Without the Crimson Flare upgrade individual legionaires are weaker than an Armor Prototype except for captains, but they're prototypes rather than mass production models and a single Nilfel legion is large enough to populate a city so Nilfel would have an enormous advantage in military might. With the Crimson Flare upgrade Nilfel would curbstomp.
Upgrading the treasures in the Realm of Evening to transcendent tier is going to massively improve the value we get from it even if we don't spend extra time in there. Imagine if we could get something like Opalascent Tower for our other Panoply items or how far we could progress in the Empyreal Signs with arbitrary amounts of transcendent materials.
It seems that the way the wind is blowing, it's either blood or ice. Since I like this more, I'm changing my vote, though I will change back if saber somehow gets more traction.
I hope you don't mind me simping today, because I'm in love with your Noir setting. If you ever need a generic death gang flunky to get offed I'd be honored to contribute!
(I'm just showing my colors)
Upgrading the treasures in the Realm of Evening to transcendent tier is going to massively improve the value we get from it even if we don't spend extra time in there. Imagine if we could get something like Opalascent Tower for our other Panoply items or how far we could progress in the Empyreal Signs with arbitrary amounts of transcendent materials.
Addendum to that, what if the upgraded Pillars can conjure something equivalent to the Tower of Earth? absorbing it would've been worth 12 Arete, and quite possibly granted +2 Empyreal Signs (though that might've been more of 'this will grant X sign progress where X is sufficient for +2 Signs at the current state'.):
[ ] Absorb the Tower of Earth [12 Arete, if successful] - Is this really the time for this? Not guaranteed to work.
*Just imagine what the Cloak could be, with earth and sky both bent to your dominion!
*Unlocks a mystery effect as well as one of the following: Immediately gain two Emypreal Signs, Triple the Protection offered by the Cloak, or strongly upgrade the Supreme Enclosure ability (Supreme Enclosure -> Bring To Heel). It is otherwise rarely practical to acquire upgraded versions of Empyreal Signs, which can in some respects match - or even exceed - the glories of the Royal Praxis in the field of magic.
*Tactics and/or omake power can somewhat strengthen your odds of successful assimilation
*You'd still need to deal with her other defenses afterwards, but maybe after such a show of force Augustine would consider giving up or offering reasonable terms!
*If you fail, who knows what could happen? Well, Augustine probably has some idea.
*Is this... bait?
*Still kinda tempting
...wait, did the Tower even get destroyed, or is it still there? I don't think it's ever stated that it's gone, so maybe we can absorb it anyway before we go to Pillars? with Augustine gone, she shouldn't be able to trigger whatever trap-thing she'd've triggered once we took it otherwise...
...wait, did the Tower even get destroyed, or is it still there? I don't think it's ever stated that it's gone, so maybe we can absorb it anyway before we go to Pillars? with Augustine gone, she shouldn't be able to trigger whatever trap-thing she'd've triggered once we took it otherwise...
Gisena went full nullity bomb after her ascension. If any of the Tower was left after Hungers initial assault it would have been turned into plain old rock after that. The Tower is unfortunately no more. Augustine may have left notes on its construction but I think it's safe to say that particular advancement is no more.
Addendum to that, what if the upgraded Pillars can conjure something equivalent to the Tower of Earth? absorbing it would've been worth 12 Arete, and quite possibly granted +2 Empyreal Signs (though that might've been more of 'this will grant X sign progress where X is sufficient for +2 Signs at the current state'.):
...wait, did the Tower even get destroyed, or is it still there? I don't think it's ever stated that it's gone, so maybe we can absorb it anyway before we go to Pillars? with Augustine gone, she shouldn't be able to trigger whatever trap-thing she'd've triggered once we took it otherwise...
"Augustine," Hunger shook his head, surveying the wreckage of the Lady Protector's estate, her towers of earth and adamant now torn down around them, soil of her ramparts reduced to smoldering ruin. The air was choked with ash and dross; sky the color of freshly-spilled blood: Augustine's final preparations had exacted brutal sacrifices from caster and domain both. They were fortunate not to have given her any more time, lest the entire realm of Nilfel, rather than this single battlefield, haven been reduced to this dire state.
In spite of certain salty exchanges between us way back, some random urge to bandwagon with Hirorubie makes me say that there's probably enough material to make me an interesting character in an AST noir setting if the urge strikes you. One of the early pioneers in the field of strategic omake reserves. Having almost singlehandedly saved the thread from the alternatives to Synthesis but getting overshadowed by Haeliel. That Metanoia newspaper I tried once. Having called several things correctly or somewhat correctly. Periodic Goals check-ins as an illustration of the relentless pragmatism/treating the quest as a game to be won like a game I like to think I strive for most of the time(Being magegang because I think that it's the best chance of breaking the Ring of Hunger's chains of incentive structure to minimize Hunger's chance of death, but if it took voting for physical training/SORD options to do that in an alternate universe quest, I'd like to think I'd do that too).
I don't remember the last time I did something because I thought it was narratively interesting in this quest yet I was genuinely interested in changing the quest genre to robot battles, though I still think I was doing so in a relatively smart, pragmatic fashion from a gamist/simulationist/I don't know what the best term is standpoint.
Things I've called to illustrate my point:
The Value of precommitting Arete to Azure Moon as a hedge against the Apocryphal Curse when Rihaku gave us that opportunity: Our failure to do so made us have to fight the Mirewolf(Inflicting chill of the grave upon us and downgrading our effectiveness) when we could have panic-researched Azure Moon healing to heal Letrezia instead.
There Being an anti-ring trap in the ring chamber of the Temple of the False Moon: Zampano and I partially called this, the trap was Sten's antimagic shadow. We just were able to fight well enough that it didn't matter.
There being weird shenanigans afoot with Armament Totality: Since at least as far back as when Outer Darkness was in contention I've been arguing that there's weird shit afoot there and that we may get Rank and/or Stats Hybridization, that it's seriously worth investigating. When the Tears of Winter Blurb got posted, the description of what happened when you give the Tears of Winter to Letrezia confirmed that there are secret Cursebearer benefits for Armament pilots, though we don't actually know what they are yet.
The Value of Synthesis/Synthesis getting us picks: We got picks conditional on us being willing to take Blood Sorcery. My obsessive crusade of theorycrafting in conjunction with everyone else's theories was close enough to the truth when filtered through Hunger's intelligence to provide Blood Sorcery as an option and a bonus to our Amplification and Distillation Roll. Basically everything in Amplification and Distillation was connected to stuff I or Unelemental came up with.
Over-Refined not actually Being a Year strictly speaking/us having options for mitigation of Decimation damage from synchronizing with the Apocryphal Armament: Making the assumption that the Heroic Advancement options would have been the same for Myth and Legend vs Armory of Night, Crimson Flare giving us options for damage control with Versch's active Decimation was something I called. Over-Refined not actually being a realspace year/us being able to get praxis back faster if we were willing to take an opportunity to do so was also something I called. It would ordinarily have taken 7.5535 Realm of Evening procs of 21 days, AKA 7.5535 cycles of realspace and realmtime of 48.321661 days for our year of recovery to have elapsed(I amended my math to use the more precise measurement for lunar months of 27.321661 days, a New Moon-New Moon Sidereal Month).
206.374 Days in Realspace(7.5535*27.321661)
158.624 Days in Realm of Evening(7.5535*21)
The Heroic upgrade for pillars of Creation gives us 210 additional days to spend in the realm of evening per real world year. We could totally have abused that to get the Praxis back faster from a realspace days standpoint, were we willing to bear the other costs like Apocrpyha of doing so.
Here's an example albeit extreme arrangement:
Lunar Month 1: 27.321661 Days
Realm Proc 1: 21 Days = 48.321661 total days have passed
Use all 210 Days at once: 258.321661 total days have passed.
Remaining recovery time: 106.678339 days.
The pillars upgrades cuts the amount of time we have to spend in realspace without the praxis to 134 Days if you do it like this. A roughly 36 percent cut in realspace time without Praxis from what we had before.
We don't even know what pillars does yet, not interested in throwing a heroic advancement on it sight-unseen.
Saber is good but rank is kinda boring and straightforward. A heroic advancement should be spent on something special and unique and fun to read about, not rank and sword skills we can get most anywhere.
King of Winter is unique and interesting, but we already paid a huge pile of arete to Adorie without seeing the results yet, and we have geas tasks in other realms to prep for while this spends most of the advancement's power locally. Besides, fixing the Fonts of Myth is Aobaru's job, as park manager he should be all over simple maintenance requests like this! Grab a plunger and get to work already!
Crimson flare is unique and interesting. It's a ring advancement, and I want to see more ring advancements as we move into the human sphere since I think the ring will be more relevant there thanks to Asterios the rival ring lord, and because human sphere humans generally don't have magic so ring-granted advantages are more significant. Most importantly though the ring is cool.
I'm not Shakespeare. I don't really know how to write poems and I didn't bother looking it up; I technically know how to write a sonnet, but this was more of a free writing exercise that I decided to post here. Go easy, but in the end, I don't care if it's cringe. Besides, Arete is Arete.
---
Justice gold, in shining storm,
Came upon the thread,
In gleaming Praxis cuneiform;
And the ages of reckoning augured on;
Behold as it was, and it might,
Foretold as it did, and it writ;
"On the third day of voting,
Plenty of song, platitudes unbloating.
Sweet vermouth in serpent body,
Foolish miners in dust-stained cloaks;
There is nothing disgustingly gaudy,
If not those hard-working folks.
They danced and they sang until the morn,
And they set out to hunt the beast of horn;
Its monstrous strength outpacing, surpassing might,
So who could defeat that fleshy animal delight?
None knew, for the beast was smarter, it learned,
Its mistress found in adaptation, the portents of death;
No longer would Lord Hunger enjoy his servants' breath,
For the beast's army would not be overturned.
And then surrounding them with spears,
Enemies far and near, defeated by a hero's cheers;
Rallied to fight, with talons and writing a story,
A bird transcending, in blue-streaked glory.
Flutter in ascension, descend thereby;
It is no matter to the Most High.
It is his blade that ends the world.
It is his tongue by which all stories are told.
For such is the station,
Of the Master of Creation."
---
I don't actually know what this poem is about. I just started writing the stuff that came to mind. I guess it's about... some kind of golden, just, ineffable force coming into the thread and telling us about a future where the Arete Miners get kidnapped by a monster they wanted to hunt and eat.
And I save them, because of course; self-aggrandizement for the win! No need to thank me guys, being the MVP is just in the blood, yakkno. All-natural, baby.
Anyway, now that you've sat through one of the curses - my poem - here's the others. All of them are related to the life of the average Arete Miner, since we all know Arete Miners are secretly High Cursebearer doing their best to aid their juniors with extra juice.
[ ] The Poetic Doom - From now, until the end of time, the Cursebearer must not only rhyme, but add ontological and philosophical weight to their statements and questions, no matter how irrelevant.
The Doom itself doesn't help in coming up with fitting rhymes, and this effect cannot be cheated through speaking in stop-motion. If the Cursebearer attempts to write, they will find themselves needing to do so in rhyme as well; sign language or language that doesn't have any form of orderly, flowing syntax might not work entirely to begin with.
This curse has some additional, hidden caveats that shall go unexplained here, and are likely to catch the Cursebearer by surprise. For one, but only one example, if someone asks the Cursebearer, "Must you always speak in riddles?" or some effective equivalent of that question, the Cursebearer will always be required to answer with the equivalent of, "But what is a riddle, hm?" They will then refuse to speak further until the person who'd asked the question answers it to the curse's satisfaction.
This curse can potentially become deadly in situations that critically demand transparency and frankness; purple language and flowery prose can be as much an impediment as tyranny.
[ ] The Creator's Geas - What is a champion's duty? To mine, and to channel his creativity into entertainment for others. That is the nature of the Creator's Geas.
From now, until the end of time, the Cursebearer acts as an entertainer for elder beings. Each week, month, year, or decade, he receives a substantial task in some way tied to creative expression; this can range from classical poetry, finger paintings, oil paintings, music, or "freeform challenges" where a certain level of creative originality must be inputted into an artistic work, expressing either a certain emotion, core idea, or whatever else the Cursebearer was tasked with at the time.
The artistic works of others, even companions, may not be used - at least not without significant mitigation.
The Cursebearer receives an instinctive understanding of how appreciated their artistic work is. This usually scales to their originality - producing two, identical works in the same century will never work, and will yield pathetic returns in the same millennium - size, quality, quantity, colors, spirit, genuine creative expression, and other factors. Generally, the elder beings that act as the critics for these works are rather understanding: so long as effort was put towards the creation, they're likely to give a decent review and let the Cursebearer push on unmolested. If they are unsatisfied, however, expect penalties ranging from spiritual exhaustion, abduction of items or companions, or death.
The biggest issue with this curse is not the resources that are spent towards buying paints, instruments, recording devices, or whatever else may be necessary for the "art projects" involved, but rather, time sunk into learning the appropriate domains: the days spent in a studio painting self-portraits, learning to play Beethoven, or working on the next draft of a Mothman musical is time spent not studying the blade, fighting one's enemies, or rebuilding a wrecked society.
A more enterprising Cursebearer may instead learn how to combine them...
[ ] Brand of the Miner - Power is to be craved; this is an axiom of human nature. The Cursebearer leaks a palpable aura that identifies them to every onlooker as a veritable source of 'Arete;' a physics-defying metaphysical proto-substance responsible for the elevation, refinement, and construction of forms.
This can result in a number of complications. Seekers of power are likely to strike at the Cursebearer outright, hoping to claim the source of untapped potential for themselves. Others may plot behind their backs or use soul magic in an attempt to simply rip the Arete out of them. None of these methods are going to work unless the Cursebearer is dead, and the removal of even a single mote of Arete is going to cause a massive burst in the Cursebearer's soul, debilitating if not killing them outright.
Worse still, those who hunt the Cursebearer may not be dissuaded through arguments of falsification; the Curse does, in fact, turn the Cursebearer into a humungous quarry of potent, reality-altering Arete... they simply cannot use it on their own. If someone were to successfully slay the Cursebearer and claim the potential within for their own use, they would likely swiftly become a creature on par with a Cultivator in the Dao Cleaving stage, with the potential to go far beyond with sufficient effort.
[ ] The Affliction of Pain- There is a gruesome truth hiding in the spirit of every Arete miner, past, present, or future. That cruel truth is nothing but exalted pain; agony beyond the words they write, torment beyond the images they paint, salt beyond any sound or glory they ever produced.
When this curse taken, immediately, the Cursebearer begins to experience a sensation akin to being constantly, repetitively stabbed in their stomach. This is normal, and should be disregarded as a mundane experience. The pain will continue to persist regardless of time or unwavering focus; determination cannot quell it, ordinary painkillers fail to silence it, and even surgical removal of the body's nerve endings only serves to stifle it a little.
Worse yet, the pain grows in time on its own. Every nine months, it metastasizes to another body part, and every three years, it doubles in the raw strength of its effects. The only way to set its progress back is through direct, active mitigation. The only way to resist its torturous nature is pure will.
And heed this lesson: will's dictates are fragile in the face of true, unending pain; the sleepless nights spend thrashing in the bed clutching one's stomach and quietly grunting in exertion, pleading for the mercy of sweet unconsciousness. Many a fool have fallen to the Affliction of Pain. Even the most hard-willed, enduring minds can fall to insanity and suicidal craze within a decade of being subject to the endless pain it offers. The pain of a million ripped-out nose hairs is but a tender massage compared to its inexpressible ultra-torture.
It has excellent synergy with Myth and Legend. We get to take Adorie along, she becomes swole, Nilfel builds up strength, hunger repays his debts, we're about as safe as it gets for the time leading up to the Pillars Proc, Hunger gets really, really swole... What's not to like?
Hm... while the Attribute bonuses provided by First Flaring are incredible, I think you guys are somewhat underestimating the value of Season's Greeting... in some ways the most powerful component of King of Winter, for where else are you going to get Apocryphal Mitigation with Stage III being so far away?
The Oath of Winter is dangerous indeed, for if any one of the prospective Sovereign's subjects should have both the power and inclination to overthrow her, their essences would be pit in a battle to annihilation; and neither allies nor companions would be afforded to assist her, for Might in the proving must stand alone.
Ugh. This sounds like anybody in Nilfel can theoretically challenge the queen, under "If you come at the queen you best not miss" rules, and... ugh. If we take her away from Nilfel, thus removing the Apocryphal protection, I'll just bet that one of the procs the Apocryphal sends will be "somebody in Nilfel grew abnormally fast, and wants to challenge Adorie." So we'll come back to Nilfel, and find somebody challenging her to 1 on 1 combat. Thus risking us losing Adorie, and her spare-the-innocent Apocryphal protection, if she loses that fight.
I hate the Apocryphal Curse, dammit.
I'm still voting for both Crimson Flare and King of Winter, but now I'm even more paranoid and worried about nilfel not being 100% Apocryphal-proofed without Adorie there. Maybe we really should just leave Adorie back in the Voyaging Realm, ruling Nilfel and the Elixir Sovereignty and the Temple, up until we get enough tech or magic advancements that we make it possible to administrate Human Sphere territories from the Voyaging Realm.
Feels like it's either "Take King of Winter, and take Adorie with us; or take Crimson Flare, but leave Adorie behind. If you really want to be safe from the Apocryphal Curse hitting old territories."
[ ] The Affliction of Pain- There is a gruesome truth hiding in the spirit of every Arete miner, past, present, or future. That cruel truth is nothing but exalted pain; agony beyond the words they write, torment beyond the images they paint, salt beyond any sound or glory they ever produced.
When this curse taken, immediately, the Cursebearer begins to experience a sensation akin to being constantly, repetitively stabbed in their stomach. This is normal, and should be disregarded as a mundane experience. The pain will continue to persist regardless of time or unwavering focus; determination cannot quell it, ordinary painkillers fail to silence it, and even surgical removal of the body's nerve endings only serves to stifle it a little.
In spite of certain salty exchanges between us way back, some random urge to bandwagon with Hirorubie makes me say that there's probably enough material to make me an interesting character in an AST noir setting if the urge strikes you. One of the early pioneers in the field of strategic omake reserves. Having almost singlehandedly saved the thread from the alternatives to Synthesis but getting overshadowed by Haeliel.
Conjured Blade - the successor of formalAl, master of the math magic and calculations. One of the first pioneer in omake reserve gathering. Legend says that Conjured blade always post only 20% of the omakes created. The rest are hidden in a remote bunker for the promised time. Conjured Blade's white whale - Philosopher's Wreath. A mirage that could never appear yet always within reach.
Many people go to Conjured Blade for guidance and advice. His exploits are far and wide - the successful arguments for Death Star saved the thread from destroying the tripartie evenining bonus that we had started.
But remember one thing - say PW is bad and all there will be reckoning. In AST Noir - Simp another day, our protagonist ask this reclusive yet wise hermit how can the simps be stopped. The answer will surprise you.
Hm... while the Attribute bonuses provided by First Flaring are incredible, I think you guys are somewhat underestimating the value of Season's Greeting... in some ways the most powerful component of King of Winter, for where else are you going to get Apocryphal Mitigation with Stage III being so far away?
Do we really want to have to pay the essence to fix Nilfel's Platinum problem from Saber? Or have to try mythologizing mundane platinum in the realm of evening as an alternative to spending essence given what's on our docket IIRC?
With Crimson Flare and King of Winter, some level of recompense is assured even before we spend the essence, and King of Winter just solves the Platinum problem by restarting the Fonts of Myth.
Conjured Blade - the successor of formalAl, master of the math magic and calculations. One of the first pioneer in omake reserve gathering. Legend says that Conjured blade always post only 20% of the omakes created. The rest are hidden in a remote bunker for the promised time. Conjured Blade's white whale - Philosopher's Wreath. A mirage that could never appear yet always within reach.
Many people go to Conjured Blade for guidance and advice. His exploits are far and wide - the successful arguments for Death Star saved the thread from destroying the tripartie evenining bonus that we had started.
But remember one thing - say PW is bad and all there will be reckoning. In AST Noir - Simp another day, our protagonist ask this reclusive yet wise hermit how can the simps be stopped. The answer will surprise you.
I like. I can't say I don't wonder how things would have gone if I had backed Veil of Grandeur instead or if Skyward Claim had been more popular, but I like.
Many of you seem to focus on the benefits it will bring to Niefel should we choose this, and it's a valid perspective; especially because I do kind of want to progress Aobaru's quest too. But by far what most interest about this option is the ability to bear another Curse. The prospect of taking additional burdens from the Accursed with time is something that has been hinted since his very first appearance, so I'm really curious to what is that like. If it allowed us to get 3 extra Lesser Remittances like in chargen for example, it would be an insane option.
Hm... while the Attribute bonuses provided by First Flaring are incredible, I think you guys are somewhat underestimating the value of Season's Greeting... in some ways the most powerful component of King of Winter, for where else are you going to get Apocryphal Mitigation with Stage III being so far away?
Well, the first step is probably to shoot them. These are Bonesaw cyborgs, so they probably aren't going to go down easy, but especially with your enhanced pistols, even body shots should hopefully interrupt any long range attacks the two of them can put out. Keep them suppressed and try to fry Coronary since it seems more likely to be the one giving you a headache. If you get an opportunity to just fly past them, take it. It's unlikely either could keep up with you and even more unlikely that the Nine know enough about you to know that you are as dangerous as you plan to be.
So enhance pistols and shoot them? That should work - I do have an initiative advantage - and time saved is quite possibly worth the time-extending-fuel lost. Pockmark isn't that much slower than me, though, at least not in an actual chase. This is enough for an update, although it might be a couple days.
I'm guessing that what it does is like something similar to Grailkeeper's effects, in that it renders a land... winter-barren. Or maybe it just renders the individual icy and unfeeling, and other wintry-stuff. A heart of ice perhaps? Hm. Probably not a Brand I'd want to bear, if that's the case; a heart of ice together with the Tyrant's Doom would be bad.
Many of you seem to focus on the benefits it will bring to Niefel should we choose this, and it's a valid perspective; especially because I do kind of want to progress Aobaru's quest too. But by far what most interest about this option is the ability to bear another Curse. The prospect of taking additional burdens from the Accursed with time is something that has been hinted since his very first appearance, so I'm really curious to what is that like. If it allowed us to get 3 extra Lesser Remittances like in chargen for example, it would be an insane option.