I'm starting to believe we're going to kill Sertorious anyway to survive the byzantine politics of Rome whether it will be in the battlefield or poison because no one wants him alive at final victory and we'll be forced to take it anyway to prevent our family's proscription.
Res Publica: A Quest of Ancient Rome
- Thread starter Telamon
- Start date
- Original Historic
I really don't have time to engage in a proper argument, unfortunately, but I can quickly list my main reasons for wanting to reject gallivanting off to Spain with Sertorius.
1 - We would be quite publicly slapping Scaevola in the face. He has done Atellus a number of favours, and it was only under his auspices that Atellus became a broad-striped tribune and thus came to the attention of Sertorius in the first place. Insulting him like this (and no, telling him face-to-face does not really mitigate the offence) seems a poor way to repay him, in my view.
2 - We would (most likely) be abandoning our sisters. They will not be in a good position if and when whoever wins the war in the east decides that Sertorius is a threat, and there will be no one to intercede for them in Rome.
3 - Going to Spain does not gain us more agency. It means that for the foreseeable future of the quest, our allies, our enemies, and our options will be dictated by Sertorius. (All our links to the optimates will be gone, for instance, with very little hope of recovery.)
4 - Going to Spain is essentially choosing to mitigate short-term risk and uncertainty by massively spiking medium- and long-term risk. Sertorius almost certainly can unite the Iberian peninsula... at which point he will most likely be facing the entire rest of the Mediterranean, meaning the enemy will have vastly superior reserves of wealth and manpower and better strategic depth. (As I strongly suspect the comparison will be made again, this is not the same as Caesar's position prior to his civil war, and even in his case a betting man would have put his money on a Pompeian victory. It took massive luck, incredible generalship, and no small amount of incompetence on the part of his adversaries for things to play out as they did.)
5 - I personally find it more boring, as it removes us from half the fun of a Republican Roman quest - the great game of the forum and the senate house, the politicking and the factions, dancing on the knife's edge between victory and disaster.
1 - We would be quite publicly slapping Scaevola in the face. He has done Atellus a number of favours, and it was only under his auspices that Atellus became a broad-striped tribune and thus came to the attention of Sertorius in the first place. Insulting him like this (and no, telling him face-to-face does not really mitigate the offence) seems a poor way to repay him, in my view.
2 - We would (most likely) be abandoning our sisters. They will not be in a good position if and when whoever wins the war in the east decides that Sertorius is a threat, and there will be no one to intercede for them in Rome.
3 - Going to Spain does not gain us more agency. It means that for the foreseeable future of the quest, our allies, our enemies, and our options will be dictated by Sertorius. (All our links to the optimates will be gone, for instance, with very little hope of recovery.)
4 - Going to Spain is essentially choosing to mitigate short-term risk and uncertainty by massively spiking medium- and long-term risk. Sertorius almost certainly can unite the Iberian peninsula... at which point he will most likely be facing the entire rest of the Mediterranean, meaning the enemy will have vastly superior reserves of wealth and manpower and better strategic depth. (As I strongly suspect the comparison will be made again, this is not the same as Caesar's position prior to his civil war, and even in his case a betting man would have put his money on a Pompeian victory. It took massive luck, incredible generalship, and no small amount of incompetence on the part of his adversaries for things to play out as they did.)
5 - I personally find it more boring, as it removes us from half the fun of a Republican Roman quest - the great game of the forum and the senate house, the politicking and the factions, dancing on the knife's edge between victory and disaster.
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- Location
- Southampton, Great Britain
- Pronouns
- He/Him
True. I just don't think we will getting the chance to go greatness for 'several years' from what Telamon has said.
That would be my bad then. I don't get hyperbole well, especially in text form. My autism means that I take things at face value and without facial expressions to show otherwise, I struggle not to take things literally.
Apologises, I meant that it was the most interesting choice in my opinion. I completely understand that other people have their own differing opinions on what is the most interesting.
This is fair criticism. I will admit that I don't know much about the Roman Republic as most of my Roman knowledge is focused around the Roman Empire and the Byzantium Empire. If there are other opportunities like this, I will only know about them from what has been mentioned in the quest and none of these other opportunities have been mentioned so I can't comment on them except to say they haven't come up in the quest.
- Location
- Somewhere
Just a thought, the term Quixotic probably doesn't exist back in Ancient Rome since the phrase is derived from Don Quixote, a Spanish novel about a crazy old man who thinks he's a knight.
- Location
- Southampton, Great Britain
- Pronouns
- He/Him
@Telamon you said the vote would be closing in the next couple of hours over two hours ago. Is the vote closed or is it still open? And if it is still open, how long will it be open for? I am asking this because I want to know if it will close soon and it will be worthwhile to stay up a bit later arguing for my preferred vote or if the vote will remain open for several hours or longer and I don't need to worry about attempting latest minute persuasion late at night.
It's not like going with Sertorius immediately makes someone all that important. We'll be a sizable fish in small pond, but even Sertorius was not unfairly called "the best Roman general you never heard about" in thread, IIRC by @Telamon. Spain in Late Republic is really not a big or well-known pond. And right now in civil war, a well-respected tribune with a chance to usurp his legion is a position that has chances of becoming very important by itself.
- Location
- Central Europe
I feel that waiting a decade for our chance at glory is actually quite favourable to us. Currently our only renowned level skill is our Intellect. A stat we have mainly observed contributing to the training of other skills&stats. Using the next decade to prepare feels more suited to our present skillset.
- Location
- Texas
20 XP for 2 pages of discussion, bringing you up to 2930 XP in the bank.
Add another 100 for the reaction post, and that's 3,030 XP in the bank.
It's still open.
Add another 100 for the reaction post, and that's 3,030 XP in the bank.
It's still open.
- Location
- Orlando,FL
One of the biggest pros for hispania is that we're going to be learning a lot under Sertorius
- Location
- Europe
Wouldn't it be 13 pages of discussion? Or am I missing something?
- Location
- Southampton, Great Britain
- Pronouns
- He/Him
It is being counted from this post.
Sertorius will push for the Sixth in-story regardless of your decision, but I'll only actually roll for it if you say yes. If not, he's automatically shot down and given a different set of legions to take Spain.
It's one of those weird votes where the players themselves have more power than Atellus does in order to allow the conceit of choice. Those will get rarer as time goes on, but I figured I shouldn't send you all off to Spain without a choice in the matter.
No, because I already wrote all the important bits in the update except the parts you all pick.
- Location
- Central Europe
The whole Samnite Campaign brought us less than 7k Military xp. Less than half of which can be attributed to Seratorius' teaching. Mostly because we held independent command away from him. Something which is quite likely to repeat itself in Hispania. So forgive me when I don't put too much faith into learning much from him. Especially, since dice might force us to betray him to Sulla in a year or two.
Regardless, I was rather talking about furthering our skills over a whole decade before making such an ambitious undertaking as this Iberian adventure.
Edit: Because this quixotic quest is very ambitious. People talk about "securing a powerbase", however this was normally done further up the cursus honorum. For example Cicero secured the long term support from Sicilian landowners when he was asigned there as a questor in his 30s. Not as a not even 20 year old broad striped tribune.
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You will be also rating omakes later, correct?
ChiefTurtle117
The Sigillite
- Location
- Holy Terra
[X] Stay the Course
- Location
- Texas
Yes, everything since before the hiatus. That should be done in a bit.
- Location
- I think somewhere. I might be nowhere though
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Also, how come on the threadmark transitions "Mars Ultor" > "The Samnite War, Turn I" and "The Samnite War, Turn IX" > "The Samnite War, Turn X" don't have the arrows to move in between them like the rest of the chapters?
Looking at threadmark list, I suspect it has something to do with how its split for shortening. It's also most probably unintended and should be reported as a bug.
- Location
- Southampton, Great Britain
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Already reported after it happened in another quest.
Threadmarks Breaking Resolved
Since the migration to XF2, I and my players have noticed a strange issue with the threadmarks in my quest Victoria Falls. Namely, while all threadmarks in a given index (Threadmarks, Sidestory, etc.) are present and can be navigated to through the drop-down menus or the full list, the arrow...
forums.sufficientvelocity.com
- Location
- Texas
Already reported after it happened in another quest.
Threadmarks Breaking Resolved
Since the migration to XF2, I and my players have noticed a strange issue with the threadmarks in my quest Victoria Falls. Namely, while all threadmarks in a given index (Threadmarks, Sidestory, etc.) are present and can be navigated to through the drop-down menus or the full list, the arrow...
Fixed.
Isn't there anything we can do for Scaevola as a governor's right hand man to make up for ditching him? I mean we'd in a pretty influential position, especially to make appointments if we're tasked with raising new legions in Spain or establishing governance in newly conquered lands. Doesn't Scaevola have any relatives or old proteges he's like to see getting a good post somewhere?
This is Rome quest. If you disagree with the senate's decisions you know what you have to do.
[Sounds of legions marching.]
This is Rome quest. If you disagree with the senate's decisions you know what you have to do.
[Sounds of legions marching.]
- Location
- I think somewhere. I might be nowhere though
- Pronouns
- He/Him
He's the Pontifex Maximus. I am fairly certain he has more sway over getting appointments where he wants than the MC or Sertorius have right now.
I suppose you could always try to prevent his death if you want to make it up to him. No clue how you could do that, but leaving on a good note here before going to Hispania would probably help.
First, I think it's more than a bit presumptive to say that we will be Sertorius' right hand man. We'd be his client and protege, probably a trusted one, but he will be a very important person and have a lot of only a bit less important subordinates, like legates of the legions he'll take with him. We will not be a second man in Spain, should we choose to go there.
Second, it's enormously presumptive, to the point of being utterly insulting, that Scaveola, a man who went through the entire cursus honorum and who is right now holding one of the most important positions in Rome, a senator with massive influence and second if not first Optimate in Rome, would need any help from an upstart barely out of his home, and with position he got only due to Scaveola's efforts.
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