As such, the benefit of more stamina does not outweigh the opportunity cost of getting new Shiny.
Don't underestimate Fall itself as a fairly cheap shiny, though! It's definitely the kind of ability we want in the long term.

Survival is important-- but the risks presented in the Temple are different in that we would truly have no way to punch above our weight class
Ruin lets us punch above our weight class, it just requires a slow, steady stream of chip damage instead of one all-powerful strike. Don't underestimate the value of all the stat increases. We'll be ridiculously faster, strong, and more durable with the Vanguard build, which was kind the point. The thing we lack is a Special Attack. That doesn't mean our regular attacks are weak, though.

Cut is a bit hit or miss, in that you have an immense strength multiplier you can use to take down things well beyond yourself, but that is what it is best at - single strikes against significantly more powerful foes. Any other encounter and Vanguard would either be neutral with it or have the advantage. Which is sensible given both builds are the same cost.

The debate can be summed up with "Are we going to run into a monster that requires a massively powerful special attack to kill before we get to pick anything, or not?" I'm betting not - even strongest monsters we should be able to whittle down, and we are significantly stronger than when we started our way here.

There is also the fact that everything is hinting that this place is a Magic Dungeon, and that means Nullity, while not all powerful, will be extremely useful.
 
[X] Investigate the Main Entrance
[X] Immortal Regiment

Rihaku convinced me. It's a fairly versatile build, and helps with our companions not horribly dying.

Taking form of rage now would mean that it is our main fighting tool, which is quite worrying for Hunter's mental state.
 
Oh ho ho, and how should we be doing Gisena?

That's only valid if Gisena's debuffs are of greater value than our boosted DPS. As it is, hit points and fast healing might actually be the greater selling point. And Vanguard paradoxically doesn't lend incentive to keeping our companions safe, but rather putting them into positions of danger more often!
I'd be happy with most ways of doing Gisena as long as it's not murder and betrayal.

Yeah but that's only counting combat strength. Out of combat Gisena greatly boosts our efficiency since she has null for magic traps, sick engineering skills for mechanical traps and high wits for riddles and puzzles.


The best argument for Vanguard so far.
I regret only being able to hug a post once.
 
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It's unclear how much we'll need stamina given a sizable boost to our Con already inherent to the build. I agree that Fall is worth more than the 2 Arete it costs, I just think that a 7 Arete option is qualitatively different (in a vastly positive way) in terms of the options and bonuses it gives us. Even if in the Temple we didn't get any bonuses, and only picked Ruinous Valor or Undying Vanguard, that would still be very worth it. As such, the benefit of more stamina does not outweigh the opportunity cost of getting new Shiny.
idk if someone said this already but con is a physical stat and our special sword move makes us spiritually tired
so at the very least it doesn't fully apply
 
You know, this title could be referring to so many different things I'm still not sure which were intended. Maybe all of them were? That seems to fit Rihaku.

Best to cut to the heart of the problem and remove the wurm-beast. The sheer scale of its battle with the giant was sufficient to cause collateral damage for every minute that it proceeded unnecessarily. He took stock of the implements available to him as he prepared to move.
Hunger, of course, immediately declares it to be the most obvious one. But that's not unexpected. This was probably the best choice, as investigating the city would be cool but Giant monster battles? Count me in!

There was the Blade of the Tyrant's Forebear. It had broken alongside him in the process of delivering his final blow to its first wielder's progeny. Had that been simple overexertion or evidence of a deeper connection? It hardly mattered now. When he'd abducted the Blade from the Tyrant's catacombs it had bonded to him fully, had leapt to his hand from the crypt, fierce and eager in its willingness to serve, the vigor of a weapon suffering dire neglect...
You know, Hunger really does have a talent for stealing things and making them his own. This was our first hint of that. Stealing the sword of his enemy's Forebear and using it to kill them? I'm not sure if that's cliche or passe, ironic, or just plain weird. Still, so many of things deal with the Tyrant or Forebear we must keep vigilant watch to make sure Hunger does not become like them. I fear his affinity for stealing the tools of his enemies might mean he is more similar to them than they would like to admit... The broken sword, of course, matches the brokeness of the wielder. As one is repaired so shall the other.

It had never betrayed him across years of insurgency. In time they had become a single being, their story a single legend, the hero true and Sword That Was Stolen, of disparate origin but as thick as thieves.
Yep, powerful sword bonded to us so strongly it became ours. Hunger really need to be careful to keep the mental contamination limited, because he could become a real monster. Still, for now the Sword is but a tool with which we may channel the little power we had then, and the still-low but more significant power we have now.

In truth it was inaccurate to think of them as separate entities. The sword was a part of him like his liver or heart, and just as essential to the hero's function. Before his infusion of Accursed power it had slumbered comatose, form and purpose shattered as he had been. All that remained of the bastard sword's blade was a jagged shard about a foot in length, but the Accursed's infusion of power had reached it as it had reached every other part of his self. The broken Blade had quickened once more, its mere presence imparting him with an echo of the Forebear's storied might, the power of Ruin suffusing his every strike.
I am so very, very glad we have Ruin. The ability to whittle down even the strongest of foes is a very useful power, so long as you can survive to employ it.


But that was not the only artifact touched by the Accursed's spark. There on his hand was the ring Hunger, a band of black mythril surmounted by crimson, the final memento of his journey and the only one stolen from the Tyrant's corpse. Rumor abounded that the ring was the source of the Tyrant's martial gift, but in his hands it had only been a powerless token. Now it had awakened, bound to him by Accursed investiture and fused indestructibly to his index finger.
Our second Artifact, this one stolen from the Tyrant. Hunger will be our name, our burden, and our gift. The ring was a very powerful choice, though I am wary of it's ruling aspects. They remind me of the origin described here. I fear that we risk setting Destiny on us as well as the Apocryphal curse if we draw upon those aspects. We may overcome destiny, but the price will be sharp.

It impelled him towards action, towards greatness, the fulfillment of his human potential; prodded him to embrace the joys and sorrows of life fearlessly and without regret. So too was the ability it imparted: the hero's capacity to advance via personal training would be greatly diminished, but any form of conflict or genuine endeavor would grant power tenfold.
A gift, and a price. In truth with the Apocryphal curse sitting around studying was never an option. There was never much chance we could truly grow the slow way like that. So the price of the ring is truly small indeed. And the benefit is great and can be made greater indeed.

A shame his armor had been stolen from him in the hours leading up to his assassination. But the Forebear's Blade granted resilience enough.
Yeah, we really needed that a few times. We eventually got a nifty cloak to make up for it though!

He bounded forth, greenery whirling by as yards and miles disappeared beneath him, towards the city of white stone in which the colossi fought. The situation became clearer as he approached: the common folk of the city, better dressed and fed than those of the Tyrant's world, were fighting a desperate action against a horde of hyena beasts, which streamed like spilled blood from the dragon-jackal's wounds. The city was pervaded by them, creatures beyond number, and he drew his blade as he reached the walls, propelling himself with a crack of thunder through an open gate and into the fray.
One of the only glimpses of civilization we have of the voyaging realm. And what do we do? We rush headlong into killing all the monsters in sight! Hunger is still a Hero. That much is not in question.

Like a falling meteor he struck, the steady tide of beasts become a sea in tumult. The force of his impact rippled outwards, monsters hurled like stray droplets as the fight began in earnest.
These minions aren't a match for us at all, really. We'll blaze straight through them. Which is probably why we decided to just go the direct route.

There was no time to waste. He scythed though their ranks with brutal efficiency, carving a path to the progenitor dragon. Thirty stories it towered above them, blotting out sky and sun, its reddish-brown carapace mottled with scars. As creatures poured from a wound, the cut itself steadily shrank in size. Troubling.
See? Didn't even break a sweat, even this soon after gaining Power. Man that Kaiju is big... and it has healing. Well, I suppose that is exactly what Ruin is for!

Nearly of a height with it was its opponent, a bio-mechanical giant armored in dark grey with accents of red. Hydraulics and ceramic plate spoke to a degree of sophistication that was absent from the city around them, but its overall appearance was disheveled, parts ill-fitting or in disrepair. Its head bore little resemblance to that of a human's; a fierce and angular thing with livid gold eyes, sporting an enormous maw filled with cruel, curving fangs.
As the story itself notes later on, totally an Eva-analog. I'm really hoping no one's mother's soul is shoved into that thing. That seems unpleasant. It is also very damaged. I wonder how much longer it would have been able to keep going if we hadn't arrived? This fight would have been won, but what about the next, and the next, and the next?

But that was hardly its strangest feature. At the top of each arm where the shoulder would normally lie was another armored head, neckless as if in place of a pauldron, similar in structure down to the fanged maw. These had eyes of green; the rightmost face stared appraising down at him. As he watched, the giant attacked, pulling aside the dragon's arm to bite at its neck, shoulder-face tearing into the flesh of that arm as it came into range.
Three heads is just odd. And the eye colors. Should they all be gold, or is there a meaning to the should-heads having green eyes? The Armament is quite powerful despite its injuries, though. More than a match for this astral beast as we get to see here.

It was probably this thing that had sparked his feeling of affinity, this devourer with three heads. Indeed he felt no hostility from it, though it hardly seemed overly solicitous.
Shame we didn't investigate this sooner, but there just wasn't a chance with the whole Fishing incident. Oh well, it was a bare few days of the Decimator's curse doing double duty.

He had almost reached the place of their duel, its radius of devastation increasingly apparent, when he was stopped short by a bolt of phantasmal force.
You know, it's only on rereading like this that I realized we met Gisena when she shot us to get our attention. If I didn't know she was lesser remittance I would have been much warier of her.

"Another outlander! Can you help me evacuate these guys?" An inappropriately cheerful voice accosted him. The interloper was a woman in a finely-tailored dress, its gossamer material streaked with trails of blood and gore, though none of it appeared to be her own. Blue eyes, pale violet hair and distractingly beautiful, inhumanly so. The hackles of his suspicion rose. Some form of Fey? Her ears seemed normal enough, but that could be glamour.
No, no fae. Just... Gisena. She is quite powerful in her own right for sure. Her beauty is a thing of Grace, of course. As our own form will be shaped by the benefits we get from our Experience. ...Asking Hunger to do something. Bold, and risky. The Doom of the Tyrant can be... finicky, at the best of times.

She was leading a large convoy of civilians out from the epicenter, so likely not an enemy. Her bolts seemed to stun and disorient those beasts they struck. It could be a ruse, improbable as it seemed. He'd allow it, at least until the civilians crossed the boulevard, but would stay on guard.

Fortunately the Doom of the Tyrant was quelled before it could take off. We came very close to triggering it here, though. Fortunately Hunger is a Hero and still has a Hero's instinct for helping people, so Gisena just pointed out something he already would have done instead of ordering him to do it. That would have ended badly.

"Fine," he assented. "Stay out of my way."

"So grumpy," she huffed, arriving at his side. "Wake up on the wrong side of the bed today?"

"Maybe I'm always rude."

She laughed airily. "A handsome knight like you? I don't believe it!"

He sighed. "Is now the time for this?"

"When better? We could die at any moment, you know. What, afraid you can't keep up?"

"Yes. So focus on the battle."

"Liar. You're even faster than me! So, where are you headed next? Going to attack that dragon? I could help..."
Banter! Also a good look into our interactions to come. Gisena is quite skilled as handling Hunger without doing anything that might run afoul of Doom of the Tyrant. This is quite impressive given she doesn't know about it beyond a vague impression at this point in time. ...Or maybe that's just her personality. It does seem to be how she always acts.

Finally the civilians were through. Tides of translucent force emanated from her, sweeping through the hyena-beasts emerging from the dragon. Where that magic passed, the creatures swayed and sat as if in a stupor.
Nullity is quite powerful against anything magical. We really need to be wary of that ourselves at this point. Unfortunately the Kaiju itself is too powerful for her to defeat. But keeping the small fry busy is useful indeed.

She seemed capable enough. "Yes. Come if you like."

"How forward! I knew you liked me after all."

"...Circle around to the far side. I'll hit it from the front."

"As if you'd get rid of me that easily! If you get me to the head, I can bypass its healing. Then you finish it off?"

He grunted in assent. "Can you survive a fall? I could throw you into range, then sprint up the tail."

"A delicate flower like me? I'm not so acrobatic. Carry me?" She batted her eyelashes.

"Fine. Climb on."

"I'd prefer a princess carry, but this is fine too." She kipped up and hugged his neck, crossing slender legs against his stomach. He did his best to ignore the prominent sensation of her chest against his back. Her skin was milk-pale, no sun exposure, hands free of callous. Likely a life spent indoors, with servants for menial work.
More Banter! Also Hunger is quite observant, when he wants to be and isn't exhausted. He's also apparently a good judge of capability, given how useful she has proven so far. Though perhaps that is on us, since once again Lesser Remittance.

Yet her speed and precision were above the level of ordinary humans. A product of her magic alone, rather than experience? No. She was composed in battle, suggesting some level of familiarity. Perhaps that selfsame magic reverted any changes to her form.
Sorcery and Graces. You'll be getting an education in that yourself, probably, Hunger. Depends if we encounter any of the better ones before we take Wreath. But that's a worry for the far future. For now, a fight to win.

Once she was secure, he sprang forward, leaping up to land on the dragon's tail. From what he could recall, he'd never actually slain a dragon before. That would have been a memory worth saving.
I wonder if he has and forgot? We know his memory-saving was imperfect, at best. But I suppose the Tyrant couldn't handle something as intelligent and arrogant as a Dragon. Too much of a personality clash.

Plunging his blade into its side, he ran up its length, too quick for it to toss. Had its attention not been diverted by a renewed assault from its chief opponent, perhaps it could have dealt with him, but not in its current sorry state. Where his blade passed, flesh parted cleanly and sloughed to the side, up and across the whole of its spine until it came apart as if unzipped. The sorceress followed up with another wave of her magic, nullifying its regeneration.
Sword acrobatics! Always fun. Especially when your sword spreads Ruin to all it touches. Still, without Gisena to nullify the regeneration this would have been a much harder fight. Ruin would have carried the day, but it would have been a much closer thing.

He attacked with savagery as they reached the head, blade-force projected into great thrusts and cleaving arcs to carve away at the dragon's skull. The sorceress shifted, holding her left arm against his collarbone to fire away with her outstretched right. Before long they had reached the brain. Crossed slashes cut it into quarters; a volley of bolts and it trembled, falling still.
Hunger has lost much of his skill on top of everything else, to be reduced to this. Still, he is no slouch.

The ring Hunger pulsed on his finger, a warm flood of power radiating outwards into his body, and through him the Forebear's Blade. The spoils of victory, progression so rapid it felt unfair. He would have to get used to that.
And the Ring almost immediately pays for itself. Even the reward of a single fight was sufficient to prove it was worth it and more.

"I hope this thing doesn't dissolve beneath us," he grumbled.

"It won't. The flesh itself is nonmagical, it was only infused with magic. Mostly its nervous system, which distributed the power as it was needed." She leapt down to inspect its wounds. "What an interesting specimen! It's a shame biology's not my forte."

"You're a scientist?"

"The very best!" She exclaimed, standing up to face him with a lecturing finger. "Lady Gisena Allria, Sorceress of Nullity and genius technologist, at your service!"
And so we finally get an introduction to the her, her magic, and her knowledge. This is one to keep, if we may. Decimator will make that more difficult than it has to be, but we shall figure it out.

"What do you think about that?" He pointed his chin at the humanoid abomination, which stared at them unblinkingly. Steam hissed out from a set of cylinders in its neck, a pillar of smoke to join the countless coiling upwards into the sky.
Steam from the neck? Are we entirely sure he isn't a titan?

The sense of affinity had grown with proximity, almost sharp now like an ache. He was certain. It was this thing - the monster itself, not any pilot or creature that resided within - that held that affinity to him, aligned across some inexpressible valence.
Decimator's affliction calls to itself.

...I wonder, does decimator's affliction harm others nearby that also have it? Probably not relevant, given the power of Progression can likely outscale someone else's drain.
---------

1214 this time. Woo.
 
idk if someone said this already but con is a physical stat and our special sword move makes us spiritually tired
so at the very least it doesn't fully apply

I remember a Rihaku quote for an Addio omake saying that DefyingHeavens!Cursebearer could apply his Strength stat to a conceptual level, and maybe it would be applicable here? As an abstraction for incremental power, the stat systems are fairly similar.

However, that's fair and this justification is all post-hoc-- this chunk of my argument has been partially/full discredited!
 
I remember a Rihaku quote for an Addio omake saying that DefyingHeavens!Cursebearer could apply his Strength stat to a conceptual level, and maybe it would be applicable here? As an abstraction for incremental power, the stat systems are fairly similar.

However, that's fair and this justification is all post-hoc-- this chunk of my argument has been partially/full discredited!
I think if we got more and more con and relevant con options we'd get a thing that let us apply it more here, but we don't have that yet. I'm not sure how much the base stat does in the quantities we have.
 
Maybe I'm biased, when I hear something is extremely risky I think there must be some kind of boss attached.

Puzzles alone don't do it, and I'm curious how much social could really help in a dungeon. Beyond other adventurers that is.

Murderer's Panoply is closer to the ultimate build many of you seem to be aiming for in the short-term. 5 Arete more to protect our companions makes it a forgone conclusion.

Vanguard's offense comes down to luck, does the additional time Gisena tanks us for allow enough random crits to let us wear down our foe? If we take Vanguard in do we have the will to roll the dice in the fights? My guess is no, I fear all that will happen is that we vote to escape the temple.

Maybe Murderer's Panoply is the way to go, if you all lack the will to try to maximize rewards from here at least it will give us some reward.
 
Maybe I'm biased, when I hear something is extremely risky I think there must be some kind of boss attached.
I mean, yes? I just expect the boss isn't going to be the only thing there, or the first chance we get to spend Arete. Any significant fight earns that, and I suspect we're walking into an actual Dungeon so said fights are near-certain.

Vanguard's offense comes down to luck, does the additional time Gisena tanks us for allow enough random crits to let us wear down our foe? If we take Vanguard in do we have the will to roll the dice in the fights? My guess is no, I fear all that will happen is that we vote to escape the temple.

I'm getting really tired of just how dismissive everyone against it is being about just how massive the stat upgrades are. I suspect we are moving a full tier up the power list Rihaku had for the Very Scenic Route just through the stat upgrades and Fall.
 
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Maybe I'm biased, when I hear something is extremely risky I think there must be some kind of boss attached.

Puzzles alone don't do it, and I'm curious how much social could really help in a dungeon. Beyond other adventurers that is.
I think the most difficult dungeon possible for us would be one that applied a magical set of rules that if you disobeyed would instantly kill you. So a Geas essentially.
 
We decided to go for an extremely hard dungeon above our level and now people are worried about buffing our companions or saving Arete? We can't afford that, it seems people are no longer worried about what is in the dungeon. We need as much as strength we can gather now. Murderer's Panoply gives us power enough to break opponents far stronger than us, in this situation this is exactly what we need. Power enough to survive and perhaps triumph.

Immortal regiment on the other hand simply lacks enough offense to beat enemies significantly stronger than and we have gotten enough hints that they may be resistance to nullity. Against such opponents this build fails hard. Remember that the Apocryphal Curse is still functioning.

Edit:

[X] The Barest Cut


Looks like my preferred option is behind.

Use Thousand cuts to alpha kill an strong opponent and than get Fall of Night + Stronk Defense of some sort.
 
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Remember that the Apocryphal Curse is still functioning.
Actually, it isn't. Since we took this pick we have two weeks off from it.

We decided to go for an extremely hard dungeon above our level and now people are worried about buffing our companions or saving Arete?

At the rate we level we need 2ish more major fights before we will be on level for it (we level brokenly quickly). So the question is if Vanguard is good enough for that, or good enough for one fight and us desperate enough to get to 7 Arete before we have to make picks.
 
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Instead of trying to save Arete I suggest we just bite the bullet, buy a 9 arete plan, and have people do chapter-react omakes. It turns out it's much less difficult than trying to spin a story and still worth something.
 
you're saying this then voting to save Arete? If you're goung to argue we only have a single viable choice then shouldn't you stick by it?
Desperate times call for strategic voting. :p

Anyway, I never said we only have one viable pick. Both MP and Forbidden are pretty damn amazing. The rest are not as good.

Murderer's Panoply seem to have been left behind, so I am going for the next best option that has a chance to win that might give us enough power to actually challenge an stronk opponent and thus get more picks. It's what I consider the least bad option of the top two.
 
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I'm getting really tired of just how dismissive everyone against it is being about just how massive the stat upgrades are. I suspect we are moving a full tier up the power list Rihaku had for the Very Scenic Route just through the stat upgrades and Fall.

The problem is every other build has a way to multiply the stats. Thousand Cuts by giving us an attack that multiplies them by 7. Rage form by multiplying all stats by 3. Vanguard has Gisena to make up the difference, but I doubt she can.

We got through the route pretty easily, I doubt the temple difficulty didn't account for small growth from an easy encounter.
 
The Solitary Moon
The Solitary Moon

"Just what is its purpose?" Hunger murmured, staring at the impossible edifice before them. From this vantage point his eye pierced shadow and cloud, perceiving a small encampment in the valley below that seemed half bazaar, half staging grounds. It was perched atop the only path that lead to or from the Temple at this angle, though the map indicated that the Temple's primary entrance was far around to the valley's other side. Though he couldn't make out details, the outpost seemed fairly teeming with adventurers and magi, tamed or summoned monsters touted openly in the streets.

"Having second thoughts?" Gisena asked teasingly, nudging him in the arm.

"Always," he replied flatly. "But if you have doubts, there's no need to fish for agreement with me. Speak plainly."

"So direct," she gasped. "How could I possibly match you in fishing? In that field I can only curtsy in appreciation of the Lord Hunger, who so expertly sates his namesake condition!"

"Very droll," he scoffed, but smiled slightly. "If you've nothing to add, we'll circle around to the main entrance and attack the problem in the morning. I feel there's great danger in this place, but great potential too... if we can see it through without substantial losses, I'm confident we'll overmatch the blue swordsman when we meet next."

Gisena nodded. "As I'm hopelessly out-Ranked, I'll defer to your supernal judgement!"

"Actually," Letrizia chimed in, eager to contribute on matters related to her hobby, "While Miss Gisena may not be able to use her Rank proactively, as a magically potent being it's likely she still has one! A sort of 'defensive Rank' that protects her to an extent from hostile actions by those with Pressure. Most magical beings have some form of astral shadow, and great magicians will have a stronger one, though not to the extent of one who actively develops their Rank."

"That matches my own theorizing!" Gisena exclaimed. "I am pretty great, after all."

"Only pretty great?" He raised an eyebrow. "That's positively self-effacing coming from you."

"I'm glad you noticed! Humility is one of my greatest traits."

"Anyway," he indicated the valley ahead. "There's an encampment of adventurers in the upcoming terrain. Letrizia, we'll circle around to the main entrance of the Temple. With a bounty on Verschlengorge's head and my own Curse-related limits, any sort of confrontation could go poorly, especially if they turn out to be stronger than us. Perhaps I'll meet a smaller contingent in the Temple itself and we can gather information that way."

He'd reaped a formidable bounty of strength from the monsters they'd slaughtered on the way here, and acquired a few new tricks as well. Still, he preferred to hold them in reserve for now. Physically he was the mightiest he'd been since arriving in this world, but something told him the Temple was deadlier. Anyone who could survive a prolonged venture inside would more than pose a threat to him, let alone his companions.

"Okay," Letrizia said, "Going by the map that'll take half a day more, but we've made good time so far. Verschlengorge has been a bit more responsive, I think your ghostfire actually is healing him a little bit!"

"Good," he nodded, and settled in for the journey.

The Temple was situated in an enormous plain, its porcelain claws towering to mountainous heights, but around that central expanse the terrain varied mightily. There was thick, mist-suffused woodland more jungle than forest, rocky outcroppings and unadorned grasslands, even stretches of arid waste bare of vegetation or fauna. On Verschlengorge's shoulders they traveled comfortably above it all, and could enjoy the meandering scope of their far-ranging voyage in relative ease.

Would that I'd had a giant robot when running from the Tyrant. And some means of hiding it...

Hours passed. He brooded productively for a time. Night fell.

Gisena came to sit beside him, luxuriantly stretching slender legs and toes in the cool air of evening. In the pale glow of the moon she seemed ethereal, languid and inescapable, and his peaceful reverie was thoroughly interrupted. He eyed her blearily, resentful of the distraction.

"Cheer up! It's a pleasant evening. Your cloak thinks so too."

"...Are we really going to talk about the weather?"

She pointed upwards. "It's a clear, cloudless night! You can perfectly see the moon."

He followed the direction of her hand to witness the bright orb of the moon clutched precisely within the Temple's spires, mantis-thin fingertips grasping and ready to pluck.

He grunted. "Either we're viewing it at the perfect time and angle for things to align, or..."

"The temple is manipulating space and time," Gisena finished cheerfully. "The moon, poor thing, always appears to be in its clutches! It can't be that the spires are moving, or it'd look different from other angles."

He shook his head. "The more I look at this place, the less happy I am about entering it."

But menacing as the Temple was, he'd seen nothing disqualifying yet. This was the path they'd chosen, and they would see it through unless circumstances changed substantially.

Gisena hummed. "I agree! But there's something comforting about it as well. It reminds me of a girl I used to know. So sharp and clear and cold! A dear friend. Probably gone now, and the rest of my home as well. Or will be, soon."

"How fatalistic. Your society isn't set up to resist the 'hero' of your world?"

She shook her head, her smile wan and soft. "Nope. They're pretty much doomed. Even if I were there to warn them, it wouldn't help."

"I'm sorry. My... friends sacrificed themselves so we could overcome the Tyrant. It was a close thing. Far too close."

She laid her head against his shoulder, the feather-touch of her hair trailing against his bare arm. "There are some things we just have to accept, hm? Maybe it won't always be so."

"Hmph. Well said."

One day, the power of Progression would allow him to see through his ambition. Bring them all back, and keep them safe once more. But he dared not give voice to that uncertain hope. Even in his heart there was a fragility to it, thin-sketched delicate whisper of a dream, as if exposing it to the real would see it dispersed by a passing breeze.

Gisena said nothing more, simply squeezing his arm in affirmation, and they carried through the rest of their journey in silence.

As the moon began to descend, the soft blue glow of morning limned the horizon. The Temple's claws ceased their transposition, as if allowing moon and stars to slip free its grasp and slowly tumble into the dawn. The light of the sun was austere and heavy, heat without warmth, illuminating the stark wasteland sea that surrounded the Temple's frontal facing.

A single avenue of shining tile cut through that bare expanse, the Temple's central promenade which featured heavily on the quicksilver map, broad enough to invite a marching army - or to deploy one. Surprisingly there was no activity, human or beast, upon the promenade. It was as thoroughly deserted as the earlier outpost had been bustling.

The towering gates were shut, dark blue steel upon which countless distorted moons were carefully engraved. Here was a sharp ellipsoid, gleaming with purest silver; there an orb covered in diamondoid patterns of blue slate and dusted with cobalt.

They stared down the entrance from a distance. Gisena's emerald eyes observed it piercingly. Immense as the gates were, they were almost tiny against the titanic mass of the Temple. The curve of its central dome was like the skull of the world itself jutting free; a hundred cities could shelter under that ivory sky with abundant space for all.

"We could try using Verschlengorge," he noted. "He wouldn't fit inside but he could break down the doors."

"Mm..." Letrizia responded unhappily.

"Or I could cut it open," he continued. The Forebear's Blade could tear through defenses that would stop a lesser artifact.

"No need!" Gisena finally said. "I think it'll let you through. Perhaps only you, but I could carve a path with my Nullity as well. There's an aura around the temple gates. The closest thing it resembles is that of your ring."

He glanced at the red-black band on his finger. Either this was a spectacular coincidence or something strange was afoot. The ring of power had come from the Tyrant's finger, from a world and a universe entirely separate from this one. What did it mean for magic of its nature to be present here?

Then again, the residents of this world had quantified the magic of Rank which he'd wielded in the previous realm. Perhaps it was not so large a coincidence as it seemed.

He shook his head. There was trepidation, fear of the unknown, fear that for all his preparations and newly bolstered strength he would still be inadequate to the conquest of this place. But there was no room for doubt or hesitation in his mind. The Accursed had granted him the power of Progression, growth unrivaled in this world or any other. He would trust to that power, and to his long years of experience, to see this task through.

This task and every other, until that whisper of a dream became reality.

"Letrizia," he said, "Remember what we talked about. And find a good location to hide and secure Verschlengorge. If I can leave after venturing inside, I'll return every day to check on you if feasible."

"Find something worthwhile," Letrizia replied, "Good luck!"

As he walked forward the gates shuddered and began to open, groaning clench of steel like a monster's exhalation. They moved only briefly, leaving the tiniest hairline crack in that wall of colossal blue, just enough for one human to fit through without touching the steel of the doors.

---

[X] Investigate the Main Entrance has won.

The build vote from the previous update is still running. Gisena will accompany you if Immortal Regiment wins; otherwise she will stay with Letrizia to guard her. Consider that in votes below.

Thousand Cuts voters may want to consolidate into a choice (Barest Cut vs Murderous) if they desire to overcome the Regiment! You can coordinate in the thread, of course, and (within reason) pledge votes if you want. For example one faction could receive pledged votes from the other in exchange for switching to the other faction's choice. Of course this is not limited only to Thousand Cuts voters!

Don't forget to include your Build Vote alongside your choice for the vote below.

You have somewhat over 11 Arete. Decide on Hunger's general stance for exploring the Temple. He will adjust this depending on the difficulty of the encounters within, but will retain the same mindset and strategy until it fails him grossly. This choice may substantially affect characterization.

[ ] Aggressive - Charge forward seeking the greatest rewards. Do not abandon intelligent decision-making, but employ tactics as to prioritize the acquisition of powers and treasures. What are you here for if not the wholehearted plundering of wealth and might? It is not within you to yield or become lesser, even in the face of malice such as this. Rise higher and greater than ever before. Meet the immensity of the challenge with the blazing star of your own spirit and will!

+Increased chance to acquire valuable resources or power
+10% increased damage and Arete gain within
+Vastly improves chances of Rank gain from encounters.

+Obviously, it's quite risky, though you do have Second Stage...
+Could recklessly trigger the Tyrant's Doom and create unnecessary conflicts if there are adventurers within
+You will still make tactically sound decisions where possible, but you will also push yourself as you have been all this time.
+A good old-fashioned red option.

[ ] Conservative - Favor cautious, thorough explanation and withdraw in the face of unusual effects that he (or party members, if available) cannot intuit an understanding of. Do not provoke creatures, if any exist, into fights, and check regularly for traps and other dangers. If possible, exit the Temple frequently for breathers. This may requiring staying in the general vicinity of the doors. Reduces [I am the Danger] bonus to 5%.

+You don't need effectiveness bonuses nearly as badly if you carefully pick and choose which encounters to trigger.
+Do I even need to argue for this approach
+Maximize survival% by taking this and every other survival-relevant bonus

Participation has yielded a bonus. Choose carefully:

[ ] +.1 Rank - The will to go on.
[ ] Ring Affinity - What does this do? Perhaps it might be important.
[ ] Absolute Focus - Lose your next 2 Arete. Gain an additional 10% effectiveness bonus within the Temple, which can be increased up to 20% depending on quality and quantity of future discussion, tactics etc. Stacks with the inherent bonus that discussion and tactics can provide.
 
[X] Ring Affinity
[X] Aggressive
[X] Murderer's Panoply

if MP or Forbidden wins than Aggressive is the way to go. otherwise go for conservative, because other builds simply lack the power to challenge this place.
 
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[X] Aggressive
[X] Absolute Focus
[X] Bright Vanquisher


Arete isn't our only avenue for advancement, better to aggressively extract every last drop of value we may obtain from this place than be chary due to self-doubt. This is almost certainly the best trade in terms of risk to reward that we'll obtain in our immediate future, grabbing both picks and Rank at a relatively low cost in Arete. For our current position in the growth curve, we need to prioritise that kind of massive gain rather than counting coppers. With this, we'll have more than enough power to defeat Bearic and leave the Voyager's Realm, while putting ourselves in a good position to negotiate with Letrizia's civilization with our immense strength. But to do this safely we need to have some level of insurance. Hence, we take Vanquisher.

Also, what kind of loser only has two Forms?
 
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[X] Immortal Regiment
[X] Conservative
[X] Ring Affinity


The Temple pulls to the Ring and the Ring to the temple. Whatever that is about is probably important if we seek to survive this.

Conservative is kinda the obvious choice, here, if only because we need to be careful about having Hunger be characterized as one that will rush headlong into what he knows to be extreme danger without need.

I do wish there was a middle ground between aggressive and conservative. I do, in fact, want to provoke fights with creatures if we can determine they aren't overwhelmingly stronger, while I still want to explore methodically and carefully in the face of many unknowns.
 
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[X] Aggressive
[X] Murderer's Panoply
[X] +.1 Rank


I don't think entering the Temple with a faint-hearted mindset will serve us best after reading this update. So i'm changing my mind, pick up a solid increase from Panoply and start snowballing.
 
Thank fuck it's not an underwater level.

Unless there's an underwater section. Better get that fishing rod ready, cause we about to hook, line, and slaughter a couple of adventures.
 
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