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A Simple Transaction I

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Unelemental said:
This is amazing and you are amazing, Unelemental.
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{X} Cursed Indemnity X3
S A V E! This shmuck is brand-new (sorry Brand bros, maybe next time!) and right off the boat. He's got no idea what he's really in for, and the world Indenture grabbed is pretty radical. Just let him dump his efforts into raw power for a minute, then hit him when he *thinks* he's safe, and ahead of the curve. Gets them every time.

Amazing. I love it. 10/10



And it's swapping time again for me. I'm just gonna vote for what I want. I want Gisena screen time and Galadriel ring stuff and big huge perfectly shaped curse mitigation. All-Defeating is amazing and I want Crimson, too, but I can't meaningfully support all three, so here we go. Hubris is a coward's word and all that jazz.
[X] Renaissance Woman
 
The question if we are going to make arguments about sheer power is who would win in a fight?

Hunger with All-Defeating Stance vs Hunger now with the aid of Gisena with Rennaissance Woman.
 
RW Gisena gives us the ability to successfully complete inflitration but than what? We can't convince them to let us have the Ring without giving them something in return. That's what Crimson flair does, it provides the moon civilization an alternative through ennobling etc.

The civilization is just not going to let us take the ring or whatever just because Gisena looks pretty. And acquiring power through developing Graces takes time.
 
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Mannan said:
The question if we are going to make arguments about sheer power is who would win in a fight?

Hunger with All-Defeating Stance vs Hunger now with the aid of Gisena with Rennaissance Woman.
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Pretty sure All-defeating Hunger would stomp. Resistence against nullity, significant stat advantage, magnified bye Edeldros...

vali said:
The all-defeating stance also included the self-defeating stance. It was doomed from the start.
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The all-defeating stance was true: It even defeated ourselves!
 
DkArthas said:
RW Gisena gives us the ability to successfully complete inflitration but than what? We can't convince them to let us have the Ring without giving them something in return. That's what Crimson flair does, it provides the moon civilization an alternative through ennobling etc.
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The problem with All-Defeating Stance is it turns the rescue of the Ring into a military operation that has Hunger scythe through the inner ring.

The problem with Crimson Flare is it is outright stated that Hunger does not have much interest in providing the same benefits equal to the constant labor of the False Moon.

Xalvitor said:
Pretty sure All-defeating Hunger would stomp. Resistence against nullity, significant stat advantage, magnified bye Edeldros...
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Gisena would have True Nullity which is Nullity with absolute force. I don't think Hunger's power of Ruin with All-Defeating have reached a point where it can counter absolute effects. It does protect against powers that stem from the blade, but a lot of stats Hunger has stemmed from the Ring which does not share that protection.

And Edeldross magnifies the stats of everyone involved which Rihaku pointed out when he argued for it benefits the party with the lower stats more.
 
Mannan said:
The problem with All-Defeating Stance is it turns the rescue of the Ring into a military operation that has Hunger scythe through the inner ring.

The problem with Crimson Flare is it is outright stated that Hunger does not have much interest in providing the same benefits equal to the constant labor of the False Moon.



Gisena would have True Nullity which is Nullity with absolute force. I don't think Hunger's power of Ruin with All-Defeating have reached a point where it can counter absolute effects. It does protect against powers that stem from the blade, but a lot of stats Hunger has stemmed from the Ring which does not share that protection.

And Edeldross magnifies the stats of everyone involved which Rihaku pointed out when he argued for it benefits the party with the lower stats more.
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If you have +++++ all stats, the effects of edeldross is much bigger than if you had only +all stats as baseline is what i mean. It's difficult to know, because it's not only the power of ruin, but also the ability of cutting trough. Can Hunger Cut Trough the other Hunger quickly enough? It's kind of difficult to know. Can Cut Trough cut trough nullity? Also difficult to know.
 
Alright, I'll go ahead and eliminate All-Defeating Stance. You guys want to consider the total risk %s here - while Renaissance Woman overcomes the infiltration challenge easily, that doesn't mean the following areas will be a cakewalk. Crimson Flare offers greater risk upfront but likely lesser risk in the next segments, especially if you can leverage its non-combat capabilities to divide and conquer.
 
Mannan said:
Gisena would have True Nullity which is Nullity with absolute force. I don't think Hunger's power of Ruin with All-Defeating have reached a point where it can counter absolute effects. It does protect against powers that stem from the blade, but a lot of stats Hunger has stemmed from the Ring which does not share that protection.
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Rihaku said:
Powers deriving from the Forebear's Blade are perfectly defended from nullification of any kind, even that stemming from a lack of fundamental metaphysics.
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Rihaku said:
perfectly defended from nullification of any kind
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Rihaku said:
perfectly defended
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My hypothesis that Gisena gang have not read the other EFBs collects more evidence.
 
Sharkey_smt said:
My hypothesis that Gisena gang have not read the other EFBs collects more evidence.
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Xalvitor said:
Self-defeating stance too strong.

Honestly, i have no clue what to vote now. I feel lost.
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Uh, that's literally in their post. They said that that powers coming from the blade can't be nullified, but are hypothesizing that it can still happen to powers from the ring, which is where a lot of Stat gains have come from.
 
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As far as overall risk%, I like Renaissance Woman for reducing risk once we enter the Human Sphere, since it gives Gisena a lot of ability to stand as an intermediary and so protect us from the Doom of the Tyrant. The medium/long term utility of her Graces would also be highly useful in a civilization.
 
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