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General Exalted Thread

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A lot of technological advancement both in settings and in our real world is less about inventing a new idea whole cloth (little in our world is, in fact) and more about taking previous ideas and improving on them, or taking something that doesn't work and discovering something new that makes it work.

Something I find irksome is that you'll have PCs that want to form a modern-style democracy or whatever because that's "just the way things ought to be", but I call bullcrap on that, that's what you the player think it should be. Which isn't a problem on its own, mind, but your character doesn't have any reason to think this way. You didn't grow up in a modern democracy, you grew up as a guild factor's daughter, or in a society where noble blood *literally* can give you magical powers to be better than everyone. Imagine how insane it would sound to somebody to suggest that a dragon blood should have no more say in the government's operations than a random rice farmer appropo of nothing.

It's obvious that you're doing this for a meta reason rather than an in-world one and moreover it's *boring*.

Democracy didn't start out as giving every person in a country the right to make decisions that would affect the whole country, it started out as an outgrowth of oligarchy. Constitutional monarchy came about because the noble class was sick of giving up their power to their king. We had steam engines for centuries before the industrial revolution, it was only when coal was discovered that steam power suddenly had a use (coal is a very dirty source of energy but it used to be plentiful on the earth's surface and it burned easily so it made for a good source of heat).

If you're going to advance society or tech in some way start by building off what's already there. In one game I was in a charlatan in a store was selling firewands that didn't require firedust to shoot. My Night Caste was curious how that worked so he stole it and examined it. He found that the wand had been made by breaking a fire-aspected hearthstone and sticking one of the shards into the gun's mechanism. In the south, the gun reloads essentially automatically, but this sort of weapon is also flimsy and will only last for so long before it needs to be repaired in full or given a replacement hearthstone shard.

Which immediately raises questions like "okay, what if the hearthstone was air aspected instead, could I shoot lightning?" or "how small do the shards need to be for this to work, would one hearthstone be able to equip a size 5 battle group?"

And really I think that's what advancement like this comes down to. Don't give me an endpoint, or even what you think is an endpoint, give me something that's interesting to play with and leads to new ideas. If you want your character to think everyone deserves to be equal under the law how do you square that with things like the dragon's blood? Both in the sense of it being a counter-argument, and in how you'd make a system that counteracts that sort of influence. If your Cynis thinks total abolition is necessary and right how do you advance that cause when your opinion is frankly not that popular even in your own house?

I'm not here to hear a treatise on how your moral philosophy is the BEST EVAR, or to see you bring modern tech I already know about into a medevial world, I'm here to see how you bring your ideas into the world and how the world reacts to them. If you want to bring things like modern democracy or cars into Exalted, fine. But how are you going to do that? What drives you to decide these are good ideas, and how are you going to make it happen in this unique setting?
 
March Lords are pretty interesting, but could use some more work imo, the God-Admirals are absolutely rad and have great aesthetics, you just have to ignore all the screaming of the damned inside your soul.
 
HalfTangible said:
Democracy didn't start out as giving every person in a country the right to make decisions that would affect the whole country, it started out as an outgrowth of oligarchy. Constitutional monarchy came about because the noble class was sick of giving up their power to their king. We had steam engines for centuries before the industrial revolution, it was only when coal was discovered that steam power suddenly had a use (coal is a very dirty source of energy but it used to be plentiful on the earth's surface and it burned easily so it made for a good source of heat).
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Little nitpick, but this is not wholly true; modern democracy started as an outgrowth of noble-dominated oligarchy, but is based on an essentially different tradition of democratic decision-making. Ancient demokratia, such as what was practiced in ancient Greece, emerged specifically in opposition to oligarkhia, and was notably called isonomia (equality) just as often as demokratia. Though, the reason I mention this is mostly to actually emphasize your point, because for centuries after centuries, electoral and ballot-based systems were not actually seen as democratic, they were seen as aristocratic measures that relied on the individual wealth of candidates, while sortition was the democratic measure that levelled distinctions between legislators, and fostered "political lifestyles", by sorting citizens through many different little institutions and councils. You can even see this as late as the French Revolution, where early revolutionaries still disagreed heavily on whether relying on suffrage or sortition was the right move. The modern system of representative democracy would be referred to, perhaps, as a kind of psemnokratia in ancient Greece; rule by ballot. Worth thinking about for Exalted, and for the kinds of social models that predominate.
 
ichypa said:
March Lords are pretty interesting, but could use some more work imo
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I think, for me at least, the main thing missing from March Lords right now is how they interact as a group.
If I had to work out something from just their Essence presentation I'd assume that the Magic School Bus was very likely to detour for your fellow March Lords and thus keep bringing them into proximity with each other like if the Time Lords had a communal TARDIS.
 
I've been trying to conjure up an idea for a Lunar solo game (as in, true solo with oracles and whatnot and not one-on-one with a storyteller) for a while now, and I keep getting stumped. The best idea I've gotten is a Blades in the Dark-inspired game set in the city of Chanos, because that city feels like the best equivalent to Duskvol in Creation. However, House Sesus and the the Air Fleet are both right there so it seems like a really fraught location to set up shop for a PC fresh off character creation. I guess I'm asking a multitude of questions here:

1. To those who would know better than I would: per the fiction of Exalted 3e, would Chanos be an impossibly difficult location for a solo Lunar to set up shop? At least, to the point where making a game fun and playable would necessitate crafting a significantly warped setting or ensuring ridiculous unforced errors be made by several normally competent factions? There might not be an Essence 5 Dragonblood around every corner, but they're going to be decently common. There might be a particularly observant magistrate in the city. Not everybody is going to be an unthinking zealot of the Immaculate Philosophy, but, per the Realm[1], they have a decent presence there, because House Sesus thinks clean and opulant temples are an impressive status symbol. The city is certainly going to be watched by the Convention on the Center, aka Chejop Kejak's Convention, as well, even if Sidereals are busy as fuck putting out fires all over the goddamn place and can't be everywhere at once. Most pertinently: it is the home of House Sesus, aka the Espionage House. (This is an oversimplification, yes, but that's still their core shtick.) There's almost certainly some room to maneuver in Chanos' criminal underworld, but Sesus' information networks are vast, the Masked Council's spymasters are depicted to be capable, and the House absolutely wouldn't take kindly to the threat to their reputation that an Anathema would represent.

Aside from the motivating factor of "fuck House Sesus," which is fair TBH, is there anything in Chanos that would justify a novice Lunar going in alone to get it? (I'm not asking for specifics, mind. I'm asking the question—and writing this post—more to interrogate myself. Though I wouldn't be averse to broad suggestions.) There's a lot of good and fun scenarios for Lunars where they are just begging to be targeted by the Wyld Hunt, but a Lunar operating in Chanos seems to go beyond simple daring and reach into the sublime realms of the asinine. (For example: why not go after one of Sesus' many satrapies?) I'm not saying that they'd be caught immediately, Lunars can be very good at not being found, even early on, but it does feel like their long-term prospects are slim to none. Even accounting for the fact that they're the protagonist, and thus Built Different somehow. Though perhaps the difficulties faced would make the story of how they managed to worm their way into the city that much more entertaining. Danger doesn't necessarily mean automatic failure. There's plenty of corruption to be had in Chanos, and there's plenty of competing agendas. And of course, there's the old standby of Dynast McDynastface going 'this Anathema is a powerful tool to advance my agenda!' before being obliterated by the Terrifying Argent Friendship Beam.

2. If Chanos IS a no-go zone, as seems likely, what other cities are out there to suit the gothic trappings of Blades in the Dark? Exalted is defined by its setting, and the sorts of stories that one can tell is heavily dependent on where in Creation et al. you're focusing on. I really want to preserve the Gothic atmosphere of Blades, because I really like the aesthetic, but there's only so many places that feel appropriate. The main alternative I had in mind was, maybe surprisingly, Stygia, since it is so riddled with competing factions, all of whom want different things. There could even be an Abyssal wandering about which could be the Lunar's Solar mate! Think of the melodrama! However the main problem with Stygia, even if I were to play a ghost-blooded Lunar, playing one of the (half?) living in the Underworld seems like a recipe for going kaput prematurely, even with Exalted magics. The Sworn to the Grave draft manuscript mentions that people who live in shadowlands for extended periods of time are marked by their time there, similar to Wyld corruption.[2] Whatever effects would occur in a shadowland would no doubt be felt much more strongly in the Underworld proper, I would think. Though a game partially about trying to ward off being tainted by death is at least a decent dramatic conceit. I have indeed read the section of Abyssal Draft Manuscript that mentions that multiple Shahan-yas have Lunar enclaves in the land of the dead, thank you very much.[3] I still think extended time in the Underworld would bad for the health of an Exalt, especially a young Exalt. In any case, setting a game in Stygia at least has the advantage of a potentially very funny situation popping up: the Lunar protagonist teaming up with the ghosts of Immaculates because, despite the centuries of well-earned enmity between Immaculate Philosophy and the Lunar host, both can agree that the Signitories and their allies are worse, somehow.

3. Would 'Blades in the Dark, but with Lunars' even be a good idea for a solo campaign? For this game, I'd want this game to be tense, risky, and dangerous but also rewarding enough to be worth the effort and peril. High highs and low lows, very up and down. Would that balance be practically possible? Or would that balance only be possible with more experienced characters, or with a well-rounded circle? Furthermore, there's the problem that all versions of Exalted are mechanically flawed games at best; I'm planning to use honest-to-god Exalted 3e, whose flaws are terrible and numerous, as discussed in this thread many times already. (Though I do have Crucible of Legend, which might ameliorate a few issues.) I also don't think myself as having either the design chops nor the energy/attention span to cobble together a ruleset for Exalted using Blades in the Dark (or Ironsworn or whatever) as a base, let alone have that theoretical ruleset be halfway decent. However, Exalts, and espeically Lunars, have the capacity to be remarkably self-sufficient, which I think would lend itself to solo roleplay.

uh i mostly wrote this post to work out my own thoughts but also i wanted to post my ramblings to see if other people thought they were anything tldr gothic heists cool but what if they were done by shapeshifting god-mosters?? can creation hold such awesomeness???? like and subscribe for more epic content i guess

[1]
Immaculate pilgrims visit temples — some dating to the Shogunate — that dot the landscape. Most are well-tended, with walls of polished marble. One, the Lapis Pillar Temple, is a tall tower lined with lapis lazuli, built with a Sesus endowment a century ago to showcase and celebrate Chanos' economic might.
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[2]
Enough time spent in a shadowland warps the body and mind of the living. Where the Wyld chaotically transforms, shadowlands draw their residents ever closer to death. Thoughts become morbid and macabre. Physical bodies become pale and gaunt, as if afflicted with illness. Some mortals resist this change easily, while others succumb to death quickly and join the ranks of the Underworld's ghostly population.

Ghostly blessings and ritual magic can mitigate the worst of these changes, but not prevent them utterly — those who dwell within a shadowland are always marked by its influence in time.
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[3]
Even in the Second Age, some Exalts still keep redoubts in the Underworld. More than one shahan-ya maintains a Lunar enclave there, and the Bureau of Destiny's Divisions of Secrets and Endings both record useful routes for Sidereal agents to travel.
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I think Lunar + Blades + Gothic High Fantasy is a great foundation for a game's flavor!

I would not assume that the Underworld has serious health risks for an Exalt. For one thing, Exalts are generally much more resistant to disease in general. For another, Lunars specifically have protection from corruption warping their form thanks to their tattoos. In particular, though, in earlier editions the Underworld was difficult to remain in as a non-Abyssal exalt and that was pretty specifically not brought back in order to make it less punishing and make it easier to play in. The vibe might still be there? Your reading may differ? But I think there's a lot of reasonable worlds in which a Lunar could operate in the Underworld at length without issue, and the cities in 3E are really cool.

I don't have as many thoughts on the viability of Chanos. Surely someone else will.

I have a lot of thoughts about other cities that might work though!

In particular: Champoor, Grieve

Looser on aesthetic but still dense urban locations with lots of Blades-esque hooks for crime and intrigue: Dajaz, Gentian, Goldenseal (in Zhaojun), Greyfalls, Nexus, Wu-Jian

Exactly the aesthetic, but maybe a little more fighting monsters and a little less intrigue in the mix: Whitewall

Sideways pitch just in case it works: Plenilune, the center of the Bull of the North's reeling empire, as Blades at the center of a Mongol conquest rather than an old dense metropolis.
 
akoboldskobold said:
If Chanos IS a no-go zone, as seems likely, what other cities are out there to suit the gothic trappings of Blades in the Dark?
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Port City of Bittern,Voice-of-the-Tides Prefecture, The Western Blessed Isle would be a good bet. It's caverns make an excellent starting point for low stakes build up and the constant influx of new individuals would make gradual exploration into the city proper easier to hide. The sunken parts of the city could make good communities of down trodden to recruit from in terms of NPC candidates and the trade coming into the city could be worked into clever reward systems.
 
akoboldskobold said:
I've been trying to conjure up an idea for a Lunar solo game (as in, true solo with oracles and whatnot and not one-on-one with a storyteller) for a while now, and I keep getting stumped. The best idea I've gotten is a Blades in the Dark-inspired game set in the city of Chanos, because that city feels like the best equivalent to Duskvol in Creation. However, House Sesus and the the Air Fleet are both right there so it seems like a really fraught location to set up shop for a PC fresh off character creation. I guess I'm asking a multitude of questions here:
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Would your plans for this story work if the protagonist is newly exalted? You could say they lived in Chanos and are unwilling to leave after exalting because all of their intimacies (friends, family, enemies, ETC) involve people living in the city. It could be particularly interesting if this includes a family they are unwilling to make aware of their status as a Lunar exalted due to their faith in the Immaculate Order.
 
Potato Anarchy said:
I think Lunar + Blades + Gothic High Fantasy is a great foundation for a game's flavor!

I would not assume that the Underworld has serious health risks for an Exalt. For one thing, Exalts are generally much more resistant to disease in general. For another, Lunars specifically have protection from corruption warping their form thanks to their tattoos. In particular, though, in earlier editions the Underworld was difficult to remain in as a non-Abyssal exalt and that was pretty specifically not brought back in order to make it less punishing and make it easier to play in. The vibe might still be there? Your reading may differ? But I think there's a lot of reasonable worlds in which a Lunar could operate in the Underworld at length without issue, and the cities in 3E are really cool.

I don't have as many thoughts on the viability of Chanos. Surely someone else will.

I have a lot of thoughts about other cities that might work though!

In particular: Champoor, Grieve

Looser on aesthetic but still dense urban locations with lots of Blades-esque hooks for crime and intrigue: Dajaz, Gentian, Goldenseal (in Zhaojun), Greyfalls, Nexus, Wu-Jian

Exactly the aesthetic, but maybe a little more fighting monsters and a little less intrigue in the mix: Whitewall

Sideways pitch just in case it works: Plenilune, the center of the Bull of the North's reeling empire, as Blades at the center of a Mongol conquest rather than an old dense metropolis.
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Okay, so:
  • I have a real bad habit of only reading the shit I'm Real Interested in, and otherwise using them as reference books, and thus I overlooked the portion in Fangs at the Gate that says that the tattoos render them immune to Wyld exposure (and also body-only Shaping effects). That's a fuckup on my part, my bad. I should endeavor to better myself and read my splatbooks books front-to-back. Eventually. Hopefully.
  • I think I'm drawn to Blades because it's a gothic setting rather than a crime setting. I'm more about strange esoteric mysteries and unspeakable horrors from beyond the veil than getting rich or dying trying. I like intrigue, I like political drama, I'm a fan of old friends realizing that they have to fight now, but I want something with a bit of the strange in it, rather than a straight-up crime story.
  • Champoor is, I think, the clear winner out of everyone. There's gothic elements with the dominant Court of Secrets, there's the crime bullshit, there's a reason for the Lunar to be here (to check the expansion of Prasad), and it especially has the fucking vibes. The ideas are percolating as we speak.
  • Grieve hasn't been fleshed out much in 3e, and I've never been much of a vampire guy; I think I'd like it better if it was Exalted Yharnam, but that seems to be the domain of Whitewall instead.
  • Dajaz is a no. Like, I think I get the angle, but I feel like it's a city where you send Sidereals, or where a circle of Infernals set up shop, but it's not a setting that really meshes well with Lunar themes and motifs I don't think.
  • I have no idea what a Lunar is supposed to do in Gentian. There's three schools of Immaculacy here—am I supposed to Yojimbo them somehow? That would be very funny, though.
  • I don't even really see what's compelling about Goldenseal, TBH? Other than the fact that it's a prime target for infiltration from a Lunar affiliated with the Bronze Tide.
  • I don't think Greyfalls really has the vibe I'm going for. Sure, it's a prime target for a Lunar conspiracy, but it doesn't feel like it really has the potential to fall from internal scheming as much as it has the potential to fall from a concerted Lunar campaign against it. Maybe I'm wrong. No, I'm probably wrong.
  • I feel like I should like Nexus more than I do. It's clearly a good vessel for crime stories, and it's fertile ground for a Changing Moon revolutionary who fucking hates the Guild, but, like… IDK, maybe I'd like something a bit more organized for my setting.
  • Wu-Jian is fun, but let's be real, it's a wuxia setting. Underground martial arts for days! Yes there's some gothic elements, like the fae and their big-ass coral birds, but they're subservient to the crime and martial arts bullshit. There's absolutely a great solo Lunar campaign here, but it's not really Blades in the Dark, I don't think. You're swearing to avenge your dead parent before the Lunar ruin lying underwater (your spirit shape is aquatic probably) and then getting into a tournament arc after a training montage.
  • Whitewall I think is good because it's a slowly building pressure cooker. A lot of angry, petty politics to be had in a city up against a wall. Monster fighting's gonna be a good break from relentless intrigue, anyway. It's not a straight-up a Blades in the Dark place, but it can absolutely be made to work, I think.
  • Eh, Plenilune's so dominated by Yurgen Kaneko that I don't really know what to do with it.
A couple other places that I feel are worth mentioning:
  • Calin is great. Big merchant republic vibes. Obnoxious plutocracy. Simmering resentment. Grand noble houses forever looking backwards. For some reason I picture all the nobles are constantly dueling like they're Utena or something. Wait. Revolutionary Calinti Lunar SEND TWEET.
  • The Skullstone Archipelago is absolutely gothic enough and filled with enough desire for change that it would make a good Lunar campaign, but… it's so much more an Abyssal campaign location than a Lunar one. I don't have the ability to explain this and I'm probably not reading things too well, I should be going to bed soon.
Places I'm going to be thinking about: Stygia, Champoor, Whitewall, Wu-Jian, not!Yharnam, Calin
 
akoboldskobold said:
  • Dajaz is a no. Like, I think I get the angle, but I feel like it's a city where you send Sidereals, or where a circle of Infernals set up shop, but it's not a setting that really meshes well with Lunar themes and motifs I don't think.
  • I have no idea what a Lunar is supposed to do in Gentian. There's three schools of Immaculacy here—am I supposed to Yojimbo them somehow? That would be very funny, though.
  • I don't even really see what's compelling about Goldenseal, TBH? Other than the fact that it's a prime target for infiltration from a Lunar affiliated with the Bronze Tide.
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Lunars being able to move outside of, within, and between social structures and bend them to their needs is a major theme both in the Lunar charmset and just in terms of what they do in the setting. Social focused Changing Moons in particular kind of thrive on like, that kind of stratified society full of norms that they can twist to their advantage or tear down. Working around Immaculates is also a regular part of Lunar play. With Dajaz in particular, I think it's a very narrow view of Lunars to assume that because a place is related to demons and hell that it doesn't work with Lunar motifs. Lunars are also divine apex predators that spirits of all kinds -- gods, demons, ghosts, or elementals -- have real cause to be wary of.

Champoor does really sound like it's the best for what you actually want here, though.
 
I had some rather interesting events happen in my Essence game recently.

Firstly, our Infernal, Ruination of Sanctity, asks us for a bunch of unrelated things as we reach Whitewall. Flint, my Getimian, is tasked with getting silk.

So he goes out and finds a Fae and makes a deal. Silk for stories that have never been told in this Creation, and then makes a wager: If the Fae beats him in a game of gateway, he'll never tell the stories to anyone else. If he beats the Fae, the Fae has to give him something extra, on top of the silk.

The creature of the Wyld naturally starts cheating by bending reality. This would work, except for the fact that Flint is not only wicked smart, he's a Getimian. Flint is just flat-out better at warping reality.

There's also a side excursion where Flint pilots the airship so our Solar can buy loads of fireworks.

It turns out we were right, these errands were for Ruin's girlfriend Lunar mate fiancée, and Ruin is very bad at lying.

Then there is a meeting with the three gods who rule Whitewall, but something is off. We twig to the Sidereal hit squad and book it, but it turns out they were serious, because here is Saturn-damn Chejop Kejak leading over a score of the Five-Score Fellowship.

During this chase, a Getimian we've been calling Gardner reaches out via sorcery, as she's been trying to track down Flint after Flint teed off Rakan Thulio something fierce. Gardner is trying to cajole the circle's location out of Flint, and Flint's response is "How badly does Rakan Thulio want to punch Chejop Kejak?"

"What? If you're being hunted by the Sidereals, we can help…"

"Chejop Kejak and two dozen Sidereals are in Whitewall. Now."

We then proceed with the chase, Flint managing to get most of the way to the end without taking a hit by flagrant use of Wall-Denying Fury to make doors and windows where there were none, Space-and-Time understanding to just blink past obstacles, and Plans Yet Unmade to suddenly always have left a big crate of fireworks at this intersection. For some reason that really annoyed Mr. Carjack.

And as we see Rut, our Dragonblooded go down (he is actually tackled by a Sid who has kinda-sorta fallen for him and become very disillusioned with Chejop's plan over the course of months) Flint lets go of the mote he's had committed to Life-in-Death inversion, uses the Instant Training stunt to learn Second Circle Sorcery…

And then uses Shaper of Secret Forces to use anima to power Stormwind Rider as his Weaving Engine* blurs, never having taken a single Gather Will action the entire chase, which whisks us all to our airship as the bulk of the Sid's chasing us are distracted by the arrival of Rakan Thulio and a dozen Getimians.

So good news, we're probably off of Rakan Thulio's kill list, and the Sidereals will have taken quite heavy losses so will be dealing with other priorities.

I have also learned a very nasty charm that makes it so Flint has suddenly always been subtly undermining an organization. The third battle of Thorns is going to be !!Fun!!**

*The way Flint initiated into first Emerald circle was by doing artificial geomancy upon his own meridians, which ended with Rut forging two rings of starmetal that are mounted where Flint's Aspect marker shows up.

** First Battle: Mask of Winters shows up and conquers the place.
Second Battle: We show up, mess with shadowlands, rip part of an Abyssal's soul out and yeet it into Oblivion, then have a 7v1 fight against the Mask of Winters who only survives because he cut a deal with Ruin and our Eclipse to get us safely out of the Underworld.
Third Battle: The circle's coming in hot and the Mask of Winters's position has been weakened.
 
samdamandias said:
So good news, we're probably off of Rakan Thulio's kill list, and the Sidereals will have taken quite heavy losses so will be dealing with other priorities.
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I dunno thude, as tight-knit as the Fellowship is and as tied in to martial arts stories as they are, at least a few of them are highly likely to swear blood oaths of furious vengeance over this kind of thing. They're still Exalted, not exactly known for dispassionate cost-benefit analyses.
 
True

However consider that we, at most, broke a few limbs while running away.

Rakan Thulio's strike team would have gotten most of the kills. I know Rosethorn's circle got at least one.

So those eternal oaths of vengeance are going to be against the rival sect Rakan Thulio and the Zen-Mu Getimians.
 
I'm more curious about how the hell Chejop Kejak and twenty other Sidereals happened to be in Whitewall at the same time.

That's the kind of killteam you muster for Deathlords.
 
Also, does the city of Whitewall still exist after just shy of 40 Celestial Exalts threw down there, and presumably the Zen Mu contingent didn't hold back since they inflicted heavy casualties on the Yu Shan group despite being outnumbered 2-to-1?
 
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Just having two Sidereals working as a Duo is what I considered a Nuclear Button for my games lmao.
 
MiracleGrow said:
Just having two Sidereals working as a Duo is what I considered a Nuclear Button for my games lmao.
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When you really think about it 2% of the power of Heaven's best agents should be a Nuclear Button in every game, lol

I've only been able to play with Sids once but it was one of my favorite experiences with Exalted.
 
akoboldskobold said:
Aside from the motivating factor of "fuck House Sesus," which is fair TBH, is there anything in Chanos that would justify a novice Lunar going in alone to get it?
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When we're talking about areas where the Realm has a substantial presence the problem with other Lunars (and Solars) is that you're collectively only as sneaky as the bored person with the worst impulse control.
 
Seeing as the manuscript preview for Getimians have come out I will say that the building an origin is going to be pretty helpful in making new Gets.

Also many of the Getimian Charms are nightmare fuel and I love that like born to die where a Get creates a second self to accept a second blow with the horror being that corpse remains with extended exposure to it will activate their great curse.

Or Second Pair of Hands upgraded version Self-Hating Self that spawns a duplicate of a Get for multitasking purpose and when that purpose is done roll dice and if you flub a roll at the end of the task the duplicate will gain full autonomy. The two will then gain the Major Intimacy "I must destroy my impostor."
 
Something I been doing with the Syndics is having them argue a ton. But only one can speak at a time so the constantly butt in and cut each other off. It makes acting them out fun lol

Though I imagine Im playing them a bit different cause They made a Abyssals that broke off from her deathlord a Boyar. Specifically as a excellent asset against the undead. No one knows she is a Abyssal yet and they plan on keeping it that way.
 
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