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Alchemical Solutions [Worm/Exalted] Thread 6: Fatal Fires Flagrantly Fry Frantic Friends, Family

Sinsystems said:
True, I actually have the image of us preforming surgery on Bonesaw while we fight her removing all her implants before knocking her out to be converted to our cause
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......holy crap. That could work.
 
sainen said:
as far as I can tell in canon Worm only Sting was unblockable by something, as glory girl's force field could tank Scion's continent buster(though if he used it as a constant stream it would probably kill her).
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I can think of a couple of capes that can't be blocked or would be very hard to, for example the Siberian, someone using a Nanoknife (unless we get an artifact weapon), clockblocker, Scrub or Scion's Omnidirectional Energy Wave.
Then there's a couple I'm not sure about, but we'd probably need a charm for them. If an attack is too big for our weapon to cover, for example a very big energy beam like the one Behemoth made with the reactor, or so strong you can't block it with strength 1 and a destructible weapon, like some Brute throwing a car at us, we'd be in trouble.
 
Sinsystems said:
Which is why I want to upgrade our Medicine.
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So now I have another point to add to my long list of reasons why we need to train medicine. Do mental illnesses or trauma count, or would we need to train in something else?
 
.IronSun. said:
So now I have another point to add to my long list of reasons why we need to train medicine. Do mental illnesses or trauma count, or would we need to train in something else?
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I'd suggest that once the Behemoth fight is over and while we're healing we assist with the relief effort using that time to work on our Medicine through administering first aid and similar treatments. Will be good for PR as well
 
It'll also help us work off some of our Clarity.
 
We want to save some members of the S9? There is a simple series of charms which will allow it to happen: say hello to Personality Override Spike and its friend Identity Recalibration Signal!
 
Giygas said:
We want to save some members of the S9? There is a simple series of charms which will allow it to happen: say hello to Personality Override Spike and its friend Identity Recalibration Signal!
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Umm, no. We're talking about unscrewing their brains, not hijacking them and rewriting their entire personality.
 
.IronSun. said:
It'll also help us work off some of our Clarity.
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Yup and if we do any work at the hospital. Assuming Panacea survives and get's back to at least a semblance of working order we can work on helping her.....

Oh shit I just realized that if we don't help Panacea and S9 try to recruit her there is a high chance she might accept
 
.IronSun. said:
Umm, no. We're talking about unscrewing their brains, not hijacking them and rewriting their entire personality.
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How is unscrewing them different from rewriting their entire current personality? :p
By creating and installing an appropriate submodule, we could even use POS and IRS to modify parahumans power!
 
there's also the fact that screwing with their personality isn't permanent. Plus we have to shove a foot long stiletto into their brain MULTIPLE TIMES in a single bout of combat to get enough successes to do what you want and if something happens and we get pulled loose prematurely the microfilaments we're pumping into them will lacerate their insides as they get pulled out of the wound.

We're supposed to bet the GOOD GUY and this kind of crap is straight up Coil's alley. If you want to go full blown psychopath go play a murderhobo quest.
 
landcollector said:
How about No. Wait a second, how about...NO.
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I don't have any moral problems with non-temporary brainwashing of hostiles into friendlies - especially people like S9 who would normally be executed - but another Worm story already had this exact derail for at least 10 pages and I don't want to see it again here.
 
Giygas said:
How is unscrewing them different from rewriting their entire current personality? :p
By creating and installing an appropriate submodule, we could even use POS and IRS to modify parahumans power!
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We're talking about making them better, what you're talking about would just be making them worse, and when the effects wear off later our actions would come around and bit us in the ass.
 
We are going to capture them and administer the supernatural theory they need. Of course i'm pretty sure we'll have to pull off something big to convince the PRT to not kill them on the spot
 
Sinsystems said:
We are going to capture them and administer the supernatural theory they need. Of course i'm pretty sure we'll have to pull off something big to convince the PRT to not kill them on the spot
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THIS. Therapy is about having the subject fix an underlying problem in their psyche and/or coping with a traumatic event, NOT screwing with their mind to force your own ideals on them.
 
.IronSun. said:
THIS. Therapy is about having the subject fix an underlying problem in their psyche and/or coping with a traumatic event, NOT screwing with their mind to force your own ideals on them.
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Thank you, fixing Bonesaw should be easier if we can kill Jack for obvious reasons. The only character I see us having to use anything invasive on would be Burnscar and that would mostly to eliminate the whole 'Using my power makes be go crazy' thing
 
there's also the fact that we'd need 4 charm slots for the load out you want Giygas, along with the fact that this ability would freak out and revolt most of our allies.
 
.IronSun. said:
We're talking about making them better, what you're talking about would just be making them worse, and when the effects wear off later our actions would come around and bit us in the ass.
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Nooooppppee????
If the "Victim" doesn't have enlightened essence, then the changes are completely permanent. And it isn't like POS and friends cannot be used for good:
Intimacies: One Intimacy of the Alchemical's choice may be added, up to his normal limit. Alternatively one Intimacy of the target's choice is removed as an Illusion effect, and the Alchemical learns what Intimacy was erased.

Memory: The victim can be made to forget a specific contiguous period of memory covering as much as five years or all memories associated with an Intimacy the Charm has excised. The Exalt does not learn the details of the memories she deletes. This is an Illusion effect.
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With these two functions we can cancel any intimacy related to jack(Which we need to imprisons/kill/convert first) and, if we want, the connected memories. And jack and connected memories is what is gluing the S9: cancelling them would cause them to stop being a cohesive threat. And we need to alterate Burnscar memories to stop her going mad when seeing fire.
Virtues: Any of the victim's Virtues may be increased or decreased by one dot. This cannot shift them above 5 or below 1.
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With this we can instead rise/lower their virtues: raising compassion to high levels should cause many of them to become substantially better peoples.
 
You're missing the point. While you COULD make a case for canceling her intimacy towards Jack, forcibly rewriting a person's likes and dislikes and FORCING them to be loyal to you is morally wrong. We're supposed to be playing as Taylor while keeping her motivations, morals and thought processes in mind. This is NOT something Taylor would do without extreme cause and a metric ton of clarity. Even then, while Clarity strips away our empathy and makes more coldly logical, logic is a means, not and end to itself. A high Clarity Alchemical is even LESS likely to be needlessly cruel or harsh, since they are far more likely to think out all likely repercussions of their actions and behave accordingly, and use the bare minimum required fore when necessary.

Clarity is NOT the same as Limit, and an Alchemical's ultimate goal is to progress unity and efficiency. The only time this is NOT the case is when you are dealing with a void tainted Dissonant Alchemical, and then you're dealing with a full on sadistic murderhobo.
 
.IronSun. said:
You're missing the point. While you COULD make a case for canceling her intimacy towards Jack, forcibly rewriting a person's likes and dislikes and FORCING them to be loyal to you is morally wrong.
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More wrong than a series of summary executions? I don't think so.

A significant fraction of the Nine have in themselves the capacity to become productive members of society. In their current states, they all ignore or reject this capacity - or, in the worst cases, fail to understand it at all. If we have the ability to rehabilitate them, then we should at least make the attempt.
 
I have no problems rehabilitating them. I think the problem here is that we both look at the word 'rehabilitate' and see two different things. I'm talking about helping them cope with their issues and become better people, whereas others talk about rewriting a person's default settings to suit their needs.

I also don't have any problems for handing out a death sentence for people like Jack Slash. For every Harvey Dent who can be rehabilitated there's a Joker who just needs to be put down as a mad dog.
 
.IronSun. said:
I have no problems rehabilitating them. I think the problem here is that we both look at the word 'rehabilitate' and see two different things. I'm talking about helping them cope with their issues and become better people, whereas others talk about rewriting a person's default settings to suit their needs.
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Mundane rehab would be great if it worked, but with the Nine I just don't see that happening. Mundane change has to come from within - they're so far gone that they won't consent to it. If we had a high-level Stranger-type power (Rose Knight) then we could diplomance the shit out of them, but with our current powerset we have to use more invasive methods.

I don't have a problem with this but obviously a lot of SBers do.
 
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