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The Elder Scrolls
Hykal94
Orange Estus Kitteh
- Location
- Firelink Shrine
Honestly? Not that fussed over not having an Obsidian Elder Scrolls, especially not with how Outer Worlds turned out.
It wouldn't have mattered if Bethesda did the QA or not because Obsidian was never going to fix the bugs that got caught due to them being recorded by fucking pen and paper.
It wouldn't have mattered if Bethesda did the QA or not because Obsidian was never going to fix the bugs that got caught due to them being recorded by fucking pen and paper.
blast flame
How far will we go if it means lighting the way?
- Location
- Perth, Australia
- Pronouns
- They/Them
We do have Avowed coming so we'll get to see how Obsidian does a first person fantasy game. I'm personally looking forward to it.
Yeah I'm curious to see how Avowed plays out- Outer Worlds was a pretty uneven experience (in a way oddly reminiscent of Fallout 3 and Oblivion, interestingly), so it will be interesting to see whether it was a one-off miss or whether Obsidian is just better at doing its own stuff than Bethesda clones*
*It is a little funny that Obsidian developed a Fallout competitor and began development on an Elder Scrolls competitor right before Microsoft bought both them and Bethesda
*It is a little funny that Obsidian developed a Fallout competitor and began development on an Elder Scrolls competitor right before Microsoft bought both them and Bethesda
The gameplay of the Outer Worlds was fine for me; it was the story and setting that were mediocre. With Avowed being in the Pillars setting, it hopefully shouldn't have that problem.
Depends on the lead. I think Tim Cain and Leonard Boyarsky are washed up but I'd trust Sawyer to have made something at least passable.
- Location
- USA
Ouch, I missed the anniversary date. I like how they relegated the "yes, we are actively developing TES VI" to the second-to-last paragraph. 
View: https://www.threads.net/@bethesdagamestudios/post/C48JmnWuDtZ
View: https://www.threads.net/@bethesdagamestudios/post/C48JmnWuDtZ
Hykal94
Orange Estus Kitteh
- Location
- Firelink Shrine
- Location
- Georgia, US
- Pronouns
- He/Him
It's really interesting how Bethesda is essentially the nega-Ubisoft. Instead of constantly pumping out games semi-regularly from a billion subsidiary studios they spend half a fucking decade (at best) making a single game. They're a massive studio but they can't make more then one game at a time and I don't know how I feel about that lol. To their credit they've clearly rejected the Ubisofication of AAA development but by going in the extreme opposite direction.
One nice thing about Starfield means that I don't have to feel annoyed by it, if there's a good chance that Elder Scrolls 6 will suck then having to wait 5+ years for it doesn't really bother me.
One nice thing about Starfield means that I don't have to feel annoyed by it, if there's a good chance that Elder Scrolls 6 will suck then having to wait 5+ years for it doesn't really bother me.
Hykal94
Orange Estus Kitteh
- Location
- Firelink Shrine
Bethesda isn't actually a big studio personnel-wise. They're actually small-ish. It's just that Starfield had a lot more people working on it.
And it seems to be a detriment to the quality of the game itself. There's a recent article where the lead quest designer of SF said they didn't have enough time to make the quest to their satisfaction.
Mind you, the game had more than five years of development time and they still felt rush. It seems to me Bethesda works best as a small tightly knit studio vs a massive one.
And it seems to be a detriment to the quality of the game itself. There's a recent article where the lead quest designer of SF said they didn't have enough time to make the quest to their satisfaction.
Article: Starfield's lead quest designer had 'absolutely no time' and had to hit the 'panic button' so the game would have a satisfying final quest
During the talk, Shen and Brigner discussed the design of a couple of memorable quests from Skyrim and Fallout 4, like House of Horrors, where the player investigates a haunted house, and Last Voyage of the U.S.S. Constitution, where robots enlist the player to return an 18th century naval frigate to the sea. Near the end of the talk, Shen spoke about the final quest of Starfield—specifically, what it was lacking.
"We were finally at a state in the project where we could play through the whole [game]. And it became very clear that we were missing the large final location that was going to tie the story together and have a satisfying action-filled payoff," Shen said. "I was both implementing the main quest and leading the quest design team, so I had absolutely no time. The entire quest design was already overbooked."
Part of the issue, Shen said, was the sheer size of the team working on Starfield. Skyrim's development team was around 100 people, which made collaboration between different departments easier. That team size grew to about 150 for Fallout 4, then over 350 for Fallout 76, and 500+ for Starfield. That's not just Bethesda Game Studios but outside developers like Machine Games, Nobody Studios, Arkane, Snowed In, and The Forge Interactive.
Mind you, the game had more than five years of development time and they still felt rush. It seems to me Bethesda works best as a small tightly knit studio vs a massive one.
- Location
- Georgia, US
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Am I right for considering this a sign of shocking incompetence? I mean, there's no doubt that making a game with 300+ people is hard as hell but they're a AAA company. Managing personnel numbers of that size is intrinsic to the concept lol
It just says very bad things about Bethesda's leadership and organizational practices that they're finding the growth so unmanageable.
- Location
- Germany
- Pronouns
- He/Him/They/Them
I'm not sure how effective/valid/(not quite sure about the right word) it'd be to look at Starfield and then build expectations for TES6. After all, the one thing Bethesda always nailed, was to create an amazing world, filled with things to find and stuff to explore. Where you could look at something in the distance, think that it'd look neat, and then walk there and find stuff.
And Starfield has basically none of that thanks to the random generated locations. Which was a baffling decisions. I know that they've wanted to make this game for a while, but it should've been pretty obvious early on that they couldn't make a proper Bethesda game out of Starfield yet. So they should've done it later. At least in my opinion.
However, the good thing is, that it's pretty unlikely that TES6 will need such a system and will (probably) go back to a proper handmade world. Which would deal with the majority of my problems with Starfield at least.
Hykal94
Orange Estus Kitteh
- Location
- Firelink Shrine
Well there's also the article last year too.
I think it says a lot that Will Shen, who's been with Bethesda since Fallout 3, went to make his own studio after Starfield. I would not be surprised people are being frustrated with how the company is working atm. I legitimately thought he was going to be the next Bethesda Guy after Todd retires.
Instead, we're gonna get Emil instead ...
Todd has always been an interesting figure when it comes to game development. Bethesda will not be where it is without his hard work. But it's also clear he's willing to make unpopular direction changes to achieve more stability by removing RP elements with each new game.
I don't remember where I heard it but someone said along the lines of "Bethesda makes a new game, gets new fanbase, makes another game, irritates the old fanbase" and the cycle repeats.
Article: Bethesda's Todd Howard tries "really hard to not be the Last Say Guy"
"All decisions run through Todd."
According to former Bethesda dev Bruce Nesmith, pretty much all decisions about the team's games "run through" Todd Howard, even if the studio head doesn't want that.
Nesmith recently spoke with the YouTube channel MinnMax about all things Bethesda, including when we can expect to hear more about The Elder Scrolls 6. In the interview, he explained his reasoning behind leaving Bethesda, noting it was in part due to just how big the studio had gotten. "There were a lot of changes going on and the structure of the company also was such that, half because of the pandemic and half just because of the necessary changes, you didn't get to interact with Todd as much anymore," Nesmith explained.
Nesmith doesn't seem to hold any kind of grudge against Howard though, saying, "When you're running six different studios and you've got a dozen projects going on at a time, he's only one man." While Howard might be responsible for a whole lot more than he used to, that doesn't mean he isn't overseeing most of the creative decisions being made. "All decisions run through Todd. He would hate, hate, hate me for saying that because he doesn't believe it's true. But unfortunately, it is true."
I think it says a lot that Will Shen, who's been with Bethesda since Fallout 3, went to make his own studio after Starfield. I would not be surprised people are being frustrated with how the company is working atm. I legitimately thought he was going to be the next Bethesda Guy after Todd retires.
Instead, we're gonna get Emil instead ...
Todd has always been an interesting figure when it comes to game development. Bethesda will not be where it is without his hard work. But it's also clear he's willing to make unpopular direction changes to achieve more stability by removing RP elements with each new game.
I don't remember where I heard it but someone said along the lines of "Bethesda makes a new game, gets new fanbase, makes another game, irritates the old fanbase" and the cycle repeats.
- Location
- Georgia, US
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I agree. This is why I'm saying that it's "likely to be bad" instead of "it's inevitably going to be bad". Bethesda going back to what they're actually good at is a positive move. However it's worth noting that Starfield hasn't gotten the criticism it has just because of the procgen content, there are other issues with the game such as quest design and worldbuilding that would impact ES6.
I don't expect it to be a good RPG, because Bethesda, but if those issues are not addressed it could be a bad game as a whole. If Starfield couldn't come together correctly it's very possible the same will happen here.
Todd, for all we meme on him, is good manager when he knows all the people in the chain and can chat them up.
He can't do that any more