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Age of Ice and Blood: A Pathfinder System Heroic Fantasy Quest

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[X] Seriously consider the offer, contingent on Zaia and Antonio agreeing to it also

I do not have strong objections against Goldfish plan either.

I've choosen the life goal as "Discovery" (and the winning vote was "Exploration:, which is close). I want to explore this world. I want to visit Tender's tribe, sea shores of Italy, Greece, Crimea, Caucasus, Palestine, Egipt. I want to travel far south, to the great empire of West Africa. As for more wild dream – discovery of North America, travel around Africa (Phoenicians did it, we are not worse!). And for the most wild, chimerical dreams... India. China. Australia. Circumnavigation.

I want to see as much worldbuilding of DragonParadox as possible.

Nevill said:
Can we get a map of the known world, or at least a rough approximation of one? I keep forgetting who's where..
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But it is just a map of a real world.
 
DragonParadox said:
The center of this world is actually further south. Agriculture spread from West Africa and not the Middle East which means that is where you would find the major empires with city states and small kingdoms radiating outwards. There are cities all along the coast of Africa at least as far as the southern band of deserts and maybe beyond, that is just the limit of the maps you have here.
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At least we can quickly reach northern Africa though, which is better than having to sail from Korman to western Africa, I think.
 
Artemis1992 said:
At least we can quickly reach northern Africa though, which is better than having to sail from Korman to western Africa, I think.
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We can quickly reach from Korman to the Africa cost, too. But it is Sahara cost, and in current age, I suspect, Sahara is a desert. There were a period of green Sahara in the past, but it was in the interglacial, and in the quest we have glacial age. It would definatly more convinient to reach West Africa from Korman than from Orinilu.

Not that I am not interesting to visit North Africa:
DragonParadox said:
Paths Open and Shut: With the blood of many battles staining the waters of the Blue Sea the pirates of the pirates of the Atun [Population of what would be Morocco] come to feast, under shark-skin banners, trade with the east is not as safe as it once was, though the Anwa keep the western path open and the Mouth of the World, allowing northern tin to keep flowing out the Mouth of the World and on to the great lands of the south. There is some wild talk of summoning aid from the south, tough few are the folk at the court of the Court of the Priest Kings who would think well of a city which rebelled against the servants of Elnu
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But West Africa seems more promising.
 
Beyond the other issues I've outlined for why I don't want to settle on Korman any time soon, another one is simple resource expenditure. To setup properly here would cost a huge amount of money. We've already made that investment in Orinilu, and quite recently at that. Sinking our liquid assets into another piece of real estate so soon is just poor planning. And Aina, despite being the new leader of Korman, cannot afford to just handwave all of that for us, even if she can give us a plot of land for free.

We have funds now that we should look toward investing in other stuff, like upgrades for Marcella, magical items, improved equipment, etc., not spending all of it on another building project when the paint has barely dried on our keep at Wayfarer's Respite.
 
This is why the other option isn't framed as acceptance, but as a consideration. I am sure Antonio will make an argument if he doesn't see it working.

I also wonder if perhaps we could "borrow" the land from one of the less loyal lords who sided with Obari/demons, but that's somethinhg for Aina to ponder. She is the one most interested in making it work, she may have something up her sleeve.
 
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I can't quite make a decision. Being a noble is not the same thing as having land. It is more legitimate and gives us genuine authority. Tjat can be leveraged into resources, more than we could have elsewhere.

It would tie us down, though, and into the Anwari culture, which I don't like. It gives us a chance to change it, though.
 
Tomcost said:
I can't quite make a decision. Being a noble is not the same thing as having land. It is more legitimate and gives us genuine authority. Tjat can be leveraged into resources, more than we could have elsewhere.

It would tie us down, though, and into the Anwari culture, which I don't like. It gives us a chance to change it, though.
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Being a noble among the Anwari is fairly limited, prestige and resource-wise. I really don't see it being something that would ever get us much in the way of wealth or resources unless we decided to take up the traditional Anwari practice of being a raider/pirate.
 
Goldfish said:
Beyond the other issues I've outlined for why I don't want to settle on Korman any time soon, another one is simple resource expenditure. To setup properly here would cost a huge amount of money. We've already made that investment in Orinilu, and quite recently at that. Sinking our liquid assets into another piece of real estate so soon is just poor planning. And Aina, despite being the new leader of Korman, cannot afford to just handwave all of that for us, even if she can give us a plot of land for free.

We have funds now that we should look toward investing in other stuff, like upgrades for Marcella, magical items, improved equipment, etc., not spending all of it on another building project when the paint has barely dried on our keep at Wayfarer's Respite.
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We *did* just get 8000 gp or so from melting down a priceless relic for silver. Funds for establishing a new home base shouldn't be an especially pressing concern with that in mind.
 
Raichu1972 said:
We *did* just get 8000 gp or so from melting down a priceless relic for silver. Funds for establishing a new home base shouldn't be an especially pressing concern with that in mind.
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it's just a cost of 2-3 seasons operating of Marcella. Closer to 2, if take into account 16% salary of soldiers and salary of Inge.

From this point of view, price of melting priceless relic is not extremely high...
 
Raichu1972 said:
We *did* just get 8000 gp or so from melting down a priceless relic for silver. Funds for establishing a new home base shouldn't be an especially pressing concern with that in mind.
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We spent way, way more than that on Wayfarer's Respite. Over 20,000 gold, IIRC.

We shouldn't immediately be looking for more real estate to invest in right now. We need to start looking for magic items, finding upgrades for Marcella, better gear, etc. And just saving money for later in case we have sudden, unexpected expenses.
 
The question now is whether we could better leverage our position in Orinilu or Korman towards our goals. As nobility we can influnce Anwari culture, something that we couldn't do as just Roland and co. with a plot of land
 
Arhin said:
it's just a cost of 2-3 seasons operating of Marcella. Closer to 2, if take into account 16% salary of soldiers and salary of Inge.

From this point of view, price of melting priceless relic is not extremely high...
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Damn, really? That makes me feel even more disappointed by the result lol


Tomcost said:
The question now is whether we could better leverage our position in Orinilu or Korman towards our goals. As nobility we can influnce Anwari culture, something that we couldn't do as just Roland and co. with a plot of land
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This is very true; influencing the Anwari away from raiding and more towards trading would likely show an increase in profit for all, and could allow the area to become a more stable center of trade.
 
Raichu1972 said:
Damn, really? That makes me feel even more disappointed by the result lol




This is very true; influencing the Anwari away from raiding and more towards trading would likely show an increase in profit for all, and could allow the area to become a more stable center of trade.
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That's why I am more ambivalent on this. Nobility brings potential that a plot of land does bot inherently have. We can't do shit in Orinilu until we become powerful enough. We are small there, and we like the culture, but we don't really love it. Nobility brings more potential, but has way more costs to sink first.
 
Tomcost said:
The question now is whether we could better leverage our position in Orinilu or Korman towards our goals. As nobility we can influnce Anwari culture, something that we couldn't do as just Roland and co. with a plot of land
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That is the work of a lifetime. I don't want the quest to become a lifelong reform project for a bunch of not!Vikings.

Changing cultures is a generational endeavour, not something accomplished with a bit of effort over a few years. In a setting like this, with travel time and communication difficulties, it would be damned near impossible in a Human lifetime. It would inevitably lead to a war between us and whatever allies we can gather and traditional elements in Anwari society.
 
Goldfish said:
That is the work of a lifetime. I don't want the quest to become a lifelong reform project for a bunch of not!Vikings.

Changing cultures is a generational endeavour, not something accomplished with a bit of effort over a few years. In a setting like this, with travel time and communication difficulties, it would be damned near impossible in a Human lifetime. It would inevitably lead to a war between us and whatever allies we can gather and traditional elements in Anwari society.
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I am not talking about doing a 180 degree turn, but somethign along the lines of trade is good, don't raid everbody all the time, that stuff
 
Raichu1972 said:
Damn, really? That makes me feel even more disappointed by the result lol
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Really.

DragonParadox said:
Soldier Salaries [Per Payment/Loot]
1% per man at arms
2% for Tom
Total Salary Cost 16%

Ship Costs :
Sailor's Pay: 2040 gp/season
Provisions: 910 gp/season
Upkeep (Marcella): 90 gp/season
Total ship Costs: 3040 gp/season
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Our men receive 8000 * 16% = 1280, Inge perfomed, I assume, 4 or 3 major healings (encuanter with giant - Dahzagan - Pale men, battle for Noromo, night attack, final battle with ooze), 100 each healing . It's 1580 minimum. So it's left 6420 after the wages, and to the end of summer from this sum will be left 340.
 
Arhin said:
Really.


Our men receive 8000 * 16% = 1280, Inge perfomed, I assume, 4 or 3 major healings (encuanter with giant - Dahzagan - Pale men, battle for Noromo, night attack, final battle with ooze), 100 each healing . It's 1580 minimum. So it's left 6420 after the wages, and to the end of summer from this sum will be left 340.
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The 8000 is your cut, after your men took theirs.
 
More like, "don't raid these specific people we have standing agreements with". Exclusive trade routes from the Mediterranean for a small fee, mmm... :V
 
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Tomcost said:
I am not talking about doing a 180 degree turn, but somethign along the lines of trade is good, don't raid everbody all the time, that stuff
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Why choose that hill to die on? We aren't going to be able to enact even that much change without years of effort. Remember, the Anwari are mostly just loosely aligned clans who do whatever the hell they want to. We've had confirmation from DP in the past that even an Anwari king or lord's authority doesn't extend any further out to sea than can be observed from their port. It's basically a free for all beyond sight of land.

I'm just completely uninterested in getting involved with the Anwari on this level. It doesn't sound even remotely fun to continue dealing with them to that degree.
 
Goldfish said:
Why choose that hill to die on? We aren't going to be able to enact even that much change without years of effort. Remember, the Anwari are mostly just loosely aligned clans who do whatever the hell they want to. We've had confirmation from DP in the past that even an Anwari king or lord's authority doesn't extend any further out to sea than can be observed from their port. It's basically a free for all beyond sight of land.

I'm just completely uninterested in getting involved with the Anwari on this level. It doesn't sound even remotely fun to continue dealing with them to that degree.
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The fragmentation of their culture means that we can indeed affect small ports of it, likely our serfs.

On the other hand, it guarantees bad neighbours.

We will have greater control on our own people. We won't have much on anybody else. That is why I haven't made my decision yet. Greater opportunity with more work attached
 
Tomcost said:
The fragmentation of their culture means that we can indeed affect small ports of it, likely our serfs.

On the other hand, it guarantees bad neighbours.

We will have greater control on our own people. We won't have much on anybody else. That is why I haven't made my decision yet. Greater opportunity with more work attached
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My feeling on the matter is that we'll have work regardless, and that we should be delegating most of that work to people Roland trusts. A Castellan to our Lord if you will.

It would take some upfront time to establish sure, but afterwords should mostly run itself beyond some occasional politicking if we do it properly.
 
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