You're the Queen - Now What? [CK2ish Character-Focused Quest]

Honestly, if it's a simple resource stat number, you can just go ahead and throw it in, Kylia. I can only speak for myself but if it's not overly complicated then I don't see the problem.

Agreed with this. Vanessa is settling in to her role as Queen, the estates have had a look at her and how she actually rules (so far quite passably in my own humble opinion but then I'm somewhat biased) Point being, on a story level, any initial goodwill from us being the compromise candidate and seeing how we do could have ran out by now, and now they're judging her, menawhile she's getting an idea of what they think of her. (I'd suspect that, well, to give an example, (not yet, but eventually,) even if we might have the nobility and moneyed classes and the rural folk singing our praises no matter how high that number gets we might still have to expect assassins from some of Gramaires agents.)

On a meta level regarding gameplay. Yeah, if the points are intended as an additional challenge for us to bear in mind now we're getting our feet under us regarding the budget and lingering banditry from the rebellion, something that was named as a potential issue in the quests introduction cropping up is not unwarranted. We are the compromise candidate after all. Or, even better, if the points are intended to help us keep track of that I wouldn't turn down the assistance.

Regarding the update itself. Rykall continues to be a reasonable boss. Traynissa is of course very polite and should in no way take her well earned promotion as a slight against her. Ideally, in a few years if/when we've settled parts of the crown estate and given her more work to do she'll look back on this moment fondly. It also serves as a nice reminder to us the readers that expanding Vanessas own personal holdings can grow an income that's not reliant upon feudal vassals. Just as one example, repairing the sacked villages and towns in the coastal march wouldn't go amiss. Nor would strengthening the thornmarch or southmarch, especially if we're going to route a bunch of trade to the necromancers through the Deathwood.

Handling the overlap between some of our councillors isn't a bad idea from Rykall either. Just as one example, The keeper of secrets and the keeper of sheriffs and reeves responsibilities overlap. Preventing friction there wouldn't go amiss.

Recruitment only picking up about half of what we needed. Is, well it could have gone worse. And the flip side to that is that many have found honest work on the roads, or returning to their homes. Even settling into mercenary bands or filling out armsmen and town guards is good.

375 total troops recruited isn't that bad either. Rienne did say she'd want about 450 minimum recruited. We could send the entire task force to south zarsim from the mobile reserve, which is what I'd like to do ASAP. We can recruit to fill gaps, and possibly extra then to cover any potential/expected losses from Zarsims civil war. One idea I'd like to float, is rather than trying to recruit individuals into the royal army (to then possibly release them later, especially if actual boots on the ground isn't wanted in Morvaks civil war ( so we shouldn't need to keep numbers too high) Is, it might actually be an idea to recruit a mercenary unit. A block of about 100 blooded men at arms in a whole company wouldn't go amiss. Especially if we could deniably send them into morvak as a unit that Regara 'hires' while we foot the bill, or actually hold them in reserve, march them up to the border, release them from our service for Regara or her supporters to actually hire them.) Another thing to consider meanwhile, is the assassin getting into the palace, and us calling in city guardsmen from patrol. Actually bumping up the numbers of our guards further wouldn't go amiss. I wish I had aimed to hire more soldiers now, even with a full success we might be left wanting more, especially if we're sending hundreds of guards away to war. Live and learn, though. I will suggest that we probably have enough skirmishers regardless.

Palace security is actually not bad, stopped well away from Vanessa, guards checked on and woke her regardless, moved her. Security procedures with the letter and keeping the agent in a cell are all reasonable. Full credit to the assassin for getting into the castle and getting away and then turning themselves in. Guards to be commended for their response in arresting the agent.

Hopefully our keeper of secrets takes lessons from the infiltration on where improvement is needed. I would humbly suggest that for a personal action, getting to know our staff- the maids, cooks, regular palace guards wouldn't go amiss. Vallefor sent an intruder this go round. But there's nothing to say that one of the cooks might not be tempted by a few silver coins to stick a note on the bottom of our plate saying "This is poisoned." Or adding some extra salt to 'kill' us. Or failing that a maid who's supposed to clean our bedroom leaving itching powder on our sheets in place of a deadly contact poison or the like.

Or even just someone slipping on a spare uniform to get close. Knowing our staff, possibly even hiring a mage and/or a small team of dedicated bodyguards from the royal guards wouldn't go amiss as actions.

I'd also have some questions, in that, upon becoming aware of an intruder, our palace guards checked on the queen. Here's my question, did anyone check on Essinya or any other visiting nobles in case it was aimed at them instead? Something to think about.


Itrick continues to be wonderful. We might want to keep a standing requirement for any say Fillibusters or the like. And permission may need to be granted on an individual basis, but I don't think it unreasable for us to request the estates vote on an exemption for Keeper Itrick on grounds of his health taking into account his many years of dedicated service to the kingdom. A respectful grace period, would be fair, but hours on end, very taxing.

Regarding Roland. I've said before. I'm inclined to slap with with fines for the financial crimes and even that not too harshly. If being foolish were a crime the prisons would be overflowing I'm inclined to let him off with a warning. in twenty years or so it will be Rolands heir we're dealing with, or if it is the man himself he and his friends and other former loyalists should remember this mercy.

As Itrick says, the evidence and letters are enough to prove he was supporting Gramaire and her son in the hopes of repayment and reward. (one minor caveat I enjoy is that legally, were it not for the expectation of reward, it would in fact be more than acceptable for a friend of Gramaires and Syrokis' to provide charity and aid to them) It's not explicitly spelled out as treason, but well, given the context, more than enough evidence to lay out for a pretty easy vote on de facto. And confiscating half of the lands.

I won't argue too hard against anyone who wishes to auction off the lands to his peers, or even to confiscate the lands directly. We have enough evidence on our side to argue convincingly for the latter, even if some nobles won't like it. But I'll stick to my position. We're in a strong enough position that we don't need to push for the maximum punishment. Some minor fines for the financial crimes (maybe push that slightly higher if we're letting him keep all his lands) but a small child on the opposite side of the world does not concern us. The civil war is over. We have the law as written on our side, but in dispensing justice we can afford to be merciful and by the legalese, we could swing it in a vote, but yeah. "Not actually illegal, this is a warning. We've got our eyes on you." Would not go amiss.

Beyond that, in my opinion, now we know the exact numbers involved. I would rather take the PR win of drawing a sharp divide between Syrokis who trampled all over the law, and not only the law but justice, compared to our rule where we've forgiven the loyalists, seeking to put the rebellion behind us. And are doing our best to act with compassion and mercy. So yeah, my vote has to be the finger wagging. That said. I would want this seen and understood as the warning and second chance that it is. Certainly not a precedent. If any people wish to take this as a sign of the queen being a soft touch I intend to firmly rebuke the next would be traitor to test us. There's only so many chances we can offer, after a certain point if people won't take the hint and bow with good grace we will be forced to conclude they will never accept our rule and we would have to deal with them accordingly.

Onto Regara and Morvak. I actually don't think this is a particularly good deal here. To be sure, Regara, the formal ceding of the Thornmarch. (I would want to add a specification, that this is a ceding now and forevermore. Just so that Regara doesn't get the bright idea that the ceding only lasts the length of the non-aggression pact. I don't think she will play word games like that, but I'd like any legal agreement to be clear and without room for interpretation.

On the face of it, lowering food prices for the duration of the civil war, and financial support before (likely to be used to bribe supporters or hire forces loyal to her, possibly even mercenaries) in exchange for 10 years of peace plus lower tariffs, should pay for itself and then some, especially if we're not even expected or required to supply troops. On the other hand, the 10 years non-aggression pact cuts both ways. And I wouldn't want to, for example, sit on our hands while Morvak cuts slices off Nerinthar or Illegorost in future. So that's a downside.

On the other hand, Regara is negotiating well, and the elephant in the room, is that, of course, we're supporting her because A, she should be less aggressive (at least towards us) but less charitably, there's B in that were I in Regara's shoes I'd suspect Halrun was purposely seeking to instigate a civil war in order to weaken Morvak as a goal in of itself. (Taking that into account, the 10 year non aggression pact might be to protect herself and her nation from Halrun invading and conquering more land) (which might not be a bad idea actually, this is a secret pact, with no contracts or treaties to be signed... If the non-aggression pact is only to be signed after the conclusion of the civil war, then simply not signing that, forgoing the trade agreement and then invading while they're weak... Or smirking and using the unspoken threat of invasion to prevent them from weakening their garrison on the border and hampering any wars of conquests Regara might wish to undertake, or even just biting the bullet and actually aiming to conquer another strip of territory weeeellll... Things to be considered after the civil war.) But, just as written, accepting the treaty in order to shift troops elsewhere is still an acceptable outcome IMO.

Suggestions for wedding. Well, my big one is that, even knowing they're unlikely to accept it, maintaining the 5 standing invitations to the Knights-generals wouldn't go amiss. Even had we succeeded I doubt they'd have sent all five, at least one would have probably claimed to be busy. As is, we can expect none, save maybe Darrach. But being polite and leaving the invitations open would be the play to me.

Specific for the wedding. In the Absence of our father, Cyril, Lord Lucas, or Councillor Trins, any one of them would be excellent father figures to 'give Vanessa away' if it needs to be done. Cyril, our mentor and teacher, father figure, famous, comes with some potential issues with the necromancers, but well, of all three he's likely the one she has the most personal connection to. General trins, powerful noble, respected general, former loyalist defected to the rebels in the face of being ordered to perform reprisals. He represents our duty to defend the nation, not least in his role of cleaning up banditry. Beyond that, he also represent our acceptance of former loyalists in our realm. Lastly, Itrick, Cleric, god of Rulership and Law and order, he's a council member we work with regularly. We mean to give the kingdom truth, justice, law and order and time to heal.

Unrelated to the wedding itself, but as to the question of who would bear the children. I'm not sure on the exact specific discourse in universe. But IMO, it might be better for Vanessa to carry the children, to avoid any possible accusations that they're not her children, or adding any fuel to any silly ideas that a 'Necromancer child' will inherit the throne if Essinya is the one to bear the children. On the other hand, there's the possibility that some assholes might get it into their head that Vanessa is 'getting screwed' by the deal if she's the one to bear the children. Either way there will probably be someone who screeches about something. There's an argument for maybe each of them bearing a child (more if they're overtaken by sudden desires to have a large sprawling family) but honestly that's probably getting too far into the weeds. My personal preference one each, or quite happy to have Vanessa bear both, especially if Essinya has reservations about carrying a child. But quite honestly, so long as the children are safe, happy and healthy I don't see that it matters too much and spiteful gossips can be ignored.


Back to our actions. One thing actually. I know that it was a failure? But actually, Knight-General Vaskon. Confirming that their obligations to the crown hold. (even if only to the letter of such agreements and not an inch further) Well, they actually have my respect for that. Arguably, one of the best things to do right now? Okay, they can't be convinced, fine. Open invitation for the knight generals to attend the wedding or send witnesses or observers in their stead, no offense taken if they decline. Apart from that, them standing sentinel to the north and watching for any banditry is a-okay. We've also got their tacit agreement that by their obligations they're bound to obey our orders to not disturb embassies, travellers, merchants, or undead travelling under the flag of peace. That should cover any necessary wedding guests and so on. That was my biggest concern.

Large numbers of undead labourers for the roads we'll have to bring in through the south from the deathwoods. It's annoying but fair enough.

To recap Overall, south Zarsim. I do think we immediately send the full amount from our mobile reserve and either spend another action with another round of recruitment to gather professionals. Failing that we could see if there are any existing mercenary companies to hire on a temporary basis if they're already in existence and have better success chances. That said, digging our way out of debt, increasing our total amount of professional soldiers wouldn't be the worst idea.

The knights failure, not great, not the end of the world. Dragging their feet at being called away from their posts for anything non-necromancer related could be painful in the event of an emergency. But honestly, just the confirmation that their obligations to us are in effect and they're not chafing to declare their independence at any moment is 'good enough'. Yeah, letting them cool off for a bit wouldn't be the worst idea before any attempts to mend that particular fence. We've got plenty of other issues to juggle. And actually just accepting that we're probably never going to be the knights of the golden throne's favourite person is. Yeah. That said, long term? Adun, Justice, cleric-knights, etc. Having them in our back pocket in case Lyrus ever *does* get deposed isn't a bad idea. And we can find other projects to help keep them busy.

Fundamentally. The knights have their responsibilities. The queen has her responsibilities. Agreeing to not step on each others toes isn't the worst idea in the world. I'm sure it would be a blessed, stress-free reign if every vassals upheld their responsibilities and the queen likewise fulfilled her obligation to her vassals and the people in turn. Loyalty flows both ways. Now's not the time to remind them of that as it might come off as petulant or a threat, but well, they did turn the offer to be first in line for new and expanded roads.

[X][TREASON DE FACTO] No, the lands shall not be confiscated in any part. (Law and Custom are on your side, but this act will be seen as generally magnanimous to Arbolast's heirs and relations, as well as suggesting you're not especially concerned by Arbolast's nominal Treason)
 
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Why is he worried?
His family rather expensively proved their allegiance to the Golden Throne by burning a wing of the Necromancy Library of Alexandria, so he is Marked, so to speak.
That was more about wanting to not get killed than a genuine allegiance to Adun, and fwiw, I did mention a while back (easy to forget, so no worries there) that Lyrus did officially pardon the Trovus family for that, as it were.
 
[X][TREASON DE FACTO] Half Arbolast's property shall be confiscated and sold at auction (Due to Itrick's strong successes, there will be no difficulty in getting the Estates to support this, and no political capital will be burned in the doing) (1d4+4 Dureks Generated)
 
[X][TREASON DE FACTO] Half Arbolast's property shall be confiscated and sold at auction (Due to Itrick's strong successes, there will be no difficulty in getting the Estates to support this, and no political capital will be burned in the doing) (1d4+4 Dureks Generated)
 
Turn 8: Finances & Upkeep Post New
QM Note: You will see that the numbers here don't quite line up with the numbers in the main assets posts. That's because I decided to save a bit of time and apply some of the changes from the slow loss of the currency contractions and other assorted bits. They don't take effect until after the turn 8 income/expenses phase, but they got edited in right after I finished this post.

Adhoc vote count started by Kylia Quilor on Nov 16, 2024 at 11:20 AM, finished with 12 posts and 7 votes.

  • [X][TREASON DE FACTO] Half Arbolast's property shall be confiscated and sold at auction (Due to Itrick's strong successes, there will be no difficulty in getting the Estates to support this, and no political capital will be burned in the doing) (1d4+4 Dureks Generated)
    [X][TREASON DE FACTO] No, the lands shall not be confiscated in any part. (Law and Custom are on your side, but this act will be seen as generally magnanimous to Arbolast's heirs and relations, as well as suggesting you're not especially concerned by Arbolast's nominal Treason)




Starting Treasury: 30.5
Pre-Income Expenses: 10.5
  • 5.5 Dureks on Military Recruitment
  • 5 Dureks Auditing the Royal Demesne
Pre Income Gains: 6 Dureks
  • 6 Dureks from Sale of Confiscated Property of Roland Arbolast Fredero following his conviction of Treason De Facto by the Estates-General
Income: 268.5 Dureks
  • Crown Holdings: 130 Dureks
  • Free Cities Taxes: 49.5 Dureks
  • Counties Taxes & Dues: 45
  • Lordships & Towns Taxes and Dues: 42 Dureks
  • Other Revenue Sources: 2 Dureks
Expenses: 131 Dureks
  • Royal Administration: 44 Dureks
  • Wages & Supply of Royal Army: 68 Dureks
  • Basic Maintinence of the Crown & Palace: 11 Dureks
  • Subsidy to South Zarsim: 7.5 Dureks
Final Income: 143.5
Final Treasury: 163.5


Outstanding Debts (742 Dureks Total Debt)
Owed to the Axecavern Bank (Lortan Dwarves): 292.5 Dureks (10% Interest) (29.25 Dureks)*
Owed to the Redhammer Bank (Lortan Dwarves): 156 Dureks (11% Interest) (17.25 Dureks)
Owed to Assorted Individual Wealthy Merchants/Etc based in Eaglecrest, Port Lest and Westcrown: 128.5 Dureks (8% Interest) (10.25 Dureks)
Owed to Assorted Individual Weathy Merchants Based in Zedarsh or Selissa: 33.5 Dureks (11% Interest) (3.75 Dureks)
Owed To The Goldaxe Bank: 131.5 Dureks (9.5% Interest) (12.5 Dureks)

Total Interest To Be Added If No Debts Are Paid Down This Turn: 73

No need to propose too many possible repayment plans, but here's two:

[ ][LOAN REPAYMENT] Domestic Debts Downpayment (50 Dureks)
-[ ] 50 Dureks to Assorted Individual Wealthy Merchants/Etc based in Eaglecrest, Port Lest and Westcrown

[ ][LOAN REPAYMENT] Highest Interest Hits (70 Dureks)
-[ ] 33.5 Dureks to Assorted Individual Weathy Merchants Based in Zedarsh or Selissa
-[ ] 36.5 Dureks to Redhammer Bank


Banditry Casualties
-5 Heavy Cavalry
-5 Light Cavalry
-9 Men At Arms
-10 Skirmishers
-2 Pikemen
-2 Crossbowmen

All Major Banditry In the Kingdom: RESOLVED. Royal Prestige Boosted.



Vote On Funding for Royal Wedding Using the Following Format:

[ ][ROYAL WEDDING] X Dureks to Wedding Fund.

Current Wedding Fund: 0 Dureks



Vote on sending Soldiers to Zarsim. All soldiers will be drawn from the Mobile Reserve. 900 Soldiers must be sent. At least 450 of whom must be pikemen, men-at-arms, light cavalry or heavy Cavalry. Format the vote like so:

[ ][SOUTH ZARSIM EXPEDITION] <Plan Name>
-[ ] X Heavy Cavalry
-[ ] X Light Cavalry
-[ ] X Men-At-Arms
-[ ] X Skirmishers
-[ ] X Crossbowmen
-[ ] X Pikemen

If you have questions or would like advice on this vote (a bit fiddly compared to most votes, I know), please ask.

The three kinds of votes - Loan Repyament, Wedding Funding and the South Zarsim Expedition should be separate.
 
It's nice to see 118 interest per turn down to 73. 40% of the interest and about 30% of the principal resolved.
 
[X][LOAN REPAYMENT] The 11% (98.5 Dureks)
-[X] 33.5 Dureks to Assorted Individual Weathy Merchants Based in Zedarsh or Selissa
-[X] 65 Dureks to Redhammer Bank

[X][ROYAL WEDDING] 15 Dureks to Wedding Fund

[X][SOUTH ZARSIM EXPEDITION] Frontliners

Dunno what the best proportion of troops to send would be, but we might as well do it now and recruit more soldiers in the next turn. As for the Wedding/Loans, this gives us a good solid 50 Dureks left for road building, plus other spends.
 
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[X][LOAN REPAYMENT] Patience being rewarded 93 Dureks total
-[X]33.5 Dureks to Assorted Individual Weathy Merchants Based in Zedarsh or Selissa
-[X]17.25 Dureks to the Redhammer Bank
-[X]29.25 Dureks to the Axecavern Bank
-[X]13 Dureks to Assorted Individual Wealthy Merchants/Etc based in Eaglecrest, Port Lest and Westcrown
[X][ROYAL WEDDING] 15 Dureks to Wedding Fund.
[X][SOUTH ZARSIM EXPEDITION] Frontliners
-[X] 100 Heavy Cavalry
-[X] 300 Men-At-Arms
-[X] 200 Crossbowmen
-[X] 300 Pikemen

Loan repayment. pretty simple. Clear off Zedarsh and Selissa, the highest rate of interest. Cover interest payments on redhammer and axecavern, the higher interest loans. Goldaxe we can let interest accrue slightly this turn, they're the bridge loan, they know what's up and can afford to wait. Our own domestic merchants. They're getting the interest paid plus a couple dureks extra.

Total cost, 93 dureks. It's going to reduce the interest next turn by a durek or two. And it shows our own merchants that yes, there's light at the end of the tunnel. Personally I'd considered just paying the interest on everything else and sending enough dureks to repay our domestic lenders about 20 dureks above the interest but I'm aware that a lot of people are still concerned about the high interest, and getting rid of the foreign merchants line item is sensible IMO.

15 Dureks to the wedding fund. Total of 108 dureks paid. MrRageQuits idea of leaving about 50 dureks in the bank for roads and other expenses is a great idea so I'll steal it.

South Zarsim. I've changed my mind slightly on the numbers. We in theory just need 450 in cav and maa and pikes. I want to aim well above that. 2 units of heavy cav. A unit and a half each of men-at-arms and pikemen. 700 soldiers total. Then an entire unit of Crossbows. Again, to reiterate, Zarsim is asking specifically for heavier units so that's mainly what I want to send them.
 
[X][LOAN REPAYMENT] The 11% (98.5 Dureks)
-[X] 33.5 Dureks to Assorted Individual Weathy Merchants Based in Zedarsh or Selissa.
-[X] 65 Dureks to Redhammer Bank.

As always, I will pay off the worst loans first, unless our financial advisor says otherwise.

[X][ROYAL WEDDING] 15 Dureks to Wedding Fund.

Let's see how fast this event spends money.

[X][SOUTH ZARSIM EXPEDITION] Frontliners.

These are far better troops than we are obliged to provide under the treaty, but I hope this will help to end the war sooner.
 
[X][LOAN REPAYMENT] The 11% (98.5 Dureks)
-[X] 33.5 Dureks to Assorted Individual Weathy Merchants Based in Zedarsh or Selissa.
-[X] 65 Dureks to Redhammer Bank.
If the money works out, we might be able to pay our local loans off in one glorious go during our wedding, as a wedding gift to the nation :p.

[X][ROYAL WEDDING] 15 Dureks to Wedding Fund.
 
[X][LOAN REPAYMENT] The 11% (98.5 Dureks)
-[X] 33.5 Dureks to Assorted Individual Weathy Merchants Based in Zedarsh or Selissa.
-[X] 65 Dureks to Redhammer Bank.

[X][ROYAL WEDDING] 15 Dureks to Wedding Fund.
 
[X][LOAN REPAYMENT] 11% (98.5 Dureks)
-[X] 33.5 Dureks to Assorted Individual Weathy Merchants Based in Zedarsh or Selissa.
-[X] 65 Dureks to Redhammer Bank.

[X][ROYAL WEDDING] 15 Dureks to Wedding Fund.

[X][SOUTH ZARSIM EXPEDITION] Frontliners
-[X] 100 Heavy Cavalry
-[X] 300 Men-At-Arms
-[X] 200 Crossbowmen
-[X] 300 Pikemen

Sending better troops seems better for us too. Beyond helping end the war, we are not under immediate danger of outright war. What we really need troops for, is to provide deterrence and quell smaller riots that might erupt. For that, the lighter troops are probably just as good.

As for loans, I think it's better to wait on most big project till the wedding, to get the undead laborers. A bit of work on the roads seems fine, but I'd rather pay the loans rather than put more than 35 in reserve, when the prices of those works are gonna drop considerably
 
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[X][LOAN REPAYMENT] The 11% (98.5 Dureks)
-[X] 33.5 Dureks to Assorted Individual Weathy Merchants Based in Zedarsh or Selissa.
-[X] 65 Dureks to Redhammer Bank.
[X][ROYAL WEDDING] 15 Dureks to Wedding Fund.
 
Couple of thoughts.

1. Based on past council updates. We could, as a reminder. Send more than 900 troops to Zarsim.

900 is the minimum total. While 450 of those have to be of a certain 'quality' let's say.

I do think that 900 troops should be enough. Especially based on the high quality we're sending. Well in excess of treaty requirements. I just think I should point out. While we're sending better quality. There's nothing stopping us from... Let's say, sending additional units such as 100 light cavalry. Or more crossbows. Or more skirmishers on top of the current force. Something to consider.

2. The other thing. While we've had good success in paying the higher interest loans first. And while there's probably no immediate risk of revolt or issues.

I personally think we've got enough breathing room that we don't have to maximise efficiency. And we should recall, that there are in fact other people at the sharp end of those numbers.

The Eaglecrest merchants et al represent minor moneylenders and small scale domestic merchants.

And while no doubt some are willing and able to sit on the bonds gleefully rubbing their hands and counting as the interest ticks up. Well. Part of the reason behind the currency contraction was that in addition to the crowns loans, our own merchants and businesses had their own loans. Thus coinage leaving the country and leading to a currency contraction.

I would humbly suggest that the GM's system has more going on in the background. Than just the simple face value of the interest rates. Yes, the domestic lenders are the cheapest debt to let interest compound on. But Halrun has merchants represented in it's estates. The domestic lenders are. In my opinion. A group whom we should take into account. And. There are multiple paths where we can make debt payments and continue reducing the principal and total interest payments.

I'm not panicked yet. And we've done a bunch to improve the real economy. But ultimately, our domestic lenders. Well. Them getting an injection of cash means it gets pumped into our citizens businesses.

Income of roughly 143. And interest payments of 73 to be made. That's a lot of wiggle room to be paying down debts IMO.
 
[X][LOAN REPAYMENT] Patience being rewarded 93 Dureks total
-[X]33.5 Dureks to Assorted Individual Weathy Merchants Based in Zedarsh or Selissa
-[X]17.25 Dureks to the Redhammer Bank
-[X]29.25 Dureks to the Axecavern Bank
-[X]13 Dureks to Assorted Individual Wealthy Merchants/Etc based in Eaglecrest, Port Lest and Westcrown
[X][ROYAL WEDDING] 15 Dureks to Wedding Fund.
[X][SOUTH ZARSIM EXPEDITION] Frontliners
-[X] 100 Heavy Cavalry
-[X] 300 Men-At-Arms
-[X] 200 Crossbowmen
-[X] 300 Pikemen
 
[X][LOAN REPAYMENT] The 11% (98.5 Dureks)
-[X] 33.5 Dureks to Assorted Individual Weathy Merchants Based in Zedarsh or Selissa
-[X] 65 Dureks to Redhammer Bank

[X][ROYAL WEDDING] 15 Dureks to Wedding Fund

[X][SOUTH ZARSIM EXPEDITION] Frontliners

No need to really go crazy here, business as usual. We can throw in the remaining 5-10 Dureks for the Wedding Fund next turn, and the usual plan of loan repayment still works out well.
 
I would humbly suggest that the GM's system has more going on in the background. Than just the simple face value of the interest rates. Yes, the domestic lenders are the cheapest debt to let interest compound on. But Halrun has merchants represented in it's estates. The domestic lenders are. In my opinion. A group whom we should take into account. And. There are multiple paths where we can make debt payments and continue reducing the principal and total interest payments.

I'm not panicked yet. And we've done a bunch to improve the real economy. But ultimately, our domestic lenders. Well. Them getting an injection of cash means it gets pumped into our citizens businesses.
I agree that paying domestic will be good, I just don't think it's more important than eliminating other debts for now. I do want to pay domestic nearer the wedding though even if it's not interest optimal.

That aside, your plan also pays the interest of Axecavern instead of throwing that towards Redhammer, which doesn't make sense to me. That leads to more total interest next turn, for no other benefit I can see? Axecavern is a giant chill dwarven bank, who sees we're paying down debts and thus is happier if we leave them til later. I don't think they need to be mollified with an interest payment.

Switching axecavern to redhammer in your plan only reduces interest by 0.3 dureks as far as I could tell, but still. That's one fiftieth the initial wedding fund! Think of all the canapes that could buy!


sidenote - I've suspended disbelief because this is a fun game, but holy toledo 10% monthly compounding loans are wild, the highest I found googling for roman / medieval interest historically is 50% annually (and that was loan shark maximums), as opposed to e.g. Redhammer here sitting pretty at 349% annual interest (1.11^12). No wonder the dwarves are so wealthy and powerful!
 
I agree that paying domestic will be good, I just don't think it's more important than eliminating other debts for now. I do want to pay domestic nearer the wedding though even if it's not interest optimal.

That aside, your plan also pays the interest of Axecavern instead of throwing that towards Redhammer, which doesn't make sense to me. That leads to more total interest next turn, for no other benefit I can see? Axecavern is a giant chill dwarven bank, who sees we're paying down debts and thus is happier if we leave them til later. I don't think they need to be mollified with an interest payment.

Switching axecavern to redhammer in your plan only reduces interest by 0.3 dureks as far as I could tell, but still. That's one fiftieth the initial wedding fund! Think of all the canapes that could buy!

I'd suggest that yeah while eliminating the high interest loan debts is good. None of the major dwarf banks are particularly time sensitive. And while I appreciate the plan to pay off domestic creditors soon (paying it off as a wedding gift to our domestic merchants even) to look at it another way when we minted the new coins flooding the market and causing inflation was a worry. So we released it in smaller batches over time to reduce that risk and help prevent any major instabilities. If we for example paid the entire lump sum to our domestic lenders at once there might be some side effects.

As to the 'why' of paying axecavern and covering most of the debts interest? Largely optics. We're paying down the total debt, but I don't want any outside voices in universe to look at the crowns finances and decide that "Oh no! The debt to Axecavern has DOUBLED! Aaaaaaaah!" Yes, we've paid down the total debt and interest. And yes we've largely done the smart plays to target the highest interest loans aggressively. And we had very good, sound financial reasons for acting as we have. But my paranoia is whispering to me worst case scenarios of one of our creditors looking at the crowns budget and finances, seeing a debt has doubled to over 300 dureks and panicking as a result. To me it's just a goal, yes, total debt is down, but I don't want to be in the situation where someone looks at our debts, see's several has doubled and causes a market panic as a result.

The point about 0.3 dureks saved comparing Axecavern and Redhammer is, well, it is true. But I'm also looking at the intangibles, good PR, Optics, just what our actions 'look like' to outside viewers. And while the crash payment of the highest interest loans and prioritisation was indeed right and proper until we could get the budget under control and back in the positives I'm also considering what would provide good signalling to not only current creditors but also potentially future lenders.

And as an example. with 73 dureks of interest per turn. First up, covering all the interest for each line. 73 dureks. And then putting the next 27 on the highest interest could reduce our interest outlay by 2.5 dureks per turn (rounded down). More as the principal gets chipped away at. Put simply, covering all of the interest, just as a sign that we acknowledge our creditors, and rather than biting off chunks of one or two debts at a time. Just being fundamentally, boring, responsible, and predictable, to keep the markets calm.

Or put another way. Our own lenders have been stuck waiting for about 8 months. Do they have another 8 months to wait while we paperclip maximise our way to paying off the debts in the most efficient manner to save some extra dureks? That's an extreme example, but my point stands.

So yeah. Short version, not letting the individual debts reach double their initial amounts. And giving everyone at least some debt servicing per turn. Weeell, they're arbitrary targets, but sometimes the markets can be arbitrary like that.

sidenote - I've suspended disbelief because this is a fun game, but holy toledo 10% monthly compounding loans are wild, the highest I found googling for roman / medieval interest historically is 50% annually (and that was loan shark maximums), as opposed to e.g. Redhammer here sitting pretty at 349% annual interest (1.11^12). No wonder the dwarves are so wealthy and powerful!

The interest rates are high, but actually IMO not that excessive taking into account that they're largely wartime loans, and even the goldaxes bridge loan, largely given with the expectation that as the newest creditor the goldaxes will be going to the back of any queue. They might be months or years out from any payment.

Some historical loans were, put politely, horrifically abusive. Massive interest rates led in part directly to Usury laws regulating and limiting that interest throughout history and in many different places and cultures. Hell, 11% monthly interest is downright reasonable compared to some historical examples. Some short term small scale loans were 12%,24%,48% interest. Chiefly to farmers. So as an example if a farmer borrowed 10 gold coins to buy seed and plant them, after harvest and sale of the crops the lender would expect 15 gold coins back. And that's not actually that unreasonable.

Some wartime loans to monarchs were hilariously lopsided. On the level of a Noble lending to their monarch, they might do so with the expectation that the monarch would double their money. Especially war loans where it was hugely risky and a legitimate question on whether the Lender would get paid at all. In the event of rulers being unable to pay these debts (and in several accounts they weren't supposed to be able to) the lender would be repaid through Royal Monopolies (being the only person allowed to produce/trade/sell a certain product) titles, land, especially land of those the monarch was at war with. Case in point Countess Gramaires friend sending her money in exchange for the promise of future repayment and titles and so on.

But yeah. Loans with arbitrary repayment plans could and did exist. "You'll double my money within a year." "I want to be paid back in full within 3 months otherwise I take the collateral." (Crown jewels have, on many occasions been used as a last ditch source of funds for exiled or deposed royals. Either for the selling of, or take take loans against.)

Beyond that, the interest rates are high, but our lenders have actually been and are being remarkably patient with us. Now that we've got things under control, frankly I'm surprised we haven't seen more pressure from our creditors to... for example, commit to a certain minimum payment per turn by now, at least from our domestic lenders.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, but one of my ideals actually might be cover all interest, then pay extra on top. So next turn, since we're all committed to getting rid of Zedarsh this turn (well done us) 73 dureks split among our creditors, then, 20 extra dureks to Redhammer, 5 extra to axehammer, 1 to goldaxe above their interest and 1 to domestic lenders above the interest.

Buuut I'm not super committed to that. I trust Rucdorn would have warned us more strongly if the minor merchants and moneylenders were in seriously dire straits (and IMO a lump sum to bring them down to about 75 dureks owed wouldn't go too amiss to just 'reset' them) (and also that so long as we've given them 'something' before the end of the year and continued improving the roads and repairing damage they should be okay) So for all intents and purposes most plans should be good so long as we're paying enough to bring down the interest at least slightly each turn.

Last thing actually, You're right in that, yeah these interest rates are high. I'm hopeful that as things continue we'll get better offers of cheaper credit since we're not as risky or desperate. But actually, one idea long term might be to compete with the banks and offer our own loans from the crown to some of our merchants and nobles who need funds. That, or investing in them directly.

There's other financial instruments we could use too. Looking at south Zarsim, we're currently subsidizing them with 7.5 dureks per turn. Post war, offering them a 'low interest' loan of 100 Dureks at about 4% MPR (monthly percentage rate) should be highly competitive and attractive to their king for him to begin some expensive reconstruction work.

Or even buying a long term gilt bond from the South Zarsim treasury. (indefinite, if we can swing it) Idea being we purchase a 1% rate treasury bond from South Zarsim for 100 Dureks. And of course, they take that money, they repair, they invest it, etc and so on. And meanwhile, we get 1 durek, per month. And here's the kicker, until we decide to sell the bond itself. There's no 'debt' to repay. We're buying the rights to 1 Durek, per month paid to us from the South Zarsim treasury, until we/Halrun/the Crown, chooses to sell that asset.

Not sure if the GM would allow that, and/or if they did there's possibly room for us to negotiate a higher rate. But the main idea there isn't to actually generate 'profit', but more to create long term reliable revenues and buy goodwill from Zarsim. 100 dureks payment should be significant to kickstart any of their rebuilding. And if we couldn't improve our revenue by 1 durek with 100 dureks of investment I'd be seriously worried about us.

But yeah. While the banks high rates are due to the civil war, high amount of debt we already have, lack of an heir and perceived instability, well, if monthly interest is the norm then the worlds banking sector definitely has room for us to move into and compete in if we're fine with accepting a little risk, or even if not, the fact that 9.5% on a bridge loan is an improvement and we're already paying off debts means... Yes there's some issues, but the various banks offered loans *aren't* all that competitive, and we should be able to undercut them IMO. Now, possibly that's something to do after we've beaten down our principal further but, well, if South Zarsim is going to be treated how we are by the banks (worse even possibly) us offering more standard 3-5% interest rates compared to literal double digit percentages, should be highly competitive and attractive.
 
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At this point I think we aren't going to convince each other, and I agree to disagree, but in interest of discourse will respond to your long and thoughtful post.

As to the 'why' of paying axecavern and covering most of the debts interest? Largely optics. We're paying down the total debt, but I don't want any outside voices in universe to look at the crowns finances and decide that "Oh no! The debt to Axecavern has DOUBLED! Aaaaaaaah!" Yes, we've paid down the total debt and interest. And yes we've largely done the smart plays to target the highest interest loans aggressively. And we had very good, sound financial reasons for acting as we have. But my paranoia is whispering to me worst case scenarios of one of our creditors looking at the crowns budget and finances, seeing a debt has doubled to over 300 dureks and panicking as a result. To me it's just a goal, yes, total debt is down, but I don't want to be in the situation where someone looks at our debts, see's several has doubled and causes a market panic as a result.
Just being fundamentally, boring, responsible, and predictable, to keep the markets calm.
I think the optics and PR point is more relevant in today's times, with masses of day traders influenced by the internet. We do have sensationalist broadsheets a la the 1700s, but I don't think the slice of merchants who could be bamboozled by misleading articles control enough of the market to be a serious risk. Nor do markets move quickly given communication is mostly by courier (I don't think magical communication is common even for merchants and lords?), and scattered across multiple cities. I agree paying down all the interest appears more responsible to an uninformed observer, but it isn't actually, to the tune of 0.3 dureks a month :p.

Granted that is only 0.5% of the total interest so tis negligible, but to keen eyed creditors paying Redhammer is more responsible. Given the bulk of our money comes from a few large banks, I think our important creditors (present and future) are keen eyed cold fish, not the general mercantile class. This is borne out by Turn 1's debts, if you ignore Syrokis' amorphous previous ones and just look at the rebellion's debts, of the 685 dureks, 510 or 75% were owed to just five big banks, the other 25% to merchants of Halrun, Zedarsh, and Selissa.

I think we care more about the pragmatic and well informed big banks than the merchant masses here (and they're listed as wealthy individuals, I wouldn't be surprised if it was fewer than 100 people all told). I'd agree with you if Axecavern were disjoint or opposed to redhammer / goldaxe, and could reasonably be worried that we'd default on them even though we're paying other creditors. But they all seem thick as thieves (including in your canon omake!), and if we defaulted on Axecavern I've no doubt we'd be punished by the other dwarves, and they know it.

Or put another way. Our own lenders have been stuck waiting for about 8 months. Do they have another 8 months to wait while we paperclip maximise our way to paying off the debts in the most efficient manner to save some extra dureks? That's an extreme example, but my point stands.
The war was 3 years long, so regardless of when in that timespan they loaned money, they've been waiting longer than 8 months without collapsing, and more importantly I doubt that's a serious portion of their assets given our monthly taxes from the 3 cities sit at 49.5 dureks, and the merchants initial loan to us was 75 dureks.

With a 600 durek annual tax burden, I can't see them missing 75 dureks as a serious hardship for the cities. I don't think paying off the merchants even in a 150 durek lump would be a tremendous change given what they handle annually vis a vis inflation, but you are right our far smaller hard currency injection did have inflation worries, so idk.

Some historical loans were, put politely, horrifically abusive. Massive interest rates led in part directly to Usury laws regulating and limiting that interest throughout history and in many different places and cultures. Hell, 11% monthly interest is downright reasonable compared to some historical examples. Some short term small scale loans were 12%,24%,48% interest.
History is vast and deep! And only tangentially related to the quest so won't go on long derail, but will mention the 12% 24% 48% numbers I saw referred to annual interest in ancient Rome, not monthly.

Maybe someday our magical crystal studded demense can be loan collateral :p, The Crown Laboratory!

Yes there's some issues, but the various banks offered loans *aren't* all that competitive, and we should be able to undercut them IMO. Now, possibly that's something to do after we've beaten down our principal further but, well, if South Zarsim is going to be treated how we are by the banks (worse even possibly) us offering more standard 3-5% interest rates compared to literal double digit percentages, should be highly competitive and attractive.
I first read this as you saying we should generally undercut banks and become a lender, which is a grand ambition but late game at best, otherwise Bastard Brunn would get thousands of dureks interest free I fear, and other trade war consequences.

But just loaning stuff to South Zarsim could be dandy, esp if Regara wins civil war, we could cooperate more closely, since Morvak also supports SZ, right?
 
Our own lenders have been stuck waiting for about 8 months. Do they have another 8 months to wait while we paperclip maximise our way to paying off the debts in the most efficient manner to save some extra dureks?
Don't they? We've been pretty reliable about paying off debts, so them waiting is just them making more money. Plus 8 months doesn't sound that long for these kinds of loans.
 
At this point I think we aren't going to convince each other, and I agree to disagree, but in interest of discourse will respond to your long and thoughtful post.

First up, less 'trying to convince'. More just debate and discuss. I freely admit I'd love if I could talk people into making some payments on the domestic lenders soon. But at the same time most of my laying out my reasoning is to nudge discussion. I mentioned before, I'm a nerd, I like economics, I like reading about politics and trade disputes and in other settings I enjoy looking at ways to maximise efficiency, so, yeah. I like the game, I like talking about it. And part of my making plans, making successful plans especially, is in airing my ideas, seeing what people like about them, what people dislike about them. And ultimately putting our heads together to try and come up with the best plans possible that take into account the variables.

I think the optics and PR point is more relevant in today's times, with masses of day traders influenced by the internet. We do have sensationalist broadsheets a la the 1700s, but I don't think the slice of merchants who could be bamboozled by misleading articles control enough of the market to be a serious risk. Nor do markets move quickly given communication is mostly by courier (I don't think magical communication is common even for merchants and lords?), and scattered across multiple cities. I agree paying down all the interest appears more responsible to an uninformed observer, but it isn't actually, to the tune of 0.3 dureks a month :p.

Granted that is only 0.5% of the total interest so tis negligible, but to keen eyed creditors paying Redhammer is more responsible. Given the bulk of our money comes from a few large banks, I think our important creditors (present and future) are keen eyed cold fish, not the general mercantile class. This is borne out by Turn 1's debts, if you ignore Syrokis' amorphous previous ones and just look at the rebellion's debts, of the 685 dureks, 510 or 75% were owed to just five big banks, the other 25% to merchants of Halrun, Zedarsh, and Selissa.

I think we care more about the pragmatic and well informed big banks than the merchant masses here (and they're listed as wealthy individuals, I wouldn't be surprised if it was fewer than 100 people all told). I'd agree with you if Axecavern were disjoint or opposed to redhammer / goldaxe, and could reasonably be worried that we'd default on them even though we're paying other creditors. But they all seem thick as thieves (including in your canon omake!), and if we defaulted on Axecavern I've no doubt we'd be punished by the other dwarves, and they know it.

Point on optics and PR being more of a modern issue. That said, our support from various factions in the kingdom has been something to constantly keep in mind. Beyond that, in past turns. Putting aside political support, past turns with the currency contraction mentioned an outright 'credit crunch'. Nothing too serious, but with our merchants having loaned cash to us and not gotten repaid yet, they evidently are lacking on funds to loan out to merchants further down the ladder, farmers, etc.

Numbers might tell less messy stories than words. But if you only look at the numbers you are missing part of the story.

Snip, all good points. But I'd argue that the big banks being well informed and pragmatic, well, they're then thusly the ones who can afford to wait.

At the end of the day. I don't expect anything outright incendiary immediately. But I do think it's at least possible, that if we take too long, eventually enough domestic creditors will look at us having paid off foreign creditors, and be paying the dwarf banks, and honestly, quite rightly point out that if we're dumping 90 dureks a turn on foreign banks a turn, we can afford to pay domestic lenders at least something.

Ultimately, our original payment plan was by necessity. We didn't have enough per turn to cover all interest, and so targeting the highest interest loans to get it under control *was* the correct play. But, by this point, not paying the interest on domestic loans is a *choice* perhaps even the correct choice. But to again point back to numbers not telling the whole story it could still be a bitter pill to swallow.

And the big banks being well informed and pragmatic. So long as we're knocking the total interest down the dwarfs should be willing to accept us paying other lenders. I'm not even suggesting 'stopping' paying the dwarfs even. Just with some very basic napkin math. I'd humbly suggest that by now we can afford to pay 100 dureks per turn. well, with interest sitting at 73(less next turn) 80 Dureks to the highest interest should reduce the interest by half a durek per turn on it's own. 20 dureks to domestic lenders should also get us some slight gains. Improving steadily over time. Of course 20 dureks to redhammer compared to 20 dureks domestically is a difference of 0.6 dureks per turn in interst, so definitely not nothing. But, well. Domestic fundamentals. The large amounts of coin leaving the country 'was' leading to a currency shortage before we intervened. So it's not like paying foreign creditors is always the 'right' choice.

I first read this as you saying we should generally undercut banks and become a lender, which is a grand ambition but late game at best, otherwise Bastard Brunn would get thousands of dureks interest free I fear, and other trade war consequences.

But just loaning stuff to South Zarsim could be dandy, esp if Regara wins civil war, we could cooperate more closely, since Morvak also supports SZ, right?

Yeah, very good reasons for paying down the debts before we engage in too much lending ourselves. There's the purely monetary fact that paying off our own high interest loans will almost by definition be more profitable than lending out low interest loans. But also if we owe less than the dwarf banks have less leverage over us when/if we end up competing against them in the money markets.

I don't know if they'd be quite so willing to support a child against us to the tune of thousands of dureks, especially not low interest but making sure we've got room in the budget before lending too much to other nations is probably a smart idea regardless.

And, yeah, out of all the places we could lend to, South Zarsim is an easy choice because of the political situation where we want to support King Gaius and pull South Zarsim away from Morvak.

On that note. Would anyone be willing to consider sending a second round of troops to South Zarsim? 900 total, is ultimately, still the minimum required by the treaty and sending more should help him win the war faster. I wouldn't want to send 'too many' but considering we can station up to 2000 troops in the country after South Zarsim wins the civil war, then adding another 5-600 wouldn't go amiss?

We'd probably want to hire another round of soldiers to make sure sending too many doesn't leave us underdefended. But oh, another 200 men at arms and 200 crossbows and say 300 skirmishers, plus some cavalry should more than cover any losses we incur from the fighting plus lend Gaius some more strength so he can win sooner. Like most things, it's not something I'm willing to nail my colours to the mast over, and if Gaius does well enough we might not need to. But well. I'm trying to look at options and consider what to do depending on how the war shakes out.

Changing the subject, specifically regarding other actions. @Kylia Quilor Now that our generals have cleaned up the bandits is there any way we could commemorate the occasion? Would an action for Vanessa to create 3 minor enchanted swords as gifts to our three generals, Rienne, General Darrach, and General Trins be something we can accomplish in 1 turn? How much would it cost? Would it be more expensive/take more time to create better enchanted swords? What kinds of enchantments could Vanessa manage? What's the going rate for enchanted weapons and the like? Or, if we hired some mages, would that be something where we can order them to create enchanted weapons for us?

Also. I know we've talked about gifting the crystals to Essinya, but is using them to create a Sanctumin the castle (potentially covering the entire whole castle) still an option?

Also, ideas in general for various keepers. Specifically regarding the Riverlands. Would the keeper of envoys be able to approach any of the city states (particularly Veldros and Gyptar) and negotiate their joining Halrun in an alliance? Or as one of the vassals with extensive rights similiar to Vannecht county or so on.

The description for Rokrin notes they sell Golems. As labourers? Weapons of war? In either case, but especially the latter do we have any idea of the prices or what kind of product we can expect if we were to buy some?

That's probably enough questions for now. I've just been looking at some of the information threadmarks and whatnot for ideas on project ideas and write ins.
 
Now that our generals have cleaned up the bandits is there any way we could commemorate the occasion? Would an action for Vanessa to create 3 minor enchanted swords as gifts to our three generals, Rienne, General Darrach, and General Trins be something we can accomplish in 1 turn? How much would it cost? Would it be more expensive/take more time to create better enchanted swords? What kinds of enchantments could Vanessa manage? What's the going rate for enchanted weapons and the like? Or, if we hired some mages, would that be something where we can order them to create enchanted weapons for us?
It could be conceivable. Enchanted weapons are pricy but that's as much because of the prestige value of owning one drives up the price artificially. How many dureks the actual action would cause... hard to say. A durek is a large sum of money all it's own.

Im not sure if i established if Vanessa has ever done weapon enchatments before. Dont think she has. She *can*, as could hired mages on theory. To an extent thats a little beyond the scope of the quest but i could probably find a way to fit it in.

Also. I know we've talked about gifting the crystals to Essinya, but is using them to create a Sanctumin the castle (potentially covering the entire whole castle) still an option?
Yes. But I believe the discussion was more gifting the nonmagical artifacts rather than the crystals per se.

particularly Veldros and Gyptar
Veldros's entire foreign policy for 76 years has been "dont get annexed by Halrun".

Gyptar is not as impossoble but its a tall order. They like their independence and they have a lot of trade power to make threatening said independence risky.

The description for Rokrin notes they sell Golems. As labourers? Weapons of war? In either case, but especially the latter do we have any idea of the prices or what kind of product we can expect if we were to buy some?
They don't mass sell Golems. One golem us a great bodyguard or a great replacement for 5, 10 laborers, but they keep careful track of who they've sold to.

In the distant misty past the sold a few hundred golems to the necrotic empire and then got very disturbed to see what a few hundred golems could actually do on the battlefield... and that they were used for conquest. Rokrin has basically made it a rule they don't let someone get that many golems anymore.

But I suppose a golem or five is something Vanessa could look into buying eventually yes.
 
Point on optics and PR being more of a modern issue. That said, our support from various factions in the kingdom has been something to constantly keep in mind. Beyond that, in past turns. Putting aside political support, past turns with the currency contraction mentioned an outright 'credit crunch'. Nothing too serious, but with our merchants having loaned cash to us and not gotten repaid yet, they evidently are lacking on funds to loan out to merchants further down the ladder, farmers, etc.
Not necessarily. The credit crunch was based on the lack of monetary supply in the kingdom, rather than any individual deficits. Also, you're assuming these are career moneylenders as opposed to actual merchants who made one-time loans in support of the rebellion. Note that all are stated to be from either the Free Cities (against Syrokis from the beginning), or Westcrown (against Syrokis the minute Vallefor decided his red line had been crossed). I haven't read anything to suggest that Halrun really has a banking industry.

Of course they'll want to be repaid, but there's no indication this is the source of their wealth, or that our lack of immediate repayment is causing broader economic issues.

At the end of the day. I don't expect anything outright incendiary immediately. But I do think it's at least possible, that if we take too long, eventually enough domestic creditors will look at us having paid off foreign creditors, and be paying the dwarf banks, and honestly, quite rightly point out that if we're dumping 90 dureks a turn on foreign banks a turn, we can afford to pay domestic lenders at least something.
Even if they would be technically correct, one can argue that doing so would not be the best form of correct. Consider that the Estates conveniently foisted responsibility for Syrokis' debts and the rebellion's debts on the new Queen, even as she's responsible for rebuilding the kingdom. And yet, in just eight months, she's eliminated all non-dwarven foreign debts (a huge chunk off the balance sheet) with but one extra bridge loan required, and is beginning to hack into the dwarven debts.

Moreover, on the domestic side, she's eradicated banditry, made major strides in restoring the roads, ended the currency contraction, and concluded a very lucratively one-sided marriage treaty with Darkmoon.

1. These things will boost their bottom line far more than the repayment will.
2. Remember the conservative nobility really don't like merchants, so they will gleefully attack any 'lese-majesty' in 'trying to dictate to the Queen how she pays her debts' when she's been very expeditious about paying them.

I'd humbly suggest that by now we can afford to pay 100 dureks per turn. well, with interest sitting at 73(less next turn) 80 Dureks to the highest interest should reduce the interest by half a durek per turn on it's own.
Well, no. If you really want to insist on paying the domestic lenders, I'd wait until Turn 10. Because then we'd have started the remaining two roads, thus stretching our margin for debt payment sufficiently to accomodate a reasonable share for them.
 
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