I'm still peeved that people nixed the story potential of dealing with the BoS. I'm going to have to deal with it, but I'm damn well not happy about it!
I'm distraught as well, I really do think we could have convinced them to help us if they were allowed to survive. Plus with them dead we'll probably be on the shit list of every brotherhood of steel chapter we run into in the future.
In a similar vein what are we going to do about the enclave remnants? Orion Moreno was terrible and deserved a bullet in the head but the rest were fairly decent when compared to other Enclave personnel in canon.
I'm distraught as well, I really do think we could have convinced them to help us if they were allowed to survive. Plus with them dead we'll probably be on the shit list of every brotherhood of steel chapter we run into in the future.
In a similar vein what are we going to do about the enclave remnants? Orion Moreno was terrible and deserved a bullet in the head but the rest were fairly decent when compared to other Enclave personnel in canon.
There's been a pretty clear character through-line here of extirpating the holdovers of the old world to make room for the new. Thus I doubt we're too concerned about whether to go to war with other Brotherhood chapters or Enclave. . . enclaves in the future. Only about how.
There's been a pretty clear character through-line here of extirpating the holdovers of the old world to make room for the new. Thus I doubt we're too concerned about whether to go to war with other Brotherhood chapters or Enclave. . . enclaves in the future. Only about how.
That's really not good reasoning since we aren't a psychopath about it and don't to be. There is also a huge difference between not wanting to become obsessed with the past and being willing to completely destroy anything and everything relating to the past. The latter is just completely impractical to do and trying to do so is just going full on Ulysses. There is also the saying that those that forget the past are doomed to repeat it.
Scheduled vote count started by Etranger on Mar 7, 2024 at 10:52 PM, finished with 219 posts and 83 votes.
[X] Plan: Strip-ped Clean
-[X][OMERTAS] Took out the whole murderous bunch.
-[X][GLOVES] Exposed them to the world.
-[X][CHAIRS] Incorporated them into your efforts.
[X] Plan: Don't Rock the Boat... for Now
-[X][OMERTAS] Turned their leaders against each other.
-[X][GLOVES] Kept their secret.
-[X][CHAIRS] Incorporated them into your efforts.
[X] Plan: Second Chances for the Lesser Evil.
-[X][OMERTAS] Took out the whole murderous bunch.
-[X][GLOVES] Kept their secret.
-[X][CHAIRS] Incorporated them into your efforts.
[X] Plan: A Modicum of Restraint
-[X][OMERTAS] Turned their leaders against each other.
-[X][GLOVES] Exposed them to the world.
-[X][CHAIRS] Let the party roll on.
[X] Plan: Tight Leash and Loyal Friends
-[X][OMERTAS] Turned their leaders against each other.
-[X][GLOVES] Exposed them to the world.
-[X][CHAIRS] Incorporated them into your efforts.
I wonder if we are going to be able or even have to give up power to the power to the people? By that I mean actually letting the people of the Mojave run things without our complete input. Because as fans of Fallout who were against House's ending noted having one single person control absolutely everything in a nation is a terrible freaking idea.
Also seems like it goes against the idea of a free Vegas to have an autocrat rule everything with an army of robots since that is just trading House for some other asshole with a robot army who wants to control everything.
Personally think that if the option comes up we absolutely should give up power to the people. Because the truth of the matter is we don't actually need to control everything and it seems like Vegas would be better off with a society built around decentralized power. And to be clear I'm not saying end the quest, we can still be in charge and influence things, we just wouldn't be a full on dictator with absolute power.
The people of this time and place are not educated and informed enough to not be hooked on cheap impulses. Their children on the other hand should be okey enough even with three years of general education.
Uh, the Courier isn't actually very educated either. They are literally a mailman, admittedly an extremely and abnormally capable one, that got ridiculously lucky to be in the right places at the right time to seize control of New Vegas.
The fact that players keep insisting that they know better than everyone else while refusing to consider that they can be wrong is literally the exact issue that a lot of fans and people in universe had with House. And I don't really trust the players to actually be willing to give up any power and control. I fully expect that if people made an arbitrary timeline that once said timeline came up you'd have numerous people making excuses for why the natives aren't 'ready' so that the players don't have to give up any power.
That's... infantalizing, arrogant, sneering imperialist rhetoric. Even ignoring how clearly, obviously, hilariously wrong it is just from playing the game, did you forget that Six is also from this time and place? What makes them special? Why do you feel like justifying being fash by belittling our own citizenry??
That's... infantalizing, arrogant, sneering imperialist rhetoric. Even ignoring how clearly, obviously, hilariously wrong it is just from playing the game, did you forget that Six is also from this time and place? What makes them special? Why do you feel like justifying being fash by belittling our own citizenry??
The wastelander we run into are combination of powerless-trying-to get-by, active getting ahead at cost of everyone else, systemized meat grinder for a goal, and vey few good people keeping their use power and violence in check. I don't doubt their intelligence but the normalized use of violence and power in their day to day have to be discontinued in a more stabilized less violence prone environment. Otherwise the first knee jerk reaction for any inconvenience is to unleash the war machines. You can argue that most interaction of the settings is violence is gameplay but like every other quest giver have violence involved. Clearly the hostile environment is not allowing a flourishing peaceful life.
To be frank, Six also responds to many situations with some incredibly cunning and carefully calculated brutality... it's not even really a negative trait, tbh, inherently? At least when it comes to seizing power in circumstances like this.
To be frank, Six also responds to many situations with some incredibly cunning and carefully calculated brutality... it's not even really a negative trait, tbh, inherently? At least when it comes to seizing power in circumstances like this.
I don't disagree tbh, people should have the ability to be extremely clever for their goals. But I rather the Six government be kicked out of office through popular votes for someone who have more depths than POWER and actual improve society and quality of life.
I don't disagree tbh, people should have the ability to be extremely clever for their goals. But I rather the Six government be kicked out of office through popular votes for someone who have more depths than POWER and actual improve society and quality of life.
At the moment we don't actually know that Six doesn't have more depths. Like, when you're taking over a state and overthrowing your enemies, you do tend to, uh, use power and brutality and cunning?
But there's no promise that that's all they're going to do.
At the moment we don't actually know that Six doesn't have more depths. Like, when you're taking over a state and overthrowing your enemies, you do tend to, uh, use power and brutality and cunning?
But there's no promise that that's all they're going to do.
So that's one, potentially two of our three casinos out of commission for the time being along with a chemical hazard right outside the 38. With the NCR already not liking us, the influx of tourism that House relied on is likely going to try up really quickly.
Assuming there aren't any Legion or NCR remnants still active in the Mojave, it looks like Six's first main hurdle is going to be handling this economic situation.
At the moment we don't actually know that Six doesn't have more depths. Like, when you're taking over a state and overthrowing your enemies, you do tend to, uh, use power and brutality and cunning?
But there's no promise that that's all they're going to do.
In my opinion what's incredibly boring is the players habit of trying to trivialize everything by trying to forcefully remove all challenges. I'd find it a lot more interesting if we can in fact lose by having the Courier resign if the people forced because Six genuinely believes in a free and independent Vegas. Since it would force players to actually think things through and try to balance their actions while punishing players for trying to force an 'easy' route.
In my opinion what's incredibly boring is the players habit of trying to trivialize everything by trying to forcefully remove all challenges. I'd find it a lot more interesting if we can in fact lose by having the Courier resign if the people forced because Six genuinely believes in a free and independent Vegas. Since it would force players to actually think things through and try to balance their actions while punishing players for trying to force an 'easy' route.
Uh, I wasn't trying to say that I want to see Six overthrown. I was saying that it seems like it would or should be a very real consequence if the players mess by pissing off everyone too much. Since it means that players can't actually do absolutely anything they want without risking serious consequences.
I also like the idea of people actually acting and responding like people would. For example going "Oh sure a ton of people may starve and suffer because of our actions in the short term but in the long term it works out!' actually risks being overthrown by people who very understandably aren't happy with the idea of their leaders willing to sacrifice numerous numbers of them because they think that there would be no serious consequences for the leaders personally in the long term.
Uh, I wasn't trying to say that I want to see Six overthrown. I was saying that it seems like it would or should be a very real consequence if the players mess by pissing off everyone too much. Since it means that players can't actually do absolutely anything they want without risking serious consequences.
I also like the idea of people actually acting and responding like people would. For example going "Oh sure a ton of people may starve and suffer because of our actions in the short term but in the long term it works out!' actually risks being overthrown by people who very understandably aren't happy with the idea of their leaders willing to sacrifice numerous numbers of them because they think that there would be no serious consequences for the leaders personally in the long term.
"I don't disagree tbh, people should have the ability to be extremely clever for their goals. But I rather the Six government be kicked out of office through popular votes for someone who have more depths than POWER and actual improve society and quality of life."
Not, "I think it should be possible for us to lose the game" but, "I'd rather Six lose power as soon as possible."
Plan: Strip-ped Clean
- [OMERTAS] Took out the whole murderous bunch.
- [GLOVES] Exposed them to the world.
- [CHAIRS] Incorporated them into your efforts.
"New" Vegas wasn't, really. By design, House had preserved a tiny sliver of the Old World, with all its greed and rapacity, like one of those snowglobes he so coveted. Arcade related a term to you once, "anemoia," nostalgia for a thing never actually experienced, and that was House all over. For all his purported love of Las Vegas, he had essentially taken its history, a period that happened a century before his own time, and turned it into a theme park, a shrine to his unrequited love. Devoid of that nostalgia, and in fact rather militantly opposed to it, you set about burning it all down.
You remember holding Joana's hand, trembling faintly beneath your gloved grip, as you watched faint wisps of green-tinted gas rise out of the corners of Gomorrah's windows. Inside, the screaming had mostly stopped, as had the frantic beating on the doors, all of which had been thoroughly nailed shut. Organizing the working girls into a makeshift carpentry crew hadn't been difficult at all, as they made up for their lack of expertise with a frightening amount of enthusiasm for the task.
When the time came, all the exits were sealed shut and all the non-Omerta casino employees and patrons swiftly evacuated. You forced yourself to stay, eyes fixed on what you had done until the last sound faded. You'll never forget standing outside with the sex workers, each of them dead-eyed and quietly satisfied as they watched the demise of the place that had victimized them. They would never be victims again.
For the White Gloves, a more subtle tactic was called for. And so you dredged up another great ancient word, this time courtesy of Veronica: ostracization. Unlike the Omertas, who ruled through fear, the White Gloves relied entirely on a combination of their mystique and a painstakingly crafted appearance of absolute elegance. It was a towering, dizzying edifice, but extremely fragile. So, of course, you threw a stone.
Outed as cannibals, the White Gloves found themselves first abandoned, then actively pushed out of New Vegas. The Ultra-Luxe was left empty, without any of the high-income patrons that made up its clientele, and the members of the Society found themselves jeered and shunned in the streets. Their suppliers stopped selling to them. When they finally ran out of funds and defaulted on their monthly tax to the Lucky 38, they seemed to take it almost as a relief, fleeing New Vegas with everything they could carry. They were chased out by a mob, kept only barely at bay by a battalion of Securitrons.
Unlike the other two Families, the Chairmen didn't have any sinister plots up their sleeve or dangerous skeletons in their closet. It seemed as though all the guile and ill intent for their entire tribe had been distilled into one person, and he was long dead. Instead, you were left with a bunch of charming, capable, intelligent individuals with a strong cultural taboo against deception. As such, and lacking House's intense penchant for micromanagement, you started giving them responsible jobs.
By the conclusion of the Second Battle of Hoover Dam, the Chairmen had started taking over for the Securitrons on people-facing matters. They were the ones who collected taxes from Strip businesses, who broke up fights between tourists, and who saw the NCR off peacefully when they fled for McCarran. Hospitality at the Tops suffered as a result, but by then, the tourist trade had stopped being a major concern.
Prior to your final confrontation with the NCR and the Legion at Hoover Dam, you found yourself venturing outside the Mojave on four separate occasions, each time marking a notable turning point in your journey.
SIERRA MADRE
Lured in by a mysterious radio signal, you found yourself kidnapped by a renegade Brotherhood Elder, locked into a bomb collar, and forced to run a gauntlet of wicked traps, clouds of corrosive gas, and seemingly-indestructable feral tribals. At the end of your efforts, you overcame all obstacles, entombed Elijah in the vault, and made good your escape. Then, you...
[] [HEIST] Pulled off the Heist of the Century.
Far beyond the value of the gold bars weighing down your pack, the true treasure of the Sierra Madre was its unique pre-War technology. By breaking through its security systems, you gained access to schematics and formulas for hard-light projections, space-age alloys, and even a limited form of matter manipulation. You and your companions, press-ganged together, dispersed afterwards with your shares of the loot.
Later, after the defeat of the Mojave Brotherhood, the militant faction fled west, only to find themselves at the wide-open gates of the Sierra Madre. Having arrived at Father Elijah's promised land, they disappeared into the Cloud; the Ghost Brotherhood that emerged later would be nothing less than the stuff of nightmares.
[] [HEIST] Left old ghosts to fade away.
Elijah's greed and hubris made him only the latest in a long string of the Sierra Madre's victims. Not wishing to repeat his mistake, you and your band of new friends left for the Mojave nearly empty-handed, eschewing forbidden knowledge for hard-won wisdom... and a few gold bars. Afterwards, your heist partners returned to the Wasteland with you, and lent their aid to your efforts.
ZION CANYON
A seemingly unremarkable caravan escort job undertaken for some quick caps ended with an ambush and then sprawled until you found yourself right in the middle of a tribal conflict over the edenic Zion Canyon. There, you encountered Joshua Graham, the former Malpais Legate, as well as the survivors of New Canaan. Caught in between the genocidal White Legs and the pacifistic Sorrows, you...
[] [ZION] Crushed the White Legs.
Forming the Sorrows and Dead Horses into an impromptu army, you and Graham laid waste to the White Legs, cutting a bloody swath through them that only concluded when you put a bullet into the tribal leader's head. The White Legs' remnants fled south, leaving Zion Canyon for the newly-confident Sorrows, who increasingly adopted warriors' ways in the wake of their victory. They would later become a valuable trading partner in an otherwise hostile world.
Vengeful and devoid of leadership, the White Legs formed an armed nucleus into whose orbit which the ostracized White Gloves and exiled criminal elements of the Great Khans later fell. Armed with Omerta weapons caches, adopting the worst traits of all their constituent groups, and bearing the heretofore-forgotten tribal moniker of the White Gloves, the skull-masked Reaper Tribe would later prove to be a terrifying menace to the settlements of the north.
[] [ZION] Helped the Sorrows flee.
Adopting Daniel's plan for a mass exodus, you shepherded the Sorrows further east, beyond the grasp of the White Legs. By slaying their leader, denying the White Legs their much-desired conflict, and leaving them to occupy Zion Canyon uncontested, you allowed the internal pressures within the tribe to boil over, resulting in its subsequent implosion and fragmentation into multiple warring raider bands. Experience with this tactic would later prove its worth on a far greater scale, and allow you to dismantle the Legion far more efficiently and with fewer casualties.
BIG EMPTY
Once again you found yourself abducted, this time via teleportation by a cadre of insane pre-War scientists living on as preserved brains. Subsequently, you were conscripted into a conflict between them and their so-called nemesis that at first appeared straightforward and borderline comical, but later proved to be far more complex. Reclaiming your vital organs and resolving the issue once and for all, you now stood before...
[] [CRATER] A high-tech toybox.
As uncontested master of the Big MT facility, you had complete control over its numerous technologies and the profoundly gifted (if also thoroughly deranged) intellects of its inhabitants. While the reason behind your periodic disappearances from the Mojave would never be fully known, the impact of the numerous advances you brought back with you would change the course of history forever. Of course, every so often, something unexpected might... wriggle its way loose.
And far to the south, disturbed by all this exotic particle activity, a long-forgotten entity slowly awakens from its centuries-long slumber, and HADES fixes its baleful electronic eye northward...
[] [CRATER] The Old World's tomb.
To you, the Big Empty was nothing but the cradle of Old World atrocities. Disgusted at its continued existence, you slew its ghoulish inhabitants, then activated its self-destruct systems. Dozens of world-changing inventions perished in the explosion, but so did hundreds of potential outbreaks and calamities, sparing the Wasteland from more monsters like the nightstalkers. You would content yourself with a few key items and a large pile of high-tech salvage.
THE DIVIDE
Having followed your self-proclaimed rival's breadcrumbs across and outside the Mojave, you faced down with him for the first and last time in the radiation-scarred expanse of the Divide. Amidst the mushroom clouds of your conflict, you came to grips with the enigmatic Ulysses, putting an end to his cryptic threats forever. As a consequence of your victory, you...
[] [DIVIDE] Relit the atomic torch.
With the launch sequence already in progress and Ulysses slain at your feet, you elected to enter a simple change of coordinates. The target: an elite formation of Caesar's Legion, its most decorated and veteran cohort, marching to the Dam as reinforcements. Devastated by the Old World's last atomic warheads, they never arrived at the battle, making your job that much easier. After that, reclaiming the secrets of nuclear power and atomic weapons from the facility was child's play.
But the 87th Cohort did not perish in the blast, nor in its fallout. Instead, its ghoulified survivors, full of fury and led by their champion, Gaius Magnus, ventured east into the cauldron of the Legion's civil war, and the Legion of the Damned would eventually emerge from the fighting powerful, united, and hateful beyond belief.
[] [DIVIDE] Snuffed out the flame.
You managed to talk Ulysses down with time to spare on the countdown, allowing the two of you to frantically abort the launch. With the missiles fueled up and the systems overcharged, the first explosion inside the facility wasn't far off, and the two of you barely made it outside with your lives before the final cataclysmic blast. Having come to a strange sort of rapport, you both returned to the Mojave together, where Ulysses would serve as a helpful, if not particularly straightforward, advisor.
The final prologue vote! 48 hours(ish) to vote; needs a convincing plurality to win or it'll go to a run-off. Please vote by plan; a sample format is included below.
[] Plan: Interesting Plan Name
-[][CAT1] Do a thing.
-[][CAT2] No, not that, the other thing.
-[][CAT3] Yes, right, exactly.
-[][CAT4] No, I meant the other other thing!
Picking the second option for any category will avert the hypothetical threat suggested by the first, but that doesn't mean the quest won't have any outside enemy forces; it just won't have those specific ones. Yes, you can pick all of the first options or all of the second options.
There is some overlap in the tech you'd get from the Sierra Madre and Big MT, but the matter manipulation vending machines and hard-light security holograms are exclusive to the former. Don't cite canon at me.
Feel free to ask questions here or come chat in my channel on Wordsmiths. Thank you to everyone for your participation so far, and have fun!
[X]Plan: The Golden Dawn of the Mojave
-[X] [HEIST] Left old ghosts to fade away.
-[X] [ZION] Crushed the White Legs.
-[X] [CRATER] A high-tech toybox.
-[X] [DIVIDE] Snuffed out the flame.
