Why do you say that? Being able to add it to bladewinds would've been huge here.
Against what? Everything we hit once died (or surrendered) before attacking again. Our problem was entirely hitting them once.

The Mage's armor took the first hit but that was irrelevant as the follow up finished the job, the warrior died in one hit, and the archer's problem was entirely hitting them the first time.
 
I'm a bit confused by the stat effects of Evening Gown. Is the default the base, to which the two choices are added? No combination of agility and Might leads to only ++++ agi and +++ strength, so I think I'm right, that we get the default in addition to stats and a pseudo grace, and 30% attack speed in melee.

Wishful thinking?
 
Actually, @Byzantine , would you mind explaining to me why you don't think "Evening Gown" is a good choice right now? I'm listening and receptive, I'd just like to see it explained directly. If you already covered it, maybe you could scroll up and post a link? This discussion is moving REALLY fast.

For now though, I still trust your judgment.

[X] Exhausted
[X] Evening Sky - Opalescence
[X] Evening Sky - Iridescence
[X] Evening Sky
- Pearlescence
[X] Forebear's Blade - Undying Vanguard
 
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So I'm not really sure what to vote for here so I'll once again raise the offer of giving my vote to someone who can get a few people or so on board for voting for or going after Gardener's Hallow if and when it next comes up.
 
Against what? Everything we hit once died (or surrendered) before attacking again. Our problem was entirely hitting them once.

They were tanking bladewinds that would've put them down if they had more punch. As it is Bladewinds have been reduced to basically a harassing measure, dramatically reducing our tempo as we have to physically run over and hit them to put enemies down.
 
Actually, @Byzantine , would you mind explaining to me why you don't think "Evening Gown" is a good choice right now? I'm listening and receptive, I'd just like to see it explained directly. If you already covered it, maybe you could scroll up and post a link? This discussion is moving REALLY fast.
I do think it could be useful here. I'm thinking the Pearlescence scaling will prove useful quickly and we'll be able to pick up Gown for cheaper.

Also we can't get gown + Opal + Iri + Vanguard, so we can't go all in on defense with it.


They were tanking bladewinds that would've put them down if they had more punch. As it is Bladewinds have been reduced to basically a harassing measure, dramatically reducing our tempo as we have to physically run over and hit them to put enemies down.
Who tanked a bladewind?
 
This is going to be another complex one, but hm... as a preliminary vote:

[X] Exhausted
[X] The Ring of Power - Dominion - 2 Arete
[X] The Ring of Power - Preeminence - 7 Arete
[X] Evening Sky - Opalescence
- The soft light of evening before which all attacks falter.
[X] Evening Sky - Iridescence - 2 Arete

War is the most broadly applicable domain here, this gets us +All Stats and +0.5 Rank in any conflict with significant stakes and builds on Bloodmight's foundation, putting us a mere 9 Arete from Ruling Ring. Opalescence and Iridescence shore up our defenses, which as this update proves are totally inadequate versus the opposition we're facing now. A small investment here will pay dividends in the long run; we haven't upgraded the Evening Sky at all since we purchased it, and it shows in our injury percentage chances. I'd be fine with Pearlescence too, but frankly we can't spare the Arete, not if we want to stay the course and grab the EFB our build's aimed at as soon as possible.
 
This is going to be another complex one, but hm... as a preliminary vote:

[X] Exhausted
[X] The Ring of Power - Dominion - 2 Arete
[X] The Ring of Power - Preeminence - 7 Arete
[X] Evening Sky - Opalescence
- The soft light of evening before which all attacks falter.
[X] Evening Sky - Iridescence - 2 Arete

War is the most broadly applicable domain here, this gets us +All Stats and +0.5 Rank in any conflict with significant stakes and builds on Bloodmight's foundation, putting us a mere 9 Arete from Ruling Ring. Opalescence and Iridescence shore up our defenses, which as this update proves are totally inadequate versus the opposition we're facing now. A small investment here will pay dividends in the long run; we haven't upgraded the Evening Sky at all since we purchased it, and it shows in our injury percentage chances. I'd be fine with Pearlescence too, but frankly we can't spare the Arete, not if we want to stay the course and grab the EFB our build's aimed at as soon as possible.
This is a very greedy build that will get us killed at the rate things are going. We cannot afford to stay the course if you want to survive the next 5 updates.

Remember, this gave us a major complication and was the middle difficulty and our first encounter! We cannot afford to be greedy or we will die.
 
Pearlescence is a very solid pick - taking it and it's prerequisites ups our defenses to "ludicrous for our level", which is nice, but more importantly it then keeps them there, even as we continue progressing.

Grab Vanguard with it and suddenly our suicidal tactics become way less sketchy.

That said...

[X] Exhausted
[X] The Ring of Power - Dominion - 2 Arete
[X] The Ring of Power - Preeminence - 7 Arete
[X] Evening Sky - Opalescence - The soft light of evening before which all attacks falter.
[X] Evening Sky - Iridescence - 2 Arete

I said I'd vote for something along these lines, and I'm staying the course.

We don't have a Life Domain for War to conflict with, so this will give us +All Stats and +0.5 Rank in Combat, plus increase our defenses and unlock Pearlescence for a future build vote.
 
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[X] Orm Embar

That build works for me. External Rank buffs are getting really important now IMO.
 
This is a very greedy build that will get us killed at the rate things are going. We cannot afford to stay the course if you want to survive the next 5 updates.
With Exhausted we should absolutely spend the next couple updates laying low, this time we don't have the Apocryphal Curse to drop a Bearic on us, so we can chat with Letrizia and do findross experiments with Gisena that may yield a powerup for her. OOC, this'll give us time to regenerate our Arete stockpile as well.
 
Hey, halving Rank Penalties is a super important defensive upgrade that even Pearlescence can't give us. Given that even the Dreadbeast was already higher Rank than us this hugely helpful. Every action is safer if you have higher Rank and riskier if you have lower. It's called the Godstat for a reason. No mind the vast gulf in offensive potential between the builds.
Against what? Everything we hit once died (or surrendered) before attacking again. Our problem was entirely hitting them once.
Naw, our first blade-wind would have pierced that girl's armor, which is something. Never mind that it would have been helpful in every other fight we had in here, so the odds are far from against it.
EDIT: Fuck me, yet again beaten out by @BrainInAJar by literal seconds. Is this what it means to have a nemesis!?
Mwahahaha, you're a hundred years to young to defeat me yet!
But is this really a stronger build than Quickening + Thousand Cuts, given that Form of Rage is not guaranteed to proc?
But like, Form of Rage is our panic button. If we trigger it we want as much power as possible to escape the situation we are in.
 
This is a very greedy build that will get us killed at the rate things are going. We cannot afford to stay the course if you want to survive the next 5 updates.

Remember, this gave us a major complication and was the middle difficulty and our first encounter! We cannot afford to be greedy or we will die.
It's not greedy, it gets:

+0.5 Ranks (The Godstat)
+All Stats (Agi, Str, Wits, Wis, Int, Cha, etc) - Wits/Int are the most important here.
++ Protection
+ Charisma
 
This is the second time we've encountered an enemy that can be in multiple locations at once. Both the Dreadbeast and the archer.

We should assume to see more of this ability going forwards. It may be a moon-ring granted ability.
 
May I suggest a Pearlescence + Vanguard build? It should make Evening gown or true Mage builds attained through Evening Sky easier to pick up in the future due to Pearlescence's scaling effect.

My problem with this build is it spends all our Arete on defense. This will leave us low on Arete for a few updates, so picking up offensive power and general utility will take several updates, and I fear we'll need improved offenses sooner then that. Evening Gown leaves enough Arete for A Thousand Cuts, Pearlescence does not.

If we survive around three updates with Peralescence, the free XP will pay off big time. And going all-in on defense is maybe less risky then some other types of all-ins. It's still an all-in though, and I'd prefer a more versatile build.
 
This is a very greedy build that will get us killed at the rate things are going. We cannot afford to stay the course if you want to survive the next 5 updates.

It's really not greedy, despite what I said before. It gives a +0.5 Rank bonus (which is huge), +All Stats (which is also huge) and ++Protection. If the problems we face in the Inner Temple aren't purely related to combat, this is likely a better build than most and it's still very, very solid when it comes to combat. And with it being 9 Arete away from the Ruling Ring, it actually puts us within reach of likely solving all of our current problems.
 
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My problem with this build is it spends all our Arete on defense. This will leave us low on Arete for a few updates, so picking up offensive power and general utility will take several updates, and I fear we'll need improved offenses sooner then that. Evening Gown leaves enough Arete for A Thousand Cuts, Pearlescence does not.

If we survive around three updates with Peralescence, the free XP will pay off big time. And going all-in on defense is maybe less risky then some other types of all-ins. It's still an all-in though, and I'd prefer a more versatile build.
We have to either go all in on defense or offense this update or we will be dead within 5 middle level updates.


It's not actually all that greedy. It gives a +0.5 Rank bonus (which is huge), +All Stats (which is also huge) and ++Protection. If the problems we face in the Inner Temple aren't purely related to combat, this is likely a better build than most and it's still very, very solid when it comes to combat. And with it being 9 Arete away from the Ruling Ring, it actually puts us within reach of likely solving all of our current problems.
War is only useful in combat, though... Or at least only in a competitive challenge of some kind.
 
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Going full Sky actually feels pretty tempting this time. Enhance Gisena, enhance Hunger, discount a pure potential magical EFB. Don't have the arete for the full-greed option, but that might change.
 
I'd say go down War domain. +0.5 Rank & +All Stats is nothing to sneeze at. Especially since all our encounters so far have been along those lines. It's also very generalist, applying to basically anything we select, a potent hedge against poor future votes.

It is generalist, but if you are going for raw power now it's a bit weak compared to powerhouse options like Quickening or Hero-Defeating Stance.

I think Exhaustion has synergy with buffing Gisena or Letrizia via Vanguard or Gown. We could go practice our napping technique and compete with Verchlengorge for most comfy mount. Losing the time hurts but I think losing the % in for weeks or ??? hurts more.

The main risk of Exhaustion is if someone attacks you in exactly one day. It's not a very high chance, but if it happens you will be at a severe, almost unrecoverable disadvantage. The other options spread out the risk progressively more.

4th coalescence Sorceress's are really powerful. I wonder what her fourth would be.

She's undergo Sorcerous Evolution, using another system of advancement!

Sheer defensive power. Quite an powerful build, if lacking in defensive power. Very effective against mages too, would hope we run into another one...also, might be helpful towards magic, maybe?

Power is a function of how long you can survive multiplied by how much damage you do per second. Against a wide array of different potential enemies, it would be wise to balance offense and defense...

Thankfully it's not a capital B brand as in the Accursed's curses. I have a feeling this is something close though. Who stained it, the Tyrant, the Forebear, someone else? Was this inscription in the ring before it was stained? If so, that would mean that this ring was made in another world or in the future of the world that Lord Hunger first got isekaied to, then dropped into the past to fulfill a stable time loop. If my theory is right, then that means that at some point, hopefully after the end of the quest, we drop the ring into the past so it can reach our hand in the first place.

Hm...

Oh, and we get Gisena a dress. Right after she asked for one. Which will lead to a funny scene.

You can just admit this is your motivation for voting for it!

We've been using our rickety defense well so far - for example in this fight Cuts would not have helped at all. The triple defense picks + vanguard would have turned it into a rout.

Not quite:

1) It took Hunger multiple hits to kill each of the distractions. This allowed the archer time to set up the field in the first place. Killing the distractions faster = fewer spatial instances = fewer wounds
2) When Hunger was rushing the archer, he could have used a 7x speed blade wind Fell-Handed Stroke instead of burning enormous amounts of energy on going fully incorporeal. This would have been both more reliable and cheaper.

Pure defense is actually somewhat questionable against scaling enemies like this one. No matter how strong your defense, if they crap out clones constantly then you will eventually be overwhelmed. But even more important than that, is not to fight yesterday's war! You should be prepared to deal with a broad field of potential enemies.

Being under bombardment from an archer with shadow clone abilities and whose individual arrows can penetrate the Evening Sky (y'know, the thing that can resist kiloton-range explosions) suggests to me that we need to considerably upgrade our defenses. Our attacks were powerful enough in this last fight, but our defenses were inadequate.

His arrows that struck the Evening Sky bounced off, it was the ones that hit areas cloaks don't cover that landed!
 
We don't need a generalist build; we want some sort of overwhelming advantage. Either offensively or defensively. I think offensively would be better considering it's a bigger deficiency right now and it would have been hugely helpful in most fights so far.

Plus, we finally get our arm back! Isn't that nice? Something to work towards?
 
I'm still not certain that Dominion+Preeminence stacks with Chief Dominion. If it does I'm less opposed to that vote, although I still like Evening Gown and even Pearlescence+Vanguard better because those do more for our allies.
 
"You got this ability just in time!" Gisena commented, cheeks flushed with warming blood, her breath frosting before her. She rubbed her hands together, maintaining circulation. "Traversing this terrain un-boosted in a dress wouldn't have been much fun."

"Some shining apex you area," he replied. "Didn't you already possess superhuman fortitude?"

"Sure, but that doesn't mean it's enjoyable to rely on." She stuck her tongue out at him. "Hey, we can go faster if you carry me, right? Let's do that. It'll be warmer too."

"If you insist."
Gisena a cute.
"Hey." Gisena squeezed him gently. "You don't need to justify yourself to me. This makes you a bit uncomfortable, right? You're used to fighting on behalf of the people. But wherever you decide to lead, I'll be by your side. Always."
Man Gisena is reliable. Imagine how depressed Hunger would be doing this without her.
"I- I can still use Soul Evocations, it's true. But I swear! I swear not to oppose you in any form or way of action! I swear it on my soul, okay?! Just let me live!"


The ring flared again, an intermittent pattern as if glowering, and finally Hunger felt the power of triumph flowing in. Gisena walked over to them, carrying his flesh body. Bereft of cloak, ring and blade, it looked only sullen.
Interesting that we don't have to kill our enemy to get the hunger power we just have to beat them. Non Lethal S rank when?
"It's a shame you can't carry me in this state..." Gisena mused. 

Truly the worst possible outcome from the fight.
Exhausted - While two day's rest will restore him fully, he'll be very vulnerable in the interim, and unable to use the Form of Rage for the first of those days.

Lingering Paralysis - 15% penalty to physical actions in both forms, reduced to 5% in Form of Rage. Lasts two weeks.

Guilt - Perhaps he is not as resolved as he pretends. Doubles Chill of the Grave penalty to 10%. Hunger will discard corporeal form more easily. Lasts until the Temple is resolved.
Assuming we can just rest for 2 days Exhausted is probably the best penalty to take, especially considering we already invested resources in mitigating it's affects.

[X] Forebear's Blade - Undying Vanguard - 5 Arete (0 picks).
[X] Evening Sky - Opalescence
[X] Evening Sky - Iridescence - 2 Arete

[X] Evening Sky - Evening Gown - 7 Arete (2 picks)


If we can scrape together 2 more arete this build seems pretty good. Opealescence and iridescence give increased protection and cha and let evening sky actually protect from magic attacks which it currently doesn't. Vanguard gives Gisena the defensive buffs to complement the offensive buffs from the ring.

Evening Gown looks to be what we unlocked by taking the Gisena option this update and gives her another grace while providing us with a pesudo grace of our choice plus 4 stats. Given getting an extra grace increased a sorceresses level by 30 in the previous quest this would be a substantial buff especially given the prevalence of magic amongst inner residents.
 
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