I understand the motivation but there's no way in hell we can let Rhaenys end up with Walder Frey as a father in law. He is an awful man. The Tyrell boys make good husbands, the Freys.... Not so much
Well whoever it would be would be a kid now, so I figure we could foster him with us or with an ally, and then have him as a squire later on, again with us or an ally. That's way we'd be sure he was raised to our standards.

I mean, a genuine royal match is likely the only way we could ever buy his loyalty for good.

I suppose we could also have him assassinated and then make use of the resultant chaos when all his children turn on each other.
 
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Well whoever it would be would be a kid now, so I figure we could foster him with us or with an ally, and then have him as a squire later on, again with us or an ally. That's way we'd be sure he was raised to our standards.

I mean, a genuine royal match is likely the only way we could ever buy his loyalty for good.

I suppose we could also have him assassinated and then make use of the resultant chaos when all his children turn on each other.

I mean I'm personally a big fan of assassinating him, but another option that was discussed was giving some of his kids land in the North, since there's plenty of space and having loyal lords there for the inevitable battle would be good. If we win the war, it's not like the Starks can object. I believe we hinted as much in the letters @Elder Haman suggested writing?

Though obviously this all hinges on him coming to our side AND actually being useful, neither of which I would particularly count on.
 
Is there someone similar to Quellon Greyjoy among the numbers of House Frey? Someone who's fundamentally decent and wants to do better than the past has done, but also tough enough to keep the dregs of their people in line? And if there isn't, can we make one? As in, through fostering or however, craft a Frey in Quellon's image?

'cause House Frey, when Walder does die, is gonna be a clusterfuck of inheritance problems. With all the different children from different wives and them being in or out of favour at different times, the House is likely to eat itself alive unless there is a clear, unquestioned successor. And offering Walder the same deal we did to Quellon is absolutely out of the question.

In OTL, Robb Stark considers Stevron, the immediate heir, as the only reasonable Frey (though let's be real, Robb did not demonstrate a well-honed judge of character). Anyone have their own opinion to offer on that?
 
We seem to have hit an impasse on discussion of the Frey's. We can't offer them the Neck, because Reed is loyal and family. We can't offer him Riverrun, because Hoster earned our gratitude by preventing Stark from breaking guest-right and we want to play that up. Well, unless his family suffers badly in the war or he's party to some atrocity we can nail him for. Regardless, that's not something we can depend on.

We haven't hit an impasse. We wrote back to him last vote:

[X] Additional letters:
-[X] Letters instructing forces at Griffin's Roost, and in the Stormlands, to gather and sail north to join Lord Sunglass
-[X] A letter to Lord Frey subtly implying rewards for his house would be found in the North

We just haven't had time to hear back from him yet.

I mean, a genuine royal match is likely the only way we could ever buy his loyalty for good.

Well why do we need that level of loyalty? It's not like the Freys are the superpower of Westeros. They are wealthy, numerous, and they control an important travel route between the Riverlands and the North. Frankly the Starks and the Tullys ought to be more concerned about gaining their permanent loyalty. We on the other hand are not as dependent on them, so what we offer should be consistent with their value to us. Which is why I think land in the North makes the most sense. We force the Starks to give up uncultivated land in the North sufficient to support a small holding, grant those lands to some of Frey's sons so that they have other inheritances besides the Twins and other Frey lands. Size of such holding to be determined by how important his different sons are to us.

That way most enmity of the North will fall on the Freys, not us. Additionally they serve as more men to support the North when the Others invade, and are a way to make sure that the mainline Freys give full effort to the North during that war. It's basically a win win for us.

Is there someone similar to Quellon Greyjoy among the numbers of House Frey? Someone who's fundamentally decent and wants to do better than the past has done, but also tough enough to keep the dregs of their people in line? And if there isn't, can we make one? As in, through fostering or however, craft a Frey in Quellon's image?

Well, there's always Olyvar Frey. He's about 2 or 3 years old now? And Roslin Frey should be a new baby? Actually, most of the children from his Rosby wife seemed decent, though they are all children right now.

There is also Emmon Frey (Walder's second son) who is married into the Lannisters (so we should probably reward him formost when handing out rewards as it rewards the Lannisters as well as the Freys), he's pretty much a dick, but his sons are relatively decent: Cleon, Lyonel and Tion. Not amazing guys, but not horrible villains.

His third son Aenys is regarded as clever and a good commander, but cruel. He has a son Rhaegar, our namesake, and he turns out badly in the book canon, but he's still young, we might be able to shape him up. His sons by Lady Swann are not particularly impressive, though Luceon rises to become one of "The Most Devout" in the Faith of the Seven, so might be worth it to cultivate his full brother Jared. His son Hosteen by Lady Crakehall is considered a strong fighter though slow and not very smart. There are some others unimpressive sons from Lady Crakehall, one of whom is married to a lady from Bravoos.

His children by his Blackwood wife are still teenagers. Lame Lothar the eldest is very cunning and dangerous (he planned the Red Wedding) he also has a reputation as a good steward. Notably, as hilf Blackwoods, they might carry the Green Pact. Lame Lothar might be enticed away from his family by the idea of power found in magic.

I'd say that we try to find lands in the North to support five or six of Frey's oldest sons, a dozen at most. Most of them as landed knights, perhaps sworn to their oldest brother (Emmon, the one married to a Frey) who is a lord then sworn to one of the Northern lords. Perhaps some land for Black Walder (Frey's second oldest great-grandson) if we want to get the most disruptive influence out of the Twins, don't know that we care about that though. Then take Rhaegar (12 to 14 years old) as our squire (mostly will have to do damage control, trying to untwist him as much as possible) and Perwyn (the oldest of the sons by Lady Rosby, about 7 or so) as our page. Maybe offer Lothar a position in our household if we want to go that route, try to bind him to us as his sponsor to learn magic. He's a nasty piece of work though, so we'd have to keep an eye on him.

Not sure if we want to do all that, but that's probably maximum commitment to trying to straighten out the Freys. Minimum would probably be land for five or six of Lord Frey's sons, and take Perwyn as a page.
 
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I'm placing almost as much importance on the Freys as I am on Reed. Those two houses control the isthmus between North and South, the bottleneck of the Neck and the river below it. Moat Caitlin is famously defensible and in disrepair. Maybe we should do something about that, even give it Reed entirely? Family deserves an appropriate seat after all, and we're likely to gift him a dragon down the line.

The twins aren't quite as famous and not nearly as old, but nearly as formidable. They've grown wealthy off the toll and have put that into their keeps, and they have a large levy, one of the greatest in Riverrun. It seems that they're hated by their peers for having the audacity to be an upstart younger family rising high through money. Really, they would be a viable candidate to replace the Tullys, if the current leadership wasn't so toxic and we didn't want to be publicly grateful to Hoster for honoring guest-right.
 
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I'm placing almost as much importance on the Freys as I am on Reed. Those two houses control the isthmus between North and South, the bottleneck of the Neck and the river below it. Moat Caitlin is famously defensible and in disrepair. Maybe we should do something about that, even give it Reed entirely? Family deserves an appropriate seat after all, and we're likely to gift him a dragon down the line.

The twins aren't quite as famous and not nearly as old, but nearly as formidable. They've grown wealthy off the toll and have put that into their keeps, and they have a large levy, one of the greatest in Riverrun. It seems that they're hated by their peers for having the audacity to be an upstart younger family rising high through money. Really, they would be a viable candidate to replace the Tullys, if the current leadership wasn't so toxic and we didn't want to be publicly grateful to Hoster for honoring guest-right.

House Reed is more important, they control the isthmus. They already have a good seat, it's called Greywater Watch, and it floats and moves. If they wanted Moat Calin they could have had it years ago. People tend not to want it because how do you support it? Also, just guessing, but it seems like the Reeds might already have a dragon egg (the one that went missing at Summerhall that the Foundation didn't get, apparently Daenys has it?)

The Twins are not as important because they don't control the whole isthmus North, they only control the bridge over the Green Fork of the Trident, and the only crossing north of the (not) Ruby Ford. So basically, to get to the Riverlands the North has to either cross at the Twins, or cross at the Harrenhall region. The Twins do not cut off the North from the Vale or the Crownlands. Still a vital crossing point, but not as important as the Reeds.

This doesn't mean they aren't important, we should certainly keep working on getting them on side, but there is no need to give away the house. We also took action so that the Greyjoys are supporting the defense of Moat Calin. With that, the North is going to have some trouble getting South. They can probably do it by sheer numbers, but not until they fully mobilize, which is probably another month away at least. At that point Dorne forces should already be at Maidenpool, and Mace Tyrell should have reached King's Landing.
 
It seems that they're hated by their peers for having the audacity to be an upstart younger family rising high through money. Really, they would be a viable candidate to replace the Tullys, if the current leadership wasn't so toxic and we didn't want to be publicly grateful to Hoster for honoring guest-right.
Well, it's not just Walder. Vile and dissolute is the rule for House Frey, not the exception. That's why getting a Quellon expy in there will be important.
I think land in the North makes the most sense. We force the Starks to give up uncultivated land in the North sufficient to support a small holding, grant those lands to some of Frey's sons so that they have other inheritances besides the Twins and other Frey lands. Size of such holding to be determined by how important his different sons are to us.

That way most enmity of the North will fall on the Freys, not us.
While it's entirely likely that there will be uncultivated land, along with land possessed by extinct families ("what's that you say? House Bolton's extinct? What a ... oh, what's the word?" "Tragedy, Your Grace?" "No, not that one.") we should be very careful in making the assumption that bile and emnity will be attached to the Freys and not us. That didn't work for Tywin or Roose OTL, it probably won't work for us here. The Northmen are backwards by some standards, sure, but they're nobody's fools.

Really, depending on how this war shakes out, we may want to be merciful and generous to the North, perhaps overly so, so that Rickard gets dismissed as a crank corrupted by his lunatic maester. I dunno. It depends on how vigorously they wage the war behind Stark, and who knows how much that they really shouldn't (loooong stare at Benjen).

All this talk of postwar planning is rather premature anyway, given how we've only just begun and don't know the broader picture of who needs rewarding and penalising.




Edit: and yes, I know that Domeric Bolton is still alive and by all accounts a decent guy. I just use House Bolton as an example, given their reputation in general and how easily their house could be extinguished in particular.
 
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Hell, maybe we should just call the Freys an enemy and leave it at that. Reed and the Ironborn can hold for a time, perhaps we should break the Freys given the chance.

I don't think we should antagonize the North, there's no real marriage we could arrange that would deserve having to live with Frey nonsense. Maybe offer them the city charter to get out from under the Tullys and if that doesn't work, tough.
 
Rhaegar's Rebellion, Part 5
I have no excuse for the lateness of this chapter, save that Fire Emblem: Three Houses is an amazing game and my favorite of the whole series. Granted I've only played four of them, but I haven't loved a game this much in years.
---
[ ] A few scraps, and what links you can seize from your imprisoned maesters. It won't be enough to reforge the blade, though the Royces will still be grateful.
[ ] Execute all full members of the conspiracy, and give the sympathizers and hangers-on to the Night's Watch
[ ] Allow the Citadel to keep the books... after you and Malora have skimmed them and taken notes. You also want copies made and sent to Dragonstone.
[ ] Just kill Pycelle.


You send letters to all corners of the realm, describing and denouncing the conspiracy. Your letters pretend that they opposed you because they saw in you a powerful seer and scholar who would restore the lost magic of House Targaryen. With the majority of the Foundation (and Pycelle) given over to Leyton Hightower's headsman, and the remainder (the ones who knew little or were only weakly attached) now on a ship to the Wall, they should never be able to contest your version of events. For those castles where you know a Foundation maester is in service, you send letters to nearby castles instead, asking for the arrest of the treasonous maester, by your authority. You make an exception for Storm's End, and instead try to be as diplomatic as possible, asking Lord Baratheon to investigate and judge his maester on his own. To the Great Houses, you also send shards of the dragon eggs so tragically lost. Including to your father; let him feel the same pain you felt.

You keep the largest shards from each egg. You're not sure why. You can't think of a use for them, and their glimmering colors make you feel nothing but depression. But you can't quite let them go.

As for the cache of books, you and Malora try to skim through them on your own but the sheer number is simply impossible to handle in the time you have. Eventually you agree to hand them over to the Citadel if copies are made and sent to Dragonstone, and leave with a few pages of notes on dragons and dragon eggs. It seems like there's strong evidence that dragon eggs will only hatch in the presence of natural fire (i.e. near a volcano) or fire magic (i.e. individuals with the Pact of Fire, or other dragons). Interesting…

----

As you prepare to leave Oldtown and set sail for Dorne, news pours in from the north. The Crownlands see a series of small but bloody battles as, one by one, the castles loyal to you are isolated and crushed. Rosby and Rykker are two of the region's most powerful lords, and none of the smaller ones can stand up to them combined. Things worsen. You hear the king has opened the royal treasury – damn you, I need that treasury – and hired an army of sellswords to crush all the defiance near King's Landing. Strongholds loyal to you remain only on the islands of the Narrow Sea (save Driftmark, of course) and on the northern edge of the Crownlands, such as the Antlers. There is some good news, however – the Clawmen have finally taken Rook's Rest, entered the Crownlands proper, linked up with the remaining forces of Buckwell, Blount, and Thorne, and now consist of an army twelve thousand strong…facing perhaps twenty thousand enemy soldiers to the south, and five thousand Rivermen to the west, sieging Maidenpool. Lord Sunglass writes to you that the army is currently stalled in the northern Crownlands, suffering from a crisis of leadership, as it is combined of men from so many different domains. He requests that you appoint an overall commander, and provides some recommendations. Sunglass himself admits he might not be the best choice to lead, as he fears the Clawmen don't respect him – but, he warns, they might also take offense if you elevate one of them to command over the others. The Clawmen houses are fiercely independent, and have rivalries with each other he does not understand.

[ ] Lord Guncer Sunglass Timid, and with not the best war record. But he is an honest and loyal man.

[ ] Lord Jaehaerys Boggs Elderly, with fading eyesight, but you know his mind is still sharp.

[ ] Ser Alliser Thorne A sour man, and harsh, but you have heard he is good at keeping men in order.

[ ] Ser Peremore Pyne Young and popular, said to be a skilled warrior, but he is untested in battle.

As for the Riverlands, news there is also mixed. Tywin Lannister decided to avoid Riverrun, since the castle is known to be terribly difficult to assault, and has struck deeper into the Riverlands. At Harrenhal he met the Whent forces in battle, and were those all he faced he would have won. But the Blackfish himself appeared at the last minute, leading an army from Saltpans, and the battle turned bloody and inconclusive – although the Westermen lost more troops. When the news came that Hoster Tully was approaching from the rear with the armies of the western Riverlands, Lord Tywin decided to bull through the Whent forces – bleeding his army even more – and continue pushing east to Maidenpool. A second army will be entering the Riverlands soon, he says, under his brother Kevan.

Further north, the crannogmen are holding Moat Cailin – Howland thanks you for the Ironborn supply ships – though the attempts to dislodge them have been quite spirited. Lord Stark may still be trapped in the Riverlands, but his bannermen have answered his call and are assembling their armies. Due to the size of the North, it has taken a while, but by the beginning of the new year a massive army will be gathered at the Moat. The Freys, meanwhile, are attempting to attack the Neck from the south, but Howland seems to view them as little more than an annoyance. The crannogs are killing more of them than the crannogmen, he writes.

Dragonstone is still holding strong. Kottar has had her archers kill men in green robes whenever they pop up. It took a surprisingly long time for the pyromancers to learn that they should just stop wearing a recognizable outfit, but when they did…what wildfire attacks did go off succeeded in horribly killing men on the walls, but little else; your castle's strange black stone held strong against the alchemical flames. So the king's forces appear to have switched strategies: ships are bringing even more men onto the island, and Kottar predicts that they will simply assault the castle once their numbers are overwhelming enough.

In the Reach, Mace Tyrell is busy marching thirty-five thousand men up the Roseroad. There would be more, he apologizes, but he had to leave some behind to deal with the traitor Reachlords. Oh, don't worry about those, they're mostly dealt with. The new Lord Peake is being very cooperative, in fact, as child hostages are wont to do. Mace thinks he and Willas will be great friends. Anyway, his army should be entering the Crownlands very soon.

---

You open your eyes upon the snow-covered ghost of Summerhall. What terrible things were wrought here in fire. You hope your actions in Oldtown have redeemed them somewhat.

YOU WISHED TO CONTACT US?

No, not really. Being battered by the overwhelming presence of the Others speaking as one is never pleasant. But you have questions to ask, and so you reached out in your dreams and rode the song of ice straight to its source. And yet, come to think of it…"Is your presence…lesser than it was, Cold Ones?" The very form of the ice dragon before you seems smaller.

YOU ARE FAR FROM US, AND MOVING FARTHER. FURTHERMORE, SUMMER IS COMING.

"I see."

THE SEASON WILL SOON BE UPON US, WHEN WE MUST RETREAT AND CONSERVE OUR STRENGTH. DO NOT SEEK TO CONTACT US AGAIN, EXCEPT IN DIRE NEED, UNTIL THE SEASONS HAVE TURNED. AND DO NOT TARRY TOO LONG IN THESE EQUATORIAL REGIONS. WHAT PRESSING BUSINESS DO YOU HAVE, TO GO TO SUCH AN UNPLEASANT PLACE?

Even in the face of that mind-numbing, emotion-dampening presence, you manage to lift up your head and, if not smile, at least put a little brightness in your voice. "My wife is sheltering in Dorne, with her kin. I go to attend the birth of our child."

The song screeches. THAT SHOULD NOT BE POSSIBLE, complains the disgusted ice dragon. UTTERLY, COMPLETELY IMPOSSIBLE. THERE IS NO SEED OF LIFE IN THE TWO OF YOU. WE BLAME THE MEDDLESOME RHOYNE. It stews. HOW HAVE YOU GOTTEN THAT ONE WITH YOUNG, AND NOT YOUR OTHER CONSORT?

"You mean Jon? He's male." The Others pause in confusion. "Are you…familiar with the difference between male and female?"

GENERALLY, ONE OF EACH IS REQUIRED TO BEGET YOUNG, YES?

You nod.

ARE YOU MALE?

You nod again.

THEN WHY – WHY DO YOU PERFORM THOSE DISGUSTING ACTIONS IF THERE IS NOT EVEN ANY SEMBLANCE OF A REPRODUCTIVE GOAL?

You consider how best to respond, considering that you really have no desire to explain your deepest emotions to these alien creatures. "Well, the answer to that is complicated, and has to do with subtle human social relations–"

THEN WE HAVE NO INTEREST IN LEARNING ABOUT IT. LET US LEAVE THIS FRUSTRATING TOPIC BEHIND. WHAT WAS YOUR PURPOSE IN CALLING FOR US?

"Very well. I wish to speak about Ned Stark." Remembering how little the Others care for human names, you clarify, "The one who claimed the ice sword."

WHAT OF HIM? HE HAS PROVED RELUCTANT TO TOUCH THE SWORD OF LATE. WE CAN INFLUENCE HIM BUT LITTLE.

"Yes, exactly. You were trying too forcefully with him. He noticed it, he grew wary, and now he refuses to touch the sword."

WE WERE TRYING TO HELP. WE WERE TRYING TO GIVE YOU AN ALLY, BEFORE SUMMER CAME AND WE WOULD BE UNABLE. IT SEEMS WE HAVE MADE A MISTAKE.

"Well, the situation can be fixed. I request that you call to him more gently or not at all, and leave the rest to me. I am well positioned to gain his loyalty. In fact, perhaps you should not try to recruit any more human allies. You are…not so good at it."

WHEREAS YOU, WITH YOUR ADEPT COMMAND OF HUMAN SOCIAL RELATIONS, WILL BE MUCH MORE EFFECTIVE. YES, THIS IS A SENSIBLE PLAN.

"Then we are in agreement. But there is something you can do to help me, in this current war to gain control of Westeros. Would you perform some minor activities near the Wall, to gain the attention of the Night's Watch?"

WE DO NOT WISH TO ATTACK THE WALL YET. WE ARE NOT READY.

"Not attack the Wall itself! I ask only that you give them some…annoyance. Let a few rangers catch glimpses of you at night, let them find some dead wildlings, make strange noises in the forest – the goal is to catch their attention, and you can do that without spending too many resources, I think. The current Lord Stark opposes me in the war. If you make the Night's Watch think that an attack might be coming, they will call for aid, and Lord Stark will answer. That will keep some of his troops in the North, giving him less to use against me."

The Others are unsure. WE WISH TO STAY HIDDEN. WE DO NOT WISH TO ALERT THE HUMAN KINGDOMS AND THE NIGHT'S WATCH OF OUR PLANS AGAINST THEM.

"Most of the human kingdoms have forgotten you exist, and will react to a plea by the Night's Watch with scorn. That scorn will only grow when your attack fails to materialize. Give the Night's Watch evidence of your intentions – it will not matter if no one respects them enough to believe their claims, especially not when I am king."

WE SHALL ATTEMPT TO DO WHAT YOU ASK, WITH THE FORCES REMAINING TO US IN THE AREA. THOUGH THERE IS A POSSIBILITY THE ICE DRAGON WILL DESTROY THEM ALL.

"Ice dragon?" you ask. "A real ice dragon?"

YOU ARE OBSESSED WITH DRAGONS. AS YOU REQUESTED, WE HAVE MANAGED TO LURE ONE SOUTH, CLOSE TO THE WALL. RELATIVELY SMALL, BUT STILL MATURE. OUR WIGHTS STOLE THE CLUTCH OF EGGS IT HAD LAID, AND IT HAS FOLLOWED THEM, ENRAGED. WE HAVE LOST FORTY-TWO WIGHTS TO THIS ENDEAVOR AND WE WILL LIKELY LOSE MORE.

"More than worth it, once I take control of the dragon," you say breathlessly. "It will be invaluable, in this war and all the future ones to come. How many eggs?"

THREE.

Hmm, three. An omen? "A good-sized clutch. Thank you, that is all I wished to ask today. Is there anything you would say to me, before leaving for the summer?"

SUCCEED. ESTABLISH CONTROL. WHEN THE SEASONS TURN, WE WILL SPEAK OF THE INVASION.
 
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WE SHALL ATTEMPT TO DO WHAT YOU ASK, WITH THE FORCES REMAINING TO US IN THE AREA. THOUGH THERE IS A POSSIBILITY THE ICE DRAGON WILL DESTROY THEM ALL.

"Ice dragon?" you ask. "A real ice dragon?"

YOU ARE OBSESSED WITH DRAGONS. AS YOU REQUESTED, WE HAVE MANAGED TO LURE ONE SOUTH, CLOSE TO THE WALL. RELATIVELY SMALL, BUT STILL MATURE. OUR WIGHTS STOLE THE CLUTCH OF EGGS IT HAD LAID, AND IT HAS FOLLOWED THEM, ENRAGED. WE HAVE LOST FORTY-TWO WIGHTS TO THIS ENDEAVOR AND WE WILL LIKELY LOSE MORE.

"More than worth it, once I take control of the dragon," you say breathlessly. "It will be invaluable, in this war and all the future ones to come. How many eggs?"

THREE.

Hmm, three. An omen? "A good-sized clutch. Thank you, that is all I wished to ask today. Is there anything you would say to me, before leaving for the summer?"

SUCCEED. ESTABLISH CONTROL. WHEN THE SEASONS TURN, WE WILL SPEAK OF THE INVASION.
I want that dragon, and I want those eggs.
 
[X] Ser Alliser Thorne A sour man, and harsh, but you have heard he is good at keeping men in order.
 
Either Thorne or Boggs, will do a bit more research to see if one is better than the other, but probably Thorne.

DRAGON EGGS DRAGON EGGS DRAGON EGGS

Oh dear the war is not going well for us. @Marlowe310811 @Elder Haman you two seem to have a good grasp on war tactics- any ideas on how we can recover this?

ICE ICE (DRAGON) BABY

Well, the main thing at this point will be to send the Clawmen/Sunglass army to join up with Tywin at Maidenpool. That will prevent our forces from being defeated in detail. Give them the better overall commander (Tywin), and relieve the siege at Maidenpool.

Meanwhile we will need to get our asses up to Dragonstone with Dornish forces to relieve the siege there. I'm worried at how fast things are going, it's what... another 3 weeks before our Dornish armies can get there.

I guess maybe we could ask Redwyne to send naval forces ahead of us to try and intercept the Royal and Velaryon navy, but that means dividing our naval forces. The only other actions I can think of to help Dragonstone would be to either try and reach out to the Velaryon house and convince them to switch sides, but I'm not sure how, or try to hire a pirate fleet from the Stepstones to harass them. Hmm... maybe the Sunglass fleet can harass ships...

@Vocalist A few questions:

First, are the estimations of sailing time still correct? 1.5 weeks to Sunspear, and then 1.5 more to Dragonstone?

Second, any word from Dorne on how soon they will be able to sail with their armies? Is it less than the time for us to reach Sunspear?

Third, the forces from Griffin's Roost, are they included in the Clawman army? And the navies of Sungalss and other Crownland houses loyal to us are also at Rook's Rest? Assuming based on the previous orders we gave.

Fourth, are the forces loyal to us around the Wendwater still active? Or are they among those destroyed? Asking because neither they or their likely opponent (Massey of Stonedance) are included in the list of forces we heard about.

Fifth, where is Aerys hiring sellswords from? The Disputed lands between Myr and Lys? Volantis? Or further north? Like Pentos or Bravoos? I'm guessing the southern route since that is the primary locations for sellswords are available, but wondering if we heard different?

SIxth, is House Thorne consdiered a Clawman house, or is it sufficiently apart from them that Clawman inter-house rivalries will not be affected by appointing him?

Anyway, it's still the middle of the night for me, so I need to get back to sleep. (I just happened to wake up to use the bathroom, and decided to check before going to bed).
 
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[X] Ser Alliser Thorne

He's an ass and much too incredulous and humorless for the long run. But we know he's competent at least.
 
Here's an idea: we don't want to to tip off the Others that we're against them yet, but we do want the Watch to trust us when the time comes. Malora already has a reputation, we could have her write to the Lord Commander on our behalf, warning that she's had terrible visions of the cold north. She'll seem much more credible very soon. Later, when we're ready, she can reveal that we were fooling the Others from the beginning.

Basically, use Rhaegars knowledge to inflate Maloras reputation as the real upcoming magical power.
 
"Well, the situation can be fixed. I request that you call to him more gently or not at all, and leave the rest to me. I am well positioned to gain his loyalty. In fact, perhaps you should not try to recruit any more human allies. You are…not so good at it."

WHEREAS YOU, WITH YOUR ADEPT COMMAND OF HUMAN SOCIAL RELATIONS, WILL BE MUCH MORE EFFECTIVE. YES, THIS IS A SENSIBLE PLAN.
If the Cold Ones were not so utterly incapable of emotion and subtlety, I would almost think this to be sarcasm.

Also...with that particular choice of phrasing, do they think we're going to seduce Ned? Excuse me while I go die of laughter.
Oh dear the war is not going well for us. @Marlowe310811 @Elder Haman you two seem to have a good grasp on war tactics- any ideas on how we can recover this?
Mostly what's been said already - get to Maidenpool to relieve the siege and unify our forces, protect Dragonstone, and draw focus away from our strongholds as much as possible. Our navies can easily overcome any other naval force, but we have to get them to Blackwater Bay, and do it yesterday. Break the siege of Dragonstone, and begin blockading King's Landing and the Blackwater. Harrying the coastal Crownlands will also help pull men off the front and let off some of the pressure they're facing. If the Tyrell armies can force a second front on the Crownlands/Riverlands borders, that would be a godsend for our more besieged forces. If we can get the second Westerland army linked up with the Tyrells, that will also make the second front that much tougher to break, and (frankly) see that sizeable army under more competent command.

An alternate plan would be to have the Tyrells blockade King's Landing in conjunction with one or more of our navies, and start starving the populace. It's shitty, and won't directly affect Aerys or the elites right away, but even they will start to feel the pinch eventually, and long before that the commonfolk are going to start making a ruckus. They back popular kings, not unpopular ones, and definitely not vicious idiot ones. Aerys isn't as bad off as Joffrey, but the situation could be comparable, and like Joff Aerys is really not good at helping himself out. Plus, between Mace severing the Roseroad like in the War of the Five Kings, Kevan marching up the Gold Road, and Tywin severing the Kingsroad, that's really going to do a number on KL's stores and siege prep.

Also, small aside: Mace is definitely misleading us about how easy pacifying his realm has gone. Thirty-five thousand is nothing to sneer at, but it is a far cry from the nearly-hundred thousand Renly was able to muster. Sure, that number's inflated by a long summer and the Stormland alliance, but that's still a considerable difference.

[X] Ser Alliser Thorne A sour man, and harsh, but you have heard he is good at keeping men in order.
-[X] His orders to are join with Tywin Lannister at Maidenpool. If he believes his force capable of relieving the siege at Maidenpool before linking up with Tywin he may do so.
[X] Write to Kottar, letting her know it will be at least three more weeks before aid arrives. That's how long it takes to sail around the arm of Dorne.

Ser Alliser should be able to control the Clawmen long enough to relieve the siege of Maidenpool, which is essential, and something his army can do easier than face the twenty-thousand Crownlanders to the south. Once that's done, I agree with Elder, we give Tywin overall command.

Edit: @Vocalist quick question: how much information have our commanders given us? Do we know which Houses in the Reach & Riverlands have been pacified, and who remains a belligerent? From the description, I suspect that Tywin blazed past Harrenhal to reach Maidenpool, but if he's managed to at least neutralize the Whents that's something.
 
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@Vocalist A few questions:

First, are the estimations of sailing time still correct? 1.5 weeks to Sunspear, and then 1.5 more to Dragonstone?

Second, any word from Dorne on how soon they will be able to sail with their armies? Is it less than the time for us to reach Sunspear?

Third, the forces from Griffin's Roost, are they included in the Clawman army? And the navies of Sungalss and other Crownland houses loyal to us are also at Rook's Rest? Assuming based on the previous orders we gave.

Fourth, are the forces loyal to us around the Wendwater still active? Or are they among those destroyed? Asking because neither they or their likely opponent (Massey of Stonedance) are included in the list of forces we heard about.

Fifth, where is Aerys hiring sellswords from? The Disputed lands between Myr and Lys? Volantis? Or further north? Like Pentos or Bravoos? I'm guessing the southern route since that is the primary locations for sellswords are available, but wondering if we heard different?

SIxth, is House Thorne consdiered a Clawman house, or is it sufficiently apart from them that Clawman inter-house rivalries will not be affected by appointing him?
1. Uh sure
2. Considering that Rhaegar will be arriving with the giant Reach/Ironborn fleet meant to transport those armies, no they can't sail before he gets to Sunspear
3. Our Crownlands ships are still in the Stormlands with the troops from Griffon's Roost. A relatively small force, so I figured they would just try to link up with the Reach/Ironborn fleet when they sail north.
4. The Wendwater houses are still loyal to Rhaegar, yes (forgot about them). They're currently in a stalemate with Massey.
5. Just some Essosi sellsword companies that are a dime a dozen around the Free Cities. Their origins are mixed, but they all have experience fighting in the Disputed Lands.
6. The Thornes are not Clawmen, no. They live on the western side of the Crownlands, on the Blackwater Rush.
 
@Vocalist quick question: how much information have our commanders given us? Do we know which Houses in the Reach & Riverlands have been pacified, and who remains a belligerent? From the description, I suspect that Tywin blazed past Harrenhal to reach Maidenpool, but if he's managed to at least neutralize the Whents that's something.
The Whents have lost a lot of their troops to Tywin's meatgrinder (and some of the Whents themselves were badly wounded, because they are very unlucky). The remaining Whent troops are joining up with the Blackfish and Hoster Tully, who are chasing Tywin east.

Still no sign of Lady Lysa.
 
Oh man, those Ice-for-brains are hilarious... It makes me worry about underestimating them. I really hope we can be present for the birth. It would suck so damn much if we lost time at sea or whatever. I wonder how our missing Kingsguard are doing.
 
[X] Ser Alliser Thorne A sour man, and harsh, but you have heard he is good at keeping men in order.
-[X] His orders to are join with Tywin Lannister at Maidenpool. If he believes his force capable of relieving the siege at Maidenpool before linking up with Tywin he may do so.
[X] Write to Kottar, letting her know it will be at least three more weeks before aid arrives. That's how long it takes to sail around the arm of Dorne.

Can't really think of any other orders to give. I guess we could order the forces at Griffin's Roost to join up with the Wendover forces (thereby giving them a small boost, and helping them hold Massey back, and then the ship could begin raiding the ships ferrying men to Dragonstone. That might buy us an additional week or two.

@Vocalist What are our military advisors thoughts on such a plan?

Hmm... I thought the Redwyne fleet had already left for Dorne so they would be loading forces there before we arrived. Those were the orders we gave when we on Pyke.

@Vocalist do we have any IC knowledge on how to go about surreptitiously reaching out to the Velaryons? Stewards, friends, trusted knights of their house, etc. Someone who could act as a trusted go between to see if they are interested in having their ships flip to us, instead of sunk on the bottom of the ocean? Or at least, being able to delay their actions so that when we inevitably win we will be generous to them? Lord Velaryon seemed to want to ride both horses, so he might be approachable.

Also, no word from the Frey's yet on our overture about finding his younger sons land in the North?
 
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