If possible, I'd suggest we offer additional concessions to the High Elves regarding Moussilon, loosening so of the restrictions on their control there in return for their guarantee that they'll never interfere in the succession of human powers we're guaranteeing.
-
Going forward, links to content from Twitter (now X) will no longer be embedded. Pre-existing links should not be affected.
The High King Acts
- Location
- Utrecht
We need to make a more robust treaty with Ulthuan than the relatively basic one we have right now.
- Location
- Wherever I feel like being
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] Yes this is an acceptable deal
[X] Yes, this is exactly what we wanted for them.
[X] Accept the offer to guarantee Reman succession. This would stabilise Remas politically and allow them much more continuity of purpose over successive emperors. However every peace turn there is a chance that if Remas were to enter into a civil war that you would be dragged in on the loyalist side.
[X] Accept the offer to support Remas Technologically. This would in effect provide Remas with the "turtle ships" and "crossbows" technologies and give them a distinct advantage over their human neighbours
[X] Yes, this is exactly what we wanted for them.
[X] Accept the offer to guarantee Reman succession. This would stabilise Remas politically and allow them much more continuity of purpose over successive emperors. However every peace turn there is a chance that if Remas were to enter into a civil war that you would be dragged in on the loyalist side.
[X] Accept the offer to support Remas Technologically. This would in effect provide Remas with the "turtle ships" and "crossbows" technologies and give them a distinct advantage over their human neighbours
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] Yes this is an acceptable deal
[X] Yes, this is exactly what we wanted for them.
[X] Accept the offer to guarantee Reman succession. This would stabilise Remas politically and allow them much more continuity of purpose over successive emperors. However every peace turn there is a chance that if Remas were to enter into a civil war that you would be dragged in on the loyalist side.
[X] Yes, this is exactly what we wanted for them.
[X] Accept the offer to guarantee Reman succession. This would stabilise Remas politically and allow them much more continuity of purpose over successive emperors. However every peace turn there is a chance that if Remas were to enter into a civil war that you would be dragged in on the loyalist side.
- Location
- Somewhere
[X] Yes this is an acceptable deal
[X] Yes, this is exactly what we wanted for them.
[X] Accept the offer to guarantee Reman succession. This would stabilise Remas politically and allow them much more continuity of purpose over successive emperors. However every peace turn there is a chance that if Remas were to enter into a civil war that you would be dragged in on the loyalist side.
[X] Yes, this is exactly what we wanted for them.
[X] Accept the offer to guarantee Reman succession. This would stabilise Remas politically and allow them much more continuity of purpose over successive emperors. However every peace turn there is a chance that if Remas were to enter into a civil war that you would be dragged in on the loyalist side.
Sir LagsAlot
Yandere Dice Magnet
- Location
- In the fridge
[X] Yes this is an acceptable deal
[X] Yes, this is exactly what we wanted for them.
[X] Accept the offer to guarantee Reman succession. This would stabilise Remas politically and allow them much more continuity of purpose over successive emperors. However every peace turn there is a chance that if Remas were to enter into a civil war that you would be dragged in on the loyalist side.
I'd prefer to sell our technology to the humans on mass for gold during our next peace turn rather than just handing it over. It gets us to the same results except we get more money out of it so I consider it a win.
[X] Yes, this is exactly what we wanted for them.
[X] Accept the offer to guarantee Reman succession. This would stabilise Remas politically and allow them much more continuity of purpose over successive emperors. However every peace turn there is a chance that if Remas were to enter into a civil war that you would be dragged in on the loyalist side.
I'd prefer to sell our technology to the humans on mass for gold during our next peace turn rather than just handing it over. It gets us to the same results except we get more money out of it so I consider it a win.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Getting involved in human politics can be troubling, but, look at the allies we have, the stability and lack of enemies in the lowlands and forests, the support we have in this war. It can also lead to major dividends.
Well to be fair it does cost us one of our precious few turn actions.
Last edited:
Sir LagsAlot
Yandere Dice Magnet
- Location
- In the fridge
Our balloons tech sells for a few gold per human polity we sell it to so imagine how much gold we could charge for our more important techs. We'd be rolling in enough money to resume our original plan of spamming canals as well as underways everywhere which is more than worth a single diplomacy action.
Last edited:
Ya know what? This is a good point. I legit hadn't considered we could sell it (think i missed that bit/option entirely) so the idea of selling it to not only ensure that whatever loot we get from the war as well as peace concessions can cover our after war obligations, but also allow us to at least make a start on the other stuff we want to do is rather appealing. More gold is good gold
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I'm having trouble finding the bit of selling the balloons for gold and the price per polity, can anyone link me to it?
[X] Yes this is an acceptable deal
[X] Yes, this is exactly what we wanted for them.
[X] Accept the offer to guarantee Reman succession. This would stabilise Remas politically and allow them much more continuity of purpose over successive emperors. However every peace turn there is a chance that if Remas were to enter into a civil war that you would be dragged in on the loyalist side.
If we were selling tech en masse we need to either give the Confederation a massive discount or give them some freebies. Of all our allies they're the only one who isn't being mercenary about helping us. That should be remembered.
[X] Yes, this is exactly what we wanted for them.
[X] Accept the offer to guarantee Reman succession. This would stabilise Remas politically and allow them much more continuity of purpose over successive emperors. However every peace turn there is a chance that if Remas were to enter into a civil war that you would be dragged in on the loyalist side.
If we were selling tech en masse we need to either give the Confederation a massive discount or give them some freebies. Of all our allies they're the only one who isn't being mercenary about helping us. That should be remembered.
Sir LagsAlot
Yandere Dice Magnet
- Location
- In the fridge
I'll look around for it.
Found it. The spotter balloons don't seem to be a tech we can hand over most likely due to the rule around only being able to sell last generation tech to people but we're allowed to sell them for 1 to 2 gold per polity from the looks of it.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Mmm, well we'll see. I favor the succession support more than weapons anyway.
Chimeraguard
We do deserve to exist.
In that case:
Tomb Kings
The Tomb Kings I imagine are going to be fun, due to how their background works. All the Tomb King soldiers are the mummified soldiers who were buried with their kings (or died in Nagash's plague IIRC), inhabited by the souls of the former owners in a method that was much better for preserving their fighting skills. This means two things:
1) The Quality of Tomb Kings soldiers is liable to on average be better than that of most Undead, barring things like Nagash pouring his magic into his Skeleton Warriors, because Tomb Kings soldiers retain more of their mental ability and skill. This is why Skeleton Archers are really mostly a thing for the Tomb Kings, but not the Vampire Counts.
2) The Tomb Kings' rank and file are a bronze age army in an era where everyone else has moved into the Iron Age at minimum and are rapidly progressing towards steel (if not better.) Since baseline Equipment seems to lean heavily on material science, that puts them at like, Equipment 2. BUT! They have an extremely high proliferation rate of enchanted equipment. All the Tomb Guard have enchanted weapons and armor, Skeleton Horse Archers are noted to use magically enchanted arrows, etc. So I think what we'll see is a low baseline level of Equipment, but it's popped up by huge portions of the army (basically anything more elite than the average skeleton/Nehekharan warrior) getting Enchanted equipment.
So to sum up the Tomb Kings: Impressive Quality for manlings, poor baseline equipment and low tech, lots of Enchanted equipment, and probably other modifiers from war statuary and plentiful magic.
----
Ogres
Ogres are bound to be "interesting." The first issue with them is obvious: the 10k army formation doesn't really work the conventional way with them, because 10k Ogres is like the kind of force that ruins whole nations. But I think there's a simple solution to this: the "10k" counts not only the Ogres, but is like, 9,000-9,500 Gnoblars and anywhere from a few hundred to a thousand Ogres, with pretty much all of the actual combat power being provided by the Ogres because you'd need some sort of fractional measure to properly show a Gnoblar army.
2nd issue with Ogres: They're not exactly professional soldiers, they're tribal warriors that are really big and tough. This would normally be a Quality 1 or 2, but that doesn't make sense for the Ogres at all because, come on, they're Ogres! Maybe Ogres instead get a floor to their Quality of 3 or something, or just an automatic +2 or whatever to their battle rolls because they're giant Ogres.
And a 3rd remark about them is that they're very much primitives. Forget Leadbelchers and Ironblasters, those are recent inventions. No Maneaters either. There might not even harpoon launchers. The Ogres right now (and even in canon) are very much a stone age civilization, with any metal being scavenged. So that's Equipment 1, maybe 2 if they're a very lucky tribe with a lot of looted metal.
So, on paper this means an Ogre force looks pretty weaksauce, with low quality and low equipment and zero technology, plus pretty poor generals, but they were like this in canon to, and that didn't stop them from being relevant (though a lot of that might have been Greassus.) But on the other hand, they seem to have been more an inconvenience and hazard on the borders rather than a nation-threatening problem, so maybe that fits.
Still, I feel that there needs to be some modifiers: one for every Ogre army on account of being Ogres instead of small people, and one that maybe depends on how expansive a beastiary the Ogres have: are they stuck with Mournfangs and Rhinoxen, or have they managed to grab a Stonehorn or two?
For us right now, I think this means that if we want to hire Ogres, we need to make sure we have good enough info for them to hit a more vulnerable target, since even if we wrangle together a large number of them, they'll struggle pretty hard if they come up against the heavy, well-garrisoned Chaos Dwarf fortifications.
EDIT: So, going by my estimates + Sir LagsAlot suggestions, Ogres would (so far as our guesses anyway) have a Quality 1 and low baseline Equipment (1 because stone age), but it gets pumped up with stuff like a +2 from being Ogres instead of tiny humans, and a +1/2 depending on what warbeasts they have available in numbers (+1 for Mournfangs and Rhinoxen, +2 if they have Stonehorns I think.) So you can theoretically get a hilarious 1/5 Quality/Equipment army.
-----
Cathay
This one is mostly just me doing theorycrafting on how Cathay at this point in the timeline might be different from the Total War Warhammer 3 depiction.
Probably still the general Peasant/Jade Warrior/Celestial Dragon Guard tier system of unit quality in place, but the tech level is overall lower. Probably no Sky Lanterns and the like for example, and even less gunpowder otherwise (rocket battery might instead be a Hwacha-style thing rather than explosive rockets.)
I'm not sure on what's the status of Cathayan metalworking, but one thing could be, in this era, steel is reserved for the elite Celestial Dragon Guard (still some domestic production of steel in army-level quantities, so still better than the Old World.) The Jade Warriors make do with iron, giving them the 3/2 statline similar to Remas/Reikland, and there might be Jade Archers mixed in with the Jade Crossbowmen (since crossbows are a technological advancement, but archery is a tradition that's been taught by the Moon Empress, so it's a long, long road to getting the military to truly replace bows with crossbows.)
Jade Lancers and other cavalry might be making use of Fire Lances, which would make them good on the charge, but rather poor at a prolonged fight (especially if horse breeding hasn't gotten to the point where you can give them and the rider heavy armor.)
Cathay actually might be an interesting bit of schizo tech, where crossbows are in wide proliferation and there's even some gunpowder weapons, but the bulk of the army is still mostly using iron.
-----
Well, these were all just idle thoughts from me. I think I got inspiration for another set of army lists. This set's theme: They really like Cavalry.
Last edited:
Sir LagsAlot
Yandere Dice Magnet
- Location
- In the fridge
The Ogres most likely have a +2 to equipment due to their nature as such fearsome fighters similar to how a dragon attached to a unit gives a +2 to equipment and their priests probably give a +1 magic bonus.
Most tribes are probably quality 1 but competent tyrants or a good number of former mercs in them are probably quality 2 as ogres are known to learn some level of discipline well working as mercs usually.
Most tribes are probably quality 1 but competent tyrants or a good number of former mercs in them are probably quality 2 as ogres are known to learn some level of discipline well working as mercs usually.
Last edited:
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Tomb Kings probably an extra +1-2-3 from Leadership, depending on said Leadership, due to By My Will, that lets the Tomb Kings and Princes and Settra instill their will on their legions to increase their martial skill.
Chimeraguard
We do deserve to exist.
There might not actually be a tradition of Ogres going abroad as mercenaries right now. Some things seem to indicate that only really picked up during Greassus's time, first from Ogres getting bored at the smaller amount of fighting while Greassus was OverTyrant, then Golgfag made it really popular and started the whole Maneater phenomenon.
At the very least, Golgfag started his work while Ungrim was King of Karak Kadrin, and that he "forged a reputation for the Ogres as fearsome killers for hire long before they became a relatively common sight in the mercenary armies of the Old World." Which means that Ogre mercenaries being a Thing in the Old World only really came about recently by the time of canon.
Might have started out earlier in Cathay, but I think that was another thing that only came about with Greassus, since he struck up a friendship with Zhao Ming, which in turn led to a surge of Ogre mercenaries heading there.
Last edited:
- Pronouns
- He/Him
- Location
- New York
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] Accept the offer to support Remas Technologically.
[X] Yes, this is exactly what we wanted for them.
[X] Yes this is an acceptable deal
[X] Yes, this is exactly what we wanted for them.
[X] Yes this is an acceptable deal
- Pronouns
- He/Him
@Lonkas
Just to be clear, the Sudenorsi are entering the war for no gold in the new negotiations, right? And—
Just to be clear, the Sudenorsi are entering the war for no gold in the new negotiations, right? And—
I mean, most of those on the list aren't actually allies, just neutral or trade partners so, yeah, they're mercenary with their help.
Sounds difficult to enforce.
Chimeraguard
We do deserve to exist.
Actually, how certain are we of this? Because Remas is already big enough that it could afford to have 80,000 men forming its elite units (though 50,000 of them are only really elite against Skaven) and offer them as expeditionary forces. That's almost as many as the whole Confederation of the Reik army sans the Brigundians, and one presumes the rank and file army who don't have any bonuses would include even more men.
Granted, any theoretical civil war would see that military split and divided against itself with lots of Legionaries that don't want to fight the Dawi, providing plenty of ablative armor for our Dwarfs, but still...
@Lonkas How large is the Reman military overall? Or that of the other human nations not involved or going to be involved in the war for that matter?
Or failing that, what do the numbers say for how many Reman Legionaries would be needed to face off against say, a 50k strong Dawi & Gnolumgi force in battle and it not be a curbstomp with a relative handful of losses for us? I imagine they'd need to outnumber us massively, but how massively exactly?
Last edited:
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Chimeraguard
We do deserve to exist.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Thank you.
I mean, 3/2 average, no tech bonuses, probably no Magic bonuses if their best legion doesn't have enough to make an appreciable, mechanical impact, Leadership 2, no special equipment…
Last edited: