No because that would assure their deaths and they are not supposed to do that. The point is you only get to die with honor when something kills you while you are fighting as hard as you can.
The Twin Holds: A Dwarf Karak Quest. (Warhammer Fantasy)
No because that would assure their deaths and they are not supposed to do that. The point is you only get to die with honor when something kills you while you are fighting as hard as you can.
- Location
- Utrecht
The only way Slayers would accept wearing explosive vests is if the trigger was a perfect deadman's switch.
Still wound not work, while the practical purpose of Slayers is to allow suicidal dwarfs to die gloriously the actual religious 'imitation of divinity' part of being a slayer is not about dying, it is about fighting for the Karaz Ankor because that is what Grimnir did. Anything that makes slayers no longer fight for their death, even if it kills more enemies goes against the purpose of the Slayer Cult.
- Location
- Utrecht
yes, which is why they would go fight to the death, kill whatever they can, and then, after they get killed, the deadman switch blows up whatever killed them too.
It's not always possible to recover the body.
A troll would likely eat the corpse.
That would mean an engineer is making something that will deliberately kill it's wearer.
The only suicide vests in use by dwarfs are improvised, when all is lost.
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Pretty much yeah. I know it is unreasonable to expect to recover the bodies of slayers, but 'reasonable' was never the primary concern of dwarfs, if it was there would be no Slayers.
- Location
- Utrecht
Imo, Slayer bodies are only recovered when they march with a Throng, or in situations like attack on our hold.
The corpses of wandering Slayers are pretty much impossible to recover.
1) trollslayer => trolls are always ravenously hungry, and have stomach acid that can dissolve metal
2) Giantslayers => also hungry monsters, although not as much as trolls
3) Dragonslayer => Well, you could go get the ashes from a Dragon's cave
4) Demonslayer => Wander into the wastes to retrieve their bodies. not likely.
The corpses of wandering Slayers are pretty much impossible to recover.
1) trollslayer => trolls are always ravenously hungry, and have stomach acid that can dissolve metal
2) Giantslayers => also hungry monsters, although not as much as trolls
3) Dragonslayer => Well, you could go get the ashes from a Dragon's cave
4) Demonslayer => Wander into the wastes to retrieve their bodies. not likely.
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This does not matter IMO, destroying a dwarf body on purpose is bad according to Gazul lore so they just do not do it, even if the practical alternative is 'eaten by troll'.
- Location
- Netherlands
Look.
Some slayers will use explosives if they think it's important enough. But most don't want to. They just want to run into battle with their axes and find a heroic doom. Not play Ranger. Also, they don't carry much on them, and explosives are heavy and high maintenance. If some slayers tag along with you, you can offer them access to your explosives. But you won't have any control what they do with it.
But this isn't anything new. Canon has plenty of examples of slayers using available gunpowder when given a chance. There's one in Skull Road that had a belt filled with incendiary firebombs. Absolutely normal
Some slayers will use explosives if they think it's important enough. But most don't want to. They just want to run into battle with their axes and find a heroic doom. Not play Ranger. Also, they don't carry much on them, and explosives are heavy and high maintenance. If some slayers tag along with you, you can offer them access to your explosives. But you won't have any control what they do with it.
But this isn't anything new. Canon has plenty of examples of slayers using available gunpowder when given a chance. There's one in Skull Road that had a belt filled with incendiary firebombs. Absolutely normal
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- Location
- Netherlands
Planning to go into battle as a slayer and blow yourself up is barely a step above suicide for a Slayer. It's like if they just stopped fighting and let a troll eat them.
The only time when it's acceptable as a slayer to do something like that is
1: you've already lost
2: it's heroic enough Grimnir will give you a pass
It's the same reason that it's dishonorable as hell to plan to scavenge a rune weapon from a fallen warrior when you go into battle. But normal if, in the heat of the melee, you grab an available weapon.
The only time when it's acceptable as a slayer to do something like that is
1: you've already lost
2: it's heroic enough Grimnir will give you a pass
It's the same reason that it's dishonorable as hell to plan to scavenge a rune weapon from a fallen warrior when you go into battle. But normal if, in the heat of the melee, you grab an available weapon.
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Why suicide bomber slayers don't exist
- Location
- Netherlands
Even then. The Slayer Oath dictates that you at least try not to get blown up by your own weapon. Slayers MUST die fighting, screaming oaths and doing everything in their power to stay alive and continue to fight.
Let's put it this way.
Planning to carry a stack of explosive charges at a door and detonate them on you? Dishonorable and effectively suicide. Grimnir won't let you into the halls of the ancestors. Enjoy wandering as a shade for all eternity.
The explosives piled at the gate haven't gone off yet, and they need to be blown up ASAP so fellow Dawi can get into the enemy fortress? Grabbing a torch and throwing yourself against the black powder barrels is an acceptable way to go as a slayer. Although you should still try to get away, either lighting the fuse again, or throwing the torch onto the barrel.
It's all about intent and motive.
And no, before anyone tries being smart. Artificially engineering the situation so the latter comes up is so shameful and disrespectful to the idea of being a Slayer, that you are going to get kicked out of the Ancestral halls the instant you die.
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- Location
- U.S.
whenever I was suggesting explosive slayers it was always with the intent of number 1, when they realize they are about to die, like say surrounded by large orks cut off from others, they 'pull the trigger' so to speak on their arsenal to take more enemies with him. I was not trying to say they only just wear some vests charge into a mob of enemies then detonate. More of a deadman switch kind of thing then the main weapon kind of thing.
this will be the last of me bringing this up, just wanted to clarify my position.
- Location
- Netherlands
That's still just deciding to commit suicide.
The Slayer should fight and actively try to break free to live and fight another day somewhere his death has purpose.
He should throw the bomb at the enemy, and then die axe in hand.
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Now I imagine slayers with explosives is a far more ok thing…. Cuz you aren't trying to kill yourself with them.
To try to reframe it better:
-The individual Slayers want to die because their shame is too great to live with.
-Suicide itself is shameful, not just to the dwarf themselves, but to their clan and guild. They've given up.
-Emulating Grimnir is honorable.
-Dying in battle against enemies of the Karaz Ankor is honorable.
-Fighting at less than your best possible effort against enemies of the Karaz Ankor is dishonorable.
To sum it up, the purpose of the Slayer role is to take deadly risks for the Karaz Ankor and succeed. The purpose of the Slayer individual is to die with honor. The former always comes first. The Slayer is a living weapon for the Karaz Ankor.
A Slayer CAN use a gun or crossbow, they don't want to. They choose the greataxe because its effective at killing enemies at the expense of opening its wielder to retaliation. They go without armor because it makes them a little quicker to come to grips with an enemy, again, at the expense of personal risk. These are tradeoffs they can justify.
This is why Slayers don't just immediately run off to the Polar Gates naked and alone, or beeline for the nearest dragon. And why they don't generally(with the exception of Slayer Engineers, who presumably know what they are doing) get loaded up with unreliable and untested equipment in the hopes of dying while testing them.
They are not allowed to waste their lives.
-The individual Slayers want to die because their shame is too great to live with.
-Suicide itself is shameful, not just to the dwarf themselves, but to their clan and guild. They've given up.
-Emulating Grimnir is honorable.
-Dying in battle against enemies of the Karaz Ankor is honorable.
-Fighting at less than your best possible effort against enemies of the Karaz Ankor is dishonorable.
To sum it up, the purpose of the Slayer role is to take deadly risks for the Karaz Ankor and succeed. The purpose of the Slayer individual is to die with honor. The former always comes first. The Slayer is a living weapon for the Karaz Ankor.
A Slayer CAN use a gun or crossbow, they don't want to. They choose the greataxe because its effective at killing enemies at the expense of opening its wielder to retaliation. They go without armor because it makes them a little quicker to come to grips with an enemy, again, at the expense of personal risk. These are tradeoffs they can justify.
This is why Slayers don't just immediately run off to the Polar Gates naked and alone, or beeline for the nearest dragon. And why they don't generally(with the exception of Slayer Engineers, who presumably know what they are doing) get loaded up with unreliable and untested equipment in the hopes of dying while testing them.
They are not allowed to waste their lives.
- Location
- yorkshire
It may be flavour but low rolls make me nervous
The rolls were almost perfectly middling when you take the average, that would be 303 and this was 311. I think we are fine on that.
- Location
- Utrecht
Umm... where?