal bias is actually easier to set up.
The female line of inheritance is absolutely without a doubt, whereas in the male line, Priit has doubts about whether his sons are all his. Theres a number of ways this works, but a fairly common mode of inheritance is to count descent through female inheritance, but with the males actually inheriting.
Though that has its own issues since it encourages close inbreeding down the line.
That would be true if we had not already decided much earlier in the quest that children are seen as descended from the patrilineal line of the father, which is enshrined in both precedent and apparently in our traits concerning divorce:
Divorce
The People recognize that even the most intimate and sacred of bonds may be severed. This is a difficult process and one often seldom undertaken, for who should break asunder that which was once one? So far, the People only recognize the cause of a woman's infidelity as grounds to initiate divorce. Children born of a union between man and woman are property of the husband's family, unless disowned.
Effects: Female promiscuity, bastardy stigmatized, children from divorce belong to their father's family
Furthermore, considering how a good majority of the voters are about to decide that the basis for interring Aeva into the Cave of Stars, and thus what is worthy for leading the People at its highest levels, is her status as a daughter of Kaspar, I don't think setting up a hereditary matrilineal bias is in the cards. The precedent that would be set by such a ruling would essentially make it so that their patrilineal heredity is what determines their right to rule. Something that is especially relevant as this argument is also one that will apply to Priit as well, as he can also point to his ancestry and relationship to Kaspar.
In short, while I acknowledge the points you've made, they haven't really persuaded me to change my mind regarding the system as it is. I don't see the point in trying to go against generations of precedence, overturning a lot of previously commonly held beliefs, something which if we do during the Law choices will make it so that we will likely lose stability, in order to abruptly change to a system that I don't believe offers us much in the way of benefits. In essence, as with the previous vote on this issue I still disagree with the choice chosen, and now that the QM has stated that this system is disadvantageous for us in the long term I feel that much more firmly about the need to change and move away from this system.
Adhoc vote count started by Japanime on Jul 23, 2018 at 10:34 AM, finished with 63 posts and 26 votes.
[X] [Aeva] Aeva was the daughter of Kaspar and born to rule.
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
-[X][Action] Raise Temple (Crystal Lake)
-[X][Action] The Law [Retributive Justice] [Admin]
-[X][Martial] Train Warriors (Warriors)
-[X][Tribute] Megaprojects - Current Megaproject
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
-[X][Action] Raise Temple (Crystal Lake)
-[X][Action] The Law [Retributive Justice] [Admin]
-[X][Martial] Train Warriors (Warriors)
-[X][Tribute] Megaprojects - Current Megaproject
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
-[X][Action] Raise Temple (Crystal Lake)
-[X][Action] The Law [Retributive Justice] [Admin]
-[X][Martial] Train Warriors (Warriors)
-[X][Tribute] Megaprojects - Current Megaproject
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
-[X][Action] Raise Temple (Crystal Lake)
-[X][Action] The Law [Retributive Justice] [Admin]
-[X][Martial] Train Warriors (Warriors)
-[X][Tribute] Megaprojects - Current Megaproject
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
-[X][Action] Raise Temple (Crystal Lake)
-[X][Action] The Law [Retributive Justice] [Admin]
-[X][Martial] Train Warriors (Warriors)
-[X][Tribute] Megaprojects - Current Megaproject
[X] [Debt] Several of the Debtors captured were makers of the tribe's eponymous bitter water. Make them produce some for the People. (???)
[X][Aeva] Aeva was the daughter of Kaspar and born to rule.
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
-[X][Action] Raise Temple (Crystal Lake)
-[X][Action] The Law [Retributive Justice] [Admin]
-[X][Martial] Train Warriors (Warriors)
-[X][Tribute] Megaprojects - Current Megaproject
IMO, the main value of the numerical elements of questing is not to generate fun by letting us manage a number system, it's to allow a form of tension that can't really be found in any other form of media; making things a bit dice based removes our assurance that things will go well just because it seems like they should. This also allows the occasional amazing result; when we get things like Kaspar the excessively prolonged, it's not a deus ex machina in our favor, it's justifed by the fact that fortune could just as easily have gone the other way and killed Kaspar before we pulled out of south lake. I certainly wouldn't mind you adding new stats (especially if you feel like the current stats don't fully model something as critical as losing a settlement), but it wouldn't improve the experience of decision making that much either.
If you want to make choices feel harder, then step one would be to stop outright telling us what the right choice is. For example, you basically said last turn that we would very much regret it if we didn't either trade or raid the mountain clans, and earlier examples of this include warning us away from Closed Heart and telling us that we would need to make sure we controlled either the west or southern farmlands.
So essentially we are on a path where a plurality of domestic/political leaders will end up being older head of house women that are descendant from male warriors of great renown?
[X] [Debt] Several of the Debtors captured were makers of the tribe's eponymous bitter water. Make them produce some for the People. (???)
[X][Aeva] Aeva was an Ember-Eye: always in touch with the spirits.
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
[X] [Debt] Moving dirt builds character. (The Hill: Fingers x2)
[X][Aeva] Aeva was an Ember-Eye: always in touch with the spirits.
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
I like @maximillian's point regarding Folk Wrestling but I simply can't approve of a plan that doesn't go for the Law megaproject while we still have some kind of hero.
If you switch out the Trails and the World tribute I'd be game.
[X] [Debt] Several of the Debtors captured were makers of the tribe's eponymous bitter water. Make them produce some for the People. (???)
[X][Aeva] Aeva was an Ember-Eye: always in touch with the spirits.
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
[X] [Debt] Several of the Debtors captured were makers of the tribe's eponymous bitter water. Make them produce some for the People. (???)
[X][Aeva] Aeva was an Ember-Eye: always in touch with the spirits.
[X][Actions] Plan Pretty Much Obligatory
