[Continuation] Schwarz-Rot-Gold: An Interwar Germany Quest
- Thread starter mouli
- Start date
- Alt. History
[X] PLAN: Vox Populi, vox Dei.
Alright, I'm convinced. 5 coalition stability is not hugely important in the grand scheme of things, and this isn't even pissing off Zentrum, who are the guys we want to work with the most. Also not bashing the far right twice is probably a smart move, yeah.
Alright, I'm convinced. 5 coalition stability is not hugely important in the grand scheme of things, and this isn't even pissing off Zentrum, who are the guys we want to work with the most. Also not bashing the far right twice is probably a smart move, yeah.
mouli
Terrible QM
- Location
- United States
One thing to ask the thread: Do you want a state of the world post (it'll be long, covering continent by continent) before we begin? If not, I can try to start putting Turn 1 together, and fold the IC knowledge into the turn options. Else you can see what the fallout has been from a brief civil war in Germany and suspension for five months of reparations payments.
Let me know within a couple hours and I can start putting it together.
Let me know within a couple hours and I can start putting it together.
- Location
- Southampton, Great Britain
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I would like to see the state of the world both because I would like the extra information before starting and because I think it would be interesting to see.
Hmm, I'm wondering if the Austrian system isn't better in another, more obscure way. Allowing people to have second or third favorite representatives should reduce partisanship among people, as they can go "Oh, I love the SPD, but those Zentrum guys aren't terrible I suppose." instead of being pushed towards having to be either or. Perhaps it'll also give us an opportunity to preserve the Reichsbanner instead of it splintering? Instead of the coalition only being there at the top level it would allow people to be more invested in the coalition on the personal level, and therefor the Reichsbanner could be maintained as a SPD-Zentrum-DDP republican organization like we want to.
@mouli do we (SPD, Zentrum elected officials) believe the referendums will go in our favour if we ignore the possibility of voter intimidation? I could definitely see it, since several of the potential future states seemingly were KPD strongholds after all, no love lost between them and the old Prussian system.
and to answer the question, I prefer to learn about the world bit by bit as it is meshed into the writing (no state of the world post).
@mouli do we (SPD, Zentrum elected officials) believe the referendums will go in our favour if we ignore the possibility of voter intimidation? I could definitely see it, since several of the potential future states seemingly were KPD strongholds after all, no love lost between them and the old Prussian system.
and to answer the question, I prefer to learn about the world bit by bit as it is meshed into the writing (no state of the world post).
- Location
- UTC+0
- Pronouns
- He/Him/They
I'd rather wait and see them naturally IC, it will make things flow easier imo. It's fine either way, but I prefer it.
mouli
Terrible QM
- Location
- United States
They're likely to swing in favor of new states, provided the SPD and Zentrum back that option. Partly on account of the populace not being great friends of Prussia, partly because the rural and low-density urban areas were Zentrum strongholds in the Rhineland, partly because there was a substantial chunk of SPD in the area. KPD stronghold does not really imply absolute control.
I see, good to know, and yeah, the KPD probably didnt have the backing of the majority of the population where they rose up, which is better for us. Knowing them a bunch of em probably would vote for staying with Prussia purely as an accelerationist vote lmao.
- Location
- UTC+0
- Pronouns
- He/Him/They
Also, if things are presented during the turns, as flavour text in the options or in the POV's, it will keep us guessing more and thus create more engagement, which seems more dynamic to me. I also have to admit I am looking forward for the first turn and don't want to delay it too much 
Last edited:
- Location
- USA
Regarding the referendum, there is a very strong grassroots party for Hannover. The German Hanoverian party managed to achieve roughly 320,000 votes in 1920 election and both 1924 elections. Considering that this is for the freaking Reichstag competing against other major parties in a province with only around 3 million people, its quite impressive!
Sadly it is also the only regional party of note we can use as while there is a Schleswig-Holstien party it netted around 25,000 votes in the same elections.
I didn't mean to throw that dice but I choose to interpret this as a sign in favor of incorporating the German Hannoverian Party into our coalition to make 4 parties in our coalition.
Sadly it is also the only regional party of note we can use as while there is a Schleswig-Holstien party it netted around 25,000 votes in the same elections.
I didn't mean to throw that dice but I choose to interpret this as a sign in favor of incorporating the German Hannoverian Party into our coalition to make 4 parties in our coalition.
Last edited:
- Location
- Southampton, Great Britain
- Pronouns
- He/Him
On the other hand, finding out what sort of ripple effects we have created would also generate engagement as people discuss the changes, trying to figure out the implications of them and how they will effect us. It will also allow us to make more informed choices using information that a government ought to know in-universe. I would also rather make an informed choice with information that we should know rather than try to guess stuff that we shouldn't be trying to guess as we should already know.
- Location
- Southampton, Great Britain
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I figured as much, but regardless, I would rather have that information that we ought to know even if it is limited and biased than make guesses about stuff we should know. I also want to know just how the world has changed due to the events of the previous quest as one of the voters from it.
in a very sneaky attempt to delay the vote being closed I shall shift my vote over to having the state of the world post being written. My guile is without peers.
(seriously, I am actually changing over to it, I could see us doing some big foreign plans that could have a wrench thrown into them if we don't know something suddenly having changed in the UK or the US, for example. @mouli )
(seriously, I am actually changing over to it, I could see us doing some big foreign plans that could have a wrench thrown into them if we don't know something suddenly having changed in the UK or the US, for example. @mouli )
- Location
- UTC+0
- Pronouns
- He/Him/They
Not as much as spreading it out though, since it the engagement would probably last as long as the period between posts.
I doubt the QM would screw us over and not give us information pertinent to the options at hand. Like, if we get a choice regarding the Entente, we'll probably be given the information relative to it. It's just it won't be as much as an infodump and will be sprinkled in organically.
They'll still give us the info, but limit it so as to not make a huge turn. We'll probably get the most immediately relevant information first and later on find out more, less impactful and not immediately relevant news. Am I somewhat correct in assuming this @mouli?
mouli
Terrible QM
- Location
- United States
Pretty much, yes. But that still means less information coming in than your character would know. It's a question of information firehose, I suppose, at what point is enough? Since most here prefer to have it rather than not, I can post a brief state-of-the-world and then shape options in a manner similar to the way I would in its absence.
- Location
- UTC+0
- Pronouns
- He/Him/They
I still prefer it to be sprinkled in the turns, even if it means we'll find out a bit less for now. Leaving us guessing a bit is fun, but if the thread prefers a state-of-the-world so as to find out more stuff immediately that is fine as well.
- Location
- Southampton, Great Britain
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Except it won't be organically because we should already know that information. The government should have some idea of how the rest of the world currently exists and therefore we should have the information rather than having it arbitrarily given to us as things pop up. We should know more than what is immediately relevant and there is no logical reason in-universe that we shouldn't know at least the basics of what is going on in places like the British Isles or North America or Russia.
Giving out information that we should already know piece meal will harm our choices because it limits our ability to plan in advanced. It is one thing for when new information occurs, but this is information that informed people should already know in-universe, like the people running the government.
- Location
- Southampton, Great Britain
- Pronouns
- He/Him
We will already be guessing enough without imposing an artificial handicap. Things are already going to be hard enough without deliberately shooting ourselves in the foot by having the Germany government decide to stick their heads in the sand and ignore the wider world until something happens to make our pay attention to different parts of it. What you want is not sprinkling in organically, it is artificially limiting information that we ought to already have.
- Location
- UTC+0
- Pronouns
- He/Him/They
This is 1920 and we just came out of the civil war, whatever information we have is going to be limited because the telegraph network would have been stressed and we probably lost some of our foreign service to the Triad.
No it's not, the government doesn't magically know everything at all times, because inter-service communication is often limited and we just came out of a civil war. It would make more sense for things to be a mess and us not know everything immediately than otherwise. And it's not limiting our information since we'd find it out eventually.
Anyway, I was just stating my preference, I'm not very interested in having to debate over this too much, since it's not even a proper vote. As I said, I think it would be more fun and engaging. Besides making some sense and not delaying the first turn, which are valid reasons as far as I'm concerned. If you want it to be the other way, there are valid reasons to do so as well, I'm not saying there aren't.
- Location
- USA
Something else I just thought of regarding my preference for the Australian system over the modified Weimar system. Because all of the orders of preference for the votes are all publicly visible, we will get early warning of when the far right and far left are beginning to gain traction again as they start rising into the third and second choices category before they actually make huge electoral gains. This would be a very useful early warning system rather than just having to guess at how voter demographics will go in the future.
[X] Plan: Zentrum is Bae
What all this illustrates is that enough of the population is (rightly) very, very concerned that we don't have an army at all. And prone to do very, very stupid things (like the Black Reichswehr, or Kama tank school, or...) in response.
And yes, as another german I can corraborate that not having the "conservative party" (no matter if labeld "Zentrum" or "Union CSU/CDU") is wierd.
Edit:
Difference is, the Reichswehr doesn't want to run the country. A lot of the tension we have is due to that this is the sort of tanks we are allowed (pic is from 1932, so this is the advanced version where the cardboard is mounted to cars, and not carried by the soldiers I had a picture in my school history book - a bit of pars pro toto), while this is what the Freikorps get. This is the police variant. Who are both allowed armored cars. Which means the army is out-tanked by the police (insert militarized police joke here).
What all this illustrates is that enough of the population is (rightly) very, very concerned that we don't have an army at all. And prone to do very, very stupid things (like the Black Reichswehr, or Kama tank school, or...) in response.
I mentioned above that equating the Zentrum with the USA-Republicans is a bad, bad idea. The Zentrum is a wierd beast, to the point that they are monarchist, pro-welfare, christian, centralist, nationalist and rather sympathetic to minorities.
And yes, as another german I can corraborate that not having the "conservative party" (no matter if labeld "Zentrum" or "Union CSU/CDU") is wierd.
Edit:
The vote is secret. Not something for the secret police.
Last edited:
- Location
- Southampton, Great Britain
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I'm willing to disagree on this matter then.