Fate/White Parmesan

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[X] You felt good. The feeling of dominating an enemy Master and defeating them was something you never imagined. You were just overwhelmed at first but now... You felt good about it. And it was worrying... You might have a positive disposition to violence, more than you could admit.
-[Q] Does this unit have a soul?

I mean one master killing another master is hardly news, probably should try not to enjoy it though
 
Raiseth said:
I wrote it basically from this premise: Brie knows how to be human, but it's as much pretending to her as being the real thing. She has skills that are activated when she requires them, so, it's like questioning herself whether her initial horror is a genuine reaction or a programmed one, since a normal person is expected to be horrified of the things she did.

Like, the first step to the grand question: is she human or does she pretend to be one, and what's the difference? Because being able to ask yourself this question is a cornerstone to the concept of free will in most philosophical theories.

Also, I'm interested in what Jeanne will tell us in response.
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There's a reason philosophers like Plato, Aristotle, and René Descartes expressed "dubito, ergo cogito, ergo sum". At the most basic level, the fact Brie has doubts at all is proof she's real, she is in control of herself. Or, to assume another phrasing, she has all the processes and actions to replicate human thoughts and morality. And if that is the interpretation one goes with, then for the question of whether or not Brie is indeed human I propose the following answer: Clark's First Law.

She is so highly advanced the distinction is irrelevant.

Brie has the capacity to think rational, possess personal preferences, and exhibits emotions within known human psychological boundaries. So what if the swords Shirou makes are all fakes, they're still good enough to blow shit up and shank a bitch. Why should Brie be any different? She's human enough to ask if she is. I do concur with your turn of phrase in this Raiseth: The question inherently delivers the answer.

As to the Core's ability to shut down her humanity in favor of pure, amoral, unemotional logos, I do not consider that to be an inherent removal of humanity. Rather, it's a part of the human psyche that is being suppressed. The logic and reasoning abilities of a sufficiently advanced and data-fed computer and a human being, again, reaches a point where the two are identical. But a human's gonna have all those little emotions and morals the computer never will until it stops being just a program and starts being a person. All the Core's doing when it flicks that switch is an Emotional Inhibitor gets turned on. So, as my recent Dr. Who binge and this clip shows, there's obviously going to be intense emotional reaction and disassociation when the part that's got less in common with ones and zeroes than the computers we're on right now gets ripped away then shoved back in.
 
[X] You felt conflicted. Did you have the right to torture her just to make her an easier target? Wasn't killing her and stopping her Servant's serial killer spree the right thing? What would you have done, had you been in control at the time? Who are you and who is the one that takes the reins once you enter the Emergency Mode? You are a bit of a mess, honestly.
 
[X] You felt conflicted. Did you have the right to torture her just to make her an easier target? Wasn't killing her and stopping her Servant's serial killer spree the right thing? What would you have done, had you been in control at the time? Who are you and who is the one that takes the reins once you enter the Emergency Mode? You are a bit of a mess, honestly.
 
[X] You felt conflicted. Did you have the right to torture her just to make her an easier target? Wasn't killing her and stopping her Servant's serial killer spree the right thing? What would you have done, had you been in control at the time? Who are you and who is the one that takes the reins once you enter the Emergency Mode? You are a bit of a mess, honestly.
 
Crafts
  • Sidestory
    • "This joke of yours may have gotten too far, old man."

    "A joke? Whatever do you mean, Madame?"

    An aged man and a mature woman sat before one another in a quiet lounge. Tea sat before the two of them as they sized one another up, trying to gauge any openings or weak defenses. It was less for the intent of striking physically and more on finding a way to create a mental jab at one another.

    The man was dressed in regal robes, his gnarled fingers adorned with silver rings but his face remained youthful as a man in his thirties. But he was far older than that, one cannot judge through looks alone.

    One could suppose the woman was the same, she was certainly old but not as ancient as the man before her. And were one to bring the topic up, then woe be upon them. She adjusted her glasses as she met the man's gaze.

    "Sending that doll and making a mess of things. If you truly wanted those blueprints back then you would have moved and finished this on the first day," the woman said as she picked up her tea and blew into it, "Is it just senility or are you just that sadistic?"

    "Had I intervened them it would end in an instant. But I decided to shoot two birds with one stone. I could extract combat data from the Doll while at the same time teaching that traitor a lesson," the old man replied with a small smile, "And what better venue than a Holy Grail War?"

    "I've seen your reports. Is it true then, that this Doll developed an anomalous element?" The woman cut to the chase with a narrowed look.

    "Indeed. It was quite surprising to be honest. However I fail to see how to replicate such a reaction. To create a pseudo-consciousness in such a manner is unprecedented," the man said with a thoughtful tone, "Should the unit survive the war, no doubt the Clocktower would be expressing interest in passing a Seal Designation upon it."

    "I wouldn't be surprised. It's no mere Homonculus at this point. A being melded with stone, flesh and magecraft, it would be akin to a Construct than a Homonculus. If I didn't know any better you may be reconstructing the wild Mudman, friend to the King of Heroes. But your family had always been interested in Greek culture and myths," the woman pointed out with a bland tone.

    The man took this in stride with good humor, "Truly that is one way of simplifying my family legacy."

    The woman remained silent with a narrowed look.

    "In any case, we've only come this far thanks to your help, Madame. Without your breakthroughs in your field, we wouldn't have been able to achieve this level of progress," the man said as he brought his hands together, "It is part of the reason why I wish for you to witness this game's end."

    "More tests?" The woman asked with a raised eyebrow.

    "Until the perfect Sculpture is made, we cannot afford to stop. This War has become my personal testing grounds," the man continued as he cracked a feral grin, "And no doubt the results we acquire will be beneficial for you and for me."

    "What's your plan?" The woman questioned as she set down her cup.

    "We'll compare. That Doll we sent was customized by you, a mage of great renown. I've gone over through your notes and crafted several similar models," the man said as he raised his hand and had emotionless sculptures of girls with orange hair stand by his side, "I'll be sending them to the battlefield for testing."

    "Five, huh? That's in addition to the one you kept posted as Berserker's Master," the woman noted with a curious look.

    "6 to 1," the man continued with a smirk.

    The woman returned his smile with her own, "Then it's a fair fight."
    ==============

    Notes: Busy right now. I'm farming like crazy. Maybe update later.
     
  • Sidestory
    • ... Oh fuck a duck. 6 v 1 and who I presume to be Touko Aozaki?

    ... Right then, nuclear option is a go! Summon the Clan Calatin! They can't kill us if we turn the countryside into a blasted, irradiated wasteland first.
     
    Hammers_Bjorn said:
    ... Oh fuck a duck. 6 v 1 and who I presume to be Touko Aozaki?

    ... Right then, nuclear option is a go! Summon the Clan Calatin! They can't kill us if we turn the countryside into a blasted, irradiated wasteland first.
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    It sounds like Probably!Touko is backing us, we just have to worry about the other dolls. And the servants. And that mage she's talking to.

    Do you think we could recruit the other dolls by throwing them into Mebd's reality marble? Being trapped in that bounded field seems to have catalyzed Brie's development and even if that doesn't happen we get 6 new minions once Rider does what she does best. One of whom commands Berserker. Win-win! All at the low, low, cost of condemning those 6 to life as Mebd's playthings/practice dummies.
     
    Just one thing. Sealing Designations are titles given to people who are members of the Mage's Association when they create/learn something unique. People/things that are not members of the Mage's Association can't be given one. They just become targets for magus' experiments with no fancy titles.
     
    Frozen Flame said:
    Do you think we could recruit the other dolls by throwing them into Mebd's reality marble? Being trapped in that bounded field seems to have catalyzed Brie's development and even if that doesn't happen we get 6 new minions once Rider does what she does best. One of whom commands Berserker. Win-win! All at the low, low, cost of condemning those 6 to life as Mebd's playthings/practice dummies.
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    *Raises hand*

    *Lowers hand*

    I was going to say that that plan sound absolutely horrrible and will end badly for everyone and anyone involved... But then, realization-

    A harem of Bries.

    Horrible a decision as it is, screw it, let's shove Brie's clones into Medb's rape dungeon and see what comes out.
     
    King Ofheros said:
    Just one thing. Sealing Designations are titles given to people who are members of the Mage's Association when they create/learn something unique. People/things that are not members of the Mage's Association can't be given one. They just become targets for magus' experiments with no fancy titles.
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    We're technically members by inheritance, like an Einzbern Homunculus would be. The family lays claim to us and thus the laws applying to the family can be applied to us.
     
    veekie said:
    We're technically members by inheritance, like an Einzbern Homunculus would be. The family lays claim to us and thus the laws applying to the family can be applied to us.
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    Then we need to inform them we're married to the Queen of Connacht and no longer under their jurisdiction.

    And we have an Emiya.
     
    Ziodyne said:
    I think this is the correct arrangement.

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    Hm. The only one I'm a little 'meh' about is Lumidia, but the only alternative for her is Shihou, and nobody on the Ginyus' would fit that. But other than that, yeah. Small but uniquely talented Goldo-Shirou, strong but dumb Recomb-Jeanne, high-speed low-humility Berter-Lumidia, pep-talk ass-kisser Jace-Medb, and of course the Villainess Herself.
    AnonymousRabbit said:
    Jesus Christ.
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    Wait until I find someone to throw money at and make a proper fanart. But for now, we'll just have to settle for you threadmarking that.
     
    Inserted tally
    Adhoc vote count started by AnonymousRabbit on Jan 17, 2020 at 1:32 AM, finished with 45 posts and 23 votes.
    • [X] You felt conflicted. Did you have the right to torture her just to make her an easier target? Wasn't killing her and stopping her Servant's serial killer spree the right thing? What would you have done, had you been in control at the time? Who are you and who is the one that takes the reins once you enter the Emergency Mode? You are a bit of a mess, honestly.
      [X] You felt justified. Olga needed to be stopped and your other self simply did what she had to in order to eliminate Olga. Medb's wrong in thinking that you didn't need to stain your hands. You're going to end up killing someone soon enough.
      [X] You felt good. The feeling of dominating an enemy Master and defeating them was something you never imagined. You were just overwhelmed at first but now... You felt good about it. And it was worrying... You might have a positive disposition to violence, more than you could admit.
      [X] You...you don't know honestly. You had broken her, went for topics that you knew would hurt her and drag out every bit of fear, every insecurity she had, every doubt and laid it at her feet and told her she was pathetic and was worthless when she trying to save her family but she hurt a lot of people and Olga knew that yet still decided to do so. She may have made it painless when killing them but she still killed them. She killed people who had love ones, a family too. But from what you can tell she was basically raised to do whatever it to succeed even if it meant doing thing that are immoral. And what you had done to her was immoral as well. Is the immoral reasons for this a circumstance of the war or is it a product of mague society itself?
      [X] You felt sick. There was no reason for it to go as far as it did. If you only cared about winning you would've killed Olga when you could. If you wanted to spare her you would've let her go when Rider was a hostage. In the end, it was pointless torture. Now, you're down a seal and Olga's running around and probably traumatized enough to ignore any logic or self preservation she had left.
      -[X] More than that though is the words you used. The tone of judgement. You threw her hopes and dreams on the ground and used her failings to grind them to dust. The killings of the civilians was immoral, but used for a strategical advantage by a Master with few options. The guards at the compound were forces of an enemy master. They all had people that cared about them.
      --[X] But so do the people Medb feeds from. How many people's lives have you thrown into disarray from enabling her actions? How many lives were ruined? Are Assassin's crimes worse just because the victims are dead? Both sets of victims had their lives ruined because of a Masters actions. And what of the quantity of victims? Even including unreported murders by Assassin, her victims only number in the double digits. You have the entire police force under your thumb. What happens when the war is over and Rider leaves them? Quantity is a Quality of it's own, and Olga's own crimes aren't worse then the amount you've done yourself. More than that, Olga's actions come from a place of desperation. She has no allies, no backer, no resources. If you hadn't summoned Medb, what would you have done? How far would you go? In the end Olga may be a Magus fighting for her wish and you a homunculus fighting for Medbs, but both of you are selfish people fighting for a prize.
      [X] You felt terrified. You were terrified of what you're capable of and what you can do. Just remembering Rider's face back then and how hesitant she was to be with you was frightening.
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    Walking Through Snow
  • Threadmarks
    • [] You felt conflicted. Did you have the right to torture her just to make her an easier target? Wasn't killing her and stopping her Servant's serial killer spree the right thing? What would you have done, had you been in control at the time? Who are you and who is the one that takes the reins once you enter the Emergency Mode? You are a bit of a mess, honestly.

    How did you feel about it really? Well that was a complicated thought now, wasn't it? At first it was a storm of emotions you weren't ready to deal with. You didn't know how to handle what you did but it all boiled down to one thing if you could be perfectly honest. You were conflicted. Your feelings were mixed. There was no other way for you to describe it but it was a strange feeling that you couldn't make heads or tails of no matter how much you thought about it.

    You felt conflicted. Did you have the right to torture her just to make her an easier target? Wasn't killing her and stopping her Servant's serial killer spree the right thing? What would you have done, had you been in control at the time? Who are you and who is the one that takes the reins once you enter the Emergency Mode? You are a bit of a mess, honestly.

    "I feel strange. I feel conflicted," you admitted as you brought your hands together, "Was I right in what I did? To make her suffer to the extent and break her spirit as hard as I did? Killing her and stopping her killing spree was supposed to be the right thing, wasn't it? Yet why do I still feel this way about it? If it was me and not that emotionless simulacrum of me, would I have done the same?"

    You raised your head to look towards Ruler with a confused and lost expression. You didn't know who to turn or confide to. You were just... You felt like you were going to fall apart, really. Medb was the only one keeping you afloat, being distracted and keeping yourself on the move, it was maintaining your sanity.

    It was all a blurred mess in your mind. Equal parts of self loathing and justification filled your chest.

    "I see," Ruler murmured as she stepped away from Kotomine's desk, "You've been through a busy night, haven't you?"

    "I'm a mess," you told her with a grim look.

    "It's never right to hurt others," Ruler said as she placed a gentle hand on your head, "But this is war. It can't be helped that you'll have to hurt someone. However that doesn't make it fine. It doesn't make it all right. These feelings you have, you're being confused by them, right?"

    You nodded and let out a shaky breath, "Yeah. I'm..."

    "You don't truly believe what's right matters. You're simply afraid of yourself, of what you're capable of and you wonder if you'll ever be forgiven for what you've done... And possibly what you're capable of doing," Ruler said before she knelt before you and met your gaze, "Brie, it was out of your hands yes, but don't be afraid of it... Of yourself. Because I know, you can be better. To improve upon themselves despite their flaws and nature, that's a mark of humanity."

    "But I'm not human!" You told her in a hard tone, "I... I'm something else! I'm a glitch, an anomaly, this... This me that you're talking to isn't truly who I am! So how can I be human? What you're asking is impossible! I'm a machine!"

    "It's because you feel how you do now, made me see that you have your own humanity in you. You feel remorse, guilt, and fear... These things aren't felt by a machine," Ruler continued with a reassuring squeeze of your hand, "You're not what you think you are. Just doubting your actions this much speaks volumes of you as a person. A machine or automata couldn't possibly cry like you do, unfeeling constructs couldn't possibly feel guilt like you do..."

    "But a part of me does. I..." You lowered your gaze and said, "I..."

    "Whatever you feel about what you've done is up to you. It's how you grow from that experience that people will try and see," Ruler said with a determined look, "I don't think it was the right thing. But that's just me. What about you, Brie? How will you grow from that experience?"

    "What do you want me to say? I needed to stop her. But I didn't want to do it like that," you admitted as you met her gaze, "I could have done better but... How?"

    "I don't know," Ruler admitted as she placed a hand on your shoulder, "But that's something you need to find out for yourself."

    "Way to dodge the question," you scoffed as you crossed your arms.

    Ruler chuckled as she stood up, "Well, I'm not exactly the best speaker. But I wanted to help if only a little bit."

    You blinked before sighing, "If only there's a physical representation of my other side, I can beat her up for landing me in this mess... I wasn't right in doing what I did. I could have done better, I should have."

    "Don't ever say you're not human," Ruler said as she had her hands behind her back, "You'd be surprised to find humanity in the most unexpected places. Even here in a bloody Grail War fought for the wishes of Selfish people, you'll find some. You are you, and only you could do something about yourself."

    You stared at her and frowned, "Strange for the Maiden of Orleans to go this far. Do you have experience talking to blank, Inhuman people like this?"

    Ruler seemed surprised before she giggled, "Perhaps. Once upon a time."

    "Thanks, Jeanne," you murmured as you leaned on your seat.

    Jeanne nodded and said, "She may be a bad influence but Rider cares about you enough to support you through all your challenges. Cherish her."

    "I would even if you didn't tell me," you grumbled as you crossed your arms.

    ......
    .....
    ....

    You were walking down the street alongside Rider. The two of you had left the church behind you both as Rider was rubbing her head.

    "That stupid Saint, if I have my chance I'd prop her up and burn her to a crisp!" Rider hissed as she rubbed her forehead, "What if she ruined my face?! Who'd be out here to hit on me?!"

    "Even if she rearranged your face, I'd still keep you around," you told her as your breath smoked.

    "But the hot guys won't fawn over me anymore then! What good is my smoking hot body if my face is paste?!" Rider groaned as she complained for complaining's sake.

    God this girl's just annoying.

    You walked by her side as she huffed and pouted.

    Walking Through Snow
    ​
    [] "Even if the world thought you're ugly, I'd still love you. Man, do I have a shitty taste."
    [] "Then that just means I get to have you all to myself. Isn't that nice, My Queen?"
    [] "It's fine. I'm pretty enough for the both of us anyway. Don't you say so?"
    [] Write in...
     
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