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Even Further Beyond [Complete]

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Rask said:
The normal Beyond Flesh, which we can get for free, has the x2.2 Cultivation multiplier. Combined with auto-Cultivation and being stuck at Peak Dao because we are waiting for Truth, this means it currently doubles our artifact output. Since there's no need to spend BP on it, we can just spend 3BP on researching a Further Beyond Vault and still upgrade the Flesh spell later if it's in the Liminal slot.
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Just because the Beyond Flesh puts a number on it doesn't mean the Vault isn't a better multiplier, which it probably is if we specialize it into one. Constant priceless-treasure generating monsters at our level is amazing for Cultivation--no more, no less. It's so broken Nameless even mentioned it as something "out of this world." It's an order of magnitude better than the Overgrowth.
 
Corripere said:
Technically, we can get Truth scarily fast if we adventure in the Tomb. At most half a year of adventuring, probably less if we use BP. If you want us not to waste BP and to be able to advance Dao as fast as possible, you might as well also vote Tomb
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Remember that negotiating peace with the Elves gives MP per month as well.
 
Skelm said:
The entire point of Liminal is that we get to spend BP over time.
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If we lose half of year of potential use though, what point is there? We're still 57 months off, and every month must have its utility maximized. The Vault allows us both awesome utility now, with an EFB that's also probably amazing.

DarkKing98 said:
Remember that negotiating peace with the Elves gives MP per month as well.
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Takes time to travel, so not as immediate. Second, we probably won't be negotiating for months on end, which means less BP than consistent adventuring. (or shouldn't be, really).

EDIT: Also, given the Tomb requires a Cerebration to acquire, I fully expect massive benefits from it.
 
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[X] Journey to the West
[X] Vault of the Ur-Pharoah
-[X] Go Further Beyond

I really prefer [ ] Elvegekere's Protector, but now's not the time or the place. We need to give Suizhen something to do, we need to give Xiaoling something to do, we need to get at least one kingdom out of the line of fire... we need to go to Value Town and fast.

Anyone else hope there's a synergy bonus for having the Midas Touch?
 
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Corripere said:
Just because the Beyond Flesh puts a number on it doesn't mean the Vault isn't a better multiplier, which it probably is if we specialize it into one. Constant priceless-treasure generating monsters at our level is amazing for Cultivation--no more, no less. It's so broken Nameless even mentioned it as something "out of this world." It's an order of magnitude better than the Overgrowth.
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Sure, but we can have both. The difference is simply in the sequence in which we acquire them and which spell we can still improve later.
 
EFB flesh does let us not give Zang Kong direct access to our body, though.

Which is important.
 
Corripere said:
Takes time to travel, so not as immediate. Second, we probably won't be negotiating for months on end, which means less BP than consistent adventuring. (or shouldn't be, really).
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Will take roughly the same amount of time probably since it's been stated traveling to the Center is the one that takes the most time.

Also, we finally learn what the fuck Naturalism is and it may actually let Xiaoling do something half as useful as potentially free Beyond Reality and Grand stages Suizhen could give us.
Corripere said:
EDIT: Also, given the Tomb requires a Cerebration to acquire, I fully expect massive benefits from it.
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Yeah, information on the Heroine was also from Cerebration. Fat load of good that's done us so far.

Besides, better to increase our base strength before going into the Tomb. Don't want to run face first into a Soul Chrysalis level trap at Ego Barrier.
 
Rask said:
Sure, but we can have both. The difference is simply in the sequence in which we acquire them and which spell we can still improve later.
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The shitty FB of Flesh and the fact that we can just get the EFB later makes the Flesh diagram just not as good as the Vault. Endless scaling Priceless Treasures is just too good.

As for destinations, the Netherine is likely the last real dungeon we can take advantage of, and it's right up our alley - where practitioners of single schools have failed, we will succeed by overcoming single-school counters. It's also going to give us an MM for every month it takes (which we desperately need for Truth) and we can send our Lackeys (mostly Suizhen) into our Vault to farm while we do it!
 
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Deathbybunnies said:
The shitty FB of Flesh and the fact that we can just get the EFB later makes the Flesh diagram just not as good as the Vault. Endless scaling Priceless Treasures is just too good.

As for destinations, the Netherine is likely the last real dungeon we can take advantage of, and it's right up our alley - where practitioners of single schools have failed, we will succeed by overcoming single-school counters. It's also going to give us an MM for every month it takes, which we desperately need for Truth, and we can send our Lackies (mostly Suizhen) into our Vault to farm while we do it!
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It's lucridous to believe the thread will have the discipline to save up a whopping 10 BP. The primary competition for our current remaining BP is PK, and that even with 1'1'1'10 is already difficult. Wanting us to get a total of 26 extra BP before Zang Kong awakens.. it's a bit much!
 
Deathbybunnies said:
The shitty FB of Flesh and the fact that we can just get the EFB later makes the Flesh diagram just not as good as the Vault. Endless scaling Priceless Treasures is just too good.
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Ignore the Flesh FB for the moment, since we wouldn't be buying it. Getting the regular version of the spell right now means the x2.2 is always active, without further input. Even while farming the Vault, which we can simply research in the FB version because we have the BP for it. Besides, farming the Vault would probably interfere with adventuring, unless we delegate it completely to Suizhen, who will get lesser rewards since she's weaker.
 
Simultaneously I disagree with Further Beyond Palimpest of the Nameless One - 0.5 stages is.. really meh for 2 BP.
 
[X] Tomb of the Netherine
[X] Vault of the Ur-Pharaoh

We might as well get it while we're here.
 
Rask said:
Ignore the Flesh FB for the moment, since we wouldn't be buying it. Getting the regular version of the spell right now means the x2.2 is always active, without further input. Even while farming the Vault, which we can simply research in the FB version because we have the BP for it. Besides, farming the Vault would probably interfere with adventuring, unless we delegate it completely to Suizhen, who will get lesser rewards since she's weaker.
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...define weaker. Because if I remember correctly, she now has a combat stage power of roughly 6.65.
 
Shard said:
It's lucridous to believe the thread will have the discipline to save up a whopping 10 BP. The primary competition for our current remaining BP is PK, and that even with 1'1'1'10 is already difficult. Wanting us to get a total of 26 extra BP before Zang Kong awakens.. it's a bit much!
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I think it's very doable, given how our subjective time keeps improving and we actually haven't been around for all that much objective time (admittedly not including the childhood stages). And the thread is strongly incentivised to save for EFBs rather than splurge on smaller purchases now we have an EFB refund. I honestly doubt we'll be spending more than 2-3BP outside of EFBs from now on - this vote being the exception due to the whole "can spend incrementally" thing.
 
Shard said:
I still maintain that 1 BP Vault is sufficient for our purposes. 3 BP and 10 BP are overkill.
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You think? I admit, I'm less sure about that. I felt that the improved quality of the Treasures and the fact that we'd be spending the BP on it eventually anyway made it worth it.

What exactly do the Priceless Treasures do, anyway? I've been thinking of them as a generic Cultivation multiplier, but if we're getting a lot of them and their effects are more varied than that they could be really quite potent.
 
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