I'm always a little bit off put when there's a sexualized or objectifying character description in an otherwise sfw work, but there's something especially skeevy to me when it's a self insert into a a woman's body from an author that's a man. like its a little weird to me if your immediate reaction to being a woman is to start listing your measurements and cup size and literally nothing else.
 
Two things, one I put on the author, one I kinda put on myself, and both are a bit hard to explain without an example:

1) I guess this can be summed up as "They (the author) should know better." One post-canon fic I read by an author I enjoy greatly had all the markings of being another favorite until the very last scene. In it, after surviving the conflict of the fic, the two main characters were all but implied to have decided to commit suicide because they felt they have served their roles to the fullest and the world no longer needed them. And it was portrayed as if they were correct in their assumption, with all of the flowery language that comes with an intended cathartic release.

I fucking hated it.

The whole scene reminded me of a teenaged first-time writer who just discovered the Downer Ending and just had to include it to appear mature and refined, regardless of how well it fits with the rest of the narrative, and it did not fit this story at all. I've read other stories by this author with darker themes, all written before this one, and they weren't nearly this corny. It's like if Spielberg went "...and that's what happened when they were Saving Private Ryan." By that point in his career, he should've known better. Same with this author.

2) I said this is a bit of a me problem, but I also lay some blame on the author. A Zelda fic I'm reading and following now is a retelling of Twilight Princess. And like many TP fics, Sheik appears as Zelda's alter ego in reference to how that aspect was planned but later dropped for the game. In this fic, "Sheik" is introduced as a separate personality for Zelda when she decides to go sleuthing. Zelda is still there and makes all the decisions, but in multiple scenes it's described that the current revelation would have Zelda panicking while Sheik allows her maintain focus, almost like a shield, and she was trained for this from a young age in case it was ever needed, referencing her predecessor from Ocarina of Time. I found it a fascinating take on the character. It reminded me of those with Dissociative Identity Disorder or even people with extremely stressful jobs who compartmentalize just to stay sane, only here it's intentionally induced in order for the fantasy ninja to operate more effectively.

At least, that's what I thought the author was going for.

When Sheik was first introduced in the story, I truly believed they were using the plural they/them instead of singular, as if there were two distinct personalities, mainly from how the author wrote the scenes. It wasn't until several chapters later when Zelda-as-Sheik gets gender-envy from a truly androgynous OC that it's confirmed it's the singular they/them. Turns out, when Zelda is operating as Sheik, it's they/them, which, in conjunction with the androgynous outfit, is supposed to make identification more difficult, or so they try to explain to Link and Midna while flustered, an emotion that seemed impossible for them to have. No mention of the laser focused training from their youth. No mention of the personality shield. Granted, this development doesn't detract from my enjoyment of the fic; amongst a bisexual Link, a trans Midna, and an entire Twili society that makes the Greater Seattle Polycule look trad, an enby Zelda fits right in. It just feels a tad bit annoying when what looked like a unique idea was seemingly reworked for shipping purposes. This development only happened a few chapters ago, though, so maybe that idea I more than likely read too much into will come back? It already gave me ideas for my own stories.
 
Pet Peeve: Pseudo-Mascot

So you have mascot characters, like pets and children.
In the story they usually serve a dual purpose of [Comedy and Fluff] and [Problem].
They are dependent on another character and aren't really responsible for their own actions.
So they might play with a dog, then the dog runs off and eats the critical magical item and now they need to replace it.

Notably this is a relative status.
A story centering around 10-year-olds might treat a 9-year-old like this.
A story about 18-year-olds might treat a 17-year-old like this.
It all comes down to how the characters and the story treats them.




Then you have a character that isn't a mascot, but becomes one.
This is typically used to keep a powerful character around, but reduce their impact.
The alien invader turns into a tentacle-y houseplant.
The mid-season villain gets kicked out and is couch surfing in the MC's apartment.
The Ancient Demon is trapped in the form of a stuffed animal.

Functionally they've been reduced to Mascot status, but there is one critical difference.

A child can't be held responsible for their actions because they don't know better.
They might be punished for doing something wrong, but people won't react like it was a deliberate, malicious act.

An ancient demon trapped in a stuffed animal can't be held responsible for their actions because they can't do anything about it.
They have to keep it around for whatever reason, and the various punishments are trivial at best.

So you have a character who essentially has a free pass to insult, abuse, and sabotage the characters, and they laugh it off.
Because it's a mascot.

When you have a slapstick setting, the MC says something stupid and gets blasted through the roof and into the sky, it's debatable if that really happens at all.
They reappear the next scene, without any injury, and there is at most a comical patch in the roof.
The story doesn't treat it as abuse.

What about emotional abuse?
What about when the mascot spends the entire season calling the MC worthless garbage, then he overcomes that in a dramatic moment?
You have to assume he was insulted in the story, and it did hurt.
Or when they destroy the critical item that the MC needs to live and they run off to fix it?

All these things happen, they matter, and nobody holds the mascot accountable for it, despite the fact that they absolutely knew what they were doing.
Even if they start off annoyed, the mascot is inevitably going to become a friend, usually without any character growth or recognition that they ever did anything wrong.
Because they are a mascot.



From the other perspective, it's also annoying to have the story completely dismiss an interesting character's traits.
It's fine to nerf their powers to keep them from harming the story, but don't they still have knowledge? Expertise?
They were a Demon Emperor, conquering 10,000 hells over a million years, and they have nothing to contribute to the discussion at all?
I don't even care if it's good advice, there's something really cringy about acting like they've never seen blood before.

Especially since they went to the effort of making a really interesting character, and then it gets Flanderized into a 1-dimensional mascot who sits around eating food in a comedic fashion.

It's especially bad when you start with a bunch of idiot teenagers who have no experience or knowledge, constantly running into problems face-first, and then when they might have a chance to get some real help, it gets deliberately smushed into a fluff-comedy act.
It really makes it clear that the characters are stupid people doing stupid things because the author wants them to be stupid and actively prevents them from doing better.
 
Last edited:
Pretty much this.

I remember reading two Tenchi Muyo fanfics where the writers crossed over with their original settings/stories.

One story was a good read because the writer had already written stories for the their world and keep everything they brought over consistent.

Pity their site with the original stories went 404 over a decade ago.

The other story. . .

The writer keep changing their characters and setting info in the fanfic.

Always saying things will get clearer when they actually write the story they are pulling their characters from.

It felt like they were using the fanfic to flesh out their story.
Could you give the names and or the sites for these fics please.
 
There's this self insert story I read for a while till this one scene just took me too out of it because the SI has been doing some world hoping and helps this protagonist with an unfortunate home life and just adopts him out of nowhere and all the the adults kowtow to her despite being a 13-15 year old girl who almost literally sprung up from nowhere just five minutes ago, it' was out of left field that I couldn't bring myself to continue.

A big peeve that keeps popping up in SI stories that I hate with the burning passion of three suns is when the protagonist is first plopped into a deathworld setting (usually worm) and they find out they've been genderbent into a girl and instead of their reaction being something reasonable like "oh no my family and old life!" or "oh no my life is in (potentially) grave danger!" it's the infuriating "oh nO mY peNiS iS gONe!"
And I understand that it's supposed to be a joke, but it instantly makes me lose all respect for the protag when instead of mourning what they've lost or fearing/planning for their dangerous future they decide to throw a fit over something that's pretty insignificant in comparison to everything else that's going on.
 
Well, I can't comment on the things playing it jokily, but I can only imagine finding that your body is suddenly different and wrong would be pretty upsetting, attention-grabbing, and probably a lot more visceral than a more abstract thing like dealing with being somewhere else dangerous without ideas of how to get back. Especially because those big things, like the loss of loved ones or a home, can just outright not feel real at first even when there's not any magical stuff going on with it. Arguing what one should focus on first rationally only goes so far, since immediate responses to shocking and probably traumatic stuff are going to be driven more by emotions.

If anything I would wager that it's not focusing on the horror of being in an unfamiliar body enough to be realistic, but I haven't read much such things to have a feel for that.
 
There's this self insert story I read for a while till this one scene just took me too out of it because the SI has been doing some world hoping and helps this protagonist with an unfortunate home life and just adopts him out of nowhere and all the the adults kowtow to her despite being a 13-15 year old girl who almost literally sprung up from nowhere just five minutes ago, it' was out of left field that I couldn't bring myself to continue.

A big peeve that keeps popping up in SI stories that I hate with the burning passion of three suns is when the protagonist is first plopped into a deathworld setting (usually worm) and they find out they've been genderbent into a girl and instead of their reaction being something reasonable like "oh no my family and old life!" or "oh no my life is in (potentially) grave danger!" it's the infuriating "oh nO mY peNiS iS gONe!"
And I understand that it's supposed to be a joke, but it instantly makes me lose all respect for the protag when instead of mourning what they've lost or fearing/planning for their dangerous future they decide to throw a fit over something that's pretty insignificant in comparison to everything else that's going on.

They are obviously all Transgirls that were in heavy denial for their whole lives.
Their author thinks that they are doing the plaything of body trope.
BUT the common of that type isekai protagonist was usually depressed loser in their previous live. They've taught themselves that they aren't allowed to do anything feminine, that they aren't allowed to let the mask slip even towards themselves.
So they will be much too focused on the safe performance they've been putting up to actually care about anything in their last live.
Years upon years of depression really can really hollow you out, seen it, done that. You might still pretend like you care, but really it's just a performance you put in the hope that you at least don't pull the others down with you.

So when they reincarnate and discover that they are a woman the first thing that will go through them is the fear that they won't be able to hide behind their carefully constructed shield of performative masculinity anymore.

Then the story goes on to show how the protagonist are happily taking up any excuse to wear cute clothes and becomes happy in this live.
How they smile and making the watcher dream about becoming a happy anime girl too. Which allows a tiny bit of plausible deniability for the eggs, wanting to be an anime girl is completely different from becoming a real girl after all
www.webtoons.com

I want to be a cute anime girl - Page 100! - Bargain

Charon's sister dressed him up as a girl, and he liked it. This is her story, learning about who she is, and slowly realizing and becoming her true self, along with her friends and family. Updates on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays.... most of the time.
 
If anything I would wager that it's not focusing on the horror of being in an unfamiliar body enough to be realistic, but I haven't read much such things to have a feel for that.

Also I think it's honestly more...immediate to wake up and realize your prioperception is all wrong, that your body does not fit. It's extremely direct and omnipresent, like being unable to get a taste off your tongue or constantly having a giant swear superimposed on your vision even with your eyes closed. You might get used to it (to a survival degree, at least) faster, just because you haven't got a choice, you can't avoid it, but in the short term that could easily make it much more impactful.
 
Last edited:
A big peeve that keeps popping up in SI stories that I hate with the burning passion of three suns is when the protagonist is first plopped into a deathworld setting (usually worm) and they find out they've been genderbent into a girl and instead of their reaction being something reasonable like "oh no my family and old life!" or "oh no my life is in (potentially) grave danger!" it's the infuriating "oh nO mY peNiS iS gONe!"
Also, like, come on, if you write an SI story where you get genderbent, you probably wouldn't be that sad if your penis were gone...
 
I prefer not to ponder on what this says about me, but "oh no, total panic if you suddenly waked up as the other gender" always felt quite unrealistic.
 
Last edited:
If I woke up in a body that were not my own, I think I would feel pretty fucked up about it. Like, body dysmorphia is a thing (despite the fact that the spellcheck on this forum doesn't recognize "dysmorphia" as a word), and a sudden body swap sounds like it would be a pretty extreme example.
 
If I woke up in a body that were not my own, I think I would feel pretty fucked up about it. Like, body dysmorphia is a thing (despite the fact that the spellcheck on this forum doesn't recognize "dysmorphia" as a word), and a sudden body swap sounds like it would be a pretty extreme example.
While that's a valid point, the authors of the works in question never wrote about anything like that except the occasional not being used to being short.
 
If I woke up in a body that were not my own, I think I would feel pretty fucked up about it. Like, body dysmorphia is a thing (despite the fact that the spellcheck on this forum doesn't recognize "dysmorphia" as a word), and a sudden body swap sounds like it would be a pretty extreme example.
I don't know, I just don't feel like my sense of "self" is really tied with my body — if that makes sense, it's "mine", not "me".
 
In some cases it feels like the author is just including it because they feel obligated to.
If they just brush it off and say "My sex changed, who cares?" then it might annoy readers that care a lot, on either side.
So they have 2 sentences of dysphoria and move on with the story.
 
I don't think it is unreasonable to be somewhat upset about being in a body that is unfamiliar.
But it probably would not be my number one priority if i get transported into a completely new world, probably not even in top ten.
It becomming issue over time would seem more likely to me.
 
Lots of (especially inexperienced) authors work on cliches they read. They read 10 fics where the 'penis is gone/not gone' reaction happens, or where a particular character has some cringe thing about their early characterization (I've seen probably dozens of times Taylor Hebert complaining about her breast size, always in chapter 1-5), that it's part of their conception of "how to do this kind of fiction".

The better ones grow past it (and stop relying on stupid things). Then again, fanfiction that actually even continues, much less provoke further writing is extremely rare, so most do not get the chance.

I guess my larger point with this response is that that kind of thing is not nearly limited to dysphoria, it comes all over because sometimes tropes are just bad\annoying, and different writers and readers have a different tolerance for characterization "quirks" that seem particularly repeated and cringe (imo, always).

It also happens with "strategies" (10.000 and one stories of a SI taking advantage of the hypothetical powers of the room of requirement for instance). But it's not nearly so annoying then because that is not characterization.
 
Last edited:
I don't think it is unreasonable to be somewhat upset about being in a body that is unfamiliar.
But it probably would not be my number one priority if i get transported into a completely new world, probably not even in top ten.
It becomming issue over time would seem more likely to me.
I think that is up for debate - it seems like it would either be your first, vicersal, reaction. Or it would get put at the back of the list. And which it would be is something that you may not be able to figure out in advance.

Basically consider gender dysphoria. Now slap inverting your physical sex on you out of nowhere. Does it creep up on you, as you slowly get smacked by the things that just feel… wrong, now? Or does it all smack into you at once because you already know what your gender is, and to have your body suddenly no longer reflecting that is incredibly unpleasant.

In reality trans people have years of experiencing being in a body that doesn't match their gender. So it's very hard to say what would happen with someone that it happens to in an instant, since that is not actually possible in the real world and it would be deeply personal as well.

I imagine most people here are probably roughly correct with how we think we would react. Though it's impossible to be sure since high-stress situations can cause really weird reactions, as I can attest first hand.
 
Last edited:
I don't know, I just don't feel like my sense of "self" is really tied with my body — if that makes sense, it's "mine", not "me".
I don't think you even need to have it strongly attached to your sense of self to be distressed. To funcion in society as a boy is different than functioning in society as a girl. You have spent decades learning how to function as one and then suddenly you are expected to function as the other. "I am not trained for this."
 
I don't think you even need to have it strongly attached to your sense of self to be distressed. To funcion in society as a boy is different than functioning in society as a girl. You have spent decades learning how to function as one and then suddenly you are expected to function as the other. "I am not trained for this."
Ah, but that assumes I am competent at functioning in society :V
 
My biggest peeve (on this site at least) is people not properly tagging their stories. If I filter out for example, self insert stories I shouldn't be seeing SI stories in the list still.
 
Tax: MCs (SIs) immediately discerning which setting they are ala Magic Sherlock Holmes.

"Oh that patch of grass near my foot definitely means I'm in Dune!"

"Oh I'm in New York? I'm in Percy Jackson! (Ignoring other fiction that has a setting in New York)"

*Looks out the window of a spaceship* "Oh this definitely means I'm in Star Wars." (They were in Rick and Morty)
 
Back
Top