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SayakaQuest Thread 10: Glory To The Death

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Shironi said:
I'm really not sure what to say here. Kyouko's clearly raging at herself more than anyone else because let's face it, this familiar farming cut a little too close to her. Not to mention they actually succeeded at killing someone intentionally whereas Kyouko only 'didn't save people'.

Any yet, these girls didn't get punished for their actions. They got off scott free, in Kyouko's mind, because of the mitigating mind fuck circumstance of Grey. That we're, hopefully, drafting them 'for the greater good' is, I think in Kyouko's mind, irrelevent. She WANTED them to get punished, if only to seperate herself from them. Clearly these girls will be dealing with the guilt of this, what they did to their friend, what their friend did to them and their actions as a group, for the rest of their lives, but Kyouko's not in any mood to care about that right now.

I mean maybe we could talk about how Sayaka herself doesn't forgive them for killing that man, but damn it, they're not irredemable so she's giving them a shot at redemption. Maybe talk about how Sayaka just didn't want add to her body count. Perhaps Sayaka saying that she forgives Kyouko for what she's done or just thankful that she never stooped this low would work. Then there's always the whole "Blame the System because fuck it" but I don't think that's the right track to go on at this point.

...Maybe we could even talk about how, pragmatically, we need their combat power for Walpurgis and if they die, well, at least it won't be by our hands(lol, IC, what's that. :p).
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Well if we say that she's better than them and that we're giving them a chance because of Kyouko herself...

I dunno.
 
Just saw the modified post....
I need a gif of Captain Picard ordering everyone to abandon ship.
 
Shironi said:
I'm really not sure what to say here. Kyouko's clearly raging at herself more than anyone else because let's face it, this familiar farming cut a little too close to her. Not to mention they actually succeeded at killing someone intentionally whereas Kyouko only 'didn't save people'.

Any yet, these girls didn't get punished for their actions. They got off scott free, in Kyouko's mind, because of the mitigating mind fuck circumstance of Grey. That we're, hopefully, drafting them 'for the greater good' is, I think in Kyouko's mind, irrelevent. She WANTED them to get punished, if only to seperate herself from them. Clearly these girls will be dealing with the guilt of this, what they did to their friend, what their friend did to them and their actions as a group, for the rest of their lives, but Kyouko's not in any mood to care about that right now.

I mean maybe we could talk about how Sayaka herself doesn't forgive them for killing that man, but damn it, they're not irredemable so she's giving them a shot at redemption. Maybe talk about how Sayaka just didn't want add to her body count. Perhaps Sayaka saying that she forgives Kyouko for what she's done or just thankful that she never stooped this low would work. Then there's always the whole "Blame the System because fuck it" but I don't think that's the right track to go on at this point.

...Maybe we could even talk about how, pragmatically, we need their combat power for Walpurgis and if they die, well, at least it won't be by our hands(lol, IC, what's that. :p).
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This isn't about them, it's about Kyoko. That was pretty much said outright in the new post. If she wanted them punished it's because she thinks she deserves to be.
 
Torgamous said:
This isn't about them, it's about Kyoko. That was pretty much said outright in the new post. If she wanted them punished it's because she thinks she deserves to be.
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We should mention that even though we consider Familiar farming horrible, we got to know Kyouko first, and learned that she wasnt a horrible person.
By no means are we just letting this incident slip by, but we know that justice isn't black and white, and we cannot treat it as such.
 
...

If anything, reassurance is what'd be called for, but we probably want to keep talking to Kyouko before properly answering.
 
Reassuring Kyouko is, I think, the correct choice here. Well, that and getting some food because food never hurts when it comes to Kyouko. That said, it doesn't matter if how much we reassure her if she herself doesn't believe it. As Torg pointed out what I was implying with my earlier post, I think Kyouko herself doesn't think she should be forgiven. Hell, IIRC, we never actually forgave Kyouko for her Familiar Farming back when she revealed it, we just hugged her and said "that's all in the past."

However, Sayaka herself saying "oh yeah, Kyouko, I forgive you for killing people" isn't...really an IC thing for her to say and truly mean. I mean Sayaka hasn't forgiven herself for killing Sora or Haruko and that was freaking self defense and in the middle of a life or death fight. Then again, this is Kyouko we're talking about and lol-unhealthy-codependant-relationship-ahoy and all that.

Largely, I feel that this isn't an issue that we can ever fully solve within the scope the quest. Patch it up so it's not dragging us down for the next 6 days? Sure. Solve? No.
 
Well, in that case, shouldn't we be attacking this from the perspective that a) we think Kyouko deserves to be forgiven, b)we're giving them a chance because we think they could be like Kyouko?
 
[x] Take Kyouko out to eat. Your treat.
-[x] "Kyouko, remember how we first met? I didn't even know you. You weren't my girlfriend, or even a close friend. Remember how we started working together? You were hurting and I couldn't stand that. I know you don't like how those girls got off scott free. And I still don't excuse them, not completely anyway. But if I just condemned them, I couldn't stand it. Not because I think they're innocent, but because I can't just watch someone destroy themselves and do nothing to stop it. No one deserves to be called a monster before they can tell their side. If I didn't believe that, we wouldn't be here now, right?

[X] You aren't a monster. You're someone who lost her family because one bunny-cat didn't read the fine fucking print for you. So every time you start calling yourself one, I'll deny it. Because watching you tear yourself apart like this? It's worse than how you look when I get myself hurt. You are a good person Kyouko. Please, never forget that.

EDIT: No worries Ugo. Just so long as it comes through, I'm happy. A little credit doesn't hurt though.

2nd Edit:Check the write-in.

3rd Edit: Again, check write-in.

4th Edit: New Write-in.
 
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I change my vote to
[x] Lancerfire

TheOneMoiderah said:
The post has been changed. It has been modified to fit your screen.
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Onboard the USS SayakaQuest....
"Oh god, Captain!" the Ensign yelled, "Moid has changed the post!"
"Onscreen," the Captain ordered.
"...No...." the Captain gasped as the entire crew gaped in horror.

Everyone staggered under the blow of the edit. People ran about aimlessly as they attempted to correct the situation.
"What do we do, Captain?" the Lieutenant screamed, "What do we do?!"
"No hope!" the Captain wailed, "There's no way out! All hands, brace for impact, all hands brace for-!"

UPDATE.
 
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Really not sold on "Everyone has baggage. So stop throwing a self-loathing seminar and finish your fries." but love the rest of that one, Lancer. Sorry for the butchery:

Hmm, yeah, actually holding off for now because NSMS pointed out the issues.

[]Lancer Fire without the last two lines.
 
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I really don't like that write-in. Specifically, this bit: 'if we never met? I honestly think I would've thought you were some villain or monster. Instead, we're...very close friends,'

First part of it (villain and a monster) comes way too close to saying 'yes, Kyouko, you are a terrible person, and it's only the fact I decided I liked you first that kept me from declaring you an irredeemable monster'. I know that's not the intent of it, and the opposite is said later on in the write-in, but I definitely got some vibes of that when I first read through it. Second part ('close friends'), in that context, could be taken to mean 'I no longer feel so close to you/want to be your girlfriend'.
 
NSMS said:
I really don't like that write-in. Specifically, this bit: 'if we never met? I honestly think I would've thought you were some villain or monster. Instead, we're...very close friends,'

First part of it (villain and a monster) comes way too close to saying 'yes, Kyouko, you are a terrible person, and it's only the fact I decided I liked you first that kept me from declaring you an irredeemable monster'. I know that's not the intent of it, and the opposite is said later on in the write-in, but I definitely got some vibes of that when I first read through it. Second part ('close friends'), in that context, could be taken to mean 'I no longer feel so close to you/want to be your girlfriend'.
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Close friends annoyed me too, but I didn't point it out because I'm assuming we'd have enough leeway for that not to sabotage the write-in's intent. The first bit...eh, I can see your point.
 
NSMS said:
I really don't like that write-in. Specifically, this bit: 'if we never met? I honestly think I would've thought you were some villain or monster. Instead, we're...very close friends,'

First part of it (villain and a monster) comes way too close to saying 'yes, Kyouko, you are a terrible person, and it's only the fact I decided I liked you first that kept me from declaring you an irredeemable monster'. I know that's not the intent of it, and the opposite is said later on in the write-in, but I definitely got some vibes of that when I first read through it. Second part ('close friends'), in that context, could be taken to mean 'I no longer feel so close to you/want to be your girlfriend'.
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Perhaps an elimination of the pause and the keeping of using 'girlfriends' would help?
 
Lancer Fire said:
Perhaps an elimination of the pause and the keeping of using 'girlfriends' would help?
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That would be better, yeah. But honestly, my main concern is the first part that I pointed out- it just comes too close to giving what (in Kyouko's mind) seems like confirmation that she is a terrible person for me to feel comfortable with it.
 
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So we're leaving the witch to Homura then? This is going to look great when she finds out we went on a date, regardless of how necessary it is. Still, bestgirl takes precedence.
 
NSMS said:
That would be better, yeah. But honestly, my main concern is the first part that I pointed out- it just comes too close to confirming (in Kyouko's mind) that she is a terrible person for me to feel comfortable with it.
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Any suggestions to keep that thought from forming? I'm a bit empty.
 
Lancer Fire said:
Any suggestions to keep that thought from forming? I'm a bit empty.
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Honestly? I'd say scrap that write-in and start over. I'm trying to come up with one, but my brain's currently a bit fried so it's slow going and I'm not happy with what I've got.
 
NSMS said:
Honestly? I'd say scrap that write-in and start over. I'm trying to come up with one, but my brain's currently a bit fried so it's slow going and I'm not happy with what I've got.
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I'm trying, but I can't think of something right now. I'll get back ASAP. I'm sorry for doing this now of all times.
 
[] Kyouko... remember how we met? And how we hit it off so well? I didn't know a thing about you back then, Kyouko. You were just a friend, not my girlfriend, or even a close friend. Remember how we started working together? You were hurting, and I didn't like seeing you like that.
-[] So yeah... I want to save everyone who I can. I know you don't like how those girls got off like they did, but... I'm not saying they're completely blameless, but they didn't want to turn themselves into murderers. They made a fucked up mistake, and because of that they did terrible things. That doesn't make them bad people, it makes them girls who got fucked up by a stupid fucking bunny-cat.
-[] I know what happened with you wasn't even remotely the same as what they did. The reasons, the actions... none of it. But the truth behind it... that's close enough. You're not a bad person, you're someone who got fucked over by Kyuubey and this system of his. And even if that wasn't true... you're still my girlfriend. And I still love you.
-[] If you truly think you're such a monster, then I'll deny it every time. Because seeing you tear yourself apart like this... it's worse than how you look at me when I get hurt. You are a good person, Kyouko. And don't you ever doubt it.

Heavily modified from Lancer Fire's, and I will say up-front that I'm not happy with it. Comparing Kyouko in any way to those girls is risky, and I think it over-emphasises 'the system is to blame/you're victims' too much (and we've already hammered that one in to the ground in previous talks). And there are probably other flaws too. But my creative side is currently a bit burnt out from writing stuff for my quests, so this is the best I can do. Basically: please don't vote for this- instead, either ignore it, or use it as inspiration for a decent write-in.
 
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