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Winter is Coming: House Stark Quest

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[X] Plan Hedge Our Bets

It makes too much sense for Littlefinger to try and get the Vale declare for Renly. Maybe guard the passes just in case.
 
Marry Robb to Shireen, assuming Stannis does his job correctly she is going to be Princess of Westeros. Though having a Florent on the throne is a little weird.
 
Meneldur said:
[X] Plan Hedge Our Bets
-[X] Eddard will go North and Robb will stay south. The heir to Winterfell has proven himself an adept commander, and it has been too long since its Lord saw his lady wife.
-[X] Send as many scouts and rangers out as possible, in a wide but closely connected net, so that if one disappears or dies, the others know of it. Order them to bring you word of whatever they hear or see. Simultaneously, order for a small host to be gathered near the Long Lake.
-[X] Say nothing in regards to Stannis or Renly. We may have declared for Stannis, but we owe him nothing; he did nothing to aid Lord Eddard in his danger, as should be his duty. Vassalage is a two-way street - if Stannis wants the powers of it, let him prove he also honors its responsibilities. As For Renly, we have no quarrel with him; the Riverlands are ours, and should he want anything of them or us, let him come and ask.
-[X] Execute Ser Gregor and send his head to Prince Doran. He was sentenced to death under King Robert, with the sentence carried out by his loyal Wardens of the North, the Stark; let that be an end to it. Still, Princess Elia deserves justice, so they now have it (if we have Amory Lorch, do the same for him).
-[X] Send a message to all the Lord and Ladies of the Vale regarding the recent occurrences. Express surprise that Lysa did not come aid her siblings,but understanding that she may not have been able to do so. Proclaim Petyr Baelish to be a traitor who killed Jon Arryn and desires to rule the Vale. Indicate a willingness to betroth Sansa to Robin Arryn, and should that not work out, to Harrold Hardyng.
-[X] Along with Gregor Clegane's head, send a message to Prince Doran, indicating willingness to betroth Arya* to Quentyn or Trystane Martell.
-[X] Speak with Lord Lefford and his daughter about betrothing Alysanne to Bran. Should they (most likely) refuse, offer instead a betrothal between Edmure Tully** and Alysanne
-[X] Speak to Lady Whent and Edmure Tully about making Rickon*** heir to Lady Whent.
-[X] Send a force of men with Arya to find her direwolf. Nobody wants that beast to become feral and terrorize the Riverlands.

*I don't really care about Dorne, but it makes us look willing to talk, and let's be honest, Arya will need to be married, and Dorne is probably the place she'd be happiest.
**Brings the Golden Tooth into the Riverlands, doesn't cost us anything, and is an excellent offer - they'd be fools to refuse.
***Will also have the benefit of making Walder Frey happy.
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You forgot about Theon in your plan.

Before we start voting on plans en masse, though...we should take a bit to consider if there's anything else we want to look into.

Oh, Bella should still be at Stoney Sept. We should pick her up. Gotta collect all the Baratheon bastards, after all. :p

I don't think the stance of neutrality is going to fly, though. I don't think Ned would go for it unless we actually are dealing with an immediate threat like the Greyjoys or Wildlings. But we'd have to actually be able to point out that they're attacking.

We could try to broker peace between the brothers.

Stannis only has Shireen as heir. If she is barren, Renly is still effectively Stannis's heir. If she isn't barren...perhaps we could broker an arrangement between the Baratheons. Joining the lines. Shireen's future heir with Renly's. Or commit to an arrangement after a generation is skipped. In the meantime Renly hangs onto Storm's End. Kind of squicky, I know, but if it avoids war...

*sigh* Doesn't seem likely to me either. But I'm trying for a solution other than war with the Reach.
 
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McLuvin said:
Could you add in a betrothal between Robb and Ysilla Royce, it's ensure our eastern border and that the Vale Lords can't attack us, Harold Harding and Sansa will just be seen as an attack by Lysa and Robin and Sansa is just a poor idea that will definitely get rejected by Lysa.
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It's called 'hedge our bets', precisely because we're not committing to anything. We've offered a nice betrothal to Lysa. Obviously she can say no if she wants; we don't need the Vale currently, we just want their neutrality. The Hardyng offer is obviously not something we're sending to Lysa - it's meant as reassurance to the other Lords and Ladies of the Vale that we're willing to deal with them and respect them, not just with Lysa. And unless House Royce rules the Vale (which it currently doesn't), marrying Ysilla is pointless. Worse,it could easily be spun as us trying to give the Royces the power to take over the Vale, leading to civil war there.
 
[X] Plan Fortify
-[X] Eddard will go North and Robb will stay south. The heir to Winterfell has proven himself an adept commander, and it has been too long since its Lord saw his lady wife.
-[X] Send as many scouts and rangers out as possible, in a wide but closely connected net, so that if one disappears or dies, the others know of it. Order them to bring you word of whatever they hear or see. Simultaneously, order for a small host to be gathered near the Long Lake.
-[X] Say nothing in regards to Stannis or Renly. We may have declared for Stannis, but we owe him nothing; he did nothing to aid Lord Eddard in his danger, as should be his duty. Vassalage is a two-way street - if Stannis wants the powers of it, let him prove he also honors its responsibilities. As For Renly, we have no quarrel with him; the Riverlands are ours, and should he want anything of them or us, let him come and ask. But while you do not offer anything to either lords, use this time wisely: fortify, fortify, fortify. Attacks could be coming from all directions. With Baelish in the wind and knowing that Lysa is under his influence, there may come trouble from there. You can't trust the Westerlands to stay silent either for too long. Also, suggest advantageous marriages between Northern and Riverlander noble families to tie the two realms closer together.
-[X] See who has lost the most due to Clegane's rampage and offer that lord to take his head. Before the execution, send out an invitation to Dorne. They can attend the execution if they manage to get there on time and if they want the body afterwards to do whatever they want to do with it, that's fine with us.
-[X] Send a message to all the Lord and Ladies of the Vale regarding the recent occurrences. Express surprise that Lysa did not come aid her siblings,but understanding that she may not have been able to do so. Proclaim Petyr Baelish to be a traitor who killed Jon Arryn and desires to rule the Vale. Hint that Lysa might have been involved in Arryn's death somehow due to her close relationship with Baelish, without outright saying it.
-[X] Negotiate with all the major Northern houses for Robb's betrothal and then chose the one who you need to bind the most to you and offers you most.
-[X] Take up negotiations for Sansa's betrothal with some of the major Vale houses, preferred outcome here being either Harry Hardying or one of the Royces
-[X] It is a bit too early to make commitments for Arya's betrothal. She's young yet and too willful. But keep on the lookout for good marriage prospects advantageous to the war and who could handle Arya. You want her to be happy, after all, and for a second Lyanna Stark not to happen.
-[X] Try to betroth Bran to Lord Lefford's daughter (see below).
-[X] For Theon, speak to the Mormonts and the Manderlys about a possible betrothal to Theon, but don't push. If one of them is inclined to agree, talk to Theon and convince him that you're doing him a favor, wanting him happy, and rediscovering his heritage by giving him strong allies on the coast. Make it seem like he has a choice (he doesn't, of course). Send a letter to Pyke using Theon's progress as a warrior as pretense (talk about all the things that would impress an Ironborn), casually mention that you shattered the Lannisters and that the Westerlands are almost unprotected now, though do not make it seem like you want Balon to attack them. Perhaps if you don't tell them to attack the Westerlands, but give them the information that they're ripe for the picking, they will attack the Westerlands. Also, fortify the North against possible Ironborn attacks, while you are at it, just in case.
-[X] Betroth Bran to Lord Lefford's daughter. Sweeten the deal by having Lady Whent name Bran her heir. Make it so that when they're married, one son will inherit Harrenhal, one son will inherit the Golden Tooth. Meanwhile, Lord Lefford's daughter should be invited as a lady-in-waiting for Catelyn, so that she might meet her betrothed. Have the Blackfish act in Bran's place until Bran is of age, should direct action be necessary in Harrenhal (should Lady Whent die) or in other such cases.



Thoughts?
 
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Cteatus said:
The man who passes the sentence should take the sword.

Clegane's execution shouldn't be a sport. As much as literally everyone will enjoy it.
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Sure, but this isn't an unwillingness on Ned's or Robb's part to swing the sword. But I believe both are pragmatic enough to recognize the effect of the one most affected by Clegane's actions beheading the guy. Also, they're in the Riverlands and the South, so this one tradition might be bent a bit for the chance to tie a Riverlander house closer to the Starks.
 
spudman said:
You forgot about Theon in your plan.

Before we start voting on plans en masse, though...we should take a bit to consider if there's anything else we want to look into.

Oh, Bella should still be at Stoney Sept. We should pick her up. Gotta collect all the Baratheon bastards, after all. :p

I don't think the stance of neutrality is going to fly, though. I don't think Ned would go for it unless we actually are dealing with an immediate threat like the Greyjoys or Wildlings. But we'd have to actually be able to point out that they're attacking.

We could try to broker peace between the brothers.

Stannis only has Shireen as heir. If she is barren, Renly is still effectively Stannis's heir. If she isn't barren...perhaps we could broker an arrangement between the Baratheons. Joining the lines. Shireen's heir with Renly's. In the meantime Renly hangs onto Storm's End. Kind of squicky, I know, but if it avoids war...
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I didn't. I don't plan anything for Theon yet. I don't want to make him bitter by forcing him into a marriage, and I'd rather keep him close for now. If he wants something, has found a girl and wants our help, again, he can come to us. I'm leaving the Iron Islands alone; in canon, when Robb tried to get Balon's help, it backfired spectacularly.

I really care nothing for Robert's bastards, it's not like any of them have a good claim on the throne. I assume the only reason we brought them along is because doesn't want any more dead kids on his conscience, but they're not a bargaining chip or anything.

Brokering peace isn't something I want to do. Let them hash it out,if the winner has problems with us, we crush him too. War that's not taking place in the Riverlands or North is not our problem.
Atri said:
-[X] Try to betroth Bran to Lord Lefford's daughter
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It's a border castle. Lord Lefford would want a man who can protect his daughter and his castle. All due respect to Bran, a cripple won't do.
 
Meneldur said:
I didn't. I don't plan anything for Theon yet. I don't want to make him bitter by forcing him into a marriage, and I'd rather keep him close for now. If he wants something, has found a girl and wants our help, again, he can come to us. I'm leaving the Iron Islands alone; in canon, when Robb tried to get Balon's help, it backfired spectacularly.

I really care nothing for Robert's bastards, it's not like any of them have a good claim on the throne. I assume the only reason we brought them along is because doesn't want any more dead kids on his conscience, but they're not a bargaining chip or anything.

Brokering peace isn't something I want to do. Let them hash it out,if the winner has problems with us, we crush him too. War that's not taking place in the Riverlands or North is not our problem.

It's a border castle. Lord Lefford would want a man who can protect his daughter and his castle. All due respect to Bran, a cripple won't do.
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Then have the Blackfish at Bran's side and acting in his stead. Besides, the offer of Harrenhal should compensate for this quite nicely.
 
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  • Informational

    • Anyone I should add to this?
     
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  • Informational
    • Versharl said:
    Here's my outline of a possible plan.
    I'm really not sure about the marriages and would like input on that. Marrying Bran to Lord Lefford's daugther seems like a fair bet and hitching Theon with a Mormont girl should prove rather interesting. If we can get Lady Whent to proclaim Rickon as her heir, that'd be great but I wouldn't count on it. I'm not sure what to do in regards to Sansa and Arya but Robb should probably marry a Northern girl in order to secure the trust and loyalty of our vassals. Then again, Robb probably already has that given his extraordinary victories against the Lannisters.
    I'd also like to execute 'Reek' who's currently sitting in a cell in Winterfell. Killing Ramsay Snow could prevent a lot of misery and death in the North and nobody will miss him, not even his father.
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    There was talk of Edmure and the Lefford heiress, to secure the Riverland's western border.

    Ramsay is in a cell in Winterfell right now? Kill him.

    Gamerlord said:
    Um, did we make sure to grab Sansa's friend, the one Littlefinger sticks in a whorehouse?
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    I assumed she fell under the category of surviving members of Ned's household in the plans. Forgot she was in a whorehouse. oops.

    Good to hear she came North with us, though.
     
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    Charcolt said:

    Anyone I should add to this?
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    Huh. Shireen Baratheon and Margaery Tyrell look a lot alike. I guess the Florents are closely related to the Tyrells after all.

    How about Alysanne Lefford, Harry Hardyng, Dacey Mormont and Arianne Martell? Might as well have the whole set.
     
    Robb should definitely marry within the North, especially as Rickon isn't and Bran is dubious. Honestly, I think Sansa should do the same. It's important to keep a connection to our vassals (which does not ITTL include the rivermen). As to the Lefford heiress... I'd say pitch the idea to Edmure, because, again, it's really much more relevant to Tully than to Stark interests.

    Rickon inheriting Harenhal would be interesting, but I'm not sure it's even desirable, given that the place is cursed.

    (Current preferences: Robb - Meera Reed, Sansa - TBD northerner (Harrion Karstark?), Arya - Trystane Martell. Though any Arya betrothal is far in the future still.)
     
    VNodosaurus said:
    Robb should definitely marry within the North, especially as Rickon isn't and Bran is dubious. Honestly, I think Sansa should do the same. It's important to keep a connection to our vassals (which does not ITTL include the rivermen). As to the Lefford heiress... I'd say pitch the idea to Edmure, because, again, it's really much more relevant to Tully than to Stark interests.

    Rickon inheriting Harenhal would be interesting, but I'm not sure it's even desirable, given that the place is cursed.

    (Current preferences: Robb - Meera Reed, Sansa - TBD northerner (Harrion Karstark?), Arya - Trystane Martell. Though any Arya betrothal is far in the future still.)
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    Meera Reed is too marginal to be considered. The Reeds are already loyal and do not need to be bound more tightly to the North, while other major houses need to be.
     
    [X]Plan Fortify

    Measured, yet proactive. This has my vote.

    With regards to the Wildlings: I suspect they have the Horn of Joramun, aka the Horn of Winter, aka the Wallsmasher. Though it's Wall smashing abilities remain admittedly unproven and may yet turn out to be mere superstition, I nevertheless believe we should not count on the Wall to stop any incoming Wildling hordes.

    And yeah, definitely kill Ramsay.
     
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    Meneldur said:
    It's called 'hedge our bets', precisely because we're not committing to anything. We've offered a nice betrothal to Lysa. Obviously she can say no if she wants; we don't need the Vale currently, we just want their neutrality. The Hardyng offer is obviously not something we're sending to Lysa - it's meant as reassurance to the other Lords and Ladies of the Vale that we're willing to deal with them and respect them, not just with Lysa. And unless House Royce rules the Vale (which it currently doesn't), marrying Ysilla is pointless. Worse,it could easily be spun as us trying to give the Royces the power to take over the Vale, leading to civil war there.
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    Okay so you are ignoring the fact that with Baelish at her side Lysa will find out about the Harry betrothal and it will screw us massively, you say a Ysilla betrothal is us sticking our noses in? No, that's the Harry thing, that is so much worse it's ridiculous. Also the offer to Lysa will seem like we are trying to take him from her, alongside the Harry thing and Baelish she will declare war. Your plan is so much worse for the Vale it hurts.

    House Royce is a security net, when she goes for us we will need the Royces to rally for us, we. Hedging our bets is all well and good but if we insult Lysa and then have no Vale alliances we will get screwed. Also your Bran betrothal is absolutely going to come off as a massive insult and we want the Golden Tooth to go to the Riverlands.


    [X] Plan: Secure the East, burn the West

    -[X] Eddard will go North and Robb will stay south. The heir to Winterfell has proven himself an adept commander, and it has been too long since its Lord saw his lady wife
    -[X] Send as many scouts and rangers out as possible, in a wide but closely connected net, so that if one disappears or dies, the others know of it. Order them to bring you word of whatever they hear or see. Simultaneously, order for a host of decent size to be gathered near the Long Lake
    -[X] Edmure Tully will gather a host and lead defensive operations in the south from Harrenhall, making sure to clear out Lannister bandits and eliminate them whilst keeping up a defensive posture, Robb will take the Northmen to attack the West as he did in canon, burn than, scatter their hosts and loot it.
    -[X] Send a message to all the Lord and Ladies of the Vale regarding the recent occurrences. Express surprise that Lysa did not come aid her siblings,but understanding that she may not have been able to do so. Proclaim Petyr Baelish to be a traitor who knew of Joffrey's origins and betrayed Lord Stark. Betroth Robb to Ysilla Royce and send the Blackfish with 1000 men to hunt him down.
    -[X] Ask Lady Whent and Edmure to make Rickon heir to Harrenhal
    -[X] Enter negotiations with the Northern Lords for Sansa's hand. Her hand will be used to find a good match and reward the Northern Lords for their loyalty
    -[X] Enter negotiations with Lord Leo Lefford to betroth Edmure to his daughter
    -[X] Execute Ser Gregor and send his head to Prince Doran. He was sentenced to death under King Robert, with the sentence carried out by his loyal Wardens of the North, the Stark; let that be an end to it

    Hurts the West, secures the South, secures the Riverlands and secures the Vale
     
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