Fire Emblem: Last of the Manakete
- Thread starter SoaringHawk218
- Start date
- Fantasy
One Day Heads Up
Alright, so looks like staying and trying to get the information by sorting things out as much as possible is winning over washing your hands of the mess and letting what will be be.
- Location
- USA
[X] Try to play mediator and find a middle-ground. You'll need to convince the bandit that it's in his best interest to tell you what you want to know as well as convince Mary that killing him won't solve anything. It won't be easy, but if you can make it work…
I just find it hard to imagine a scenario where we all sit down and try to talk out our differences actually working. If the QM wants it to work, then it will, obviously, but some things require more suspension of disbelief than others. And that choice feels like some kind of idealized "get everything you want for no cost" thing.
Well, if it works, that would be convenient, so I won't complain.
Well, if it works, that would be convenient, so I won't complain.
I will say that it's not guaranteed to work, but it's not guaranteed to fail either. There will be rolling to see how much, if anything, you get out of this. There are several pieces of information you could get, some more helpful than others.
- Location
- Earth
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I don't know what you think the people voting for "Play mediator" are expecting, but none of us actually expect "Ryza makes friends with the bandit and everyone goes skipping into the sunset". There might be an argument with Mary, and that's a cost we're willing to pay to not accept torture.
Jiven
With the power of the moon...
- Location
- Strasbourg, France
I am actually expecting Ryza to fail in some form. I voted for it so that Ryza confront a situation she can't solve by simply being a good girl, and because it was the most ic choice.
If we picture the scene playing out in-universe, I can't imagine Ryza managing to convince Mary not to torture him--not with, potentially, the lives of her kidnapped colleagues on the line. I also can't imagine bluffing him with some kind of "Truth Spell" or threatening him with lightning, because if he's determined enough to be tortured by a clearly furious woman with a spear, he'll almost certainly call our bluff. Also, in regards to the text of the option--killing him does in fact solve a problem in the sense that he won't be attacking travelers in the middle of the night anymore, so how could we convince Mary it won't?
It's just my general opinion that narratively, a vote option that conveniently solves all the intractable problems, gets us what we need, and allows us to maintain our ethical purity seems rather contrived in the face of all that. But the rolls haven't happened and the next chapter isn't written, so there's really nothing to talk about here and now.
- Location
- Earth
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Two points to make. First, unless Mary is a supervillain in shining armor, she's going to go a lot lighter on the torture if a small child is watching her.
Second, and more importantly, I didn't say that Ryza would definitely convince Mary to not torture the bandit at all. I said she wouldn't accept torture. There's a difference between failing to stop torture and walking away from torture. Even if it was truly hopeless, the trying matters.
Please read the words I actually type instead of projecting whatever assumptions you think I made onto my posts.
Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
I feel like Ryza is too much of a busybody to accept just turning away from this kind of thing.
[X] Try to play mediator and find a middle-ground. You'll need to convince the bandit that it's in his best interest to tell you what you want to know as well as convince Mary that killing him won't solve anything. It won't be easy, but if you can make it work…
Better to try and fail than do nothing and definitely fail.
[X] Try to play mediator and find a middle-ground. You'll need to convince the bandit that it's in his best interest to tell you what you want to know as well as convince Mary that killing him won't solve anything. It won't be easy, but if you can make it work…
Better to try and fail than do nothing and definitely fail.
[X] Try to play mediator and find a middle-ground. You'll need to convince the bandit that it's in his best interest to tell you what you want to know as well as convince Mary that killing him won't solve anything. It won't be easy, but if you can make it work…
As to your first point, I can only disagree. Again, her fellow Whitewings' lives may depend on her getting that information. She's seriously angry, so her decisionmaking may not be at its best. Plus Ryza just finished murdering a couple guys with 30,000 amps of electricity, it's a bit late to mistake her for a harmless little innocent cutie when the air still reeks of burnt meat. But this is just two different interpretations of the characters and the situation, and reasonable people can disagree.
As to your second point, I actually agree with you. Hey, miracles do happen!
Well. There's some... irony in you saying that, let's phrase it that way. Since my point evidently hasn't made it across, let me state it as straightforwardly as I can.
As a person sitting at a desk reading off a computer screen, I do not find it satisfying to read a written work of fiction wherein multiple intractable problems are solved in a few paragraphs due to either a deux ex machina or the protagonist being awesomely perfect. This, to me, is true of all fiction. It is relevant to this quest only because that vote option seems like it would pretty much require one of those things to happen, given how much the in-universe scenario seems slanted against it.
But I am not a writer and my concern may prove to be misplaced. Again, the next update does not exist, so it's a little early to begin critiquing it. Considering this is just my opinion here, you are of course free to disagree with me; if we could not argue about it, that would be great.
UARTman
Flat Snark
- Location
- Russia, unfortunately
- Pronouns
- He/Him
That's great. Congratulations on having taste. No one argued with this part, ever, so highlighting it was pointless.
You should have highlighted this, instead, because that's the core of your argument people are critiquing.
And the response to this is that we aren't voting for outcomes, we're voting for actions. Ryza will try to "mediate", and it will definitely not actually resolve the conflict in a couple paragraphs. But the ways Ryza and the situation can fall short of the ideal are numerous, plausible, and, above all, interesting to explore. Will the bandit latch onto Ryza as a get-out-of-stabbing card and spin a sob story? Will Mary not let Ryza interfere citing some backstory about the bandits and what they're doing? The events here are a vehicle for characterization and worldbuilding. The outcome is gonna be some variation of "Get Sidequest" regardless of our choice!
Your position feels like complaining for the sake of complaining, because it lacks any substantial basis at all. There is no update to critique, and no sentiment expressed in the thread about how we the protagonist should "win" this. You're tilting at windmills while low-key insulting your fellow readers and the author.
At least, that's what it feels like to me.
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Vote closed
Alright, so pretty clear win for attempting mediation. Let's see how that goes: can I get 3 d20s?
I'm trying a simplified rolling system that I've used a few times for background stuff, thanks again for everyone's patience with my fiddling.
Also, as always, please remember to debate respectfully with each other. There weren't any big problems, especially for the ugly mess I dropped on all of you, but the debate was starting to get a little tense at the end.
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- Location
- Florida
Here we go
Edit: okay not good
Edit: okay not good
Barondoctor
The things I chase come to me.
- Location
- The other side of the mirror
- Pronouns
- He/His/Him
reasons I wasn't fond of this option!
EDIT: Acceptable mediocrity was rolled.
EDIT: Acceptable mediocrity was rolled.
Ferb_Ancos
The one under the table
- Pronouns
- He
Ryza Levinheart will remmember that.
- Location
- Florida
Well hey if we failed to come to a compromise I still appreciate making the effort to avoid torture. Sometimes that's the most important part.
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... ouch.
Well, good news, this was never going to result in any sort of physical risk for Ryza, but since the DC was 13... yeah, that's a total failure.
Basically, how it works is if 1 of the 3 dice is over the DC, you get a minor failure: you don't succeed, but the results aren't too bad. 2 over the DC = partial success: you get what you want, but there're complications. If all three are over the DC, then it's a total success: you get everything you want.
Well, good news, this was never going to result in any sort of physical risk for Ryza, but since the DC was 13... yeah, that's a total failure.
Basically, how it works is if 1 of the 3 dice is over the DC, you get a minor failure: you don't succeed, but the results aren't too bad. 2 over the DC = partial success: you get what you want, but there're complications. If all three are over the DC, then it's a total success: you get everything you want.
Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
Oof.
This hurts me. And it doubly hurts me that Ryza's going to piss them off and they're probably going to spread the word that she's a bandit sympathizer or something, which means no QT Pegasus Knight friend ever because presumably the Whitewings take percieved slights extremely seriously and all it takes is one fuckup for them to Never Forgive You as an entire polity.
That being said, holy hell, that was majorly stacked against us. DC 13 and we needed at least 2 successes just to get something we wanted? I'd have definitely reconsidered if we knew the odds were just that awful.
This hurts me. And it doubly hurts me that Ryza's going to piss them off and they're probably going to spread the word that she's a bandit sympathizer or something, which means no QT Pegasus Knight friend ever because presumably the Whitewings take percieved slights extremely seriously and all it takes is one fuckup for them to Never Forgive You as an entire polity.
That being said, holy hell, that was majorly stacked against us. DC 13 and we needed at least 2 successes just to get something we wanted? I'd have definitely reconsidered if we knew the odds were just that awful.
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Yep.
Basically, starting DCs are either 5 (easy) 10 (medium) or 15 (hard). I then add up the bonuses and banes to modify that.
Ryza did her best, but she just couldn't overcome the sheer hate these two have for each other.
In future, if I keep using this system, I'll probably give an idea of what the starting DC for an action will be, so that voters can better judge if it's worth attempting.