Behind the Serpent Throne (CK2)

No, that was because we were ahead of them by a couple weeks and it wasn't wise to slow down particularly as it's been mentioned that the roads start struggling when moving a 100k+ army which is what we had.

There should be no reason that they haven't started moving forward towards the front now that Jinhai committed to going into Hirand and politically it suits their goals fine as Hari-Nat's governor bringing such a large force was so he could acquire prestige for his son. Similarly the army we gathered in Irit should have marched out into Basrat as there is no one to oppose them.
@The Laurent ? Is that right?
 
No, that was because we were ahead of them by a couple weeks and it wasn't wise to slow down particularly as it's been mentioned that the roads start struggling when moving a 100k+ army which is what we had.

There should be no reason that they haven't started moving forward towards the front now that Jinhai committed to going into Hirand and politically it suits their goals fine as Hari-Nat's governor bringing such a large force was so he could acquire prestige for his son. Similarly the army we gathered in Irit should have marched out into Basrat as there is no one to oppose them.

[X] Kiralo could slow down his movements, to try to angle the battlefield as a lake-filled region that also has a number of small hills that might be useful for placing cannons on, depending on the landscape. He can anchor his forces against a lake if need be. It'd involve waiting a little, but he can shift to keep it from being easy for Jinhai to get past him...and if he does, then that's Jinhai's lost.

Kiralo has given no such order for the forces of Hari-Nat to move forward like that, and it's possible that they might stick to the city to enforce a strong defense.

But Kiralo would also say, from his political read of the situation, that Hari-Nat might do that as well. This is an area where Kiralo's actual command of events isn't actually absolute, in a way, because Governors do have power.

And there are actually arguments either way: on the one hand, hanging back might allow Jinhai to pull his forces together if he wins but is battered, but it also means that Hari-Nat could set up strong defenses to totally fuck over any attempt to actually take the capital.

On the other hand, moving forward could allow them to reinforce Kiralo if things go right, but could also leave them out of place if Jinhai moves just right.

Kiralo last recieved a letter/message from the other army a week and a half ago, and has been distracted since, all of which might lean a little towards Hari-Nat marching out, actually.

So on the balance? He'd give better than even odds that Hari-Nat has come in after him, but doesn't want to just tell him. Why? Maybe they think that his army is full of spies? Maybe they want credit for suddenly popping up to save the day.

******

As for the forces in Irit? They are indeed moving to attack Basrat. Which does mean they'll be out of place if Jinhai somehow wins and charges for the capital, and ultimately, "Emperor's forces take Basrat, but Jinhai takes Emperor" is a winning scenario for the Prince. But it is yet another complication, and does mean that if Kiralo wins, he might not have to take his forces into Basrat to subdue them.
 
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So on the balance? He'd give better than even odds that Hari-Nat has come in after him, but doesn't want to just tell him. Why? Maybe they think that his army is full of spies? Maybe they want credit for suddenly popping up to save the day.
Or maybe they have secretly allied with Jinhai and are planning to hit us in the rear. *pause* Nah, I'm getting too paranoid now.
 
[X] Kiralo could slow down his movements, to try to angle the battlefield as a lake-filled region that also has a number of small hills that might be useful for placing cannons on, depending on the landscape. He can anchor his forces against a lake if need be. It'd involve waiting a little, but he can shift to keep it from being easy for Jinhai to get past him...and if he does, then that's Jinhai's lost.

I don't think we have any need to make haste, and having time to properly prepare and maybe for the soldiers to rest after the marches sounds like a good thing to me.
 
[X] Kiralo could slow down his movements, to try to angle the battlefield as a lake-filled region that also has a number of small hills that might be useful for placing cannons on, depending on the landscape. He can anchor his forces against a lake if need be. It'd involve waiting a little, but he can shift to keep it from being easy for Jinhai to get past him...and if he does, then that's Jinhai's lost.
 
Slowing down lets the army tail catch up tho. And the reinforcements if they are coming. Here's hoping Rassit will show competence even in sub par circumstances.
 
[X] Kiralo could slow down his movements, to try to angle the battlefield as a lake-filled region that also has a number of small hills that might be useful for placing cannons on, depending on the landscape. He can anchor his forces against a lake if need be. It'd involve waiting a little, but he can shift to keep it from being easy for Jinhai to get past him...and if he does, then that's Jinhai's lost.

More complex terrain means more potential advantage to be gleaned from Rassit scouting.
 
Slowing down lets the army tail catch up tho. And the reinforcements if they are coming. Here's hoping Rassit will show competence even in sub par circumstances.
It's not like the Rassit even have to fight within this terrain though. There's nothing stopping them from being utilized in a harassing role and going after the supply lines or causing disruption, which is what light cavalry excel at rather than direct combat.
 
Vote closed.
Adhoc vote count started by Muer'ci on Jun 7, 2017 at 8:40 PM, finished with 19 posts and 8 votes.

  • [X] Kiralo could slow down his movements, to try to angle the battlefield as a lake-filled region that also has a number of small hills that might be useful for placing cannons on, depending on the landscape. He can anchor his forces against a lake if need be. It'd involve waiting a little, but he can shift to keep it from being easy for Jinhai to get past him...and if he does, then that's Jinhai's lost.
    [X] Speed up a little. There is some good, dry farmland in an area with quite a few small towns, villages, and castles whose walls could make a good place to put cannons if the fight shifts the right way, and if it doesn't, then there's still good ground for deploying the Rassit, because the flanks will be wide open on plains like that.
 
Yis'il'in, the spirit that personified human endurance. He whispered the name often, drawing on that strength to stay upright, to ride and ride out even though he wanted to collapse. He knew that there were generals who rode by carriage, but as he drew closer to a fight, the last thing he wanted was even the smallest scent of weakness.

Hi'lao'gai, a spirit of the air that he had to order again and again to go through his lungs, which had been slightly damaged by one of the poisons.

Gao-ren, a spirit of water, that brought balance to his harmonies. He chanted the name often, under his breath, a litany.
caught up! loved this part. hope we get more of his thoughts on spirits and naming later.
 
Turn 12: The Battle--Part 1
Turn 12--The Battle, Part 1

A fight began before the first blade was drawn, before the first made thought of murder. Or if not before it, with it. A man thought that he would murder, he knew or didn't know if he could put that thought into action. Whether it was an ambush or not, each man trained themselves to kill, and prepared their mind and soul for the moment of violence.

A battle began when the forces were too far apart to fight, when his scouts ranged ahead and Kiralo began drawing the camps closer together, began to make sure that the men had double, even triple rations, the better to stoke their bodies and prepare them for the clash.

For the average soldier did not eat well. A little rice, or even millet, a little bit of vegetable and meat. It wasn't much to keep a starving body together, and war would devour anything in a man's stomach. He wouldn't feed them so well on the day of the fight, not because he believed, as some generals did, that an empty stomach strengthened the resolve to live to fill it again, but because he'd seen men eat too much out of nervousness only to throw it all up on the battlefield.

Regular rations, no more and no less, and no double-ration of rice wine, not when it was needed.

Which wasn't yet, because there were still days until they clashed, and those days would stretch out, because the army was not so much marching as crawling. Perhaps Jinhai's agents would be so dumb as to think that it was a result of cowardice, or perhaps exhaustion. Perhaps Jinhai would make enough mistakes, would march his men too hard and too fast to meet him.

Perhaps he wouldn't. He knew the route Jinhai was going to take, had stared at the map until his bleary eyes had watered, until his stomach, still ill, had turned with the inaccuracies.

But then he read reports, reports that told the same story. This was ground that was familiar to his scouts, and he'd done well to make sure he had a full screen of talented scouts, not just on foot, which was important too, since knowing how a man would walk over the ground mattered, sometimes. A marsh that might seem impassable, given to collapsing a horse into mud, might be just barely navigatable by a human, which opened up possibilities.

But it was the boys on horses, and his scout-specialized Rassit, that paved the way and won the day, and it meant that he knew each battlefield, was aiming for some very good ground if he could get to it.

Everything was down to timing, and the days passed slowly. They dragged when every single minute mattered, when all the world was hanging in the balance.

He breathed, and that was a good thing.

Plenty of people didn't, already. Somewhere the Typhoon was rampaging across Csiritan land. Somewhere the Bueli were at the edge. Somewhere beyond the border to the north, there was an entire people that had been destroyed, but survived.

There were Anlan, and there were Southlanders, there was an entire world, and it was true that more of it than one might imagine didn't care. Or wouldn't know what happened.

But then, there were a hundred thousand and more men with him now, and that was just the fighting men, not the cooks, not the hostlers, not the ladies and men who catered to the needs of the soldiers. If he lost, they would die. Not all of them, but enough.

And he would die. And his father would die, and his mother would never be buried beneath a lake in Csirit, in a place of honor. Her ghost would not rise up, she would not scream and wail, she had not been dishonored, she had been buried as best that her money and situation could afford.

But there was so much more he could do.

Kueli, too, would die. And who knew who else would be purged?

He was the man on horseback if he won. He was a small note at the bottom of the page in the annals of the history of an Empire if he lost.



And there was a child who would no doubt eventually suffer an unfortunate accident. Jinhai was of the blood of Emperors. He would not stand to be anything less, would not consent merely to stand behind the throne with a dagger, a smile, and power.

And would Jinhai be the worst possible Emperor? If Kiralo discarded his faith, then he could say honestly that there were worse men. But there were better, and done on the back of so many dead, it would weaken and tear the Empire apart.

It was unholy, too. The Gods had chosen the Emperor, had placed him there, the son of the previous Emperor, when everyone knew that a soul could be cast about anywhere. That a man could be born as a potter or born as a lord, and it was the Gods and the Judges who knew what might happen to him.

To overthrow the Emperor was to declare war against Heaven itself.

He wanted to stand in front of Jinhai. He wanted to talk to the man. He wanted to make treason and heresy all at once have a face.

But it was likely he'd never see the man alive, win or lose. Jinhai was a man of action. He would know what capture meant, wouldn't he? And he would fight.

There were many things one could say against the Prince, truly there were, but he was brave. People marveled at the stories of his youth, at his riding and his high spirits, at his intelligence and proper poise, at the foes he had routed. They said that he'd even once, in the "barbarian style" that was the only style Kiralo knew, fought at the head of his army, had risked his life in battle instead of standing back.

He was too important for that now, though. He'd only fight if there was no other choice, because if Jinhai fell, then no victory would be enough.

Had he a brother?

Yes.

His brother, a young boy who idolized him, perhaps fourteen now, would possibly be executed, or perhaps not. Perhaps he'd merely die, or commit suicide out of grief with a knife that had somehow found its way into his confinement.

Everyone had someone they cared for.

What made him and Jinhai different was not their ability to create, it was their ability to destroy. Lives, hopes, dreams.

The armies moved closer. Closed the distance.

And now Kiralo had a decision to make.

Release the Rassit?

[] Yes. Have the Rassit move out now, to harass the supply line of Jinhai, and his troops as well. He might have forces designed to try to stop that, so there is that danger, and even if it's a complete success, it will wear down and exhaust the Rassit before the actual battle. But there are definitely morale and logistical advantages to sending them out now.
[] No. Keep them back and rested, mostly, for the battle. Use them to guard against any of Jinhai's attempts at doing what they might have done, but to Kiralo. And use them as extra scouts for now.

*******

Kiralo's Analysis: 1d100+15 (Martial)+2 (Strategic Insight)-1 (Illness)=???
Jinhai's Analysis: 1d100+12 (Martial)+2 (The Flexible Mind)=???

Kiralo's Maneuvers 1: 1d100+15+3 (Terrain Master)+/- ? (Degree of success)-1 (Illness)=119+1d100=137
Jinhai's Maneuvers 1: ???

Scouting: 1d100+15 (Martial)+3 (Terrain Master)+5 (The Rassit Scouts and the Scout-allies they trained)=30, but that's a reroll (below 10), so 81

A/N: So, here we have a vote. Either way, the battle won't begin quite yet, but we're moving closer to it.
 
So by deduction the degree of success for Kiralo is 2? Good to know.

Anyway, Jinhai has pushed his troops hard, and surely they cannot be more well fed than the imperial army. War is logistics and morale. This is our chance to make him pay.

[x] Yes. Have the Rassit move out now, to harass the supply line of Jinhai, and his troops as well. He might have forces designed to try to stop that, so there is that danger, and even if it's a complete success, it will wear down and exhaust the Rassit before the actual battle. But there are definitely morale and logistical advantages to sending them out now.
 
[x] Yes. Have the Rassit move out now, to harass the supply line of Jinhai, and his troops as well. He might have forces designed to try to stop that, so there is that danger, and even if it's a complete success, it will wear down and exhaust the Rassit before the actual battle. But there are definitely morale and logistical advantages to sending them out now.
 
[x] Yes. Have the Rassit move out now, to harass the supply line of Jinhai, and his troops as well. He might have forces designed to try to stop that, so there is that danger, and even if it's a complete success, it will wear down and exhaust the Rassit before the actual battle. But there are definitely morale and logistical advantages to sending them out now.
 
Almost there, it's almost over.

[X] Yes. Have the Rassit move out now, to harass the supply line of Jinhai, and his troops as well. He might have forces designed to try to stop that, so there is that danger, and even if it's a complete success, it will wear down and exhaust the Rassit before the actual battle. But there are definitely morale and logistical advantages to sending them out now.

In the Southlands our Rassit must have faced plenty of situations designed specifically to stop them, and I doubt the Prince could have cobbled up something of the same level so quickly, so they should have a good idea on how to deal with those. I think we have a good chance of weakening the Prince's army at minimal cost to our Rassit.

Jinhai's Analysis: 1d100+12 (Martial)+2 (The Flexible Mind)=???
Flexible Mind says something about the way the Prince fights, and it's not good for us. His Martial stat should be 24-25, which is lower than ours and only slightly higher than Kueli's (23), but that doesn't say much.
 
Almost there, it's almost over.

[X] Yes. Have the Rassit move out now, to harass the supply line of Jinhai, and his troops as well. He might have forces designed to try to stop that, so there is that danger, and even if it's a complete success, it will wear down and exhaust the Rassit before the actual battle. But there are definitely morale and logistical advantages to sending them out now.

In the Southlands our Rassit must have faced plenty of situations designed specifically to stop them, and I doubt the Prince could have cobbled up something of the same level so quickly, so they should have a good idea on how to deal with those. I think we have a good chance of weakening the Prince's army at minimal cost to our Rassit.


Flexible Mind says something about the way the Prince fights, and it's not good for us. His Martial stat should be 24-25, which is lower than ours and only slightly higher than Kueli's (23), but that doesn't say much.

As I've noted before, a Martial score of 20 is actually really high.
 
If a martial of 20 is really high what real world figure does our level of martial equate us to?

Whew. Comparisons are hard, especially when I don't know military history enough to really judge? Like, one thing is that a person can totally find themselves, by bad luck, dead despite all their skill, or despite being merely 'very good' they could shake and shape the world.

But you'd, uh, be thinking of people like Napoleon, Alexander the Great, Ceaser.

Regardless of whether any of those people are as good as their hype is, I'm just saying, the 30-35 area is the area of legends that, if given the right scope of action, can ring down history. That said there are probably people with "Martial 30" who die in a ditch when they take an arrow to the eye in the middle of a fight.

******

An actual 'historical' example of someone with 30-35 Marital would be Hanae, the famous hero who saved the Empire and created the Hanin.
 
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Well hopefully by improving the empires cavalry massively and introducing proper field artillery we can reform the empires military to the same degree, ideally we'd also increase the number of Hanin we have so that we actually have some professional cavalry.
 
Well hopefully by improving the empires cavalry massively and introducing proper field artillery we can reform the empires military to the same degree, ideally we'd also increase the number of Hanin we have so that we actually have some professional cavalry.

???

Hanin, for instance, are crossbow elites protected by spearmen elites.

They're the ones that broke the Tarnarin in battle.
 
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[X] No. Keep them back and rested, mostly, for the battle. Use them to guard against any of Jinhai's attempts at doing what they might have done, but to Kiralo. And use them as extra scouts for now.

I just want to see the Rassit in battle again at full strength. The whole multiple arrows per second or two thing would be fun to watch. Especially as they wouldn't (?) have Rassit or Tarnarin of their own to harass us back.
 
[X] Yes. Have the Rassit move out now, to harass the supply line of Jinhai, and his troops as well. He might have forces designed to try to stop that, so there is that danger, and even if it's a complete success, it will wear down and exhaust the Rassit before the actual battle. But there are definitely morale and logistical advantages to sending them out now.
This is what Rassit are best at.
 
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