Arthur Hansen
Author of no Authority.
- Location
- Utah, behind the Zion Curtain.
Eh, I grabbed that center part off of Google images, edited it Google docs and photo and posted it.
You'd probably win that bet!
Falling Iron (IM MCU/WORM)
- Thread starter Arthur Hansen
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Did you mean to show the police is wholly corrupt and that Armsmaster doesn't care (or is at least resigned to that) and isn't trying to fight the corruption or even noting when a cop admits to doing something illegal? If not I suggest you drop the bit of the assistant principal given the police instructions on what cases to close. A legitimate reason to close the case would be if they concluded it was a gang initiation or something of the sort, or simply having the investigating officer told not to spend any time on it by his superior.
No, just corrupt.
While not actually doing anything about a case because they have other cases taking priority would be legitimate(as bad as the locker was investigating drug dealers and murders should take priority) closing a case because a random civilian, or worse a civilian connected to the case who might be worried about what the investigation shows can only be explained by corruption. I'd say telling Armsmaster that was stupidity but given his (lack of) reaction he's obviously aware of the corruption and not about to try and fight it.
Arthur Hansen
Author of no Authority.
- Location
- Utah, behind the Zion Curtain.
He closed the case after he heard of a lawsuit and that a settlement was being worked on. So a large dose of apathy, a small bit of corruption and a dash of realpolitik. He's got first degree murders to be working on.
You missed a slight bit of context.
And Armsmaster is too busy holding himself back from kicking these guy's asses so hard that they will start to do their job. He knows that local police department hate the PRT and Protectorate, because they took most of the funding for law enforcement in this day and age.
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If it was a gang initiation, that's even more reason to investigate fully. Gangbanger shoves a girl into a biohazard and traps them in there for hours as part of their initiation is something to be discouraged. As to Armsmaster's reaction or lack thereof to Detective Lazybones's offhand admissions of misconduct, I got the impression that he was angry inside, but knew that going off on him would just make it harder to get the information he needs to determine what the issue is between Chrysalis and Shadow Stalker. When Detective Lazybones expresses reluctance to reopen the case, Armsmaster asks for where to find his supervisor, then marches over to said supervisor's office and when the supervisor expresses reluctance, Armsmaster threatens to drop official paperwork on him that will likely kill the guy's career. That's as much of the heavy end of the hammer that Armsmaster can drop on these guys before he starts burning bridges that the PRT would prefer not be burned.
Tisaku
Head Chief Thinkomancer
For some reason Armsmaster kinda strikes me as the kind of guy that wouldn't even bother with threats, just nod and sink the guy. Even though that would do horrible, horrible things to the investigation.
...Although that could also be the sleep deprivation talking. Insomnia sucks.
Castle_Bravo
The user formerly known as Nuke_Equestria
using parkour to move out...
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That's not how it works. Not working on the case because he has more important things to do is fine, officially closing the case would normally require either finding a suspect or the statue of limitations running out.
That's even more reason to point out that what he just admitted to doing is illegal - something like "If you reopen the case and actually put your full effort into it I won't mention what you just admitted to anybody". Alternately leave them and report that the school was apparently involved with the police in a criminal conspiracy to coverup events surrounding the locker incident - which would get a lot higher priority for investigation than "student got shoved in a locker full of biological waste"
If you were planning to have Armsmaster addressing this in some future chapter, or if this is an indication of how helpless the Protectorate/PRT is and we'll be seeing more of this tone in the story forget I said anything, but if that's not what you intended you should fix the scene.
Point. I was thinking more "close as a separate investigation and pass everything to X who's handling the gang initiations investigation".
As I said if this was intended to show Armsmaster being resigned to the corruption to the point he's not even bothering to mention a cop admitting to a criminal conspiracy and accessory after the fact to whatever crimes the locker incident and events surounding it end up being, that's fine. That's a bit darker than Worm is or than this story appeared to be so far but it works, as long as that's what the author intended.
I don't think that's what he meant the scene to convey.
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- In the depts of despair.
Armmaster is more of a political creature than most give him credit, he was after all willing to steal the laurels from Skitter her first night out in order to get the rep of taking down Lung and he was sidelining Dauntless with his patrol schedule to limit his popularity. On this occasion he might be willing to wait until the police does something stupid that can be traced to the guilty parties before dropping the hammer, after all is quie difficult to prove malice over stupity or lazyness and he is far more interested in getting the people at Winslow that disrupting the already stressed BBPD and gaining a new enemy or two.
Plus if he does discover something more than an idiot closing an investigation with an inane escuse on the paperwork such as 'the victim trapped herself on a badly cleaned locker' he can use the threat of actual legal action to trade for favors later.
mojtaba
nothing new going on here.
guys stop focusing on armsmaster and the police......did you not witness the start of the new Science Bros? 
Think about it, Tony Stark working together with a guy who can build anything from videogames or whatever. I mean, I can't even think of the awesomeness that's going to spring forth from their minds because if I did my mind would explode.
Think about it, Tony Stark working together with a guy who can build anything from videogames or whatever. I mean, I can't even think of the awesomeness that's going to spring forth from their minds because if I did my mind would explode.
Please don't confuse insufficient knowledge of the actual procedure from the author for corruption in the people shown...
bobnik
Memetic Warfare Specialist.
Yes but that's the question. It seems many readers are taking mixed messages from the scene, and we'd like to know which one the author intended.
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I'm not, I'm pointing to the author the lack of knowledge and suggesting ways to correct the scene.
Arthur Hansen
Author of no Authority.
- Location
- Utah, behind the Zion Curtain.
There is corruption (and apathy) here, but it really boiled down to the detective finding out that the victim is getting dealt with out of court. The medical bills are being handled, the Hebert's can't sue the only 'official' people involved and all that's left is finding out the person that pulled the nasty prank. He would probably not care if he did catch them, but he's already seen that the school and students are blocking him out.
And as far as he can tell, it was just a nasty prank.
He's being too busy forcing them to actually get the information he needs. Unfortunately, Armsmaster can't really directly handle the situation, because that would possibly out one or the other of his newest Wards.
That really boils down to the fact that it is not Armsmaster's job to fix the local Police Department. He needs the investigation reopened for his own reasons, so he's using his own powers as leader of the local Protectorate to kick them into motion. He might send a report though the PRT to internal investigations, but in the greater scheme of the hell hole known as Brockton Bay, the investigation dropping through the cracks is (on a bureaucratic scale) pretty small in scope.
From the police's point of view, it was a pretty bad prank, but the 'system' seemed to deal with victim in getting her treatment. They have no idea that there has been systematic abuse being 'condoned' by the school. Heck, the officer would probably feel bad if he did discover it, but he's basically done his half of the job.
We have a much greater insight into what really happened and have a very sympathetic understanding as the readers, but most everyone else involved only has a small pieces of the puzzle. The ones that really dropped the ball is the school system, but even they really only see Taylor's problem through limited information and lies. She's the student that's failing and skipping school, just like all those want to be gangsters.
Tack on that her father isn't 'handling' the situation...
It's a Rube Goldberg's sort of situation.
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No he didn't. He didn't even interview ONE person. He just let the file sit on his desk, taking a nap or doing other stuff while waiting for someone else to do the work for him. The argument that he did his job MIGHT have held water(about as well as a sieve) if he had so much as interviewed ONE person. But he didn't. He never so much as laid eyes on the victim, nevermind gotten her statement, he never bothered to try to determine who might have witnessed the attack, I don't think he even read the hospital report on Taylor's injuries. I'd say he phoned in the investigation, but that would have required him to actually dial. I really hope that, at some point in this fic, we see that lazy bum of a detective getting his walking papers.
Arthur Hansen
Author of no Authority.
- Location
- Utah, behind the Zion Curtain.
I'm pretty sure that I wrote that he did go and talk to people, but everyone claimed that they did not witness it. Ie. no witnesses (and a wall of silence) and he's down to the word of the victim versus whomever she will say did it to her.
He did a bare minimum and when he would have talked to Taylor as a witness of the event, the situation was 'handled' by the school with an out of court settlement to the Heberts.
He didn't do enough, I'll admit that. But to say he didn't do anything is a bit of a misread and I might need to make that a little more clear.
Except half of that "victim vs. whoever" equation is missing as he never got around to talking to Taylor. The wall of silence itself should have been suspicious as the attack occurred when the hall should have been full of students. And the school stonewalling is itself a sign that something's rotten in Denmark, they papered over the incident as fast as they could, suggesting that perhaps a faculty member might have been the guilty party? The possibilities are numerous as he never even started the investigation. He walked into the school. Said "anybody see what happened to the Hebert girl?" either nobody answered or those who did answer said "no" and he walked out and marked case as having gone cold without ever talking to the victim.
So, in canon, Taylor was working on her Black Widow spider silk costume from shortly after realizing she had bug powers. I don't really see working for Tony as a big enough change that she'd not get around to doing that, and it's been a long time so I'd need to go back and re-read the fic to determine what all happened with that.
Anyways. Point being, even if she's getting a tinkertech armour suit, she should still make a spider silk undersuit. Just because the suit works better as armour and costume, doesn't mean you should ignore the chance to make an extra layer of defence. For that matter, Taylor should make costumes or undersuits (determined by cloth or armour costumes) for all the wards and protectorate. But particularly herself and Tony.
She should also make a whole bunch of spider silk cloth and take it to Parain to start a business partnership, but that didn't happen in canon or most fics. Which kind of makes me sad.
Anyways. Point being, even if she's getting a tinkertech armour suit, she should still make a spider silk undersuit. Just because the suit works better as armour and costume, doesn't mean you should ignore the chance to make an extra layer of defence. For that matter, Taylor should make costumes or undersuits (determined by cloth or armour costumes) for all the wards and protectorate. But particularly herself and Tony.
She should also make a whole bunch of spider silk cloth and take it to Parain to start a business partnership, but that didn't happen in canon or most fics. Which kind of makes me sad.
Czlyydwr Llrngwl
"Sell ya a door Learn gull," Czly/Celly for short
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She should get working on a silk undersuit for Tony at least, now that she's seen how involved the armor-up process is, and after already having been attacked in his lab once and needing to buy time for him to get the thing on. And always wear hers under her clothes, too.
Well, preferably two or three each so they don't have to use the same one every day, but you get my point. Other members of the Wards or Protectorate can come after she forms some positive relationships with them, instead of being "those jerks who make me work with the one person I hate above all others."
Well, preferably two or three each so they don't have to use the same one every day, but you get my point. Other members of the Wards or Protectorate can come after she forms some positive relationships with them, instead of being "those jerks who make me work with the one person I hate above all others."
Arthur Hansen
Author of no Authority.
- Location
- Utah, behind the Zion Curtain.
That's a pretty good point, but Taylor is over a month away from making her own first suit of spider-silk. When she wasn't distracted by Tony and joining the Wards. So making plans for her to have multiple silk suits that quickly is jumping the gun. A lot.
Czlyydwr Llrngwl
"Sell ya a door Learn gull," Czly/Celly for short
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Ah, I keep forgetting that this is still pre-canon start time. Even with an "unusually warm" climate, it's probably still too cold for large numbers of widows to be active, unless she could talk Tony into giving her a workroom of her own to keep terraria in to breed her own. Even then, it's a PRT-owned building, and "breeding thousands of deadly spiders" seems to me to be the kind of thing they would give a pretty hairy eyeball for an unproven rookie.
Especially since the jury is currently out as to what's going on between her and Shadow Stalker, though hopefully Halbeard managed to light a big enough fire under Detective Lazybones to get him to do the investigation he should have done when the Locker happened
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That would work, it is not however what you wrote. You wrote:
So the crooked cop in question is either unaware, or lying about the extent of the injuries suffered and was ordered to coverup the case by a civilian who might have some very good reasons for the coverup.
If you changed it to what you wrote above, possibly with the added point that he was told the victim was refusing to name her attackers, much less press charges the conversation would then fit the tone you seem to be aiming at.
There's no relationship between the Hebert's civil settlement against the school and the police criminal investigation into the direct perpetrators.
That makes sense, but I never suggested Armsmaster handle things himself. Reporting the idiot to Internal affairs, or the police commissioner, or District Attorney, etc... would simultaneously get a much more massive and through investigation than any he could compel out of the lazy idiot and provide much better cover for the Wards since the official reason for Armsmaster's involvement would be him discovering police corruption and reporting it.
No, but it is his duty to report that corruption when he sees it to the people whose job it is. What you have Armsmaster doing is like having an FBI agent knowingly working with a criminal on their own authority and not reporting the fact that the guy is a criminal simply because none of his crimes crossed state lines and thus aren't under FBI juristiction. A case could be made that cops who do not report other cops for being corrupt are accessories after the fact. If you want Armsmaster to observe some code of silence that's fine, but if the protectorate follows that sort of rule I'd expect Jarvis to discover it and report that to Tony.Agreed. However a High school assistant principal being able to order an investigation officially closed is a VERY big deal.
You're missing the point. If you had the cops not do any work investigating that would be fine. If you had them drop the case because Taylor refused to name names that would be fine. If you had them drop the case simply because they felt like it that would be...not fine, but minor corruption and quite believable.
Instead you had them ordered to drop the case by the school, and that is very much NOT fine and indicates a major corruption issue.
As for "he's basically done his half of the job." No, he hasn't. He has failed to do any of his actual work as investigating officer (collecting initial statements of potential witnesses is not part of that job, although may be done by him depending on local regulations and various other details).
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True but remember that once she knew how to make a suit and had space to keep her spiders in she didn't need to keep hidden from her father she was able to make several suits in a week or so. Given that her father knows about her powers if she'd gotten to the point she can actually start making her suit I don't think she'd have a problem making multiple suits in a couple of weeks. On the other hand I think it would be perfectly plausabile to say she was still in the design stage and hadn't quite figured out how to make a spidersilk suit when she met Tony and got distracted from that project.
Given that Armsmaster's job is largely to deal with the Parahuman leader's of the cities gangs, wouldn't it be in his best interest to have competent and non-corrupt police to deal with the regular members where they can? Just letting it go seems bizarre
I'd also be worried about the principal of the school so many gang members come from being able to get police to drop investigations there. How much gang-related crime has been swept under the rug that way?
I'd also be worried about the principal of the school so many gang members come from being able to get police to drop investigations there. How much gang-related crime has been swept under the rug that way?
Arthur Hansen
Author of no Authority.
- Location
- Utah, behind the Zion Curtain.
What extent of injuries? Taylor never mentioned any physical wounds. She was traumatized by the experience and had an emotional breakdown, which the school/city is paying for along with her stay at the hospital.
There is, actually. With the settlement, the Heberts have limited their ability to go after the schools for their liability in the situation. The only person that it seems that the detective could go after is some kids that all in all probably will get off with a slapped wrist, being juveniles. Yes, he could spend dozens, if not hundreds, of man hours and probably figure out eventually which kids shoved her in a locker. And force it to go to court and waste a lot more time in the system.
It would probably make more sense to say 'ignoring' the case rather than the legal term closing the case. He's doing more of the first rather than the second. He could pull up the file rather rapidly, after all.
So I'm supposed to show Armsmaster immediately dropping everything to force an internal investigation? That is a very small footnote in his schedule when he can write a report. And one of the first things about doing a good internal investigation is not warning them of the investigation.
Agreed. However a High school assistant principal being able to order an investigation officially closed is a VERY big deal.
You are equating it as "officially told to close it" rather than "Hey, Lance? You know that situation about Taylor Hebert? Yeah, well it looks like the school's going to pay for all of her damaged stuff and her hospital stay if they agree to not sue us or try to press charges. So you probably don't need to do a lot more. Damn kids and their stupid ass pranks."
You are also ignoring that I've painted a grim picture where a girl getting shoved in that locker is so low on their priority that it would have effectively been dropped even without someone mentioning that Heberts did an out of court settlement.