General Exalted Thread
Right, I know that.
The contention was that the (Primordial) Cosmic Principle created through the Howl of the Devil Tiger pathway was different from (Yozi) Cosmic Principle, because the new charmset does not represent a Yozi. Thus, the Devil Tiger could pursue their own Cosmic Principle, but not those of the Yozis.
Yozi and primordials are political differences.
Its been something of a thing up until now that if an attack would qualify as an area-of-effect (either due to size or range or what-have-you), you need to be able to move completely outside of its maximum distance with the use of that dodge, otherwise the defense attempt simply fails before it has the chance to check for things like Perfection.
Inapplicability-trumping dodges still function as defenses in this case, but now you have to cope with the fact you are still within that area. But now its mere seconds after the attack has resolved, which in the case of the mountain example, likely means buried harmlessly under thousands of tons of rubble.
I'm... pretty sure that's wrong is what I'm saying. I said, specifically, that if you create a You charm tree via Triumphant Howl, you can't then learn (You) Cosmic Principle.
Walker of the Yellow Path
Ho There!
- Location
- The Land of Memes
It's a semantic quibble on the fact that it uses Yozi (On the ground that Yozi are Primordials stuck in hell) rather than just saying Primordial Cosmic Principle. It's stupid because as C.o.S.a.R says, The difference between a Yozi and Primordial is mostly political.
Ah, I misread (You) as (Yozi). My bad.
IIRC They specifically had an elder essence dodge charm for dodging aoe events you couldn't move away from (like a mountain falling on you) in DotFA, which, if I'm not misremembering, does suggest other charms don't do that.
- Location
- Snowbound Wilderness
An oddity there would be that the dodge charm would assure that a space under the rubble large enough to hold you exists.
notthepenguins
Neither Spherical Nor Frictionless
- Pronouns
- He/She/They
It suggests that they don't move you. But if your Perfect Dodge trumps applicability, you can dodge it anyway. Because Exalted bullshit.
I found the Charm I was thinking of:
DIVINE WITNESS OF UTTER SAFETY
Cost: — (+4m); Mins: Dodge 5, Essence 5; Type: Permanent
Keywords: Mirror, Obvious
Duration: Permanent
Prerequisite Charms: Leaping Dodge Method, Seven Shadow Evasion
When the Primordials once uprooted mountains and cast them down against the armies of the gods. The Solar Exalted, embarrassed by such clumsy efforts, learned to absent themselves from the paths of these excessive demonstrations. A character who has learned this Charm may pay a four mote surcharge when invoking Seven Shadow Evasion to avoid an attack which inflicts damage on everything within an area (such as Lambent Bolt of Annihilation). The Solar's dodge deposits her at the nearest safe edge of the damage effect, if that location is within (Essence x 50) yards; walls and other obstacles are no impediment to this evasion. She may also carry out any consenting characters she is protecting with Defend Other actions at the time of activation. At Dodge 6+, Essence 6+ this restriction disappears, and the Solar's leaping dodges will carry her as far as necessary to remove her from the effect.
DIVINE WITNESS OF UTTER SAFETY
Cost: — (+4m); Mins: Dodge 5, Essence 5; Type: Permanent
Keywords: Mirror, Obvious
Duration: Permanent
Prerequisite Charms: Leaping Dodge Method, Seven Shadow Evasion
When the Primordials once uprooted mountains and cast them down against the armies of the gods. The Solar Exalted, embarrassed by such clumsy efforts, learned to absent themselves from the paths of these excessive demonstrations. A character who has learned this Charm may pay a four mote surcharge when invoking Seven Shadow Evasion to avoid an attack which inflicts damage on everything within an area (such as Lambent Bolt of Annihilation). The Solar's dodge deposits her at the nearest safe edge of the damage effect, if that location is within (Essence x 50) yards; walls and other obstacles are no impediment to this evasion. She may also carry out any consenting characters she is protecting with Defend Other actions at the time of activation. At Dodge 6+, Essence 6+ this restriction disappears, and the Solar's leaping dodges will carry her as far as necessary to remove her from the effect.
Sucal
The Devil’s Cut
- Location
- Bottom of the barrel
I'd rather just perfectly parry/soak the attack, forcing it to stop dead at the touch of my fingers.
That makes me wonder: Would you rather have a Perfect Defense do something you wouldn't expect (Seven Shadows teleporting you away from an AoE attack), or be required to use an appropriate PD instead? (A soak to negate the damage of AoE, as parry would only block the portion directly hitting you, leaving you open to "splash damage").
Roadie
A plate full of blins and a cat nearby.
This sounds about right.
Note that in 3e the "perfect" defenses (only SSE is probably still a true perfect) actually provide scene-long protection against "uncountable" damage (aka avalanches, Yozi-size attacks, Gem exploding, etc), despite being weaker against human-scale attacks.
I personally kind of like the "he drops dead five days later" interpretation if the Third Circle knows about it instantly-it leads to more plot hooks as you have given a Third Circle 5 days to try to take post-mortem revenge on you.
Probably not the most canon answer but it feels the coolest.
azoicennead
Overly-Affectionate Zombie Squad
- Pronouns
- He/They
What would happen if you attacked a 3CD in multiple places? E.g. find Ligier in Creation while your buddies find him in Malfeas and (through unspecified means) attack simultaneously.
Is there an advantage to doing this?
Is there an advantage to doing this?
That would be interesting. I could see it going both ways, depending on how the story was structured. If this was the culmination of a story I might just have them drop dead there. If it was something more accidental or less purposeful, then having the post-mortem revenge could be much more interesting.
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Doubtful. One group is attacking Ligier, a dude with a sword, while the other group is trying to loose arrows at a giant flaming ball of essence way up in the sky.
Each body present radically different challenges. And since the demon can co-locate and operate without difficulty, splitting his attention is probably not something that occurs.
Kylar
In Training Forever
- Location
- Canada
Splitting his mote pool, however, might be.
(Honestly, if you've managed to set up a dual pronged assault to go off in two different dimensions at the same time, you damn well have earned some kind of advantage.)
azoicennead
Overly-Affectionate Zombie Squad
- Pronouns
- He/They
You're focusing too much on the example, rather than the general idea.
notthepenguins
Neither Spherical Nor Frictionless
- Pronouns
- He/She/They
Ligier's sole mode of interaction in Malfeas is not 'the sun.'
Oh hey, Holden has posted something nice for once for players who don't like the BP/XP split. It almost makes up for his snippiness at a legitimate concern.
Holden said:
Sucal
The Devil’s Cut
- Location
- Bottom of the barrel
Wow.
Actually acting like a developer for once, rather then being bratty about people disliking his 'masterpiece'.
EDIT: Ok, so this post is kind of rude but really, I don't really like Scaling XP which the BP/XP divide makes one of the systems real flaws. Means that If I want to do a thing, I need to start as its master off screen (especially with Supernal) rather then have my character slowly progress through it.
Actually acting like a developer for once, rather then being bratty about people disliking his 'masterpiece'.
EDIT: Ok, so this post is kind of rude but really, I don't really like Scaling XP which the BP/XP divide makes one of the systems real flaws. Means that If I want to do a thing, I need to start as its master off screen (especially with Supernal) rather then have my character slowly progress through it.
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When you've got people dissatisfied with certain core rules, but satisfied with others, don't think of this as a problem! Think of it as a business opportunity!
I know a lot of people liked nWoD Mirrors, and that was full of only moderately-tested optional rules which would fuck with balance but some people thought would make the game more fun, or made more sense. The Mutants & Masterminds book which brought out a lot of potentially unbalancing optional rules (like multiple actions, which as everyone knows tend to be hilariously OP) was also reasonably popular-and it let you basically change the game any way you wanted, to the point where you could basically turn it back into D20 Modern if you felt like it, or completely shift its balance one way or another.
Obviously this takes dev time, but if people are interested in it, audience members may well be willing to pay to be catered to.