Rising of the Shield Hero Discussion Thread
- Thread starter Sarissa
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Shanejayell
Yuri Fan without a Pause
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WWWWHHHHYYYYYY......
Ahem.
The Rising of the Shield Hero - Wikipedia
The series is infamous for it's jerk ass lead, false rape accusation and general misogeny.
Ahem.
The Rising of the Shield Hero - Wikipedia
The series is infamous for it's jerk ass lead, false rape accusation and general misogeny.
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You missed your chance on the 1st Sarissa.
Nothing good can come from this.
Nothing good can come from this.
Shanejayell
Yuri Fan without a Pause
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Thread opened partially because of a extended discussion here before mods asked people to stop.
Goblin Slayer Discussion Thread - Anime | Page 70
Pretty much.
Goblin Slayer Discussion Thread - Anime | Page 70
Pretty much.
Jiven
With the power of the moon...
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- Strasbourg, France
*blink* Erm.
I agree on the jerk ass lead (which is part of the appeal: watching a jerk in a jerk world doing nice things), but misogyny ? #metoo accusation ? Where did you see that in the series ? It's only political commentators that tried to stuck those labels on Rising of the Shield Hero.
EDIT: I should precise i am only talking about the current state of the anime. I heard nasty things about the web novel, but i am not curious enough to read it.
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Shanejayell
Yuri Fan without a Pause
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First novel has a woman claim he tried to rape her. It's a huge plot point. 0_o
Jiven
With the power of the moon...
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- Strasbourg, France
So what ? A villain is doing a villainy thing, and it's used in the story to justify why the Shield Hero is incapable to trust anyone later on.
I am not sure if talking about #metoo is relevant here. And i don't see any misogyny in the anime so far ?
Sorry if i seems slow or something, because i might need an explanation here.
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Ivar
Dark Reaper
- Location
- Russia Moscow
I think that #metoo has nothing to do with it purely for the reason that the Author is not a time traveler . Seriously this thing started in 2012. If you want to say "False rape accusation," say so. Because ", false #metoo accusation" is not something that can happen in the world before, #metoo
I will not make a moral assessment of the "False rape accusation" as a plot device because I did not see the anime and therefore cannot speak about this particular case.
I will not make a moral assessment of the "False rape accusation" as a plot device because I did not see the anime and therefore cannot speak about this particular case.
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Shanejayell
Yuri Fan without a Pause
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Good summary of the series issues.
Why The Rising of the Shield Hero is the Most Controversial Anime This Season
Changed it just to 'false rape accusation' then....
Why The Rising of the Shield Hero is the Most Controversial Anime This Season
Changed it just to 'false rape accusation' then....
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The reason it's shitty is that false rape accusations are incredibly rare and yet a certain misogynistic paranoia drives some people to obsess over them which is often used to dismiss the concerns of the many honest accusers because "bitches lie". So a work that has a false rape accusation as a major part of its plot can feed those toxic and paranoid views.
I don't know about the quality of the work in question but the presence of a major false rape accusation is terrible, it's a super MRA-y premise.
Jiven
With the power of the moon...
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- Strasbourg, France
After reading Richard Eisenbeis's article, i am firmly in the camp 'your mileage may vary greatly' and 'if i was the LN writer, i would have resolved differently the slavery subplot, because it was very clumsily badly handled'.
Won't stop me watching the anime for now, we will see if the truly awful parts that might be coming later are changed or not.
So you judge a series which doesn't have any sexist point of view in itself (as i said, for now) on the unrelated reactions of stupid and insane people on an unrelated topic ?
Won't stop me watching the anime for now, we will see if the truly awful parts that might be coming later are changed or not.
So you judge a series which doesn't have any sexist point of view in itself (as i said, for now) on the unrelated reactions of stupid and insane people on an unrelated topic ?
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No, I judge the series for using a highly problematic premise that is completely unnecessary to write any kind of good story.
Furthermore, I literally said they weren't unrelated. That premise feeds the exact kind of mentality that leads to MRA thought, that women are just waiting to falsely accuse you of rape because they're evil lying bitches. The fact it was a single woman is irrelevant, people are quite adept at taking single instances and projecting them onto larger groups.
The author may not have anything worse in it but that doesn't make their choice of premise any less objectionable or irresponsible.
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Jane Dough
(She/Her)
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I see the fun has already started/s
all fictions
I hate you! (it's not against the rules!)
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Man, the TVTropes page is kinda bad but what it points out:
Shows you not seeing it is on you. This is all mostly things from the first episode.
We have:
- A hero concerned about having a female companion for chauvinistic reasons
- The false rape accusation
- The fact that the fantasy kingdom is a matriarchy for some reason and that apparently means rape accusations lead to executions, making it appear like a strawman feminist construct
- Him getting a female slave to fantasize enslaving his tormentor
Jiven
With the power of the moon...
- Location
- Strasbourg, France
Let just say that i completely disagree with you on principle. No premise, as problematic as it can be, can be deemed 'unnecessary to write a good story'. The true question (and i think you might agree with me) is if the author can write this problematic premise well.
Of course, it seems many are of the opinion that Rising of the Shield Hero is badly exploiting its premise.
For now it's a civil disagreement, we will see if the world burns later.
* A juvenile and immature man is having at the start juvenile and immature thoughts. He will lose them soon.
* The false rape accusation is a villain's action, the tvtropes page's speculations are irrelevant to the show (and they are also unfounded).
* Nothing to say about the kingdom itself, it might or might not be a product of values dissonance.
* Fantasizing of enslaving his tormentor ? Yeah, it's really bad and disgusting, but doesn't happen at all in the anime (apparently it's from the LN ?). It's also very soon after the treason, with Naofumi in a very bad place mentally and being at his worst. The only interest of showing this thought to the reader is how he will change for the better from there.
Reveen
Castro-Trudeauist
But it's not just a villain doing a villainy thing, it's a very specific setup of the story's ideological worldview that just happens to coincide perfectly with an MRA way of viewing the world.
MRA's blowing false rape accusations out of proportion isn't just a thing they do because they believe wrong things, it's intentional propaganda designed to get men to distrust women by portraying a world where women who aren't subservient to their men are secret puppetmasters maliciously manipulating and toying with men for no other reason that they're evil hedonistic harpies.
And Shield Hero makes this literally true in its world. Thw critical detail is that the false rape accusation is the villainous action that lets you know the villain is a monster. Not, like, fucking blowing up a villain or killing someone the hero cares about. But a very specific gender portrayal that just happens to tap into the insecurities of a male geek audience.
And the fact that the character is just evil isn't a defence. It's the exact opposite of one. Because the character being just evil for obviously gender coded reasons and not at any point allowed to have some sympathetic traits tips the story's hand.
It's not immediately as bad as the original work, which makes it clear that it thinks being a seductress who makes false rape accusations is not only evil, but absolutely evil with no hope for redemption to the point where your mother can send you off to be raped tortured to death without being a fucking monster for it.
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all fictions
I hate you! (it's not against the rules!)
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- Mons Regius
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- He/Him
It's not speculations, it's descriptive. Not sure what you mean by unfounded either.
You're also missing the forest of my arguments for its trees, which doesn't actually rebut it because, as I said, taken as a whole it paints a bad picture, so individually adressing each point is not really effective and missing the point (I even said some elements on their own would be innocuous).
Jiven
With the power of the moon...
- Location
- Strasbourg, France
You might be right. As i said, i will watch the series for now and see where it goes, how it encapsulate everything.
I actually like the concept of "an isekai gone really wrong, where the protag became a jerkass due to trauma but with enough character development and love came back to being a hero". So i would be pissed if it's another wasted opportunity to have a good story.
I actually like the concept of "an isekai gone really wrong, where the protag became a jerkass due to trauma but with enough character development and love came back to being a hero". So i would be pissed if it's another wasted opportunity to have a good story.
Sarissa
OwO
- Location
- Washington, D.C.
Honestly, the rape accusation isn't the defining problem. Myne is literally a princess. I'm pretty sure if you traveled back to the Middle Ages where the recognition of rape was... less, a princess accusing some luckless commoner of rape would probably still result in the getting the head chopped off. The claim that it's a matriarchy only comes from Myne herself in her effort to persuade him to fuck himself.
The bigger issues are that he's adamant in maintaining female slaves even past what's necessary, their determination to remain slaves even when they don't have to, and Myne's punishment. The rape accusation becomes part of the bigger issue, when taken in with all this, but it isn't really defining.
Edit: I meant to say is not the defining problem
The bigger issues are that he's adamant in maintaining female slaves even past what's necessary, their determination to remain slaves even when they don't have to, and Myne's punishment. The rape accusation becomes part of the bigger issue, when taken in with all this, but it isn't really defining.
Edit: I meant to say is not the defining problem
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Actually, yes, Melromac is matriachal kingdom. The Queen wasn't there because she had to stop her neighbours from bickering while, y'know, monsters popping up regularly. Myne can do what she can because her mom wasn't there to spank her.
He kept male slaves too. Just sayin'
Shield Hero basically legendary folk hero for beastman and demihuman. Most of his slaves basically demihuman/ beastfolk that had been f***ed over by other humans, and basically scouted by slave trader and then resold to Shield Hero. Shield Hero depends on Slave Trader simply because he's best option available for him. And then became a habit
She tried to kill her sister, involved in coup attempt (three times), and in general being unproductive toward her own country. It's practically miracle she survived executor blade for so long.
- Location
- Canada
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If I have any sort of complaints about this, it's how it's very similar to a Betrayal fic in Pokemon.
Like, in a usual Betrayal Fic, Ash Ketchum gets betrayed by his friends, usually accused of a crime he didn't commit, thus causing him to fall from grace. Only for him to get good (possibly by ditching his old Pokemon) and beat them all later on.
Shield Hero is basically that, but toss in the Isekai and Gamer Fic tropes as well, and make Ash's Pokemon into Pokegirls.
I do like the characters, though. That said, the entire setting in of itself, as well as the antagonists, are... eh.
Also, as a side note, I don't really like how people are dropping the show over something that:
Like, in a usual Betrayal Fic, Ash Ketchum gets betrayed by his friends, usually accused of a crime he didn't commit, thus causing him to fall from grace. Only for him to get good (possibly by ditching his old Pokemon) and beat them all later on.
Shield Hero is basically that, but toss in the Isekai and Gamer Fic tropes as well, and make Ash's Pokemon into Pokegirls.
I do like the characters, though. That said, the entire setting in of itself, as well as the antagonists, are... eh.
The entire reason why the Shield Hero gets shit is because the previous Shield Hero was the only one who thought enslaving Demi-Humans was a bad idea and fought with them. Kinda goes to show just how shallow and cartoonishly evil Melromac's high class are, especially when the King starts threatening Naofumi.
Also, as a side note, I don't really like how people are dropping the show over something that:
- Happened in the first episode
- Something that a villain did
- Had been used in stories before
- Location
- America in all but name
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- Location
- Ireland
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- He/Him
There is literally no possible way to ever justify writing your hero as a slave owner and calling it a good thing, because you are entirely responsible for the treatment of said demi-humans because of the fact that you're the goddamned author. If you set up your work such that it shows the main character to be justified in his taking of slaves, then that's incredibly fucked up.
Also, wow, "he kept male slaves too" as a response. Fucking hell.
As for the rape accusation, here's my thoughts. Would the exact same effect have been achieved if the accusation had been for attempted murder or intent to harm? Yeah? Then why the fuck make it rape?
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Oh hey, it's the review site that assumed the gender of Shield Hero's author.
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